CardinalJim Wrote:"We have a commitment that the schools will be together at least five more years [because of the TV contract],'' Tranghese said. "Aside from that, though, I haven't had one conversation about a possible split with our presidents. ...."

If Tranghese is placing his hope on the TV contract being a reason for the football playing schools to stick with the basketball onlys then he is in for a rude awakening. Didn't the Big East have football and basketball TV contracts when VT and Miami left for the ACC? Didn't CUSA have same type contracts when teams left and joined that conference? Does he really think that the fans of Big East football schools are going to be convinced that signed contract will not be broken? Mike how many signed contracts have the football schools had with scheduled opponents just to have them voided.

As usual Mike's zeal to protect the basketball onlys is showing. When the split occurs Mike will be one of the last to know. If he did know something now what purpose would it serve for him to announce it?

Consider this scenario.......

You have decided to start a business. Like most you feel like they can make more money doing what you are doing today for yourself instead of another company. When are you going to tell your boss your leaving? When you start planning the exit or after you have a plan in place? Again why would the football playing schools talk to Tranghese about leaving?

Some strange things about this article......

1. Tranghese calls the televison contract "a commitment ", not a contract.

2. Tranghese mentions a "split". Before this article he most always talked about expansion only.

3. The writer mentions Memphis by name. Is he hearing something or is he reading this messageboard and others like it?

Some may think that this article is an answer to an often asked question about the future of this conference. In my opinion the article creates as many questions as it answers.
CJ

The Big East haS been an 8 team FB league since it's inception and it will probaly stay that way unless notre dame joins, which is not likely unless they become just an average FB school and NBC dumps them.
It is what it is an 8 team FB league"oh how boring".

Of course he hasn't had a conversation with any of the presidents about a split, they didn't talk to him about adding Cincinnati and Louisville, the presidents and chancellors did it on their own.

Wow. You realize that 3 of the top 5 schools in hoops are bball schools, while the bottom 2 teams are football schools. You realize that MU went to the final four before they were even invited to join the BE. You realize that you are saying that the hoops schools would be on par with LaSalle if they were without the football schools. Ouch. For some reason, I don't think you are painting an accurate picture.

Then they shouldn't have any problem forming their own conference.

BTW, if you dump the bball schools, you will lose your ties to the Chicago, New York, Milwaukee, D.C. and Phily markets. No more trips to New York or Chicago, to play in front of recruits (potential students as well as athletes) and alumni.

Last I checked Syracuse was still part of New York, and Rutgers is close enough. If the Big East really wanted Philly they could add Temple.

Yup, that will be good for you school and the old ESPN contracts. While the conference may split one day, there are heck of a lot of benefits to the football schools to the current arrangement. The Presidents see it, even if certain football fans do not.

Well, the Presidents are going to feel a lot of heat from these fans as time goes on. And those certain fans are going to force them to make a change or stop supporting them. What are the benefits for the football schools in the long term? Being stuck at 8 teams? Being vulnerable to a raid? Being labelled a basketball conference?

Stookey57 Wrote:

CardinalJim Wrote:"We have a commitment that the schools will be together at least five more years [because of the TV contract],'' Tranghese said. "Aside from that, though, I haven't had one conversation about a possible split with our presidents. ...."

If Tranghese is placing his hope on the TV contract being a reason for the football playing schools to stick with the basketball onlys then he is in for a rude awakening. Didn't the Big East have football and basketball TV contracts when VT and Miami left for the ACC? Didn't CUSA have same type contracts when teams left and joined that conference? Does he really think that the fans of Big East football schools are going to be convinced that signed contract will not be broken? Mike how many signed contracts have the football schools had with scheduled opponents just to have them voided.

As usual Mike's zeal to protect the basketball onlys is showing. When the split occurs Mike will be one of the last to know. If he did know something now what purpose would it serve for him to announce it?

Consider this scenario.......

You have decided to start a business. Like most you feel like they can make more money doing what you are doing today for yourself instead of another company. When are you going to tell your boss your leaving? When you start planning the exit or after you have a plan in place? Again why would the football playing schools talk to Tranghese about leaving?

Some strange things about this article......

1. Tranghese calls the televison contract "a commitment ", not a contract.

2. Tranghese mentions a "split". Before this article he most always talked about expansion only.

3. The writer mentions Memphis by name. Is he hearing something or is he reading this messageboard and others like it?

Some may think that this article is an answer to an often asked question about the future of this conference. In my opinion the article creates as many questions as it answers.
CJ

The Big East haS been an 8 team FB league since it's inception and it will probaly stay that way unless notre dame joins, which is not likely unless they become just an average FB school and NBC dumps them.
It is what it is an 8 team FB league"oh how boring".

You completely missed the point it has stayed an 8 team league, which means, while other conferences have grown and changed with the times the Big East has stayed stagnant. Saying "it is what it is" is ridiculous. In order to keep up with the other BCS conferences the Big East is going to have to be aggressive and proactive, not just settle for something they have had for 15 years. That's why the conference was raided 8 years ago, because it had no vision.

By the way, Tranghese already gave a hint that he and the football schools were at odds:

Quote:Our football people would like to add a ninth school,'' Tranghese said Tuesday, "but we're at 16 [in basketball].

"Some say we should add a school for football only. Well, whom would we add to make us better? Right now there's not a lot of support to add a ninth [football] team.''

This issue, of course, comes up each year from at least one school that has but three conference games at home. Last season, WVU squawked with just Louisville, Connecticut and Pitt at Mountaineer Field.

From this viewpoint, it seems the only solution to the football scheduling problem would involve a major conference upheaval. If the "football schools'' disengaged from the remaining "basketball schools'' and added, say, Memphis, the problem would be solved.

MU88 Wrote:Wow. You realize that 3 of the top 5 schools in hoops are bball schools, while the bottom 2 teams are football schools. You realize that MU went to the final four before they were even invited to join the BE. You realize that you are saying that the hoops schools would be on par with LaSalle if they were without the football schools. Ouch. For some reason, I don't think you are painting an accurate picture.

BTW, if you dump the bball schools, you will lose your ties to the Chicago, New York, Milwaukee, D.C. and Phily markets. No more trips to New York or Chicago, to play in front of recruits (potential students as well as athletes) and alumni. Yup, that will be good for you school and the old ESPN contracts. While the conference may split one day, there are heck of a lot of benefits to the football schools to the current arrangement. The Presidents see it, even if certain football fans do not.

It sounds like you're saying that the football schools need the bball schools in order to have a strong bball conference. If thats what you're saying then you're very wrong. By the way, you count Notre Dame as a bball school? They may not play football in the Big East but they're definitely a football school. Also there are only two bball schools in the top 9 of the conference. Rutgers and USF are at the bottom of the conference but between Syracuse at #9 and Rutgers at #16 are the rest of the bball schools and they're all within 2-3 games of each other.

How did the BE ever survive without the Chicago and Milwaukee markets??? The BE was succesful for a long time before MU and Depaul joined the league. My guess is they'll continue to be succesful without them. The fact is the BE doesn't own either of those markets, those areas will always be owned by the B10 just like the ACC owns the DC area. Marquette, Depaul, and Georgetown get attention in their home cities but they, by no means, own those markets. More importantly they do absolutely nothing for the BE during football season.

Despite what bball fans would like for the rest of us to believe, a strong bball conference is not enough to keep the BCS slot or hold this conference together. The only thing that will do that is a strong and stable conference for all sports.

We all know a split is coing and the BB only schools will be just fine. They can add new BB only members.

I don't think this is about BB vs FB schools in the BE. The new members to the conference I think drive this more. Syr and G'town have a long tradition just as UofL and Memphis have a history. Most of my life I hated G'town now I root for them as well. I think we will split but I also think both sides are strong. The weakest element in all of this is the FB schools are not strong enough to bring in new members. Mike T does not want to bring in another starter-up FB school when our current schools are gaining the worse class of recruits inthe BCS.
Memphis, ECU, UCF, Temple, Umass, no matter where you look, none of these schools help us in FB. They are all works in progress. Why jump the gun to bring them in. How does that benefit the BE? It benefits those schools but not the conference in terms of strength.
We're not ranked above the ACc and the Big 10- this year. Let's just keep that up- see what the Big 10 does with Rutgers what Rutgers does, (Syr won't join the Big 10- Syr has nothign the Big 10 wants, Syr has no real market the Big 10 benefits from). maybe we don't have to add fixer-uppers. maybe we can split and add somebody good if the money, markets and opp. is there.
I thnk MikeT did a good job so far. By all accounts, BE football is way ahead of what anyone predicted. Mike T is not a fool.

panite Wrote:Typical BB ND puppet. He knows that the BB schools will take a hit if the FB schools split. Especially his beloved Providence. No more big gates to rake in the cash when Cuse, Conn, L'ville, Cinn, Pitt, and WV come into town. They will be down to ND, Gtown, and Nova. The cash cow gates drop from 9 to 3 and that happens across the board with all the Catholic schools. Its no wonder Goose, ND, and the BB schools want to keep this thing together. With those 5 big gates gone the TV revenue will drop too. That is another key as to why the Goose and ND and the BB schools want to keep this thing together and control it from the BB side. That is why Goose keeps throwing trinket bowls at the FB schools as bait to try and keep them happy. The power in the TV contracts is with the FB schools for BB and FB. The FB schools double dip for TV in two sports while the BB schools only get one shot.

The best thing for the BE right now if they want to save the "East of the Mississippi Market" is to pick up Memphis all sports with their BB and Liberty Bowl following and go to 17. Play 16 conference games 8 home and 8 away or split into divisions with H&A games and cross over games. If the BB schools don't like it they can leave. If the consenses is for UCF do the same thing and work on Florida Bowls that most of the BE fans would travel too during the Christmas and New Years Holidays not before or after.

So what if the power mongers of the BB and ND side are down one vote. Its better to have a piece of something than to have it all slip thru your hands and have nothing at all. The time for NE small potates thinking is over. Its time to think big and start working on getting there. Rutgers is started with stadium expansion to 56,000 in 2009. They are only 39 years behind South Carolina who had a 54,000 seat stadium in 1971. Eleven years later they grew to 72,400 and 14 years after that they grew to 80,250. I hope Rutgers expedites that and gets to 80,000 in about a 1/3 of the time. They have the stadium to do it. Expand and grow or be left behind. Its time to leave the Goose-BB-ND protectionist era behind if the those entiies are not willing to let the FB schools grow by at least one to help with the problems on their side.

Again, brillantly said!

army56mike Wrote:The basketball schools are in desperation mode to keep the football schools around. Without them, the basketball schools aren't any better than a middle of the road Atlantic 10 team. The football schools could have the world, but are being held in check for now.

Spot on Mike!

CardinalJim Wrote:"We have a commitment that the schools will be together at least five more years [because of the TV contract],'' Tranghese said. "Aside from that, though, I haven't had one conversation about a possible split with our presidents. ...."

If Tranghese is placing his hope on the TV contract being a reason for the football playing schools to stick with the basketball onlys then he is in for a rude awakening. Didn't the Big East have football and basketball TV contracts when VT and Miami left for the ACC? Didn't CUSA have same type contracts when teams left and joined that conference? Does he really think that the fans of Big East football schools are going to be convinced that signed contract will not be broken? Mike how many signed contracts have the football schools had with scheduled opponents just to have them voided.

As usual Mike's zeal to protect the basketball onlys is showing. When the split occurs Mike will be one of the last to know. If he did know something now what purpose would it serve for him to announce it?

Consider this scenario.......

You have decided to start a business. Like most you feel like they can make more money doing what you are doing today for yourself instead of another company. When are you going to tell your boss your leaving? When you start planning the exit or after you have a plan in place? Again why would the football playing schools talk to Tranghese about leaving?

Some strange things about this article......

1. Tranghese calls the televison contract "a commitment ", not a contract.

2. Tranghese mentions a "split". Before this article he most always talked about expansion only.

3. The writer mentions Memphis by name. Is he hearing something or is he reading this messageboard and others like it?

Some may think that this article is an answer to an often asked question about the future of this conference. In my opinion the article creates as many questions as it answers.
CJ

And Louisville is scheduling Memphis again in football? Well, that is interesting, because UC is renewinf their Memphis relationship in basketball.

E-zone Wrote:

panite Wrote:Typical BB ND puppet. He knows that the BB schools will take a hit if the FB schools split. Especially his beloved Providence. No more big gates to rake in the cash when Cuse, Conn, L'ville, Cinn, Pitt, and WV come into town. They will be down to ND, Gtown, and Nova. The cash cow gates drop from 9 to 3 and that happens across the board with all the Catholic schools. Its no wonder Goose, ND, and the BB schools want to keep this thing together. With those 5 big gates gone the TV revenue will drop too. That is another key as to why the Goose and ND and the BB schools want to keep this thing together and control it from the BB side. That is why Goose keeps throwing trinket bowls at the FB schools as bait to try and keep them happy. The power in the TV contracts is with the FB schools for BB and FB. The FB schools double dip for TV in two sports while the BB schools only get one shot.

The best thing for the BE right now if they want to save the "East of the Mississippi Market" is to pick up Memphis all sports with their BB and Liberty Bowl following and go to 17. Play 16 conference games 8 home and 8 away or split into divisions with H&A games and cross over games. If the BB schools don't like it they can leave. If the consenses is for UCF do the same thing and work on Florida Bowls that most of the BE fans would travel too during the Christmas and New Years Holidays not before or after.

So what if the power mongers of the BB and ND side are down one vote. Its better to have a piece of something than to have it all slip thru your hands and have nothing at all. The time for NE small potates thinking is over. Its time to think big and start working on getting there. Rutgers is started with stadium expansion to 56,000 in 2009. They are only 39 years behind South Carolina who had a 54,000 seat stadium in 1971. Eleven years later they grew to 72,400 and 14 years after that they grew to 80,250. I hope Rutgers expedites that and gets to 80,000 in about a 1/3 of the time. They have the stadium to do it. Expand and grow or be left behind. Its time to leave the Goose-BB-ND protectionist era behind if the those entiies are not willing to let the FB schools grow by at least one to help with the problems on their side.

The smart move would be go 9 football schools and 10 basketball schools (keep Notre Dame for basketball and all other sports).

Blank that Leech, ND!!!!

Gray Avenger Wrote:

army56mike Wrote:The basketball schools are in desperation mode to keep the football schools around.

Parasites always attach themselves to their hosts firmly.

Spot on! And Notre Dame is the biggest leech of them all!

Cat claw,

You are 100% correct in what you say, the Big East is doing good as a total conf, BB is doing great as is FB and they have the attitude if it ain't broke don't fix it....
I'm in favor of making a big push for ND and Memphis or South Fla.
We need to get to 10 for FB only by 2010 to keep up with the joneses. Then if we split, they get full membership......

I assume you meant Central Florida because South Florida is already in the BE.

Stookey57 Wrote:Cat claw,

You are 100% correct in what you say, the Big East is doing good as a total conf, BB is doing great as is FB and they have the attitude if it ain't broke don't fix it....
I'm in favor of making a big push for ND and Memphis or South Fla.
We need to get to 10 for FB only by 2010 to keep up with the joneses. Then if we split, they get full membership......

I think you meant Central Florida. I agree about adding a football-only member or two. I would definitely be down with that if the Big East did it right away. If Mike Tranghese were smart he would push for that right away, because it would likely quell talks of a split for a few more years. As much as I want a split, expanding to 9 or 10 teams in football would probably satisfy the football schools and their fans for awhile. It definitely would mean that we have control over our own football destiny.

Stookey57 Wrote:Cat claw,

You are 100% correct in what you say, the Big East is doing good as a total conf, BB is doing great as is FB and they have the attitude if it ain't broke don't fix it....
I'm in favor of making a big push for ND and Memphis or South Fla.
We need to get to 10 for FB only by 2010 to keep up with the joneses. Then if we split, they get full membership......

Wow, how soon we forget. If you look back to before the defections the conference was doing very well in football and bball. In fact, it could be said that the conference was doing much better than its doing now, but that didn't stop the shake up.

The problem is the conferences structure makes it unstable. The bball schools publicly complain about scheduling and tournament bids. The fball schools publicly complain about scheduling and expansion issues. Yet, Tranghese publicly states that there are no real issues and everyone is happy.

IMO, the best thing the BE has going for it is that there are no other BCS conferences in close proximity looking to expand, because if they were, just about any fball school in this league would jump to a more stable situation in a heart beat.

RUmojo Wrote:

Stookey57 Wrote:Cat claw,

You are 100% correct in what you say, the Big East is doing good as a total conf, BB is doing great as is FB and they have the attitude if it ain't broke don't fix it....
I'm in favor of making a big push for ND and Memphis or South Fla.
We need to get to 10 for FB only by 2010 to keep up with the joneses. Then if we split, they get full membership......

Wow, how soon we forget. If you look back to before the defections the conference was doing very well in football and bball. In fact, it could be said that the conference was doing much better than its doing now, but that didn't stop the shake up.

The problem is the conferences structure makes it unstable. The bball schools publicly complain about scheduling and tournament bids. The fball schools publicly complain about scheduling and expansion issues. Yet, Tranghese publicly states that there are no real issues and everyone is happy.

IMO, the best thing the BE has going for it is that there are no other BCS conferences in close proximity looking to expand, because if they were, just about any fball school in this league would jump to a more stable situation in a heart beat.

That's the unfortunate part, and unavoidable, it seems to me. We're an eclectic group of schools who have been left out of the mix of the other 'majors' and we just have to keep working on a winning formula so we can stay in the mix. We'll never lure a big name school away from one of the other conferences, and should the ACC ditch BC, or the B-10 look for someone other than ND, then it will be the BE who gets hit again. We have to deal with our reality. One way of NOT dealing with it is to stay too long as a cobbled together jalopy. Being eclectic is one thing, being hybrid is something else entirely.

RUmojo Wrote:Wow, how soon we forget. If you look back to before the defections the conference was doing very well in football and bball. In fact, it could be said that the conference was doing much better than its doing now, but that didn't stop the shake up.

The truth is Miami was never happy in the BE. Even when they were winning in FB they were losing money. VT always looked towards the ACC. BC- they're just fools.
Prior to the split the BE's BCS fortunes were all tied into Miami. That's why once Miami decided to leave talk began of the BE losing its auto bid. That's even before VT decided to bolt. Now consider that BC and VT carried the ACC these past two years and they really didn't need to follow Miami for the sake of keeping a BCS bid.
The ACC also promised more money but that was in part tied to the ACC getting two teams into BCS games. That has not happened yet.
When the BE took teams from CUSA, Louisville and Cincy were no-brainers. They were top to bottom the best teams and the best schools in Conf USA. USF was added to keep the BE in Florida.
What reason would there be to add the rest of ConfUSA with the exception of UCF. The BE is not trying to be in North carolina or Tenn. Why would the conference want to be in those states. Even if we could add the University of Tenn., I don't see the BE jumping into that situation because it's really just another Miami- travel and costs in the long run. Mike T lived through that with Miami and I don't see him doing it again. So if you are talking expansion, You're talking maybe Temple or UMass from Mike T's perspective. Neither of those are attractive where the BE is right now. UCF could be the best bet because it reduces the situation that happened with Miami over non-revenue sports and travel and the BE likes Florida.
But why pull the trigger on anything right now? Adding Memphis, ECu and UCF won't stop the Big 10 from inviting Rutgers- if that's what they want to do. And the quality of play of those teams and the travel expense they bring to the BE, Rutgers can argue it's cheaper to make the run to the Big 10 lineup than the BE line-up if we are that spread out.
Mike T is right when he says there's no one to add right now that does more than split our money nine ways instead of eight while paying another struggling program in never-never land.
Pat White may be the only sure thing the BE got going for it right now. We're far from out of the woods. Adding another developing program won't help us.
UCONN's coach may have some clout because his team was conference co-champion but he'd have more clout if he had beaten WF as the BE co-champ.
Let's see what Cincy and Pitt can do this year. As the BCS conference with the lowest amounts of money, why should Mike T rush to split that money nine ways? Unless that ninth team brings something worthwhile to the conference.

P.S. I'm sure Seton Hall and St. Johns can't wait for a split. Take the Fb schools off their schedule and they can become great programs again.

Wilkie01 Wrote:

Gray Avenger Wrote:

army56mike Wrote:The basketball schools are in desperation mode to keep the football schools around.

Parasites always attach themselves to their hosts firmly.

Spot on! And Notre Dame is the biggest leech of them all!

Catholic Cardinal @ Notre Dame: I resemble that remark.

MU88 Wrote:if you dump the bball schools, you will lose your ties to the Chicago, New York, Milwaukee, D.C. and Phily markets.

Obviously, you don't know where the football schools are located geographically. Chicago and Milwaukee were never markets for The BEast in football. That is Big 10 country, and saying anything otherwise is stupid.

As for New York and Philadelphia, Rutgers and UConn have New York sandwiched, so that market isn't lost for football or basketball. Rutgers has a share of the Philly market too, and The BEast is the only major college game in town for the Philadelphia or NYC TV market regions. So there is no effect on Philly or NYC either.

That just shot the heck out of that. Any other stupid comments that need shooting down?

The BE will be fine no matter what it does... yes it is the BCS conf with the least amount of $$$ even without a 2nd bcs bid all ACC schools make more than BE schools.. but the BE is way ahead of the top non bcs $$$ wise and that wont change. The auto bid never was and still isnt at risk. The BE can add now if it wishes.. split in 2010 if it wishes.. or in 2013.. or never.. it doesnt really matter... at worse the B10 grabs cuse or rutgers... if that happens the BE simply replaces them... they are not irreplacable... any of the 3 talked about CUSA schools..or temple will do just fine...