(01-24-2022 06:01 PM)johnintx Wrote: Someone upthread made a good point. CSU is a P5 school with a G5 athletic department.
It's interesting how this all played out through time. Colorado State is a similar institution to Kansas State, Iowa State, and Oklahoma State. Owing to their history as a land-grant institution, they have been using a throwback orange "A" for Aggies. However, it doesn't seem like they've attained a statewide following as KSU, ISU, and OSU have, though they are the state land-grant school. Sure, rural Colorado has been now dwarfed by the growth in the Denver metro area. But, is there a reason why, going back decades (before Denver got big), that CSU's athletic following didn't match those other schools? Is it because KSU/ISU/OSU were competing with midwest flagships in the Big 8, while CSU was competing with mountain schools?
I know it could be the culture of the state, as well, as CU's fan base is smaller than those of its historic peers.
Nonetheless, Denver is a pro market, and that extends to the rest of the state. Broncos uber alles.
When conferences were being formed in the 1920's Iowa had 2-1/2 times the population of Colorado. Iowa State is the dominant school in western Iowa except for perhaps at one time Drake. Iowa City is not that far from Illinois. So when conferences were being formed ISU, Nebraska, Missouri, KU, K-State and Oklahoma formed a conference. Note they left out OSU. ISU and Oklahoma would not be in the same conference except for the schools in the middle (for some reason they called this the Missouri Valley Conference, perhaps for the Missouri River that flows past Omaha and Columbia, and near to Lawrence).
Remember you are traveling by train. Long distance travel by not so modern cars and not so modern highways that went through every town was not fun. You don't want to get caught in a whiteout blizzard in 2022. You certainly would not in 1922.
Meanwhile CSU, joined nearby schools DU, CU, and Wyoming, along with Utah, Utah State, and BYU. Two compact clusters with a long trip over the mountains. CSU was always kind of near the bottom with Utah, CU, and DU were the top schools, with BYU up and down.
It is hard to farm in Colorado without irrigation and relatively flat land, and a short growing season because of the altitude. So agriculture tends more to ranching and wheat farming on large tracts of land, which results in lower population density. So while there is agriculture around farm towns such as Ft.Collins, Greeley, Loveland, Longmont, Fort Morgan, Sterling, etc. that might be supportive of A&M, it is a relatively small area and population. And the normal school, which is now UNC, was in Greeley.
Few people lived in the High Plains or Mountains. Denver has always been a large dominant city towards the center of the state. Pueblo was a steel town, again less likely to identify with the Ag School on the other side of Denver.
After WWII, CU left to join the Missouri Valley which changed its name to Big 7. It probably was not joining K-State and ISU, but Nebraska, KU, Missouri, and Oklahoma. These were still a long way away, but not as far as they were in the 1920s. Mentally, it would be more like BYU or Boise State to Missouri. It is sort of like adding Nebraska, or Penn State, or Maryland or Rutgers to the B1G. The states touched.
DU dropped football, leaving CSU isolated with Wyoming. When the WAC was formed, CSU, Utah State, and Montana were dumped in favor of the Arizona schools. The original WAC was New Mexico, Arizona State, Arizona, Utah, BYU, and Wyoming. NMSU, CSU, and USU were left out. Arizona State might be a land grant college but it is essentially in Phoenix. Only a few years later were CSU and UTEP added, and even then they did not play a full schedule, beginning the first year with 3 conference games, and only reaching the full seven almost a decade later, just before Arizona and ASU jumped to the Pac 8.
Colorado has always been more of basketball area rather than football. James Naismith came to Denver (to get his MD) before he moved to KU who was followed by Phog Allen. The AAU was a big event in Denver when the NBA was a tiny circuit in the northeast. There is largely not organized football at the junior high level, so the high schools produce relatively fewer players.
Because so many people have moved to Colorado after college, there is less of an alumni and booster base. The Bronco fan base is much more college-like than most NFL cities. Of the original AFL 8, they have not moved like the Texans/Chiefs, Oilers/Titans, Oakland/LA/Oakland/Las Vegas Raiders, LA/San Diego/LA Chargers.
The Patriots were ranked about here relative to:
Red Sox
Bruins
Celtics
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Patriots
and might still be there if not for Tom Brady.
The Jets compete with the Yankees, Mets, Giants, Knicks, Rangers, Isles, Devils. Even Buffalo has moved out to the suburbs.
So I think the short answer is that by the time CSU got to where it is at now as an educational institution, other comparable institutions had moved on in the athletic world.
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Does Colorado State have what it takes to get into a P5 conference?
