(03-30-2013 09:08 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 08:40 PM)stever20 Wrote:  well, doesn't get any easier for C7 that doesn't want public schools now does it? The 2 top candidates are both public schools in Wichita and VCU.

No, I still see SLU as the top candidate.

Curious to see how good SLU and WSU are next season. Both lose some key pieces.

Personally if I had to put my chips on one, I'd got with WSU to sustain their success because Marshall has been successful everywhere. Not sold on Crewes...yet. I think we'll know just how good he is in two years when their top 8 scorers from this season have all graduated.

SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

WSU will be pretty good in a depleted Valley next year. They will still have Early, Van Vleet and Baker. Marshall is a good coach and reloads every year. This year was suppose to be a rebuilding year for them. I'd be worried about SLU. Crews is playing off of Majerus' players and supposedly isn't a great recruiter.

(03-30-2013 09:18 PM)stever20 Wrote:  SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

I think winning a stacked A-10 is pretty good credentials too.

(03-30-2013 09:18 PM)stever20 Wrote:  SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

We really can't wait for them as either the MWC or the Aresco league might lock them up.

(03-30-2013 09:53 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:18 PM)stever20 Wrote:  SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

We really can't wait for them as either the MWC or the Aresco league might lock them up.

There has been no reports or even rumors that C-TBA and MWC are interested in BBall schools.

(03-30-2013 09:47 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:18 PM)stever20 Wrote:  SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

I think winning a stacked A-10 is pretty good credentials too.

Compared to a final 4? Not a chance.

(03-30-2013 10:03 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:47 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:18 PM)stever20 Wrote:  SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

I think winning a stacked A-10 is pretty good credentials too.

Compared to a final 4? Not a chance.

Beating VCU twice in one season? Oh wait, VCU went to a final four 3 tournaments ago.

(03-30-2013 10:06 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 10:03 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:47 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:18 PM)stever20 Wrote:  SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

I think winning a stacked A-10 is pretty good credentials too.

Compared to a final 4? Not a chance.

Beating VCU twice in one season? Oh wait, VCU went to a final four 3 tournaments ago.

Still VCU has made a final four here in the last 3 years. SLU hasn't. It's not close between the two from a national perception.

(03-29-2013 05:01 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I get what you're saying but renewing doesn't happen until year 8 or 9. A conference isn't going to bring in more mouths unless its getting more food ($).

You assume TV money is the only thing. For many smaller conferences, it equates to less than half of the money a conference gets. Case in point, Witchita State just earned $9 million and counting for the MVC by getting to the Final Four. That is nearly half of their TV contract from one team.

(03-30-2013 10:01 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:53 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 09:18 PM)stever20 Wrote:  SLU doesn't have the on court credentials either VCU or Wichita have now. Going to the Final Four is a huge differential.

Makes me wonder if 12 is possible still for next year. Wichita could easily get out of the MWC for what is it 50k? Get them and VCU and call it a day.

We really can't wait for them as either the MWC or the Aresco league might lock them up.

There has been no reports or even rumors that C-TBA and MWC are interested in BBall schools.

True but both are at 12 football schools and 11 Olympic schools with the MWC (Hawaii football only), Aresco (Navy Football only). Kansas is contiguous to Colorado (MWC), Oklahoma (Aresco), and Nebraska (Big East).

All conferences have an issue: either no football or public school. At some point Wichita State with its high level ranking in multiple sports becomes too attractive for someone to pass up. The other two are going to regret passing on them. As a Butler and Fresno fan I hope it is one of the leagues I follow, but I think Aresco league will move the quickest.

I think they go with 3: VCU, Wichita State and one more. With Temple, UConn, Cincinnati, Memphis, VCU, and Wichita State they will reestablish themselves as a top basketball league.

(03-30-2013 08:18 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  Basketball is the last thing the Aresco league is worrying about. The presidents might not want to go back to that hybrid model. Nothing has come out that they would even be interested in a 12th bball team.

They already have a hybrid model with Navy. No matter what people want to say, a hybrid is a hybrid is a hybrid. Just like the ACC is not a hybrid.

If the Big East went WSU/VCU, it would be a good decision based on Tournament Success...you win in March, good things happen.

Good luck to whoever it may be.

(03-30-2013 10:20 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 05:01 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I get what you're saying but renewing doesn't happen until year 8 or 9. A conference isn't going to bring in more mouths unless its getting more food ($).

You assume TV money is the only thing. For many smaller conferences, it equates to less than half of the money a conference gets. Case in point, Witchita State just earned $9 million and counting for the MVC by getting to the Final Four. That is nearly half of their TV contract from one team.

Actually for Wichita St the number is 7.5 million. 5 units(that's the max) for 6 years. Each unit is 250k right now. You only get units for up to the final 4.

(03-30-2013 10:30 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 10:20 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 05:01 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I get what you're saying but renewing doesn't happen until year 8 or 9. A conference isn't going to bring in more mouths unless its getting more food ($).

You assume TV money is the only thing. For many smaller conferences, it equates to less than half of the money a conference gets. Case in point, Witchita State just earned $9 million and counting for the MVC by getting to the Final Four. That is nearly half of their TV contract from one team.

Actually for Wichita St the number is 7.5 million. 5 units(that's the max) for 6 years. Each unit is 250k right now. You only get units for up to the final 4.

True but the tournament is hot right now and revenue could go up with the contract comes up. I don't know when that is so I am absolutely speculating.

I don't know if the fan base reflects the conference Presidents but the Aresco league is most positive about adding VCU and Wichita State. The Big East is lukewarm and the MWC fans have their heads up that behinds.

(03-30-2013 10:38 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 10:30 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 10:20 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 05:01 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I get what you're saying but renewing doesn't happen until year 8 or 9. A conference isn't going to bring in more mouths unless its getting more food ($).

You assume TV money is the only thing. For many smaller conferences, it equates to less than half of the money a conference gets. Case in point, Witchita State just earned $9 million and counting for the MVC by getting to the Final Four. That is nearly half of their TV contract from one team.

Actually for Wichita St the number is 7.5 million. 5 units(that's the max) for 6 years. Each unit is 250k right now. You only get units for up to the final 4.

True but the tournament is hot right now and revenue could go up with the contract comes up. I don't know when that is so I am absolutely speculating.

I don't know if the fan base reflects the conference Presidents but the Aresco league is most positive about adding VCU and Wichita State. The Big East is lukewarm and the MWC fans have their heads up that behinds.

contract just was redone a few years ago. This is year 3 of like a 14 year deal I believe it was.

It's 5 units for 6 games. Only the championship game doesn't carry units.

(03-30-2013 10:49 PM)LouPower Wrote:  It's 5 units for 6 games. Only the championship game doesn't carry units.

Right, though for VCU, they only got 5 units 3 years ago, even though they played 6 games thru the semifinal game.

(03-30-2013 10:30 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 10:20 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 05:01 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I get what you're saying but renewing doesn't happen until year 8 or 9. A conference isn't going to bring in more mouths unless its getting more food ($).

You assume TV money is the only thing. For many smaller conferences, it equates to less than half of the money a conference gets. Case in point, Witchita State just earned $9 million and counting for the MVC by getting to the Final Four. That is nearly half of their TV contract from one team.

Actually for Wichita St the number is 7.5 million. 5 units(that's the max) for 6 years. Each unit is 250k right now. You only get units for up to the final 4.

$250k is the old number: it's over $300k now per unit.

Also note that to date every conference save for the current BE makes more money from the tourney's other payouts than the "NCAA credits," and the payouts are based on conference size and sports offered. So additional teams earn money that way as well, an average of about $2 million per team, deepening on a few things.

(03-30-2013 11:29 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 10:30 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(03-30-2013 10:20 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 05:01 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  I get what you're saying but renewing doesn't happen until year 8 or 9. A conference isn't going to bring in more mouths unless its getting more food ($).

You assume TV money is the only thing. For many smaller conferences, it equates to less than half of the money a conference gets. Case in point, Witchita State just earned $9 million and counting for the MVC by getting to the Final Four. That is nearly half of their TV contract from one team.

Actually for Wichita St the number is 7.5 million. 5 units(that's the max) for 6 years. Each unit is 250k right now. You only get units for up to the final 4.

$250k is the old number: it's over $300k now per unit.

Also note that to date every conference save for the current BE makes more money from the tourney's other payouts than the "NCAA credits," and the payouts are based on conference size and sports offered. So additional teams earn money that way as well, an average of about $2 million per team, deepening on a few things.

True but to value it correctly you should really consider the effect it has on relative strength. Meaning the perception of a Big East with VCU and Wichita State versus an Aresco league with both of them. Strength equates with TV dollars down the road. I know it is a stretch but not doing can get you in trouble.

For example at one point the MWC could have added more schools in Texas to complement TCU and more schools in CA to bring more population to the Mountain. They thought short term and are now out of Texas completely and have lost their league station which was carried by DirectTV. I don't think any league can be run as poorly as the MWC but we should think long term.