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I don't see CSS making that switch yet. If you sit Jones you're essentially waving the white flag to the team. Jones still can make plays with his feet. The issue is keeping the locker room and Satt is close to losing some of it based on what I've heard about a couple of players tweeting after the loss on Saturday. Believe me, I've got issues with Jones but I'm not sure what someone else is going to do much better with SIX games to go.

(10-16-2023 08:03 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  I don't see CSS making that switch yet. If you sit Jones you're essentially waving the white flag to the team. Jones still can make plays with his feet. The issue is keeping the locker room and Satt is close to losing some of it based on what I've heard about a couple of players tweeting after the loss on Saturday. Believe me, I've got issues with Jones but I'm not sure what someone else is going to do much better with SIX games to go.

its a tough spot - the OL is not good, the receivers don't seem to break off routes - they just run down and stop and stand next to whoever's covering them - in a lot of regards, EJ is not the only problem - but, they need to do something to shake it up - the status quo ain't getting it done

they're not going anywhere this year - at least get the guys, who will hopefully be here next year, some experience.

(10-16-2023 07:34 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  

(10-15-2023 09:21 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(10-15-2023 08:06 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(10-14-2023 03:46 PM)CincyBro Wrote:  Why do other programs make freshman Qb's work but UC never does.....

Because our freshmen QBs are typically guys with very obvious development areas and/or simply aren't physically developed. Drogosh is the first freshman QB we've had since Bennie Coney who looks like a D1 QB physically, and he has a ton of work to do on the processing side of the game.

There is 100% no reason to burn a RS this season, and Lichtenburg, while a good passer, doesn't have the mobility necessary to remain upright behind this OL.

Let him get a bunch of snaps the last 3-4 games and he keeps his RS season intact.

Is that the current rule in college football? I know college basketball allows participation in several (five maybe?) games without burning a redshirt, but I thought football was much more limited participation, if any at all.

4 games or less of participation.

When a team looks this bad, I think it is fair for people to question the QB. However, there is nothing about this team's performance that suggests to me the QB is the only problem.

I'm not here to defend Jones. If we had a better QB, I believe he'd be on the field. The fact that Fickell and Satterfield have left Lichtenberg, Drogosh, Hoying, Kocher, and Perry on the bench suggests that they aren't quite ready. Granted, I don't think Fickell was very offense-minded and didn't care as much as Satterfield probably does.

The biggest problem for this team is the offense, the biggest offensive problem is playcalling. Perhaps the playcalling is hemmed in because of personnel issues, but we could mix it up a bit just to keep the defense honest. Our WR can't seem to get open, we're afraid to call downfield passing, but we never keep a TE or RB in the backfield for extra blocking. On 4th down calls we run play action when no defense in the world would believe we're going to run the ball. Why? It's just a waste of time. It's all horizontal passing and dump-offs.

Everything comes back to Satterfield for me. I watch his press conferences and there should be a warning not to operate heavy machinery while listening to him. He has no charisma, no finesse. He doesn't strike me as an "X's and O's" mastermind and I would be stunned to find out that he is a "rah rah" locker room guy. My best guess is that he takes a hands-off CEO-type approach. We've only had one other guy try that at Cincinnati and it didn't go well.

When Satterfield speaks, I lose faith in the team. When he throws our whole RB roster under the bus, I suspect the players lose faith in him. Whatever he said at halftime seemingly made things worse. I think he has lost the locker room and I expect they'll be phoning it in the rest of the season.

I would LOVE to be wrong, but I'm not seeing any progress/growth/development. The playbook seems to be getting smaller, execution seems to be getting worse, and the results are some of the worst football I've seen in Nippert in my 25+ years of attending.

By the way, when is the last time we lost three straight games at Nippert? Props to the fans for continuing to sell out and show up, but as a longtime season ticket holder, I know that pattern won't hold without some results.
- Butch's 2010 season (4-8) had three straight home losses but one was at Paul Brown.
- Dantonio's 2005 team (4-7) lost two straight at Nippert.
- The correct answer is Rick Minter's 1999 team lost three straight at Nippert in a 3-8 season. I was there for those games, it was a few thousand fans at most. Totally different atmosphere.

Satterfield has dropped three straight at Nippert for the first time this millennium.

(10-16-2023 08:30 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(10-16-2023 07:34 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  

(10-15-2023 09:21 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(10-15-2023 08:06 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(10-14-2023 03:46 PM)CincyBro Wrote:  Why do other programs make freshman Qb's work but UC never does.....

Because our freshmen QBs are typically guys with very obvious development areas and/or simply aren't physically developed. Drogosh is the first freshman QB we've had since Bennie Coney who looks like a D1 QB physically, and he has a ton of work to do on the processing side of the game.

There is 100% no reason to burn a RS this season, and Lichtenburg, while a good passer, doesn't have the mobility necessary to remain upright behind this OL.

Let him get a bunch of snaps the last 3-4 games and he keeps his RS season intact.

Is that the current rule in college football? I know college basketball allows participation in several (five maybe?) games without burning a redshirt, but I thought football was much more limited participation, if any at all.

4 games or less of participation.

Thanks for that clarification on redshirts.

I'm all in for trying a new QB. Seems there is very little downside risk if Emory walks away given the current trajectory of the season. And if both Brady and Brady are highly touted, let's see what they might produce before retooling for next season. I do agree that this is beginning to look like much more than just a QB problem though.

(10-16-2023 08:18 AM)dave108 Wrote:  

(10-16-2023 08:03 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  I don't see CSS making that switch yet. If you sit Jones you're essentially waving the white flag to the team. Jones still can make plays with his feet. The issue is keeping the locker room and Satt is close to losing some of it based on what I've heard about a couple of players tweeting after the loss on Saturday. Believe me, I've got issues with Jones but I'm not sure what someone else is going to do much better with SIX games to go.

its a tough spot - the OL is not good, the receivers don't seem to break off routes - they just run down and stop and stand next to whoever's covering them - in a lot of regards, EJ is not the only problem - but, they need to do something to shake it up - the status quo ain't getting it done

they're not going anywhere this year - at least get the guys, who will hopefully be here next year, some experience.

I don't disagree but I'll be shocked if CSS makes a switch with six games left on the schedule. I'm not defending Jones or the coach but stating what I believe the coach will do at this point.

(10-16-2023 10:47 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  

(10-16-2023 08:18 AM)dave108 Wrote:  

(10-16-2023 08:03 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  I don't see CSS making that switch yet. If you sit Jones you're essentially waving the white flag to the team. Jones still can make plays with his feet. The issue is keeping the locker room and Satt is close to losing some of it based on what I've heard about a couple of players tweeting after the loss on Saturday. Believe me, I've got issues with Jones but I'm not sure what someone else is going to do much better with SIX games to go.

its a tough spot - the OL is not good, the receivers don't seem to break off routes - they just run down and stop and stand next to whoever's covering them - in a lot of regards, EJ is not the only problem - but, they need to do something to shake it up - the status quo ain't getting it done

they're not going anywhere this year - at least get the guys, who will hopefully be here next year, some experience.

I don't disagree but I'll be shocked if CSS makes a switch with six games left on the schedule. I'm not defending Jones or the coach but stating what I believe the coach will do at this point.

I could see him making a change late in the season if things continue to go as they have, but not 2 games under .500 with six games left. I know we've lost winnable game after winnable game, but every game left on the schedule is "winnable" to some degree. The staff is going to do all it can to salvage a bowl game. That would be a big win for them given the start to the season.

(10-16-2023 11:00 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  I could see him making a change late in the season if things continue to go as they have, but not 2 games under .500 with six games left. I know we've lost winnable game after winnable game, but every game left on the schedule is "winnable" to some degree. The staff is going to do all it can to salvage a bowl game. That would be a big win for them given the start to the season.

If they lose to Baylor that would be 4 straight @ home and the season is over - beat Baylor and there is still an outside shot @ a bowl. There is a reason we were picked 13th pre-season. Nippert was full at the start but by the time I left @ the beginning of the 4th quarter the place looked like it did when I walked in to see them play the College of the Pacific 65 years ago. We will need patience but I hope that Satterfield reverts back to pre-Louisville, otherwise we are going to waste 3-5 years, and, at my age, I may not have 3-5 years to wait for the new guy to turn things around!

Joyless, no energy team coached by a guy with all the juice and excitement of a beige Volvo 240 wagon.

The quarterback must be able to throw the football to his eligible-receiver teammates.

(10-16-2023 04:11 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Joyless, no energy team coached by a guy with all the juice and excitement of a beige Volvo 240 wagon.

Even worse, mine was white not beige.

I'll suggest that in my time as a fan, Kelly was our best coach in terms of strategy and talent evaluation. He also could articulate his plan to the fans and media. I'll add that Fickell was our best program builder and while not flashy, he developed a rapport with the media and seemed to enjoy the give and take in his press conferences.

If Satterfield was the next coming of Nick Saban, I could live with the dull as dishwater pressers. But when I listen, he does little to inspire confidence that he possesses a vision, a strategy, a plan, to turn this around. Even if he said we're two years away from winning big, I think people would respect his candor. But I just get nothing from him of substance.

However even if he does think that internally, he can't say that. How would his team feel if he said that publicly?

(10-16-2023 04:40 PM)OKIcat Wrote:  

(10-16-2023 04:11 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  Joyless, no energy team coached by a guy with all the juice and excitement of a beige Volvo 240 wagon.

Even worse, mine was white not beige.

I'll suggest that in my time as a fan, Kelly was our best coach in terms of strategy and talent evaluation. He also could articulate his plan to the fans and media. I'll add that Fickell was our best program builder and while not flashy, he developed a rapport with the media and seemed to enjoy the give and take in his press conferences.

If Satterfield was the next coming of Nick Saban, I could live with the dull as dishwater pressers. But when I listen, he does little to inspire confidence that he possesses a vision, a strategy, a plan, to turn this around. Even if he said we're two years away from winning big, I think people would respect his candor. But I just get nothing from him of substance.

I had a gray one....It was the boring, non-descript government accountant of cars. The coach Satterfield Mobile.

(10-14-2023 05:13 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  I remain perplexed by the fact that the brain trust of the staff identified Jones out of all of he options in the portal as the guy. I'm not sure what they were looking at but this is exactly who that dude is in year 6...A guy who can run and who probably looks the part in a T-shirt and shorts, but who's wildly lacking as a passer, who can only lock onto one receiver and who makes bad decisions.

I said it when we picked him up that if he's the one year rent a starter we are probably in for a long season.

The sad part is, I think they paid him pretty well to. Unfortunate.

(10-17-2023 12:46 PM)Z-Fly Wrote:  

(10-14-2023 05:13 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  I remain perplexed by the fact that the brain trust of the staff identified Jones out of all of he options in the portal as the guy. I'm not sure what they were looking at but this is exactly who that dude is in year 6...A guy who can run and who probably looks the part in a T-shirt and shorts, but who's wildly lacking as a passer, who can only lock onto one receiver and who makes bad decisions.

I said it when we picked him up that if he's the one year rent a starter we are probably in for a long season.

The sad part is, I think they paid him pretty well to. Unfortunate.

I prefer to be optimistic; given the timing of the coaching change perhaps better options were already further down the road with other schools by the time he took over. But for all of our issues we'd be better with mediocre QB play. I'll give him a mulligan on Emory but given a full offseason if we don't have a much better QB next year it's a Satt problem.

(10-17-2023 01:55 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  

(10-17-2023 12:46 PM)Z-Fly Wrote:  

(10-14-2023 05:13 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  I remain perplexed by the fact that the brain trust of the staff identified Jones out of all of he options in the portal as the guy. I'm not sure what they were looking at but this is exactly who that dude is in year 6...A guy who can run and who probably looks the part in a T-shirt and shorts, but who's wildly lacking as a passer, who can only lock onto one receiver and who makes bad decisions.

I said it when we picked him up that if he's the one year rent a starter we are probably in for a long season.

The sad part is, I think they paid him pretty well to. Unfortunate.

I prefer to be optimistic; given the timing of the coaching change perhaps better options were already further down the road with other schools by the time he took over. But for all of our issues we'd be better with mediocre QB play. I'll give him a mulligan on Emory but given a full offseason if we don't have a much better QB next year it's a Satt problem.

Bolded... hoping that our young QBs, with a year in Satt's system, are ready to take the reins next season regardless of how the rest of this year develops. Just don't want to lose one of the talents in that room and see them starting on another team because we continue the "rent a QB" strategy

(10-17-2023 12:46 PM)Z-Fly Wrote:  

(10-14-2023 05:13 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  I remain perplexed by the fact that the brain trust of the staff identified Jones out of all of he options in the portal as the guy. I'm not sure what they were looking at but this is exactly who that dude is in year 6...A guy who can run and who probably looks the part in a T-shirt and shorts, but who's wildly lacking as a passer, who can only lock onto one receiver and who makes bad decisions.

I said it when we picked him up that if he's the one year rent a starter we are probably in for a long season.

The sad part is, I think they paid him pretty well to. Unfortunate.

Speaking of government accounting...is that like a $10,000 toilet seat?

(10-17-2023 12:46 PM)Z-Fly Wrote:  

(10-14-2023 05:13 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  I remain perplexed by the fact that the brain trust of the staff identified Jones out of all of he options in the portal as the guy. I'm not sure what they were looking at but this is exactly who that dude is in year 6...A guy who can run and who probably looks the part in a T-shirt and shorts, but who's wildly lacking as a passer, who can only lock onto one receiver and who makes bad decisions.

I said it when we picked him up that if he's the one year rent a starter we are probably in for a long season.

The sad part is, I think they paid him pretty well to. Unfortunate.

Paying him is crazy

(10-17-2023 03:16 PM)Cal1362 Wrote:  Bolded... hoping that our young QBs, with a year in Satt's system, are ready to take the reins next season regardless of how the rest of this year develops. Just don't want to lose one of the talents in that room and see them starting on another team because we continue the "rent a QB" strategy

I agree. However given the lack of experience in the QB room it's unlikely we have someone ready to start next year. Maybe it's just my perception but it doesn't seem like Lichtenberg is viewed as an eventual starter. Bringing in a veteran QB for next season I don't think would affect Drogush as a redshirt freshman. Even if one of the Brady's played well over the last half of this season they'd probably still need to bring in a veteran anyway in case of injury.

(10-18-2023 06:15 AM)RealDeal Wrote:  

(10-17-2023 03:16 PM)Cal1362 Wrote:  Bolded... hoping that our young QBs, with a year in Satt's system, are ready to take the reins next season regardless of how the rest of this year develops. Just don't want to lose one of the talents in that room and see them starting on another team because we continue the "rent a QB" strategy

I agree. However given the lack of experience in the QB room it's unlikely we have someone ready to start next year. Maybe it's just my perception but it doesn't seem like Lichtenberg is viewed as an eventual starter. Bringing in a veteran QB for next season I don't think would affect Drogush as a redshirt freshman. Even if one of the Brady's played well over the last half of this season they'd probably still need to bring in a veteran anyway in case of injury.

Bolded, it appears that way. The mystery to me is we see some freshmen QB's that perform at a high level each season in FBS football. I know it's the most complex role of anyone on the field. We've been told our current roster has some highly recruited QB's (Even Prater has long been touted as one of those).

But thinking about Prater's years before switching to WR this season, it seems there has to be a point where one or both of the Bradys, see meaningful game action. This team can live with mistakes from inexperienced QB's as long as there is some evidence those can be offset by a higher percentage of passing completions and successful game management. Right now we're not seeing either of those skills demonstrated sufficiently to score enough. It's too much to expect the defense to hold opponents scoreless for victories and an offense that can't score must certainly demoralize a hard working and pretty effective defensive unit.