(03-04-2019 11:20 AM)goliath74 Wrote: Basically, every C-USA fan base thinks their coaching job should be top 5 in the conference.
Guilty as charged actually I want ODU to be the top but I am a realist so I am okay with being in top 2.
My life is so much simpler: just win, baby!
+1
We aren't really talking about two different things. Yours is cause and mine is the effect. Winning will make it a good program, a good program attracts good athletes and coaches and eventually those coaches winning will put them in the top tier.
That's right. Which is why I do not lose sleep over the other criteria, attendance, facilities (even though FAU's are not bad), etc. Just win and they will come.
(03-04-2019 04:45 PM)wh49er Wrote: 1a) ODU
1b) UAB
1c) UTSA
Let's be honest, those are 3 best jobs if a coach can come in and consistently win. Large metro areas with little to no competition from professional sports. Marshall and USM might be solid based on tradition but they've plateaued as programs.
Not exactly. Winning hasn't proven that fans will support any of these schools in droves. Most of those major cities are filled with fans of P5 schools that couldn't care less about them. Sadly, winning isn't the cure for all problems.
Big difference between a one-off season winning record and stringing to together multiple seasons with bowl appearances.
(03-08-2019 08:06 AM)ghostofclt! Wrote: clt says Charlotte, ODU, and FAU have the most potential
You keep saying this. Potential for what? CUSA championships? Movement to another conference?
I hate this comparison, but look at the state of Alabama. I spent the last month in Birmingham. Biggest city in the state. UAB just won the CUSA championship. Was this on the hearts and minds of Birminghamians? Unfortunately, those small market cities in Opelika/Auburn AL and Tuscaloosa AL dominate the market.
But that conversation may be too difficult for you to understand.
Keep in mind NO ONE knows what the next wave of realignment will prioritize.
(03-08-2019 08:06 AM)ghostofclt! Wrote: clt says Charlotte, ODU, and FAU have the most potential
You keep saying this. Potential for what? CUSA championships? Movement to another conference?
I hate this comparison, but look at the state of Alabama. I spent the last month in Birmingham. Biggest city in the state. UAB just won the CUSA championship. Was this on the hearts and minds of Birminghamians? Unfortunately, those small market cities in Opelika/Auburn AL and Tuscaloosa AL dominate the market.
But that conversation may be too difficult for you to understand.
Keep in mind NO ONE knows what the next wave of realignment will prioritize.
AL is a weird place. The big time school dominates the state.
ODU has no such competition, not even from any pro sports. I can't speak for FAU and Char if they have bigger schools overshadowing them or not.
FWIW, I agree with the top 4 in the list. Marshall has the tradition.
CLT is simply pointing out (as is the argument against you and USM always, whether it's warranted or not is another question) is that you guys have had football for decades and you are still are where you still are. ODU, FAU, Char are relative newcomers with more marketable potential. Money talks, and if you get the people behind the programs, it COULD 'potentially' cause a snowball. Marshall and USM have already proved that past success and tradition isn't enough to get the money to come pouring in. Just my $0.02 opinion.
(03-08-2019 08:06 AM)ghostofclt! Wrote: clt says Charlotte, ODU, and FAU have the most potential
You keep saying this. Potential for what? CUSA championships? Movement to another conference?
I hate this comparison, but look at the state of Alabama. I spent the last month in Birmingham. Biggest city in the state. UAB just won the CUSA championship. Was this on the hearts and minds of Birminghamians? Unfortunately, those small market cities in Opelika/Auburn AL and Tuscaloosa AL dominate the market.
But that conversation may be too difficult for you to understand.
Keep in mind NO ONE knows what the next wave of realignment will prioritize.
AL is a weird place. The big time school dominates the state.
ODU has no such competition, not even from any pro sports. I can't speak for FAU and Char if they have bigger schools overshadowing them or not.
FWIW, I agree with the top 4 in the list. Marshall has the tradition.
CLT is simply pointing out (as is the argument against you and USM always, whether it's warranted or not is another question) is that you guys have had football for decades and you are still are where you still are. ODU, FAU, Char are relative newcomers with more marketable potential. Money talks, and if you get the people behind the programs, it COULD 'potentially' cause a snowball. Marshall and USM have already proved that past success and tradition isn't enough to get the money to come pouring in. Just my $0.02 opinion.
So call it what it is. When you or anyone from Charlotte talk about potential, you are talking about realignment.
Just remember, wherever you are, there will always be bigger markets and larger budgets than yours.
ODU has proven a solid add to CUSA. Charlotte, not so much.
In fact, if anyone from Charlotte were looking at this objectively...
Say you hired a young professional. In five years, they've never shown any kind results. Would they still be around? Yet, that young candidate still consider themselves a candidate for promotion??
(03-08-2019 09:05 AM)odu09 Wrote: AL is a weird place. The big time school dominates the state.
ODU has no such competition, not even from any pro sports. I can't speak for FAU and Char if they have bigger schools overshadowing them or not.
FWIW, I agree with the top 4 in the list. Marshall has the tradition.
CLT is simply pointing out (as is the argument against you and USM always, whether it's warranted or not is another question) is that you guys have had football for decades and you are still are where you still are. ODU, FAU, Char are relative newcomers with more marketable potential. Money talks, and if you get the people behind the programs, it COULD 'potentially' cause a snowball. Marshall and USM have already proved that past success and tradition isn't enough to get the money to come pouring in. Just my $0.02 opinion.
So call it what it is. When you or anyone from Charlotte talk about potential, you are talking about realignment.
Just remember, wherever you are, there will always be bigger markets and larger budgets than yours.
ODU has proven a solid add to CUSA. Charlotte, not so much.
In fact, if anyone from Charlotte were looking at this objectively...
Say you hired a young professional. In five years, they've never shown any kind results. Would they still be around? Yet, that young candidate still consider themselves a candidate for promotion??
Actually, I respectfully disagree with your first point. When I'm talking about potential, sure realignment is a part of that, but there's more that goes with it which includes fan support (donations, ticket sales, attendance), marketability (full stadiums look better on tv, which means home games are more likely to get picked up on tv), etc.
I don't disagree with the your 2nd point. I'm just not sure what the point of telling us that there's bigger and better teams out there (entire P5).
(03-08-2019 09:38 AM)rileylives Wrote: In fact, if anyone from Charlotte were looking at this objectively...
Say you hired a young professional. In five years, they've never shown any kind results. Would they still be around? Yet, that young candidate still consider themselves a candidate for promotion??
You're correct to say the results aren't there but if you truly want to look it objectively you have to look at the leadership Charlotte had. Imagine having a boss that was underqualified, sabotaged your growth, and put employees that were low revenue producers on the same footing as high revenue producers...that would be Judy Rose.
Charlotte fans know as well as anyone that we've struggled in the important sports but we are finally confident in our leadership and believe the results will come shortly.
(03-08-2019 08:06 AM)ghostofclt! Wrote: clt says Charlotte, ODU, and FAU have the most potential
You keep saying this. Potential for what? CUSA championships? Movement to another conference?
I hate this comparison, but look at the state of Alabama. I spent the last month in Birmingham. Biggest city in the state. UAB just won the CUSA championship. Was this on the hearts and minds of Birminghamians? Unfortunately, those small market cities in Opelika/Auburn AL and Tuscaloosa AL dominate the market.
But that conversation may be too difficult for you to understand.
Keep in mind NO ONE knows what the next wave of realignment will prioritize.
AL is a weird place. The big time school dominates the state.
ODU has no such competition, not even from any pro sports. I can't speak for FAU and Char if they have bigger schools overshadowing them or not.
FWIW, I agree with the top 4 in the list. Marshall has the tradition.
CLT is simply pointing out (as is the argument against you and USM always, whether it's warranted or not is another question) is that you guys have had football for decades and you are still are where you still are. ODU, FAU, Char are relative newcomers with more marketable potential. Money talks, and if you get the people behind the programs, it COULD 'potentially' cause a snowball. Marshall and USM have already proved that past success and tradition isn't enough to get the money to come pouring in. Just my $0.02 opinion.
So call it what it is. When you or anyone from Charlotte talk about potential, you are talking about realignment.
Just remember, wherever you are, there will always be bigger markets and larger budgets than yours.
ODU has proven a solid add to CUSA. Charlotte, not so much.
In fact, if anyone from Charlotte were looking at this objectively...
Say you hired a young professional. In five years, they've never shown any kind results. Would they still be around? Yet, that young candidate still consider themselves a candidate for promotion??
As opposed to the 60-year-old guy who's been at the company since college, does his job well-enough and occasionally gets the Employee of the Month plaque to hang on the cubicle wall, but was never really considered for promotion because he has a personality similar to a slightly warm vegetables?
At least the five-year guy still has a chance to turn his career around.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2019 10:28 AM by 49RFootballNow.)
I actually agree with them. We've been triple garbage in sports that matter since our acceptance to CUSA.
Luckily, we can't get "fired."
I do think for the first time in 20 years we are actually trying, and not sitting with a finger inserted in our collective rectum.
I know everyone says this about their own campus and whatnot, but there's no reason give our resources for us to be as bad as we are. I do think if things ever catch fire at Charlotte it will be damn hard to put out. Sick of talking about potential though. If were gonna suck forever, we are a burden on this conference as much as ourselves.
(This post was last modified: 03-08-2019 10:38 AM by ImfromClayton.)
(03-08-2019 08:06 AM)ghostofclt! Wrote: clt says Charlotte, ODU, and FAU have the most potential
You keep saying this. Potential for what? CUSA championships? Movement to another conference?
I hate this comparison, but look at the state of Alabama. I spent the last month in Birmingham. Biggest city in the state. UAB just won the CUSA championship. Was this on the hearts and minds of Birminghamians? Unfortunately, those small market cities in Opelika/Auburn AL and Tuscaloosa AL dominate the market.
But that conversation may be too difficult for you to understand.
Keep in mind NO ONE knows what the next wave of realignment will prioritize.
AL is a weird place. The big time school dominates the state.
ODU has no such competition, not even from any pro sports. I can't speak for FAU and Char if they have bigger schools overshadowing them or not.
FWIW, I agree with the top 4 in the list. Marshall has the tradition.
CLT is simply pointing out (as is the argument against you and USM always, whether it's warranted or not is another question) is that you guys have had football for decades and you are still are where you still are. ODU, FAU, Char are relative newcomers with more marketable potential. Money talks, and if you get the people behind the programs, it COULD 'potentially' cause a snowball. Marshall and USM have already proved that past success and tradition isn't enough to get the money to come pouring in. Just my $0.02 opinion.
So says the guy with the 20,000 seat stadium!
Every program in C-USA has problems peculiar to themselves....even the ones who THINK they are "on the rise"....or they wouldn't be in C-USA.
USM resides in a small, poor state with TWO SEC TEAT SUCKERS who drain the life outta every living and dead thing in the Magnolia State....BUT...it's been that way FOREVER, even though the welfare OP/MSUcks receives now to bolster their programs is at record levels.
So, we've ALWAYS existed on a limited budget and done quite well...You guys have only seen the USM team of the last decade, destroyed not by money or conference realignment, but by a DUMB MOVE TO HIRE GRANPAPPY BUTTERMILK.
Many in our conference think our recent mediocrity means we are in permanent decline...something that is in THEIR best interest, by the way....but reports of USM's death are greatly exaggerated, and anyone who thinks otherwise best beware.
(03-08-2019 09:05 AM)odu09 Wrote: AL is a weird place. The big time school dominates the state.
ODU has no such competition, not even from any pro sports. I can't speak for FAU and Char if they have bigger schools overshadowing them or not.
FWIW, I agree with the top 4 in the list. Marshall has the tradition.
CLT is simply pointing out (as is the argument against you and USM always, whether it's warranted or not is another question) is that you guys have had football for decades and you are still are where you still are. ODU, FAU, Char are relative newcomers with more marketable potential. Money talks, and if you get the people behind the programs, it COULD 'potentially' cause a snowball. Marshall and USM have already proved that past success and tradition isn't enough to get the money to come pouring in. Just my $0.02 opinion.
So says the guy with the 20,000 seat stadium!
Every program in C-USA has problems peculiar to themselves....even the ones who THINK they are "on the rise"....or they wouldn't be in C-USA.
USM resides in a small, poor state with TWO SEC TEAT SUCKERS who drain the life outta every living and dead thing in the Magnolia State....BUT...it's been that way FOREVER, even though the welfare OP/MSUcks receives now to bolster their programs is at record levels.
So, we've ALWAYS existed on a limited budget and done quite well...You guys have only seen the USM team of the last decade, destroyed not by money or conference realignment, but by a DUMB MOVE TO HIRE GRANPAPPY BUTTERMILK.
Many in our conference think our recent mediocrity means we are in permanent decline...something that is in THEIR best interest, by the way....but reports of USM's death are greatly exaggerated, and anyone who thinks otherwise best beware.
I think referencing stadium capacity just kind of proves how short-sighted some of you are. We've only had football for 10 years.
ODU also just raised $16M from donations last year. How much is USM bringing in from their fanbase? The potential we speak of has to do with MONEY. Not stadium capacity...
I don't think you are in permanent decline, I just don't think you are going anywhere. So far, long term history is proving that to be true.
(03-08-2019 09:05 AM)odu09 Wrote: AL is a weird place. The big time school dominates the state.
ODU has no such competition, not even from any pro sports. I can't speak for FAU and Char if they have bigger schools overshadowing them or not.
FWIW, I agree with the top 4 in the list. Marshall has the tradition.
CLT is simply pointing out (as is the argument against you and USM always, whether it's warranted or not is another question) is that you guys have had football for decades and you are still are where you still are. ODU, FAU, Char are relative newcomers with more marketable potential. Money talks, and if you get the people behind the programs, it COULD 'potentially' cause a snowball. Marshall and USM have already proved that past success and tradition isn't enough to get the money to come pouring in. Just my $0.02 opinion.
So says the guy with the 20,000 seat stadium!
Every program in C-USA has problems peculiar to themselves....even the ones who THINK they are "on the rise"....or they wouldn't be in C-USA.
USM resides in a small, poor state with TWO SEC TEAT SUCKERS who drain the life outta every living and dead thing in the Magnolia State....BUT...it's been that way FOREVER, even though the welfare OP/MSUcks receives now to bolster their programs is at record levels.
So, we've ALWAYS existed on a limited budget and done quite well...You guys have only seen the USM team of the last decade, destroyed not by money or conference realignment, but by a DUMB MOVE TO HIRE GRANPAPPY BUTTERMILK.
Many in our conference think our recent mediocrity means we are in permanent decline...something that is in THEIR best interest, by the way....but reports of USM's death are greatly exaggerated, and anyone who thinks otherwise best beware.
I think referencing stadium capacity just kind of proves how short-sighted some of you are. We've only had football for 10 years.
ODU also just raised $16M from donations last year. How much is USM bringing in from their fanbase? The potential we speak of has to do with MONEY. Not stadium capacity...
I don't think you are in permanent decline, I just hope you are not going anywhere. So far, long term history is proving that to be true.
Fixed
well, our first football game was against the Hattiesburg Boy Scouts...so we've come pretty far since then!
We weren't handed a DIV I Conference immediately like you guys were when you restarted your long dormant program....so, yes, we've had to fight, struggle, grasp, beg and crawl to get where we are.
You judge your program by months, we've judged ours for decades...
Our stadium started at 4,000 capacity way back when...then jumped to 10K...then 15K....then 33k...and is now at 36K with some state of the art club seats. So we've always been growing, sometimes at a snail's pace like today, but sometimes a little quicker.
Glad you think you guys are better positioned for the "next moves" (whatever they may be), as well you may be....but I predict everyone you disagree with is not shortsighted or destined wallow in the mire...but we shall see.
well, our first football game was against the Hattiesburg Boy Scouts...so we've come pretty far since then!
We weren't handed a DIV I Conference immediately like you guys were when you restarted your long dormant program....so, yes, we've had to fight, struggle, grasp, beg and crawl to get where we are.
You judge your program by months, we've judged ours for decades...
Our stadium started at 4,000 capacity way back when...then jumped to 10K...then 15K....then 33k...and is now at 36K with some state of the art club seats. So we've always been growing, sometimes at a snail's pace like today, but sometimes a little quicker.
Glad you think you guys are better positioned for the "next moves" (whatever they may be), as well you may be....but I predict everyone you disagree with is not shortsighted or destined wallow in the mire...but we shall see.
That's my point exactly, though. You've been in this game for decades, yet we are in the same conference. Your stadium started at a low capacity and eventually grew over decades. Our stadium was a million years old when we started football and we are in the middle of a massive renovation project. Despite having a low capacity right now, it doesn't mean we won't grow. Our rate of growth is a lot faster than yours.
I don't "hope" against any of our current conference mates. It's just not the way I'm programmed. I root for the conference to improve so that CUSA can stop being the step along the way. For what it's worth, I don't think ODU has yet to contribute to the conference as much as we'd like. That's part of the growing process and the issue with only being in FBS for a few years.
And lastly, no, I don't think that everyone I disagree with is short sighted. I think we can disagree on plenty of things. What I suggested is short sighted is thinking stadium capacity (in phase 1) is what defines us as a program.
well, our first football game was against the Hattiesburg Boy Scouts...so we've come pretty far since then!
We weren't handed a DIV I Conference immediately like you guys were when you restarted your long dormant program....so, yes, we've had to fight, struggle, grasp, beg and crawl to get where we are.
You judge your program by months, we've judged ours for decades...
Our stadium started at 4,000 capacity way back when...then jumped to 10K...then 15K....then 33k...and is now at 36K with some state of the art club seats. So we've always been growing, sometimes at a snail's pace like today, but sometimes a little quicker.
Glad you think you guys are better positioned for the "next moves" (whatever they may be), as well you may be....but I predict everyone you disagree with is not shortsighted or destined wallow in the mire...but we shall see.
That's my point exactly, though. You've been in this game for decades, yet we are in the same conference. Your stadium started at a low capacity and eventually grew over decades. Our stadium was a million years old when we started football and we are in the middle of a massive renovation project. Despite having a low capacity right now, it doesn't mean we won't grow. Our rate of growth is a lot faster than yours.
I don't "hope" against any of our current conference mates. It's just not the way I'm programmed. I root for the conference to improve so that CUSA can stop being the step along the way. For what it's worth, I don't think ODU has yet to contribute to the conference as much as we'd like. That's part of the growing process and the issue with only being in FBS for a few years.
And lastly, no, I don't think that everyone I disagree with is short sighted. I think we can disagree on plenty of things. What I suggested is short sighted is thinking stadium capacity (in phase 1) is what defines us as a program.
Well, to steal a line from "Caddyshack" ( Judge Smails: "How do you measure yourself against other golfers?" Ty : "By height". ), "Hey ODU, how do you measure your stadium against other programs?" USM: "By capacity."
Sure, we weren't given a Golden Ticket like you guys, but judging by the poor performance of the AAC lately, maybe we should be glad we are where we are.
ODU is a good school in a good location with lots of potential...no one disagrees with that...But I'm telling you my friend, USM's best days are NOT OVER by a longshot.
