The ACC needs to rethink the way it does things and collectively it seems oblivious to each other's needs or wants and out of touch with what is happening outside of it's conference. Rather than a bunch of squabbling Presidents and ADs lobbying to get their way, I think the ACC commissioner needs to be a guy who has a vision and has absolute creative control within certain important boundaries like voting in new members.

I'll play the role as the fantasy commissioner of the ACC and play the hand I was dealt. Our first priority is to pacify it's current members enough so that nobody leaves or bankrupts itself in the process of doing so, also we want to project the appearance of stability so that it does not scare away future members. First, let's address the problems:

(1) FSU, Clem and UNC did not vote for expansion, the rest of you that voted for this will need to do the bulk of the travel, at least until contracts expire.

(2) Let's be honest with ourselves, there is a huge gap in media value between FSU and Wake Forest, there is also a huge attendance gap, there is also a huge travel expense gap between both of these schools. It does not make sense to profit share, but not expense share.

(3) The ACC has been bad thus far about protecting the interest of it's money makers. This can be liken to building up your basketball program and de-emphasizing the football program in which some ACC programs had did until fairly recent. One member is worth more than the others, but it does not mean the other members are unimportant, they just don't get priority over the most important.

(4) The officiating is corrupt and/or bad. That needs to be cleaned up. Officials that suck need to be replaced.

(5) The conference HQ does not need a full share of the money to operate. They can do just fine with less than half as much as they are getting now. Back in 2012, the ACC members including the HQ signed a contract that would net an average of $12m annual per member, so in 2012 the HQ was getting only around $9m and it would escalate from there.

(6) Selfish turf protection and holding a grudge mentality. Why did the ACC expand to get schools thousands of miles away when there were schools right in our backyards? We only hurt ourselves. But staying within my own boundaries as the fantasy commissioner it's not my place to dictate who we bring in, just to work with what I got.

(7) ESPN is bad media partner, but we are stuck with them for a while, so we need to give them more schedule control over which games would make them more money, so it makes the ACC more money.


Now that the problems are addressed and I have absolute creative control, here is what I have in mind:

(1) FSU is the big money maker and is sort of the lynch pin that keeps the conference stable. Swallow your pride, recognize that. If FSU wants/needs and can justify more money, then give it to them. It could/should come out of the ACC HQ's cut and it would not need to cost anyone else their share.

(2) Schedules need to maximize games fans want to see and networks want to broadcast. We are already doing or will do a wacky schedule that has some school playing 3 annual games and others playing 0 annual games. The problem is, if we are going to go this direction, then we can do better, we left a lot of meat on this bone. It does not matter if some schools have a harder conference schedule than others, make it up on the OOC end of things.

(3) Cut down on non-revenue sports travel. That would include less conference games and more conference games that are region specific. We can sort out a champion and runner up at the ACCT.

(4) The ACC should poach the best refs from other conferences and constantly evaluate their performances. This would cut down on negative publicity due to ref error and preserve the integrity of the game.

(5) All travel expenses are pooled together and split. The other changes mentioned above would save a lot on travel expenses, but going a bit further, if the conference is going to accept schools in California, then everyone has to evenly split these expenses.

(6) I'd leave alone the "success initiative incentive" as I think it's adequate and encourages other schools to better themselves.

Another scheduling option if some team really want exposure in some state is to have neutral site games in that state. If FSU vs Wake just has to be played, then games in Jacksonville or Orlando can be played and still draw a decent crowd. FSU home games do not draw well vs Wake and Wake can only draw to it's 30k max home capacity. A neutral site game in this instance would be a win-win. I'd alternate these type of neutral games between Wake, Duke and BC thusly:

Year 1 Wake @ FSU, FSU @ Duke
Year 2 FSU @ BC, Wake vs FSU (neutral)
Year 3 Duke @ FSU, FSU vs BC (neutral)
Year 4 FSU @ Wake, Duke @ FSU
Year 5 BC @ FSU, Duke vs FSU (neutral)

Garrett, I don't know where you get your information. So much of it is wrong.

Use ProPublica and you can download the ACC's taxes for the last 20 years.

The ACC office operates on the basis of about a half share of revenue, In 2012 the office operation was 10.6 Million against income of $231 million. In 2022 that number was $21 million versus income of $616 Million. The league office gets about what ND games, plus or minus a million or two.

Total income for the ACC was

$134 M in FY 10
$214 M in FY 13
$405 M in FY 17
$616 M in FY 22

The per school payout last year was $39.4 million per full time school. It's on page 2 of schedule A of last year's report.
The per school payout in fy 2011 was $12.5 million per full time school. It's on page 1 of schedule A of that year's report.

The expenses of the office have gone up 98% in 12 years. Per school revenue per school has gone up 350% in 12 years.

I thought you had a business school and a school of public policy at FSU. In those schools you are supposed to mint accountants and money managers. The liars and dissemblers are supposed to hang out in the law school or in the b school with the future real estate agents. So much of your information is wrong that it makes you seem like a troll. But having looked at FSU's books and filings online, it may be that people from those parts really don't understand the difference between cash accounting, accrual and modified accrual.

(01-01-2024 02:44 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  Another scheduling option if some team really want exposure in some state is to have neutral site games in that state. If FSU vs Wake just has to be played, then games in Jacksonville or Orlando can be played and still draw a decent crowd. FSU home games do not draw well vs Wake and Wake can only draw to it's 30k max home capacity. A neutral site game in this instance would be a win-win. I'd alternate these type of neutral games between Wake, Duke and BC thusly:

Year 1 Wake @ FSU, FSU @ Duke
Year 2 FSU @ BC, Wake vs FSU (neutral)
Year 3 Duke @ FSU, FSU vs BC (neutral)
Year 4 FSU @ Wake, Duke @ FSU
Year 5 BC @ FSU, Duke vs FSU (neutral)

In the last 15 years you have hosted BC 7 times. In that same time you have had 98 home games but only 37 of those games have resulted in attendance above 95%.

Florida has done that for you 6 times, Miami 5 times and guess who is third?

Yep good ole BC at 5 instances in 08, 10, 12, 14, and 22. You barely play Duke.

Y'all are your own worst enemy.

(01-01-2024 06:40 PM)SouthernConfBoy Wrote:  Garrett, I don't know where you get your information. So much of it is wrong.

Use ProPublica and you can download the ACC's taxes for the last 20 years.

The ACC office operates on the basis of about a half share of revenue, In 2012 the office operation was 10.6 Million against income of $231 million. In 2022 that number was $21 million versus income of $616 Million. The league office gets about what ND games, plus or minus a million or two.

Total income for the ACC was

$134 M in FY 10
$214 M in FY 13
$405 M in FY 17
$616 M in FY 22

The per school payout last year was $39.4 million per full time school. It's on page 2 of schedule A of last year's report.
The per school payout in fy 2011 was $12.5 million per full time school. It's on page 1 of schedule A of that year's report.

The expenses of the office have gone up 98% in 12 years. Per school revenue per school has gone up 350% in 12 years.

I thought you had a business school and a school of public policy at FSU. In those schools you are supposed to mint accountants and money managers. The liars and dissemblers are supposed to hang out in the law school or in the b school with the future real estate agents. So much of your information is wrong that it makes you seem like a troll. But having looked at FSU's books and filings online, it may be that people from those parts really don't understand the difference between cash accounting, accrual and modified accrual.

I was always told the ACC office got a full share, like the other members. If that is not the case then I take it back. I distinctly remember the ACC signing a contract with ESPN in around 2012 at an average of $12m per member over a 13 year period; it starts low and escalates, thats where I got the $9m for that year. I figured the operating budget would have doubled with 50% more members and inflation since then.

(01-01-2024 06:54 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(01-01-2024 06:40 PM)SouthernConfBoy Wrote:  Garrett, I don't know where you get your information. So much of it is wrong.

Use ProPublica and you can download the ACC's taxes for the last 20 years.

The ACC office operates on the basis of about a half share of revenue, In 2012 the office operation was 10.6 Million against income of $231 million. In 2022 that number was $21 million versus income of $616 Million. The league office gets about what ND games, plus or minus a million or two.

Total income for the ACC was

$134 M in FY 10
$214 M in FY 13
$405 M in FY 17
$616 M in FY 22

The per school payout last year was $39.4 million per full time school. It's on page 2 of schedule A of last year's report.
The per school payout in fy 2011 was $12.5 million per full time school. It's on page 1 of schedule A of that year's report.

The expenses of the office have gone up 98% in 12 years. Per school revenue per school has gone up 350% in 12 years.

I thought you had a business school and a school of public policy at FSU. In those schools you are supposed to mint accountants and money managers. The liars and dissemblers are supposed to hang out in the law school or in the b school with the future real estate agents. So much of your information is wrong that it makes you seem like a troll. But having looked at FSU's books and filings online, it may be that people from those parts really don't understand the difference between cash accounting, accrual and modified accrual.

I was always told the ACC office got a full share, like the other members. If that is not the case then I take it back. I distinctly remember the ACC signing a contract with ESPN in around 2012 at an average of $12m per member over a 13 year period; it starts low and escalates, thats where I got the $9m for that year. I figured the operating budget would have doubled with 50% more members and inflation since then.

The dirty little secret inside the ACC is that a big TV payday does not help certain schools raise money - it in fact retards those efforts and causes negative publicity. This is the case at UVa, VT, UNC, Duke, WF, and NC State. It's a Tidewater Atlantic/Presbyterian/Episcopalian cultural thing. Up until maybe 5 years ago just talking about it was gauche.

It has become obvious that Florida State (administration and fans) no longer feel they "fit" in the ACC model.
The rest of the conference is not going to change just to accommodate one school. It's time the 'Noles moved on.
It's unfortunate that the conference will have to use the court system to get Florida State to live up to their obligations.

There is no going back at this point. The pin can not be put back in the grenade.
Florida State will have to face the consequences of their actions, and the ACC will move on.

(01-02-2024 06:09 AM)XLance Wrote:  It has become obvious that Florida State (administration and fans) no longer feel they "fit" in the ACC model.
The rest of the conference is not going to change just to accommodate one school. It's time the 'Noles moved on.
It's unfortunate that the conference will have to use the court system to get Florida State to live up to their obligations.

There is no going back at this point. The pin can not be put back in the grenade.
Florida State will have to face the consequences of their actions, and the ACC will move on.

I agree. Its like dejavu with the Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville. We went thru the exact same thing when the 2 schools gave notice that they were leaving the BE, and WV wanted to leave the BE early and they were bent on doing so no matter how it made them or their current league looked. Bad publicity all the way around.

(01-02-2024 08:53 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:09 AM)XLance Wrote:  It has become obvious that Florida State (administration and fans) no longer feel they "fit" in the ACC model.
The rest of the conference is not going to change just to accommodate one school. It's time the 'Noles moved on.
It's unfortunate that the conference will have to use the court system to get Florida State to live up to their obligations.

There is no going back at this point. The pin can not be put back in the grenade.
Florida State will have to face the consequences of their actions, and the ACC will move on.

I agree. Its like dejavu with the Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville. We went thru the exact same thing when the 2 schools gave notice that they were leaving the BE, and WV wanted to leave the BE early and they were bent on doing so no matter how it made them or their current league looked. Bad publicity all the way around.

I believe this is how most people feel on both sides - full speed ahead to a resolution. I think only a small minority on the FSU side and not many more from the ACC would even want to put the pin back in the grenade, if that were possible.

(01-02-2024 11:03 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 08:53 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:09 AM)XLance Wrote:  It has become obvious that Florida State (administration and fans) no longer feel they "fit" in the ACC model.
The rest of the conference is not going to change just to accommodate one school. It's time the 'Noles moved on.
It's unfortunate that the conference will have to use the court system to get Florida State to live up to their obligations.

There is no going back at this point. The pin can not be put back in the grenade.
Florida State will have to face the consequences of their actions, and the ACC will move on.

I agree. Its like dejavu with the Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville. We went thru the exact same thing when the 2 schools gave notice that they were leaving the BE, and WV wanted to leave the BE early and they were bent on doing so no matter how it made them or their current league looked. Bad publicity all the way around.

I believe this is how most people feel on both sides - full speed ahead to a resolution. I think only a small minority on the FSU side and not many more from the ACC would even want to put the pin back in the grenade, if that were possible.

IMO, the big problem is that there are some extremists on both sides -- the FSU guys who don't want to pay one red cent, and the ACC guys who want every dime paid with interest!

(01-02-2024 12:52 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 11:03 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 08:53 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:09 AM)XLance Wrote:  It has become obvious that Florida State (administration and fans) no longer feel they "fit" in the ACC model.
The rest of the conference is not going to change just to accommodate one school. It's time the 'Noles moved on.
It's unfortunate that the conference will have to use the court system to get Florida State to live up to their obligations.

There is no going back at this point. The pin can not be put back in the grenade.
Florida State will have to face the consequences of their actions, and the ACC will move on.

I agree. Its like dejavu with the Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville. We went thru the exact same thing when the 2 schools gave notice that they were leaving the BE, and WV wanted to leave the BE early and they were bent on doing so no matter how it made them or their current league looked. Bad publicity all the way around.

I believe this is how most people feel on both sides - full speed ahead to a resolution. I think only a small minority on the FSU side and not many more from the ACC would even want to put the pin back in the grenade, if that were possible.

IMO, the big problem is that there are some extremists on both sides -- the FSU guys who don't want to pay one red cent, and the ACC guys who want every dime paid with interest!

Sad but true, hopefully after the season we'll finally see the adults gather in a room and work something out that allows both sides to move forward into their separate futures. Looming court dates sometimes have a way of making just that kind of compromise happen!

(01-02-2024 01:00 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 12:52 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 11:03 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 08:53 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:09 AM)XLance Wrote:  It has become obvious that Florida State (administration and fans) no longer feel they "fit" in the ACC model.
The rest of the conference is not going to change just to accommodate one school. It's time the 'Noles moved on.
It's unfortunate that the conference will have to use the court system to get Florida State to live up to their obligations.

There is no going back at this point. The pin can not be put back in the grenade.
Florida State will have to face the consequences of their actions, and the ACC will move on.

I agree. Its like dejavu with the Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville. We went thru the exact same thing when the 2 schools gave notice that they were leaving the BE, and WV wanted to leave the BE early and they were bent on doing so no matter how it made them or their current league looked. Bad publicity all the way around.

I believe this is how most people feel on both sides - full speed ahead to a resolution. I think only a small minority on the FSU side and not many more from the ACC would even want to put the pin back in the grenade, if that were possible.

IMO, the big problem is that there are some extremists on both sides -- the FSU guys who don't want to pay one red cent, and the ACC guys who want every dime paid with interest!

Sad but true, hopefully after the season we'll finally see the adults gather in a room and work something out that allows both sides to move forward into their separate futures. Looming court dates sometimes have a way of making just that kind of compromise happen!

I’m much more pessimistic that this lawsuit will expedite a resolution. It took OUT, ESPN and the B12 about 2.5 years to develop a solution to their early exit…and everyone was amicable. Ideally, ESPN could help broker a solution…but there are conflicting priorities.

The only positive has been the ACC addition of the three new members.

It usually takes at least two to three years for many civil lawsuits to be resolved, whether via trial or mediation or straight negotiation.

So, it these two civil suits are like most, sit back and relax for a while.

(01-02-2024 03:48 PM)Wahoowa84 Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 01:00 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 12:52 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 11:03 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 08:53 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  I agree. Its like dejavu with the Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville. We went thru the exact same thing when the 2 schools gave notice that they were leaving the BE, and WV wanted to leave the BE early and they were bent on doing so no matter how it made them or their current league looked. Bad publicity all the way around.

I believe this is how most people feel on both sides - full speed ahead to a resolution. I think only a small minority on the FSU side and not many more from the ACC would even want to put the pin back in the grenade, if that were possible.

IMO, the big problem is that there are some extremists on both sides -- the FSU guys who don't want to pay one red cent, and the ACC guys who want every dime paid with interest!

Sad but true, hopefully after the season we'll finally see the adults gather in a room and work something out that allows both sides to move forward into their separate futures. Looming court dates sometimes have a way of making just that kind of compromise happen!

I’m much more pessimistic that this lawsuit will expedite a resolution. It took OUT, ESPN and the B12 about 2.5 years to develop a solution to their early exit…and everyone was amicable. Ideally, ESPN could help broker a solution…but there are conflicting priorities.

The only positive has been the ACC addition of the three new members.

There is some irony here.

I think FSU’s posture definitely helped many other ACC schools to vote for the expansion.

(01-02-2024 06:30 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 03:48 PM)Wahoowa84 Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 01:00 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 12:52 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 11:03 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  I believe this is how most people feel on both sides - full speed ahead to a resolution. I think only a small minority on the FSU side and not many more from the ACC would even want to put the pin back in the grenade, if that were possible.

IMO, the big problem is that there are some extremists on both sides -- the FSU guys who don't want to pay one red cent, and the ACC guys who want every dime paid with interest!

Sad but true, hopefully after the season we'll finally see the adults gather in a room and work something out that allows both sides to move forward into their separate futures. Looming court dates sometimes have a way of making just that kind of compromise happen!

I’m much more pessimistic that this lawsuit will expedite a resolution. It took OUT, ESPN and the B12 about 2.5 years to develop a solution to their early exit…and everyone was amicable. Ideally, ESPN could help broker a solution…but there are conflicting priorities.

The only positive has been the ACC addition of the three new members.

There is some irony here.

I think FSU’s posture definitely helped many other ACC schools to vote for the expansion.

It's a short term money grab by the other 14 schools. I'm not really against this strategy as I was pleased with it, but after they get full shares those travel expenses will start to add up.

Of the 3 that voted against this expansion, it seems to me that FSU should have been the least against. Stan and Cal do bring a little more excitement than BC, Wake, Duke, UVA and on par with SU, Pitt, UNC. Getting a toe in Texas was a good strategy and SMU has TCU potential.

Clem and UNC should be fussing the most, up until now, most of their games were within a 5 hour drive.

(01-02-2024 12:52 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 11:03 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 08:53 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:09 AM)XLance Wrote:  It has become obvious that Florida State (administration and fans) no longer feel they "fit" in the ACC model.
The rest of the conference is not going to change just to accommodate one school. It's time the 'Noles moved on.
It's unfortunate that the conference will have to use the court system to get Florida State to live up to their obligations.

There is no going back at this point. The pin can not be put back in the grenade.
Florida State will have to face the consequences of their actions, and the ACC will move on.

I agree. Its like dejavu with the Pitt and Syracuse and Louisville. We went thru the exact same thing when the 2 schools gave notice that they were leaving the BE, and WV wanted to leave the BE early and they were bent on doing so no matter how it made them or their current league looked. Bad publicity all the way around.

I believe this is how most people feel on both sides - full speed ahead to a resolution. I think only a small minority on the FSU side and not many more from the ACC would even want to put the pin back in the grenade, if that were possible.

IMO, the big problem is that there are some extremists on both sides -- the FSU guys who don't want to pay one red cent, and the ACC guys who want every dime paid with interest!

Following a contract to the letter is not an extreme position to take. (that's why you had a contract to begin with).
What is extreme is a party that is trying to weasel out of paying what they owe.

(01-02-2024 07:19 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:30 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 03:48 PM)Wahoowa84 Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 01:00 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 12:52 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  IMO, the big problem is that there are some extremists on both sides -- the FSU guys who don't want to pay one red cent, and the ACC guys who want every dime paid with interest!

Sad but true, hopefully after the season we'll finally see the adults gather in a room and work something out that allows both sides to move forward into their separate futures. Looming court dates sometimes have a way of making just that kind of compromise happen!

I’m much more pessimistic that this lawsuit will expedite a resolution. It took OUT, ESPN and the B12 about 2.5 years to develop a solution to their early exit…and everyone was amicable. Ideally, ESPN could help broker a solution…but there are conflicting priorities.

The only positive has been the ACC addition of the three new members.

There is some irony here.

I think FSU’s posture definitely helped many other ACC schools to vote for the expansion.

It's a short term money grab by the other 14 schools. I'm not really against this strategy as I was pleased with it, but after they get full shares those travel expenses will start to add up.

Of the 3 that voted against this expansion, it seems to me that FSU should have been the least against. Stan and Cal do bring a little more excitement than BC, Wake, Duke, UVA and on par with SU, Pitt, UNC. Getting a toe in Texas was a good strategy and SMU has TCU potential.

Clem and UNC should be fussing the most, up until now, most of their games were within a 5 hour drive.

The travel has been addressed with Dallas being a halfway point for various matches and meets etc.

The ACC programs are making something like three or four times the amount of money they were 20 years ago. That money dwarfs what it used to, even with inflation calculated. I don’t feel any program is hurting for money. It’s all coveting thy neighbor’s media deal. It’s like “I have two Mercedes Benz but I want four!”

(01-02-2024 08:42 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 07:19 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:30 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 03:48 PM)Wahoowa84 Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 01:00 PM)Gamenole Wrote:  Sad but true, hopefully after the season we'll finally see the adults gather in a room and work something out that allows both sides to move forward into their separate futures. Looming court dates sometimes have a way of making just that kind of compromise happen!

I’m much more pessimistic that this lawsuit will expedite a resolution. It took OUT, ESPN and the B12 about 2.5 years to develop a solution to their early exit…and everyone was amicable. Ideally, ESPN could help broker a solution…but there are conflicting priorities.

The only positive has been the ACC addition of the three new members.

There is some irony here.

I think FSU’s posture definitely helped many other ACC schools to vote for the expansion.

It's a short term money grab by the other 14 schools. I'm not really against this strategy as I was pleased with it, but after they get full shares those travel expenses will start to add up.

Of the 3 that voted against this expansion, it seems to me that FSU should have been the least against. Stan and Cal do bring a little more excitement than BC, Wake, Duke, UVA and on par with SU, Pitt, UNC. Getting a toe in Texas was a good strategy and SMU has TCU potential.

Clem and UNC should be fussing the most, up until now, most of their games were within a 5 hour drive.

The travel has been addressed with Dallas being a halfway point for various matches and meets etc.

The ACC programs are making something like three or four times the amount of money they were 20 years ago. That money dwarfs what it used to, even with inflation calculated. I don’t feel any program is hurting for money. It’s all coveting thy neighbor’s media deal. It’s like “I have two Mercedes Benz but I want four!”

FSU has the problem that all "new money" has when attempting to run with the rich. They have some money, but they are not multi-generationally wealthy. In their own state Florida has 50-60K more alums, but they are older and wealthier. The graduate school advantage UF has is big. The UF endowment is over twice what FSU's endowment is. In the region FSU's endowment runs behind Miami's, Bama's, Auburn's and Georgia's. The really killer is that money wise FSU is locked out of Atlanta and Nashville and the money aggregated there. Vandy's endowment is $11 B. GT and Emory combined is $14 B.

FSU is not "poor" by most metrics, but they play with the "rich kids".

Because they need every dollar, they overbuilt their stadium starting when they joined the ACC they added 7,000 seats to bring Doak to 70K. Eventually they brought it to 84K which was a solid 10-15K more than needed when FSU is not undefeated.

That's the key to FSU attendance, they have to win. It's not like at Clemson or NC State where the fans will attend a body bag game in the rain.

They have painted themselves into a corner with their fanbase and they have insulted everyone in the ACC. No one trusts them to keep their mouths shut and that's the most important thing in the entire relationship with other schools - you keep it private.

(01-02-2024 04:44 PM)TerryD Wrote:  It usually takes at least two to three years for many civil lawsuits to be resolved, whether via trial or mediation or straight negotiation.

So, it these two civil suits are like most, sit back and relax for a while.

Yup. I don’t see a quick settlement.

It’s going to be interesting to see whether FSU gives a formal notice to the league by Aug 15.

Jim Phillips on Dec. 30

"Well it's a legal case now and I stand by every word that myself and President Jim Ryan at Virginia, who's the chair of the ACC board, indicated," Phillips said on the broadcast. "We're incredibly disappointed and we feel very strongly about a document that was signed by one of our members, willingly signed by one of our members back in '13 and in '16, and we're ready to fight. And we will go through this in a reasonable way, but we will protect the ACC."

(01-02-2024 09:26 PM)SouthernConfBoy Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 08:42 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 07:19 PM)Garrettabc Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 06:30 PM)random asian guy Wrote:  

(01-02-2024 03:48 PM)Wahoowa84 Wrote:  I’m much more pessimistic that this lawsuit will expedite a resolution. It took OUT, ESPN and the B12 about 2.5 years to develop a solution to their early exit…and everyone was amicable. Ideally, ESPN could help broker a solution…but there are conflicting priorities.

The only positive has been the ACC addition of the three new members.

There is some irony here.

I think FSU’s posture definitely helped many other ACC schools to vote for the expansion.

It's a short term money grab by the other 14 schools. I'm not really against this strategy as I was pleased with it, but after they get full shares those travel expenses will start to add up.

Of the 3 that voted against this expansion, it seems to me that FSU should have been the least against. Stan and Cal do bring a little more excitement than BC, Wake, Duke, UVA and on par with SU, Pitt, UNC. Getting a toe in Texas was a good strategy and SMU has TCU potential.

Clem and UNC should be fussing the most, up until now, most of their games were within a 5 hour drive.

The travel has been addressed with Dallas being a halfway point for various matches and meets etc.

The ACC programs are making something like three or four times the amount of money they were 20 years ago. That money dwarfs what it used to, even with inflation calculated. I don’t feel any program is hurting for money. It’s all coveting thy neighbor’s media deal. It’s like “I have two Mercedes Benz but I want four!”

FSU has the problem that all "new money" has when attempting to run with the rich. They have some money, but they are not multi-generationally wealthy. In their own state Florida has 50-60K more alums, but they are older and wealthier. The graduate school advantage UF has is big. The UF endowment is over twice what FSU's endowment is. In the region FSU's endowment runs behind Miami's, Bama's, Auburn's and Georgia's. The really killer is that money wise FSU is locked out of Atlanta and Nashville and the money aggregated there. Vandy's endowment is $11 B. GT and Emory combined is $14 B.

FSU is not "poor" by most metrics, but they play with the "rich kids".

Because they need every dollar, they overbuilt their stadium starting when they joined the ACC they added 7,000 seats to bring Doak to 70K. Eventually they brought it to 84K which was a solid 10-15K more than needed when FSU is not undefeated.

That's the key to FSU attendance, they have to win. It's not like at Clemson or NC State where the fans will attend a body bag game in the rain.

They have painted themselves into a corner with their fanbase and they have insulted everyone in the ACC. No one trusts them to keep their mouths shut and that's the most important thing in the entire relationship with other schools - you keep it private.

By that logic, then most ACC schools over built their stadium. The last 2 including the current major renovations are for improved fan experience enhancements. The seats just so happens to be the causality. I hope they don’t price out faithful fans in tough economic conditions.