Gonzaga fits the BE better. Small Catholic BB school.

(11-05-2022 05:02 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  

(11-05-2022 02:20 PM)BigHouston Wrote:  

(11-05-2022 03:29 AM)otown Wrote:  I get worried that they would drop down like witchita state did in the AAC

I like Wichita State… Wonder what caused them to take a noise dive after joining The AAC.

Here hope they revive their basketball program soon.

lost coach and didn't recover.

TBH, Wichita St was falling off in the AAC before losing their coach. The step up in competition was too much for them. The same thing would happen to Gonzaga moving to the Big 12 ...

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(11-09-2022 08:52 AM)uhmump95 Wrote:  

(11-05-2022 05:02 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  

(11-05-2022 02:20 PM)BigHouston Wrote:  

(11-05-2022 03:29 AM)otown Wrote:  I get worried that they would drop down like witchita state did in the AAC

I like Wichita State… Wonder what caused them to take a noise dive after joining The AAC.

Here hope they revive their basketball program soon.

lost coach and didn't recover.

TBH, Wichita St was falling off in the AAC before losing their coach. The step up in competition was too much for them. The same thing would happen to Gonzaga moving to the Big 12 ...

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In the 7 years before the AAC they averaged 30 wins a year. The first 3 years in the AAC they averaged 23. All years under Mad Man Marshall.

Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

(11-09-2022 05:58 PM)Charlie Broadway Wrote:  Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

I think the truth is it is more difficult to recruit in hoops outside the P5 today than it was 5-6 years ago. Initially P5 was about football, but it eventually bled into hoops. We are seeing P5 schools that are traditionally zeroes in hoops recruiting at their highest clips ever (ie. Penn State, South Carolina, Clemson, BC, Rutgers, Nebraska).

(11-09-2022 05:58 PM)Charlie Broadway Wrote:  Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

somewhere, i saw that one of the reasons that gonzaga is looking to move, is to maintain their status, after mark few retires.

to me, that indicates that GU has some doubts about life after Mark Few. WSU and Gregg Marshall are a recent, cautionary tale. I do think that there's some risk, probably for both sides, but, as the saying goes, it doesn't hurt to talk.

I don't see it happening, think it was a mountain made out of a mole hill.

Iffy on them in Big 12.

Focus on Oregon, Washington, Arizona, Arizona St., Utah until they are in or the door shuts. If this is using Gonzaga as leverage to increase pressure then cool beans outside that won’t be mad if they are added but wouldn’t be happy either.

(11-10-2022 06:14 PM)natibeast2.0 Wrote:  Iffy on them in Big 12.

Focus on Oregon, Washington, Arizona, Arizona St., Utah until they are in or the door shuts. If this is using Gonzaga as leverage to increase pressure then cool beans outside that won’t be mad if they are added but wouldn’t be happy either.

I am ok with doing both. I don't think you can do anything with PAC until TV deal is coming to a close. If they can get near 30 with short term, approx. 5 or 6 year deal I don't think anyone breaks up the Pac.

(11-21-2022 10:29 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  

(11-10-2022 06:14 PM)natibeast2.0 Wrote:  Iffy on them in Big 12.

Focus on Oregon, Washington, Arizona, Arizona St., Utah until they are in or the door shuts. If this is using Gonzaga as leverage to increase pressure then cool beans outside that won’t be mad if they are added but wouldn’t be happy either.

I am ok with doing both. I don't think you can do anything with PAC until TV deal is coming to a close. If they can get near 30 with short term, approx. 5 or 6 year deal I don't think anyone breaks up the Pac.

back when the pac started its negotiations, I recall seeing that espn gave it two options: 20 million per team per year, for six years, or 31 million per team, for twelve years, with a grant of rights. i can't see the pac getting a grant of rights at this point. maybe espn would bump the lower offer, but, if the pac strikes gold, i think it comes from streaming, which gets into the exposure question.

Agree, but it is still all in the details of a new TV deal. I don't see a big bump from ESPN so it is on what Amazon will want, or not want for games and $$. I agree a long term GOR won't happen, but short term might. If no deal is coming from BIG right now, OR and WA more likely to sign short term GOR deals. Bottom line for Big 12 is everything is on hold until TV deal gets close to finish line and potential PAC to B12 schools know what they gain or lose. If the gain is small I don't see them blowing up the PAC.

(11-21-2022 10:39 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  Agree, but it is still all in the details of a new TV deal. I don't see a big bump from ESPN so it is on what Amazon will want, or not want for games and $$. I agree a long term GOR won't happen, but short term might. If no deal is coming from BIG right now, OR and WA more likely to sign short term GOR deals. Bottom line for Big 12 is everything is on hold until TV deal gets close to finish line and potential PAC to B12 schools know what they gain or lose. If the gain is small I don't see them blowing up the PAC.

I agree that it all depends on the tv deal - i'd just be surprised if the pac gets a "good"
deal - and, i can't OU/WA signing a grant of rights at all. IIRC, the six year deal wasn't going to require a GOR

(11-10-2022 09:19 AM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-09-2022 05:58 PM)Charlie Broadway Wrote:  Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

somewhere, i saw that one of the reasons that gonzaga is looking to move, is to maintain their status, after mark few retires.

to me, that indicates that GU has some doubts about life after Mark Few. WSU and Gregg Marshall are a recent, cautionary tale. I do think that there's some risk, probably for both sides, but, as the saying goes, it doesn't hurt to talk.

You can say that about any school trying to get into a P5, they're worried about life after a coach leaves and they want the resources to keep this rolling and attract a quality coach which would be hard to doin the WCC, AAC or MWC. I think the difference between Wichita State abs Gonzaga are the conferences. Wichita State could have attracted a quality coach to replace Marshall if they were in the Big 12.

Every school is a bad hire away from mediocrity

(11-10-2022 09:19 AM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-09-2022 05:58 PM)Charlie Broadway Wrote:  Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

somewhere, i saw that one of the reasons that gonzaga is looking to move, is to maintain their status, after mark few retires.

to me, that indicates that GU has some doubts about life after Mark Few. WSU and Gregg Marshall are a recent, cautionary tale. I do think that there's some risk, probably for both sides, but, as the saying goes, it doesn't hurt to talk.

Gonzaga is closer to Duke than Wichita State IMO. Wichita State, while a great program under Marshall, was never a blue blood. Gonzaga is.

(11-23-2022 11:07 AM)bear2be2 Wrote:  

(11-10-2022 09:19 AM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-09-2022 05:58 PM)Charlie Broadway Wrote:  Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

somewhere, i saw that one of the reasons that gonzaga is looking to move, is to maintain their status, after mark few retires.

to me, that indicates that GU has some doubts about life after Mark Few. WSU and Gregg Marshall are a recent, cautionary tale. I do think that there's some risk, probably for both sides, but, as the saying goes, it doesn't hurt to talk.

Gonzaga is closer to Duke than Wichita State IMO. Wichita State, while a great program under Marshall, was never a blue blood. Gonzaga is.

I kindly disagree about Gonzaga being tagged as a blue blood although I do agree them being slightly over Wichita State.

Let’s look UConn for example… They were nearly nonexistent their performance while in the AAC was close to pitiful, well at least in my view.

(11-23-2022 11:39 AM)BigHouston Wrote:  

(11-23-2022 11:07 AM)bear2be2 Wrote:  

(11-10-2022 09:19 AM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-09-2022 05:58 PM)Charlie Broadway Wrote:  Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

somewhere, i saw that one of the reasons that gonzaga is looking to move, is to maintain their status, after mark few retires.

to me, that indicates that GU has some doubts about life after Mark Few. WSU and Gregg Marshall are a recent, cautionary tale. I do think that there's some risk, probably for both sides, but, as the saying goes, it doesn't hurt to talk.

Gonzaga is closer to Duke than Wichita State IMO. Wichita State, while a great program under Marshall, was never a blue blood. Gonzaga is.

I kindly disagree about Gonzaga being tagged as a blue blood although I do agree them being slightly over Wichita State.

Let’s look UConn for example… They were nearly nonexistent their performance while in the AAC was close to pitiful, well at least in my view.

They just dropped out the top five for the first time in like five years this week. They've played for two national titles over that stretch and recruit at an elite level.

I think Gonzaga has reached a level, like Duke under Coach K, where it would take a monumental screw up to derail that train. The commitment and expectation level is too high and the potential coaching talent pool too deep for that program to collapse within years of Few's retirement.

Just for the record, I'm not suggesting Gonzaga is as good as Duke, but it's closer to that level than Wichita State or any of these other programs that had strong 10-15 year stretches under one coach.

(11-23-2022 01:10 PM)bear2be2 Wrote:  

(11-23-2022 11:39 AM)BigHouston Wrote:  

(11-23-2022 11:07 AM)bear2be2 Wrote:  

(11-10-2022 09:19 AM)dave108 Wrote:  

(11-09-2022 05:58 PM)Charlie Broadway Wrote:  Add me to list of Gonzaga skeptics. AMAZING program, but as others have said the Wichita St experience scares me. I have a lot of respect for their program too. I just expected more when they joined.

somewhere, i saw that one of the reasons that gonzaga is looking to move, is to maintain their status, after mark few retires.

to me, that indicates that GU has some doubts about life after Mark Few. WSU and Gregg Marshall are a recent, cautionary tale. I do think that there's some risk, probably for both sides, but, as the saying goes, it doesn't hurt to talk.

Gonzaga is closer to Duke than Wichita State IMO. Wichita State, while a great program under Marshall, was never a blue blood. Gonzaga is.

I kindly disagree about Gonzaga being tagged as a blue blood although I do agree them being slightly over Wichita State.

Let’s look UConn for example… They were nearly nonexistent their performance while in the AAC was close to pitiful, well at least in my view.

They just dropped out the top five for the first time in like five years this week. They've played for two national titles over that stretch and recruit at an elite level.

I think Gonzaga has reached a level, like Duke under Coach K, where it would take a monumental screw up to derail that train. The commitment and expectation level is too high and the potential coaching talent pool too deep for that program to collapse within years of Few's retirement.

Just for the record, I'm not suggesting Gonzaga is as good as Duke, but it's closer to that level than Wichita State or any of these other programs that had strong 10-15 year stretches under one coach.

Don’t get me wrong I actually like Gonzaga I think they’re a proven basketball program… My biggest concern however is them falling off after stiffer competition in the Big12

(11-23-2022 10:29 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  Every school is a bad hire away from mediocrity

UC hired Tuberville and for 4 years it was downhill. Fickell righted the ship.

In BB we hired Brannen and then Wes Miller we are on our 4th down year.

(11-23-2022 06:08 PM)doss2 Wrote:  

(11-23-2022 10:29 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  Every school is a bad hire away from mediocrity

UC hired Tuberville and for 4 years it was downhill. Fickell righted the ship.

In BB we hired Brannen and then Wes Miller we are on our 4th down year.

Happens everywhere eventually. No matter what level they are at. You not only need the right coach, but the right coach for your program.

Scott frost is perfect example, he was perfect fit at UCF and AAC, but horrid at Nebraska. He will do well at USF if hired. Big 10 was wrong conference for his style of play.