(10-04-2012 07:37 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Let's talk numbers: 1% of ATL, stop it that is a pipe dream, last home game they got 0.15%.

Since when is attendance indicative of TV market size? We have had multiple game where our attendance was more than twice the entire population of Boone. Since you want to talk numbers, attendance is not what is important to TV advertisers, this is:

Atlanta: median household income is 45,171; per capita income is $35,453; 22.6% are below the poverty line (that's just in the city, when you take in the entire metro area, poverty goes down and median income goes up to $51,948 and per capita goes up to $37,655),

Boone: Median household income is $20,541; per capita income is $12,256; 37% are below the poverty line.

Atlanta is a big juicy pie that getting even a sliver of will produce big dividends. Boone....not so much.

(10-04-2012 09:44 AM)Panthersville Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 07:37 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Let's talk numbers: 1% of ATL, stop it that is a pipe dream, last home game they got 0.15%.

Since when is attendance indicative of TV market size? We have had multiple game where our attendance was more than twice the entire population of Boone. Since you want to talk numbers, attendance is not what is important to TV advertisers, this is:

Atlanta: median household income is 45,171; per capita income is $35,453; 22.6% are below the poverty line (that's just in the city, when you take in the entire metro area, poverty goes down and median income goes up to $51,948 and per capita goes up to $37,655),

Boone: Median household income is $20,541; per capita income is $12,256; 37% are below the poverty line.

Atlanta is a big juicy pie that getting even a sliver of will produce big dividends. Boone....not so much.

You should drive up to a game in Boone.

Most of the fans, from what I could tell based on car flags, come from Charlotte.

(10-04-2012 09:43 AM)MTPiKapp Wrote:  1% a pipe dream? We're talking viewership not attendance.

I bet they get that now, I know I am guilty of watching and enjoying their games this season! I'm really looking forward to the next few weeks, They have one easy game against Rhode Island and the rest of the schedule is some of the best the CAA has to offer.

(10-03-2012 03:09 PM)OwlFamily Wrote:  I am gonna ask that we get this back on track here. Discsussing what city you live in and how that relates to your perception of possibble additions isnt really relevant.

(10-04-2012 09:49 AM)GaSouthern Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 09:44 AM)Panthersville Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 07:37 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Let's talk numbers: 1% of ATL, stop it that is a pipe dream, last home game they got 0.15%.

Since when is attendance indicative of TV market size? We have had multiple game where our attendance was more than twice the entire population of Boone. Since you want to talk numbers, attendance is not what is important to TV advertisers, this is:

Atlanta: median household income is 45,171; per capita income is $35,453; 22.6% are below the poverty line (that's just in the city, when you take in the entire metro area, poverty goes down and median income goes up to $51,948 and per capita goes up to $37,655),

Boone: Median household income is $20,541; per capita income is $12,256; 37% are below the poverty line.

Atlanta is a big juicy pie that getting even a sliver of will produce big dividends. Boone....not so much.

You should drive up to a game in Boone.

Most of the fans, from what I could tell based on car flags, come from Charlotte.

This is the argument I would be voicing if I was an Appy fan. App draws from the Charlotte, Winston-Salem, and Asheville markets fairly significantly because other than ECU, they have been the most successful football program in the state (regardless of which division). Highlight the fact that by moving in to the Belt, there will be ADDITIONAL markets to be had and stop talking about GSU and the Atlanta market.

And btw, to those talking about the "Boone" market....that's like saying that the only market that WKU offers is Bowling Green, the only market that MTSU offers is the 'Boro, etc. The Boone market is irrelevant, but the Charlotte, Winston-Salem, and Asheville markets combined aren't.

(10-03-2012 10:21 PM)MTPiKapp Wrote:  This argument is stupid and Saint...you're still wrong.

If you don't think Georgia State's on field product will improve, if you don't think their attendance will improve, if you don't think their market share will improve, you just don't get it.

The television networks would be crazy to take Georgia State over App State today, but again, it's not the numbers they're putting out today that has their attention, it's their potential they're drooling over. Is that fair? No, but it is what it is. And again, if Georgia State can capture 1% of the entire metro Atlanta area, that's nearly triple the entire population of Boone. This isn't that hard to figure out.

It really isn't even potential. The reason to add Ga State was based on location only. Doesn't even matter if they are ever successful on the field. All that matters is that they are in Atl as far as the SBC ic concerned. If they happen to have some success, even better. But it ultimately does not matter.

App State has a great fanbase & a fine football program. I'll give them credit for that. They don't deserve to be stuck in FCS and watch Charlotte move up when they haven't boiled their first mouthpiece. You can blame the other CUSA schools for choosing Charlotte over App State. They used to be a really good basketball & baseball program in CUSA 1.0, so by my assumption that's what got them into CUSA. Their market certainly helped as well. However, I know for a fact that ECU's AD supported App over Charlotte.

Maybe it's not right but unfortunately it is what it is at this point. There's just no point in arguing about it, it's too painful.

Good luck App State Mountaineers and GA Southern Eagles.

(10-04-2012 09:56 AM)LifetimeTopper Wrote:  This is the argument I would be voicing if I was an Appy fan. App draws from the Charlotte, Winston-Salem, and Asheville markets fairly significantly because other than ECU, they have been the most successful football program in the state (regardless of which division). Highlight the fact that by moving in to the Belt, there will be ADDITIONAL markets to be had and stop talking about GSU and the Atlanta market.

Appy is number four in Charlotte, soon to be #5 when UNCC gets going.

I love the "most successful program in the state line" that the Apps and GaSots like to use. Just shows how clueless they are about what it takes to move the meter in cities like Atlanta and Charlotte.

(10-04-2012 10:39 AM)Panthersville Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 09:56 AM)LifetimeTopper Wrote:  This is the argument I would be voicing if I was an Appy fan. App draws from the Charlotte, Winston-Salem, and Asheville markets fairly significantly because other than ECU, they have been the most successful football program in the state (regardless of which division). Highlight the fact that by moving in to the Belt, there will be ADDITIONAL markets to be had and stop talking about GSU and the Atlanta market.

Appy is number four in Charlotte, soon to be #5 when UNCC gets going.

I love the "most successful program in the state line" that the Apps and GaSots like to use. Just shows how clueless they are about what it takes to move the meter in cities like Atlanta and Charlotte.

Where do you get this number? If you have some research, I'd be interested to see it. I'm basing my analysis on having family in Matthews and Weddington and I see more about App football than any other school, especially since the win over Michigan. Basketball...of course not. But they do have a good presence when it comes to football IMO. Maybe I'm wrong and you can prove me otherwise though.

And I'm curious to know what it takes to "move the meter." Please enlighten me.

I'm a WKU supporter who simply has an interest in this discussion. I'm trying to take a non-partisan approach to it all so please don't lump me in as an App or GaSo supporter...

(10-04-2012 09:38 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 09:06 AM)panama Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 07:37 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  MT of course GA St. will improve, great prediction. They certainly can't get any worse.

Let's talk numbers: 1% of ATL, stop it that is a pipe dream, last home game they got 0.15%.

UAB without the solid basketball program is what you have in GA St. The Belt got a location not a market with that add.

If they are who I predict they are the Belt will enjoy them for a long time, if they are successful the Belt will be renting them. There is no way this turns into a successful long-term partnership. Look at what happening in CUSA this last round and listen to the ECU and Southern Miss fans. That my friend is the reality of the situation.

Everybody except the SEC and its members is renting.

Add the ACC to that after their latest move. My point is if the Sun Belt had used a different formula than CUSA (location grab) the results long-term would be different. You can't use someone else's gameplan and expect different results. Adding GA St. is a lose-lose situation for the Belt. They continue to perform poorly, bad, perform up to what some see as their "potential" and they leave, worse, as the other members may have had a chance to move up.

100% agree, been making this same point for years.

If your goal is to move up the conference totem pole and overtake CUSA, I’ve never understood why you would just follow the exact same strategy as they are. You are basically accepting the big market FCS teams that are left over after CUSA had their pick of the litter, while at the same time serving as a potential farm system for CUSA to pick from. It’s like playing a pick-up basketball game, and Team A gets to pick all the best players and Team B gets to pick from what is left over. Then if Team A likes a player they see on Team B, they can just bring them over as well. Team B is going to have a hard time winning long term with that scenario. It’s the same thing CUSA is doing for the Big East and the same thing the Big East is doing for the other 5 BCS conferences.

I just think the Sun Belt should be looking at this from a different perspective. CUSA is mainly interested in markets, so why add exactly the kind of teams they are looking for? You get to keep them if they are terrible, and if they have any kind of success you lose them. Lose/Lose. Sun Belt is closing the talent gap on CUSA now and it’s not because of market share or TV contracts, it’s because of success on the field. I think the Sun Belt would have been better served by focusing on getting better on the field as quickly as possible, and while these CUSA move ups are taking their lumps maybe Sun Belt could jump them from a talent level/perception stand point.

I don’t mean this as an insult to Georgia State or Texas State (if anything, I’m complementing them by saying that they have a chance to be courted by other conferences). I also don’t mean that Sun Belt could have just added App and Georgia Southern and then automatically been better. Just think that obsession with markets makes less and less sense the further down the line you are.

This self serving message was bought to you by the party to elect Appalachian State

App State- Georgia Southern 2013

(10-04-2012 10:39 AM)Panthersville Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 09:56 AM)LifetimeTopper Wrote:  This is the argument I would be voicing if I was an Appy fan. App draws from the Charlotte, Winston-Salem, and Asheville markets fairly significantly because other than ECU, they have been the most successful football program in the state (regardless of which division). Highlight the fact that by moving in to the Belt, there will be ADDITIONAL markets to be had and stop talking about GSU and the Atlanta market.

Appy is number four in Charlotte, soon to be #5 when UNCC gets going.

I love the "most successful program in the state line" that the Apps and GaSots like to use. Just shows how clueless they are about what it takes to move the meter in cities like Atlanta and Charlotte.

I would argue as far as football is concerned, that App St football is as popular as NC State and UNC Football. North Carolina is a basketball state and that is what ultimately rules.

(10-04-2012 11:31 AM)panama Wrote:  This self serving message was bought to you by the party to elect Appalachian State

App State- Georgia Southern 2013

That's right. Unlike Ga State, App and Georgia Southern have to actually put in some effort to make this happen. Unlike Ga State, we didn't charge huge athletic fees and have the "luxury" (and I use that term loosely) of being in a large media market. We have earned it on the field and we are earning it with fan support and donations. For that reason alone we will both be more successful in the FBS than Ga State ever will be because with us, there is no sense of entitlement that the 500 Ga State fans have.

Ok,

I thnk we've JUST about exhausted this topic on the main board.

There IS a SBC game tonight as a MTSU fan reminded us.

(10-04-2012 12:06 PM)Tennessee_Eagle Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 11:31 AM)panama Wrote:  This self serving message was bought to you by the party to elect Appalachian State

App State- Georgia Southern 2013

That's right. Unlike Ga State, App and Georgia Southern have to actually put in some effort to make this happen. Unlike Ga State, we didn't charge huge athletic fees and have the "luxury" (and I use that term loosely) of being in a large media market. We have earned it on the field and we are earning it with fan support and donations. For that reason alone we will both be more successful in the FBS than Ga State ever will be because with us, there is no sense of entitlement that the 500 Ga State fans have.

....so tell me again how you do this without two (2) student fee increases?

If you think GSU fans have a sense of entitlement, you are an idiot. We just know what our natural fit is, and where we belonged all along. The fact that our administration wanted to pretend otherwise so as to not tick off the CAA is the primary reason we are so bad right now.

(10-04-2012 11:31 AM)panama Wrote:  This self serving message was bought to you by the party to elect Appalachian State

App State- Georgia Southern 2013

I want App and Georgia Southern to join the Sun Belt, no doubt about it. Take App and Georgia Southern out of the conversation and I still feel the same way about what the Sun Belt should be doing.

Do you disagree with the point I made? What is the best case scenario for the Sun Belt with Georgia State? The better you are, the more likely that you are taken by another conference. Florida International was about 30 games under .500 as a Sun Belt member, had little fan support, didn’t move the needle at all, and they are nowhere near any other CUSA team. That was good enough for a CUSA invite.

The Sun Belt is not going to “out market” (as in have better markets) than CUSA. The only way to overtake them is by doing it on the field, and my only point is that it’s hard to do when you just add teams using the exact same criteria as CUSA (market, market, market) and they get to pick before you do.

(10-04-2012 12:15 PM)OwlFamily Wrote:  Ok,

I thnk we've JUST about exhausted this topic on the main board.

There IS a SBC game tonight as a MTSU fan reminded us.

I thought they did that 10 pages ago...

"Hey man, I can't wait to see that matchup this weekend. Those teams have great markets!"- Said by nobody in the history of sports.

(10-04-2012 12:15 PM)Panthersville Wrote:  ....so tell me again how you do this without two (2) student fee increases?

If you think GSU fans have a sense of entitlement, you are an idiot. We just know what our natural fit is, and where we belonged all along. The fact that our administration wanted to pretend otherwise so as to not tick off the CAA is the primary reason we are so bad right now.

Well for one, our Students Voted for our increase. I could be wrong about this, but I don't believe your students voted. It was just implemented.

Second, the only fee that will be added is $25 at this point to add students seats to the stadium. Our enrollment is 3 times as much as it was when the stadium was built. I helped pay for a Rec building when I was there. They are paying for something they will use as well.

The other athletics fee is implemented once we get an invite. So unless that happens, they don't pay that.

Even if both fees are implemented, Georgia Southern students still pay less than Georgia State students.

Regarding your natural fit, are you saying you "fit" in the SBC?

(10-04-2012 11:31 AM)panama Wrote:  This self serving message was bought to you by the party to elect Appalachian State

App State- Georgia Southern 2013

Ga State is thanking God you don't have to be re-elected in 4 years. :)

(10-04-2012 09:44 AM)Panthersville Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 07:37 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Let's talk numbers: 1% of ATL, stop it that is a pipe dream, last home game they got 0.15%.

Since when is attendance indicative of TV market size? We have had multiple game where our attendance was more than twice the entire population of Boone. Since you want to talk numbers, attendance is not what is important to TV advertisers, this is:

Atlanta: median household income is 45,171; per capita income is $35,453; 22.6% are below the poverty line (that's just in the city, when you take in the entire metro area, poverty goes down and median income goes up to $51,948 and per capita goes up to $37,655),

Boone: Median household income is $20,541; per capita income is $12,256; 37% are below the poverty line.

Atlanta is a big juicy pie that getting even a sliver of will produce big dividends. Boone....not so much.

What are you talking about App alums live in Charlotte, Greensboro, and Winston, the difference is they care about App, come to games (3 times as many as you guys) and donate money (again 3 times as much as you).

You are easy to get to you got us there, but that's about it. Sometimes the road less traveled does make all the difference.

(10-04-2012 04:13 PM)Tennessee_Eagle Wrote:  

(10-04-2012 12:15 PM)Panthersville Wrote:  ....so tell me again how you do this without two (2) student fee increases?

If you think GSU fans have a sense of entitlement, you are an idiot. We just know what our natural fit is, and where we belonged all along. The fact that our administration wanted to pretend otherwise so as to not tick off the CAA is the primary reason we are so bad right now.

Well for one, our Students Voted for our increase. I could be wrong about this, but I don't believe your students voted. It was just implemented.

Second, the only fee that will be added is $25 at this point to add students seats to the stadium. Our enrollment is 3 times as much as it was when the stadium was built. I helped pay for a Rec building when I was there. They are paying for something they will use as well.

The other athletics fee is implemented once we get an invite. So unless that happens, they don't pay that.

Even if both fees are implemented, Georgia Southern students still pay less than Georgia State students.

Regarding your natural fit, are you saying you "fit" in the SBC?

Our fee increase was voted on by the student leadership - not the students as a group.

No, I am not saying we are a "fit" with the SBC, I'm saying we are a far better fit in FBS than FCS. App and GaSo, not so much.