I’m 99% sure I’ve never seen a statement that didn’t at least thank the departing school, or express some appreciation that were members.

It sounds like butthurt. It doesn’t have a kind tone. It’s definitely out of place from the type of statements other conferences typically make when schools move on. It isn’t quite blatant or nasty, but it’s as close as one can get. It doesn’t speak well of him, personally, or the conference.

He doesn’t actually mention RGV until the final sentence. And he doesn’t mention their future plans, or wish them well.

It’s a weird and convoluted statement that he probably felt like he had to make but didn’t really want to, so he did it out of some resentment or anger.

With this guy in charge, the WAC is in trouble. He doesn’t have what it takes to keep it together. It still has a good future without him, but I can’t imagine him being here another year or two.

https://wacsports.com/news/2024/3/21/gen...alley.aspx

For comparison, look at the positive verbiage used in the AAC announcement about UCF and the others. It s a “normal” and professional statement. But even being voted out and it being more contentious, and a much bigger deal than one school essentially moving down, the statement followed a usual protocol. And language is important.

https://theamerican.org/news/2022/6/10/g...rture.aspx

Or the WCC statement about BYU. Notice the type of statement t being made, how it’s framed, and the vibe compared to the WAC guy?

https://wccsports.com/news/2021/9/10/gen...rence.aspx

It does seem a little bitter but I don’t know if I would say butt hurt. It screwed up there ability to fly solo for football. We also don’t know the behind the scenes deal. Was there some warning they wanted to move or was this out of the blue? Had they made some commitments to the WAC we don’t know about? Had the WAC helped in launching football? Remember the WAC was there gateway to D1.

The AAC was getting a nice financial settlement from UCF and the others so that helps. The WCC guy knew BYU wanted a football league. And while BYU is a religious affiliated school it hardly fits the profile of the WCC in that it is huge and Mormon.

(03-27-2024 05:09 AM)AssKickingChicken Wrote:  It does seem a little bitter but I don’t know if I would say butt hurt. It screwed up there ability to fly solo for football. We also don’t know the behind the scenes deal. Was there some warning they wanted to move or was this out of the blue? Had they made some commitments to the WAC we don’t know about? Had the WAC helped in launching football? Remember the WAC was there gateway to D1.

The AAC was getting a nice financial settlement from UCF and the others so that helps. The WCC guy knew BYU wanted a football league. And while BYU is a religious affiliated school it hardly fits the profile of the WCC in that it is huge and Mormon.

You may be thinking of another school, because the WAC didn’t help UTRGV move to D1. They’ve been D1 for decades before joining the WAC. It’s the former Texas-Pan American.

It’s true that I don’t know if anything happened behind the scenes. But I do know the Commissioner and Conference have little to gain by not simply thanking them and wishing them well.

Pointing out that WE (the WAC) have high standards and that WE want to be competitive and that WE are on an upward trajectory. WE won’t waiver from that…. Between the lines says that UTRGV doesn’t have high standards, doesn’t want to be competitive, isn’t on an upward trajectory, and is wavering.

Even if they are all true, and I’m not saying they are, is petty to publicly insinuate. There’s no reason to phrase it like that if it isn’t what you are getting at.

Sorry, but the WAC is only here now because UTRGV/Pan Am joined a handful of others to help keep it from going under. They were members when he took the job as well. Now he sounds sad and bitter about something that isno big deal. If I had to guess who has issues, him or RGV, I’d definitely guess it’s him. I doubt RGV is leaving with any sort of bitterness.

(03-27-2024 03:50 AM)Todor Wrote:  I’m 99% sure I’ve never seen a statement that didn’t at least thank the departing school, or express some appreciation that were members.

It sounds like butthurt. It doesn’t have a kind tone. It’s definitely out of place from the type of statements other conferences typically make when schools move on. It isn’t quite blatant or nasty, but it’s as close as one can get. It doesn’t speak well of him, personally, or the conference.

He doesn’t actually mention RGV until the final sentence. And he doesn’t mention their future plans, or wish them well.

It’s a weird and convoluted statement that he probably felt like he had to make but didn’t really want to, so he did it out of some resentment or anger.

With this guy in charge, the WAC is in trouble. He doesn’t have what it takes to keep it together.

Didn't seem so bad tbh.

The WAC is a way station for the unhoused and commissioner what's-his-name is just trying to keep the lights on.

Not every conference boss is going to be as cool, calm and collected during the bad times as Judy

(03-27-2024 06:16 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 03:50 AM)Todor Wrote:  I’m 99% sure I’ve never seen a statement that didn’t at least thank the departing school, or express some appreciation that were members.

It sounds like butthurt. It doesn’t have a kind tone. It’s definitely out of place from the type of statements other conferences typically make when schools move on. It isn’t quite blatant or nasty, but it’s as close as one can get. It doesn’t speak well of him, personally, or the conference.

He doesn’t actually mention RGV until the final sentence. And he doesn’t mention their future plans, or wish them well.

It’s a weird and convoluted statement that he probably felt like he had to make but didn’t really want to, so he did it out of some resentment or anger.

With this guy in charge, the WAC is in trouble. He doesn’t have what it takes to keep it together.

Didn't seem so bad tbh.

The WAC is a way station for the unhoused and commissioner what's-his-name is just trying to keep the lights on.

Not every conference boss is going to be as cool, calm and collected during the bad times as Judy

Why are male commissioners so emotional?

Think people are reading a bit too much into the statement. Brian Thornton is a good young commissioner and a big basketball fan who is probably a little frustrated how much of an anchor UTRGV has been for the league in recent years specifically in hoops and certainly since he's been commissioner.

I think he will be proactive about the WAC's next move. How the majority of people here see the WAC compared to how he sees it are very different. He has high ambitions for the league.

(03-27-2024 03:50 AM)Todor Wrote:  I’m 99% sure I’ve never seen a statement that didn’t at least thank the departing school, or express some appreciation that were members.

It sounds like butthurt. It doesn’t have a kind tone. It’s definitely out of place from the type of statements other conferences typically make when schools move on. It isn’t quite blatant or nasty, but it’s as close as one can get. It doesn’t speak well of him, personally, or the conference.

He doesn’t actually mention RGV until the final sentence. And he doesn’t mention their future plans, or wish them well.

It’s a weird and convoluted statement that he probably felt like he had to make but didn’t really want to, so he did it out of some resentment or anger.

With this guy in charge, the WAC is in trouble. He doesn’t have what it takes to keep it together. It still has a good future without him, but I can’t imagine him being here another year or two.

https://wacsports.com/news/2024/3/21/gen...alley.aspx

For comparison, look at the positive verbiage used in the AAC announcement about UCF and the others. It s a “normal” and professional statement. But even being voted out and it being more contentious, and a much bigger deal than one school essentially moving down, the statement followed a usual protocol. And language is important.

https://theamerican.org/news/2022/6/10/g...rture.aspx

Or the WCC statement about BYU. Notice the type of statement t being made, how it’s framed, and the vibe compared to the WAC guy?

https://wccsports.com/news/2021/9/10/gen...rence.aspx

It’s one thing to be positive about a school leaving the conference for a power conference vs one making a lateral move. One that would give the WAC its own football auto bid.

Actually, the statement wasn’t bad in my opinion.

You’ve got to remember that there is a lot of bad blood between the Southland and WAC:

The WAC stole SLC teams, selling them on the vision that they had a path the FBS

NMSU and SHSU got invited to a bona fide FBS league

The SLC turned around and stole back 2 teams, Lamar who had spent a season in the WAC and UIW who was scheduled to join in just mere months—this wrecked the planned football schedule.

The loss of 2 schools to promotion and 2 to defection was devastating to the WAC, particularly Southern Utah ex-SLC schools ACU and SFA.

UTRGV would have given the WAC their 6th football school and an autobid to the FCS playoff.

The words actually used are not the issue. But if you read a lot of PR releases, public announcements regarding things like this (and I do), you realize there is a very standard format for these types of statements. They are virtually all the same.

You thank the school, tell them you appreciate their contributions, and wish them well in their future. No more, no less. The choice to deviate from this format is only done intentionally. It’s done to tell them you don’t thank them, you don’t appreciate them, and you don’t wish them well.

It would be like standing up at someone’s retirement party and saying that you “acknowledge” that person was employed there. No, those exact words aren’t insulting per se. But the format is to thank them, say a few nice words, and tell them you hope they enjoy retirement. Even if everyone were glad the person retired, you’d have to really go out of your way to not simply follow the standard.

The deviation from any professional norm is enough to be considered petty and bitter sounding.

Maybe it’s time commissioners stopped being nice. Imagine if the ACC said this when UNC and the others go to the Big Ten:

We had a good thing going and they screwed it all up by leaving the rest of us high and dry. **** them. I hope Michigan hangs a hundred on them.

(03-27-2024 06:59 AM)Mid-Major Hoops Enthusiast Wrote:  Think people are reading a bit too much into the statement. Brian Thornton is a good young commissioner and a big basketball fan who is probably a little frustrated how much of an anchor UTRGV has been for the league in recent years specifically in hoops and certainly since he's been commissioner.

I think he will be proactive about the WAC's next move. How the majority of people here see the WAC compared to how he sees it are very different. He has high ambitions for the league.

I don't know if many people are doing this, but the OP seems to be.

I wonder if the WAC felt blindsided by this and if that played a role

(03-27-2024 07:15 AM)Todor Wrote:  The words actually used are not the issue. But if you read a lot of PR releases, public announcements regarding things like this (and I do), you realize there is a very standard format for these types of statements. They are virtually all the same.

You thank the school, tell them you appreciate their contributions, and wish them well in their future. No more, no less. The choice to deviate from this format is only done intentionally. It’s done to tell them you don’t thank them, you don’t appreciate them, and you don’t wish them well.

It would be like standing up at someone’s retirement party and saying that you “acknowledge” that person was employed there. No, those exact words aren’t insulting per se. But the format is to thank them, say a few nice words, and tell them you hope they enjoy retirement. Even if everyone were glad the person retired, you’d have to really go out of your way to not simply follow the standard.

The deviation from any professional norm is enough to be considered petty and bitter sounding.

(03-27-2024 07:46 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 06:59 AM)Mid-Major Hoops Enthusiast Wrote:  Think people are reading a bit too much into the statement. Brian Thornton is a good young commissioner and a big basketball fan who is probably a little frustrated how much of an anchor UTRGV has been for the league in recent years specifically in hoops and certainly since he's been commissioner.

I think he will be proactive about the WAC's next move. How the majority of people here see the WAC compared to how he sees it are very different. He has high ambitions for the league.

I don't know if many people are doing this, but the OP seems to be.

Yeah, I agree.

It's a little out of the boiler-plate norm, but it seems fairly accurate. He doesn't owe them a pat on the back for leaving.

I don't think it would have been the end of the world even if he said what you're reading into it. Just flat out say "they can't hang" if that's what you want to say. Universities aren't people. They don't have feelings to hurt.

But if you are worried about hurting an institute's feelings somehow anyway - I think the damning with faint praise approach of "yes, we acknowledge that this team is leaving" is a good approach. He doesn't work for them anymore.

I really don’t think this statement is too out of the ordinary. It’s not overwhelming gracious in heaping praises on UTRGV but it has all the elements I’d typically expect from a reactionary statement. These are almost always far more focused on the excellence and commitment of the conference rather than thanks and well wishes for the outgoing member.

I do agree that there is a degree of implication that UTRGV is choosing to take a cheaper, easier path.

Personally the WAC needs to do the following (with a bit of help from the Big Sky):

-WAC adds Central Oklahoma and West Texas A&M, both are in a position to fit into FCS and would fit the current WAC footprint

-Encourage/push for non Football members to add it to bring the numbers up, UTA, UVU etc.

-The Big Sky is a bit bloated I feel so Cal Poly and UC-Davis being Football only could join the WAC, honestly would be healthy for both Conferences in terms of OOC games in the long run, could garuntee a full D1 slate for all teams in both Conferences:

WAC.....................................Big Sky

UC-Davis..............................Montana
Cal Poly................................Montana State
SUU.......................................Idaho
UT-Tech................................Idaho State
WTA&M................................Weber State
Central Oklahoma...............Sac State
ACU......................................NAU
Tarleton State......................EWU
SFA.......................................UNC
UT-Arlington.........................Portland State

To be honest, I don't think it's that bad.

I really don't see the necessity to pretend everything is great between any two when one leaves. Dont see the necessity in wasting everyone's time with these smoke shows. If a school leaves, a conference commissioner or anyone affiliated with the conferences shouldn't have to say anything. They don't owe them. If two peaple are dating or married and a split happens, I'm not going to expect one to say good things about the other either.

I would have rather the statement say "Bye Felicia" or something like that.

(03-27-2024 09:51 AM)Utgrizfan Wrote:  Personally the WAC needs to do the following (with a bit of help from the Big Sky):

-WAC adds Central Oklahoma and West Texas A&M, both are in a position to fit into FCS and would fit the current WAC footprint

-Encourage/push for non Football members to add it to bring the numbers up, UTA, UVU etc.

-The Big Sky is a bit bloated I feel so Cal Poly and UC-Davis being Football only could join the WAC, honestly would be healthy for both Conferences in terms of OOC games in the long run, could garuntee a full D1 slate for all teams in both Conferences:

WAC.....................................Big Sky

UC-Davis..............................Montana
Cal Poly................................Montana State
SUU.......................................Idaho
UT-Tech................................Idaho State
WTA&M................................Weber State
Central Oklahoma...............Sac State
ACU......................................NAU
Tarleton State......................EWU
SFA.......................................UNC
UT-Arlington.........................Portland State

Why in the world would UC Davis leave the Big Sky which, as you well know I’m sure, is a top two football league and about the only FCS conference that isn’t a skeleton of itself for a far-flung group of D2 callups and former Southland schools that may or may not really want to be there? Not like the Aggies are exactly dead weight either like one could argue Southern Utah was.

SUU messed up bad leaving the Big Sky. Should’ve declined their WAC invitation like Weber did…

(03-27-2024 10:32 AM)EatEmUp11 Wrote:  

(03-27-2024 09:51 AM)Utgrizfan Wrote:  Personally the WAC needs to do the following (with a bit of help from the Big Sky):

-WAC adds Central Oklahoma and West Texas A&M, both are in a position to fit into FCS and would fit the current WAC footprint

-Encourage/push for non Football members to add it to bring the numbers up, UTA, UVU etc.

-The Big Sky is a bit bloated I feel so Cal Poly and UC-Davis being Football only could join the WAC, honestly would be healthy for both Conferences in terms of OOC games in the long run, could garuntee a full D1 slate for all teams in both Conferences:

WAC.....................................Big Sky

UC-Davis..............................Montana
Cal Poly................................Montana State
SUU.......................................Idaho
UT-Tech................................Idaho State
WTA&M................................Weber State
Central Oklahoma...............Sac State
ACU......................................NAU
Tarleton State......................EWU
SFA.......................................UNC
UT-Arlington.........................Portland State

Why in the world would UC Davis leave the Big Sky which, as you well know I’m sure, is a top two football league and about the only FCS conference that isn’t a skeleton of itself for a far-flung group of D2 callups and former Southland schools that may or may not really want to be there? Not like the Aggies are exactly dead weight either like one could argue Southern Utah was.

SUU messed up bad leaving the Big Sky. Should’ve declined their WAC invitation like Weber did…

It's only an example , but I listed them as they are a Football only member along with Cal Poly and I personally don't think large Conferences work as well in FCS as they do in FBS. Another option would be geography based where NAU and Northern Colorado would move to the WAC, but I feel that's less likely as they're full members. Having another FCS Conference with a decent Western prescence would be good and healthy for all involved in the long run.

Brian’s statement may have been worded in a less than favorable manner. But it wasn’t awful. Besides, it doesn’t look like UTRGV was impeded from leaving or they were being sued. If this was the move they wanted, it doesn’t matter what mostly empty words stated. Anyway, compare this to Jim’s actions in the ACC.

NJTerp

(03-27-2024 09:46 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I really don’t think this statement is too out of the ordinary. It’s not overwhelming gracious in heaping praises on UTRGV but it has all the elements I’d typically expect from a reactionary statement. These are almost always far more focused on the excellence and commitment of the conference rather than thanks and well wishes for the outgoing member.

I do agree that there is a degree of implication that UTRGV is choosing to take a cheaper, easier path.

I agree with you there.

To me, it does reveal a certain level of anger. Possibly merely disappointment or shock. But for it to be at the level of letting that show through in a routine statement is the telling part.

The funniest part of all of this-UTRGV showed little serious interest in football until the Texas 4 came along. And I’m sure there was a lot of pressure to do it, convincing them that this is the future of the WAC and that they should get on board.

So they started the ball rolling, made a public announcement, started investing. And in the meantime, the WAC became the failure and disappointment , because they couldn’t deliver on the conference football home for RGV they “sold.” And that was the point when RGV left. They stretched THEIR budget to try to accommodate the conference and its members needs, even though all of the football joiners knew they were joining a non football conference.

The WAC fumbled this one. RGV would likely not be leaving if they hadn’t added football to keep up with schools that were never committed to the WAC in the first place. Also a fumble on RGV’s part to not have predicted the outcome of of these misfits joining, like I did from day 1.