(12-03-2021 07:51 AM)chess Wrote:  Can Penny get a quality assistant to help with game management?

Better than Larry Brown? I doubt it, mostly because there aren't that many people better than Brown alive or dead.

This doesn't surprise me at all .. one of the hardest things to do in coaching is to manage elite young talent and mold it into a team that respects roles and knows how to rely on more than superior athleticism when things get hard. There are almost always going to be growing pains around that.

(12-03-2021 10:56 AM)DuelingDragon Wrote:  This doesn't surprise me at all .. one of the hardest things to do in coaching is to manage elite young talent and mold it into a team that respects roles and knows how to rely on more than superior athleticism when things get hard. There are almost always going to be growing pains around that.

I would say that's the biggest issue, but I really don't know the details of what's up behind the scenes.

Duke and UK seem to be able to deal with it (other than UK last year). We'll see. I thought Brown would help with that, but not sure if Penny is listening.

I do know the fan base is restless, and there are already threads saying fire Penny, but he's not going to be fired anytime soon. Eventually, if he doesn't figure this out, but not this year. Even Larry Finch was fired, lol, so it's not impossible.

But we're a long way from that. I guess our fans forgot about Pastner and Tubby. And some fans are pulling for the NCAA to give Penny a show cause, and let Brown coach the team, lol.

(12-03-2021 11:11 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(12-03-2021 10:56 AM)DuelingDragon Wrote:  This doesn't surprise me at all .. one of the hardest things to do in coaching is to manage elite young talent and mold it into a team that respects roles and knows how to rely on more than superior athleticism when things get hard. There are almost always going to be growing pains around that.

I would say that's the biggest issue, but I really don't know the details of what's up behind the scenes.

Duke and UK seem to be able to deal with it (other than UK last year). We'll see. I thought Brown would help with that, but not sure if Penny is listening.

I do know the fan base is restless, and there are already threads saying fire Penny, but he's not going to be fired anytime soon. Eventually, if he doesn't figure this out, but not this year. Even Larry Finch was fired, lol, so it's not impossible.

But we're a long way from that. I guess our fans forgot about Pastner and Tubby. And some fans are pulling for the NCAA to give Penny a show cause, and let Brown coach the team, lol.

First, I acknowledge I don't know anything about the situation and have just watched Memphis play a few times. I have seen this play out at a lot of schools, though, whenever there's a big influx of young talent beyond the norm or in a rebuild mode.

Duke, UK, Kansas, UNC, etc., are a different animal I think. They've had 5-star prospects in their programs under established coaches for decades who have loads of experience managing those dynamics. Even then, it can go sideways as we saw with UK when the chemistry isn't right.

Memphis has a bunch of players used to being the guy who showed up to be "the guy." I read Penny's comments as him sending the message to his team that his expectations are about more than just being talented, and that some guys may have it twisted about what is important and that they need to recognize he controls the minutes.

Gotta be patient and tough love on them. Fans are gonna fan though, lol.

(12-03-2021 12:27 PM)DuelingDragon Wrote:  

(12-03-2021 11:11 AM)TripleA Wrote:  

(12-03-2021 10:56 AM)DuelingDragon Wrote:  This doesn't surprise me at all .. one of the hardest things to do in coaching is to manage elite young talent and mold it into a team that respects roles and knows how to rely on more than superior athleticism when things get hard. There are almost always going to be growing pains around that.

I would say that's the biggest issue, but I really don't know the details of what's up behind the scenes.

Duke and UK seem to be able to deal with it (other than UK last year). We'll see. I thought Brown would help with that, but not sure if Penny is listening.

I do know the fan base is restless, and there are already threads saying fire Penny, but he's not going to be fired anytime soon. Eventually, if he doesn't figure this out, but not this year. Even Larry Finch was fired, lol, so it's not impossible.

But we're a long way from that. I guess our fans forgot about Pastner and Tubby. And some fans are pulling for the NCAA to give Penny a show cause, and let Brown coach the team, lol.

First, I acknowledge I don't know anything about the situation and have just watched Memphis play a few times. I have seen this play out at a lot of schools, though, whenever there's a big influx of young talent beyond the norm or in a rebuild mode.

Duke, UK, Kansas, UNC, etc., are a different animal I think. They've had 5-star prospects in their programs under established coaches for decades who have loads of experience managing those dynamics. Even then, it can go sideways as we saw with UK when the chemistry isn't right.

Memphis has a bunch of players used to being the guy who showed up to be "the guy." I read Penny's comments as him sending the message to his team that his expectations are about more than just being talented, and that some guys may have it twisted about what is important and that they need to recognize he controls the minutes.

Gotta be patient and tough love on them. Fans are gonna fan though, lol.

The next two weeks are going to show what we need to know about this team, good or bad.

Assuming this result holds, he's gotta be in trouble now.

(12-04-2021 02:11 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  Assuming this result holds, he's gotta be in trouble now.

Didn't he sign an extension last year?

(12-04-2021 02:16 PM)WhoseHouse? Wrote:  

(12-04-2021 02:11 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  Assuming this result holds, he's gotta be in trouble now.

Didn't he sign an extension last year?

5 years at $12.25M total through 2025-26. But the school doesn't pay that. If this disaster continues, at some point the big boosters will cut bait. Just a matter of when.

We're still trying to make the Big 12 if they expand again. We won't let this go another 4 years, for certain.

Fans are hoping for a show cause for Penny from the NCAA now, lol.

Yikes. Georgia is bad and Ole Miss is pretty pedestrian -- probably NIT-level. Not good. Like TripleA said, it's gut check time. Beat Alabama and Tennessee and all will mostly be forgiven. Drop those two games, and it will be a tough uphill climb to get an at-large birth. Even Murray State is a potential land mine.

Clyde Drexler and James Dickey, you could argue, were the two best “recruiters” among all the basketball coaches UH has ever had. Just based on hype and rankings. Both were also are our shortest tenured coaches in history. You gotta win games. Five star guys are cool — as long as they are team players who understand that winning matters more than stat lines.

Yeah ... He's in trouble. He's lost 3 games in a row. On the road ... to Big 12 and SEC teams. Go figure. This team ain't top 25. Yet. Got a 6-1 Murray State team at home on Friday. Gotta beat the Racers !!! Go Tigers !!!

(12-04-2021 04:43 PM)steves Wrote:  Yeah ... He's in trouble. He's lost 3 games in a row. On the road ... to Big 12 and SEC teams. Go figure. This team ain't top 25. Yet. Got a 6-1 Murray State team at home on Friday. Gotta beat the Racers !!! Go Tigers !!!

Iowa State won 2 games last year. Picked last in the Big 12 this year.

Georgia picked last in the SEC.

Ole Miss middle of the pack, perhaps.

Murray State won't be easy. Then the next 2 are Alabama and Tennessee.

(12-04-2021 02:11 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  Assuming this result holds, he's gotta be in trouble now.

Out of the Top 25 for sure.

It’s about to be 8 years since Memphis made March Madness.

Penny is decent and will get you wins. That's about it imo.

(12-04-2021 09:24 PM)legacygt777 Wrote:  Penny is decent and will get you wins. That's about it imo.

I wouldn't be so sure any more.

(12-04-2021 09:24 PM)legacygt777 Wrote:  Penny is decent and will get you wins. That's about it imo.

Not if he keeps playing 12 guys and makes a line change every 3 minutes.

Are big crowds still going to the games? Or, has anyone seen a down tick of no shows?

(12-04-2021 03:54 PM)uhcoog27 Wrote:  Clyde Drexler and James Dickey, you could argue, were the two best “recruiters” among all the basketball coaches UH has ever had. Just based on hype and rankings. Both were also are our shortest tenured coaches in history. You gotta win games. Five star guys are cool — as long as they are team players who understand that winning matters more than stat lines.

A lot of these kids are more concerned with their stat lines because their goal is NBA, not winning championships. Unless Penny can manage this, Memphis will continue to under-perform.

(12-05-2021 01:01 PM)Fishpro10987 Wrote:  

(12-04-2021 03:54 PM)uhcoog27 Wrote:  Clyde Drexler and James Dickey, you could argue, were the two best “recruiters” among all the basketball coaches UH has ever had. Just based on hype and rankings. Both were also are our shortest tenured coaches in history. You gotta win games. Five star guys are cool — as long as they are team players who understand that winning matters more than stat lines.

A lot of these kids are more concerned with their stat lines because their goal is NBA, not winning championships. Unless Penny can manage this, Memphis will continue to under-perform.

The funny thing is, most stats aren't even that important in terms of NBA potential. We've seen one-and-done players average 10 ppg in college and go on to be NBA All-Stars. Efficiency and what you put on tape is more important than overall stats. If you're on a loaded team and share the ball too much to get a ton of field goal attempts, the scouts will still notice your efficiency metrics and shooting percentages.