The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

(12-20-2012 04:03 PM)Whinny1 Wrote:  

(12-20-2012 02:35 PM)ESSSS Wrote:  

Quote:It turned into that debate because he's all aflutter about potential gun control, so they cut to god to deflect.

What are the expected outcomes with "gun control"?

The gun control proposal I hear of most often is abolishing the sale of assault-type weapons with large magazines, except for law enforcement and the military. Penalties for sale and possession would include large fines and jail time. Get them out of the hands of civilians, period. The expected outcome would be to make mass shootings resulting in dozens of deaths much less likely. Having to reload frequently would have allowed many more of the Sandy Hook children to run and escape. The same with the Aurora CO theater patrons.

But it's not just about gun control. We have to find a way to better locate, serve, and treat those with personality disorders and mental illness.

I would support the sale and possession of assault type weapons as long as they are kept under lock and key at a gun club. There is no reason for them to be in homes.

(12-20-2012 02:22 PM)Whinny1 Wrote:  It's unfortunate that this thread has turned into a pro/con religious discussion in this case. Yes, religious principles can be a factor. Good, healthy family structure can be a factor. A person's environment is a huge factor on a developing young adult.

In my eyes, this horrid massacre boiled down to one thing ... this was a young man who had not only been diagnosed with Asperger's (which has no connection with violence, BTW), but also had been diagnosed with several personality disorders, according to his uncle. He was not considered to be a threat, and was not disturbed enough to warrant institutionalization of any kind. His mother had followed through with therapy and medication suggestions. She was home schooling him because of his discomfort in interacting with his peers in high school. He was described by neighbors as a loner, extremely remote, introverted, and without friends. His mother had done everything possible to help him. But he continued to fall through the cracks of the system. Truth be told, there are MANY people like this, who can't get the kind of help they need, because they are not considered severe enough.

The shooter developed an interest in guns, which his mother collected. She encouraged him to respect firearms, and made sure he knew how to handle them safely. They sometimes went to the gun range together. The guns were always locked in a gun safe at home. In the meantime, the son became obsessed with war video games, like Call of Duty and World of Warcraft. (I've seen the ads for Call of Duty. I can't watch them. Not when a guy with a gun is mowing down scads of people with his assault rifle.) If the son wasn't being home schooled, he was playing the games. He asked to move down into the basement, where he had a bunker-like, windowless room. He covered the walls with war and violent video game posters. He bought camo suits. His mother was glad that he was showing an interest in something.

And then the unthinkable happened, due to a sick young man who didn't get the right kind of help he desperately needed.

Well said, Whinny. Well said.

(12-20-2012 03:59 PM)EA3 Wrote:  

(12-20-2012 03:50 PM)Whinny1 Wrote:  

(12-20-2012 02:25 PM)EA3 Wrote:  Has anyone read how he got his hands on the guns if they were kept under lock and key in the house?

Yep. His mom was out of town from Tues until Thurs night last week. He was alone in the house. That gave him time to find the key and make his plans to be the "war hero."

Well...that's certainly a variable that could have been controlled by someone else. Unfortunately the mom ended up paying the ultimate price. (wishing she took the key with her...so sad)

The mom has been quoted as saying that her son was finally in a place where he was doing very well. She never had any reason to believe that he might turn violent. She was really happy about his progress, as she had M.S. and wasn't sure how much time she had left. She wanted to get him settled in college so he'd be able to have a career and be able to take care of himself. Unfortunately, there were only the two of them living in the home. She was a single mom, and her other son lived with his father in another area. So there weren't "someone elses" to intervene or control the situation.

(12-20-2012 04:15 PM)Whinny1 Wrote:  

(12-20-2012 03:59 PM)EA3 Wrote:  

(12-20-2012 03:50 PM)Whinny1 Wrote:  

(12-20-2012 02:25 PM)EA3 Wrote:  Has anyone read how he got his hands on the guns if they were kept under lock and key in the house?

Yep. His mom was out of town from Tues until Thurs night last week. He was alone in the house. That gave him time to find the key and make his plans to be the "war hero."

Well...that's certainly a variable that could have been controlled by someone else. Unfortunately the mom ended up paying the ultimate price. (wishing she took the key with her...so sad)

The mom has been quoted as saying that her son was finally in a place where he was doing very well. She never had any reason to believe that he might turn violent. She was really happy about his progress, as she had M.S. and wasn't sure how much time she had left. She wanted to get him settled in college so he'd be able to have a career and be able to take care of himself. Unfortunately, there were only the two of them living in the home. She was a single mom, and her other son lived with his father in another area. So there weren't "someone elses" to intervene or control the situation.

I was referring to the mom as "someone else".

It's sad, it's unfortunate...but the mom made a fatal error in misjudging her son's progress. Maybe he was smart enough to fool her. I don't know.

Hindsight is 20/20, and I can't say I would do anything different than the mom. However, if she was smart enough to hide the key, that means she didn't trust him 100% with the guns. I wish she would have taken the key with her. That's all.

(12-20-2012 02:35 PM)ESSSS Wrote:  

Quote:It turned into that debate because he's all aflutter about potential gun control, so they cut to god to deflect.

What are the expected outcomes with "gun control"?

What are the expected outcomes of "traffic laws"?

Quote:What are the expected outcomes of "traffic laws"?

I'm not sure that "traffic laws" are a commodity that many in general public would demand to have.

Guns, like drugs and alcohol are.

Do you think a black market in traffic laws would evolve if we got rid of them?

Having said that, I'm just wondering if folks feel strongly that "gun control" would result in fewer violent crimes?

Quote:m not sure that "traffic laws" are a commodity that many in general public would demand to have.

A traffic law might not be a commodity, but a car is now days.

Quote:Do you think a black market in traffic laws would evolve if we got rid of them?

A black market for licenses when they are revoked is already in place.