Fo Shizzle
Pragmatic Classical Liberal
Posts: 42,023
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 1206
I Root For: ECU PIRATES
Location: North Carolina
|
North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
The state is paying 12 million to take over one of NCs biggest tourist attractions and historic landmarks. This includes 8k of surrounding land and the historic "swinging bridge".
Im sorry to see this happen...Anytime a govt. bureaucracy takes over private lands...they go....downhill fast. Tragedy of the commons!
|
|
09-28-2008 07:46 PM |
|
ETSUfan1
SoCon / ETSU Mod
Posts: 12,628
Joined: Apr 2005
Reputation: 93
I Root For: ETSU Football
Location: Abingdon, VA
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Been there a few times. Why are they taking it over?
(This post was last modified: 09-29-2008 12:20 AM by ETSUfan1.)
|
|
09-28-2008 07:47 PM |
|
Fo Shizzle
Pragmatic Classical Liberal
Posts: 42,023
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 1206
I Root For: ECU PIRATES
Location: North Carolina
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
ETSUfan1 Wrote:Been there a few times? Why are they taking it over?
I think its been run privately after Hugh Morton died in 06? I dont know the details...all I know is I hate to see the govt. take over.
|
|
09-28-2008 07:56 PM |
|
flyingswoosh
Hall of Famer
Posts: 15,863
Joined: Jul 2003
Reputation: 69
I Root For:
Location:
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Fo Shizzle Wrote:The state is paying 12 million to take over one of NCs biggest tourist attractions and historic landmarks. This includes 8k of surrounding land and the historic "swinging bridge".
Im sorry to see this happen...Anytime a govt. bureaucracy takes over private lands...they go....downhill fast. Tragedy of the commons!
that is too bad. I've been there twice, it's really beautiful. Good hiking, especially if you go off the trails.
|
|
09-28-2008 07:58 PM |
|
TomorrowHerd
Protecting the Northern Flank
Posts: 2,614
Joined: Aug 2003
Reputation: 132
I Root For: Pie!!!!
Location: Anchorage, AK
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Are they going to make it a state park?
|
|
09-29-2008 03:45 AM |
|
Fo Shizzle
Pragmatic Classical Liberal
Posts: 42,023
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 1206
I Root For: ECU PIRATES
Location: North Carolina
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
TomorrowHerd Wrote:Are they going to make it a state park?
Thats my understanding. Id rather it remained private property.
|
|
09-29-2008 06:25 AM |
|
DrTorch
Proved mach and GTS to be liars
Posts: 35,887
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 201
I Root For: ASU, BGSU
Location:
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Fo Shizzle Wrote:The state is paying 12 million to take over one of NCs biggest tourist attractions and historic landmarks. This includes 8k of surrounding land and the historic "swinging bridge".
Im sorry to see this happen...Anytime a govt. bureaucracy takes over private lands...they go....downhill fast. Tragedy of the commons!
If you don't already know it, I think you'll enjoy this blog.
http://www.coyoteblog.com/coyote_blog/20...s-and.html
Scroll down to the bottom of this day's entry
Quote:The other problem sitting on my desk is a snack bar I inherited on a lease in California at Lake Piru. The snack bar is a dump. It is designed wrong, it is set up to cook the wrong kinds of foods, and uses space in the building very inefficiently. I want to lay the whole thing out differently, as a win-win for everyone. We could sell more with fewer workers. The customers would get more selection, including much healthier choices. The operation would be safer, because we would eliminate most of the heavy cooking (e.g. deep fat fryers). And it would be cleaner, with less wastewater and cleaner wastewater because there would be less grease and oil.
Unfortunately, it is very clear that Ventura County, California is not going to allow me to make these changes, at least at any cost I can afford. First, apparently I need to build a new wastewater treatment plant for the snack bar! But I am reducing the waste water load, I argue. Does not matter. New code requires a plant. So because of this environmental code, I am pushed to continue the current operation which is environmentally worse than my proposed alternative. We have the exact same problem on fire suppression. But I am removing the ovens and most of the cooking equipment! It's safer! Doesn't matter, if I make any change at all, I have to install a new fire suppression system. And on and on. this is the true face of government regulation. We face this kind of thing ten times a day.
|
|
09-29-2008 10:36 AM |
|
flyingswoosh
Hall of Famer
Posts: 15,863
Joined: Jul 2003
Reputation: 69
I Root For:
Location:
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
gotta love Cali
|
|
09-29-2008 11:05 AM |
|
I45owl
Hall of Famer
Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
I think we went there just after September 11. It was nice, but I grew up going to the Rocky Mountains every summer, so the Appalachians aren't too impressive to me on the whole. I don't seem to remember the bridge, though, so we must not have known about it, or may have wandered aimlessly.
With regards to building codes - I think a whole lot of people in the Houston area are glad to have them at this point, and I have to believe that only a fraction of the 80000+ that died in Szechuan province would have died if the buildings were built to American like codes. Codes themselves I think are good, but transitioning facilities that are grandfathered often leads to ridiculous things like what you quote. If you accept that codes are necessary or useful, then what is the alternative? It seems like there could be a reasonable solution, but it also seems like it could easily be abused to look like a completely new facility that's allowed to bypass codes through a loophole.
|
|
09-29-2008 11:16 AM |
|
Rebel
Unregistered
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Maybe it's just me, but the Rockies PALE in comparison to the Smokies. The only thing they have on them is height. Nothing else.
|
|
09-29-2008 11:19 AM |
|
I45owl
Hall of Famer
Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Rebel Wrote:Maybe it's just me, but the Rockies PALE in comparison to the Smokies. The only thing they have on them is height. Nothing else.
I thought we were comparing mountain ranges?
|
|
09-29-2008 12:04 PM |
|
Rebel
Unregistered
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
I45owl Wrote:Rebel Wrote:Maybe it's just me, but the Rockies PALE in comparison to the Smokies. The only thing they have on them is height. Nothing else.
I thought we were comparing mountain ranges?
Smokies, Blue Ridge, Appalachians, all the same to me.
|
|
09-29-2008 12:08 PM |
|
I45owl
Hall of Famer
Posts: 18,374
Joined: Jun 2005
Reputation: 184
I Root For: Rice Owls
Location: Dallas, TX
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
If you exclude the natural beauty of the rocks, the aspen, pine, snow covered mountain tops, actual wildlife, and other such things, I could see where you're coming from. I do like the smokies (I prefer most mountain-like things to plains or hills or the like), but they seem like a pale imitation to me. I guess you'd have to be more specific about which areas you're comparing.
|
|
09-29-2008 12:20 PM |
|
Rebel
Unregistered
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
I45owl Wrote:If you exclude the natural beauty of the rocks, the aspen, pine, snow covered mountain tops, actual wildlife, and other such things, I could see where you're coming from. I do like the smokies (I prefer most mountain-like things to plains or hills or the like), but they seem like a pale imitation to me. I guess you'd have to be more specific about which areas you're comparing.
Never seen the Aspens during "that" season when they all turn, but I've been to the Rockies. Cascades are nice as are the Olympics. There's an actual rain forest on the Olympic peninsula. The Alaskan range is also nice. They're just all a little too high for me. Never been to the Sierra Nevadas. Have been to the Ozarks. Those are nice, IMO. Isn't the oldest in the country the Wichita Mountains in Oklahoma?
|
|
09-29-2008 12:30 PM |
|
Fo Shizzle
Pragmatic Classical Liberal
Posts: 42,023
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 1206
I Root For: ECU PIRATES
Location: North Carolina
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
I45owl Wrote:If you exclude the natural beauty of the rocks, the aspen, pine, snow covered mountain tops, actual wildlife, and other such things, I could see where you're coming from. I do like the smokies (I prefer most mountain-like things to plains or hills or the like), but they seem like a pale imitation to me. I guess you'd have to be more specific about which areas you're comparing.
The Rockies are shockn'awe....Smokies are moonshine and shade...both are wonderful to me in different ways.
|
|
09-29-2008 02:06 PM |
|
Lord Stanley
L'Étoile du Nord
Posts: 19,103
Joined: Feb 2005
Reputation: 994
I Root For: NIU
Location: Cold. So cold......
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Fo Shizzle Wrote:The state is paying 12 million to take over one of NCs biggest tourist attractions and historic landmarks. This includes 8k of surrounding land and the historic "swinging bridge".
Im sorry to see this happen...Anytime a govt. bureaucracy takes over private lands...they go....downhill fast. Tragedy of the commons!
Hey, your point is well taken, but
"private" lands has reduced my hunting and fishing land by god knows what percentage. "Public" land has many good uses, and everyone's enjoyment of the outdoors would be limited if all land was private land...... especially the outdoorsman, who do so much to keep the public land in good shape.
|
|
09-29-2008 03:09 PM |
|
smn1256
I miss Tripster
Posts: 28,878
Joined: Apr 2008
Reputation: 337
I Root For: Lower taxes
Location: North Mexico
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
DrTorch Wrote:Scroll down to the bottom of this day's entry
Quote:The other problem sitting on my desk is a snack bar I inherited on a lease in California at Lake Piru. The snack bar is a dump. It is designed wrong, it is set up to cook the wrong kinds of foods, and uses space in the building very inefficiently. I want to lay the whole thing out differently, as a win-win for everyone. We could sell more with fewer workers. The customers would get more selection, including much healthier choices. The operation would be safer, because we would eliminate most of the heavy cooking (e.g. deep fat fryers). And it would be cleaner, with less wastewater and cleaner wastewater because there would be less grease and oil.
Unfortunately, it is very clear that Ventura County, California is not going to allow me to make these changes, at least at any cost I can afford. First, apparently I need to build a new wastewater treatment plant for the snack bar! But I am reducing the waste water load, I argue. Does not matter. New code requires a plant. So because of this environmental code, I am pushed to continue the current operation which is environmentally worse than my proposed alternative. We have the exact same problem on fire suppression. But I am removing the ovens and most of the cooking equipment! It's safer! Doesn't matter, if I make any change at all, I have to install a new fire suppression system. And on and on. this is the true face of government regulation. We face this kind of thing ten times a day.
This is true with many building codes across the country. Open up a wall and see wiring? Well, if the wiring is not to code you have to replace it. Is the header over a door or window not up to code? If you open the wall and it is you'll have to replace it.
While the above example is frustrating, if we have codes and they're interpreted differently by different people in different situations then the codes sort of become useless. I'd even argue that if there's a chance of getting an exception to a code then getting a permit to do something might take even longer and be more expensive than usual because you'd have to argue your point to the governing agency and wait for them to decide - then you might appeal and it would take even longer. Strictly enforcing code might ensure migraines and ulcers but it keeps things consistent and the line moving.
|
|
09-29-2008 04:36 PM |
|
Fo Shizzle
Pragmatic Classical Liberal
Posts: 42,023
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 1206
I Root For: ECU PIRATES
Location: North Carolina
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Lord Stanley Wrote:Fo Shizzle Wrote:The state is paying 12 million to take over one of NCs biggest tourist attractions and historic landmarks. This includes 8k of surrounding land and the historic "swinging bridge".
Im sorry to see this happen...Anytime a govt. bureaucracy takes over private lands...they go....downhill fast. Tragedy of the commons!
Hey, your point is well taken, but
"private" lands has reduced my hunting and fishing land by god knows what percentage. "Public" land has many good uses, and everyone's enjoyment of the outdoors would be limited if all land was private land...... especially the outdoorsman, who do so much to keep the public land in good shape.
I think in a world of only "private" land that those problems would be solved with free market solutions like Disney World and private hunting and fishing reserves(which already exist)..but..I see your concern.
I guess my biggest problem with public lands is the same problem I have with almost all government programs...they are financed by the coercive use of force against those that dont use them.
|
|
09-29-2008 04:53 PM |
|
smn1256
I miss Tripster
Posts: 28,878
Joined: Apr 2008
Reputation: 337
I Root For: Lower taxes
Location: North Mexico
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
Fo Shizzle Wrote:I guess my biggest problem with public lands is the same problem I have with almost all government programs...they are financed by the coercive use of force against those that dont use them.
Good point.
Obama, are you listening?
|
|
09-29-2008 07:26 PM |
|
Fo Shizzle
Pragmatic Classical Liberal
Posts: 42,023
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 1206
I Root For: ECU PIRATES
Location: North Carolina
|
RE: North Carolina to take over historical "Grandfather Mountian".
smn1256 Wrote:Fo Shizzle Wrote:I guess my biggest problem with public lands is the same problem I have with almost all government programs...they are financed by the coercive use of force against those that dont use them.
Good point.
Obama, are you listening?
Well..Let's be principled with that view. Both parties are guilty of the same use of coercive force through taxation....They just choose to spend(or waste) it in different ways.
|
|
09-29-2008 07:55 PM |
|