The pageantry of the Army-Navy game got me thinking that their needs to be greater fanfare for Army-Air Force and Navy Air Force.

Air Force should host their CIC games at Mile High
Air Force @ Navy in DC/Baltimore
Air Force @ Army in the Meadowlands

The networks should drum up more fanfare for these games. With all 3 academies playing in conferences beginning in 2024, the games involving Air Force could move to September where there a fewer top notch match ups. Labor Day would make for a great atmosphere and time slot for one of them. Maybe week 4 for the other. Alternatively, Veterans Day would make for a nice back drop.

Moving to NFL stadiums without the demand to sell it out doesn’t create more fanfare. It creates more empty seats and a lesser gameday environment.

How about this. Play one CIC game in an exclusive window Sunday before NFL regular season. One CIC game on Thanksgiving or Black Friday day in an exclusive window. Veterans Day is definitely an option

(12-13-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Moving to NFL stadiums without the demand to sell it out doesn’t create more fanfare. It creates more empty seats and a lesser gameday environment.

The point I’m getting at here is that with the proper marketing and time slot, there’s plenty of potential there to make the other two games as big as the Army-Navy game.

(12-13-2023 09:51 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  

(12-13-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Moving to NFL stadiums without the demand to sell it out doesn’t create more fanfare. It creates more empty seats and a lesser gameday environment.

The point I’m getting at here is that with the proper marketing and time slot, there’s plenty of potential there to make the other two games as big as the Army-Navy game.

I disagree. While there's an energy to the AF games it's just not the same, ancient rivalry as Army/Navy and that can't be manufactured. Army/Navy was already special before it got it's own weekend getting heavy promotion not only from CBS but getting ESPN to bring Gameday every year. That's helped but they were already selling NFL stadiums out before that amplified promotion started.

There's also the matter that for Army and Navy, they move their biggest game of the year off campus and it's a positive to host their second biggest rival every other year at their own stadium.

(12-13-2023 09:19 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  How about this. Play one CIC game in an exclusive window Sunday before NFL regular season. One CIC game on Thanksgiving or Black Friday day in an exclusive window. Veterans Day is definitely an option

Army-Navy in December is likely to lose significance and exclusivity with the expanded CFP schedule. I suggest that the Army-Navy game moves to Veteran's Day every year.

The other dates to consider for Air Force-Navy and Air Force-Army to make the games more meaningful and to put them on a grander stage should include dates on or near:

- Patriot Day, September 11
- Air Force Birthday, September 18
- Navy Birthday, October 13
- National Day of the Deployed, October 26

(12-13-2023 11:40 AM)YNot Wrote:  

(12-13-2023 09:19 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  How about this. Play one CIC game in an exclusive window Sunday before NFL regular season. One CIC game on Thanksgiving or Black Friday day in an exclusive window. Veterans Day is definitely an option

Army-Navy in December is likely to lose significance and exclusivity with the expanded CFP schedule. I suggest that the Army-Navy game moves to Veteran's Day every year.

The other dates to consider for Air Force-Navy and Air Force-Army to make the games more meaningful and to put them on a grander stage should include dates on or near:

- Patriot Day, September 11
- Air Force Birthday, September 18
- Navy Birthday, October 13
- National Day of the Deployed, October 26

They have their own weekend to themselves. That may not be sacrosanct as it's only been the case for about 15 years but it's a good setup and there's no compelling reason to move it. The playoff won't start until a week after.

AF-Army have played last couple yrs in Dallas, this yrs game was in Denver.
that's why Army plays 2 fcs games to get 5 home games in West Point

(12-13-2023 11:10 AM)Just Joe Wrote:  

(12-13-2023 09:51 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  

(12-13-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Moving to NFL stadiums without the demand to sell it out doesn’t create more fanfare. It creates more empty seats and a lesser gameday environment.

The point I’m getting at here is that with the proper marketing and time slot, there’s plenty of potential there to make the other two games as big as the Army-Navy game.

I disagree. While there's an energy to the AF games it's just not the same, ancient rivalry as Army/Navy and that can't be manufactured. Army/Navy was already special before it got it's own weekend getting heavy promotion not only from CBS but getting ESPN to bring Gameday every year. That's helped but they were already selling NFL stadiums out before that amplified promotion started.

There's also the matter that for Army and Navy, they move their biggest game of the year off campus and it's a positive to host their second biggest rival every other year at their own stadium.

Absolutely. Army-Navy is special. Nothing against Air Force, but they will never be able to duplicate that. Too much history.

This seems like the right place to mention that my daughter's friend got an offer from Army yesterday. His dad is a (retired) Marine, his mom is retired Army. Despite this, his dad seems pretty happy.

Counterpoint:
The current setup is pretty good.
Changes would not deliver what you hope.
Dumb ideas are dumb.

For the networks, CBS actually does do some fanfare when they move up an Air Force game from CBSSN to CBS. They have done it for games on Army's independent contract, on the mwc contract, and on the "Navy tier" AAC-CBSSN contract (and previously on the Navy independent contract). They just don't really do the numbers. A million and a half or so, but it just isn't the same as Army-Navy, America's Game presented by USAA. It wasn't deemed worth it to move Army-Air Force up to CBS this year.

As was already pointed out - oh by the way, that game was at Mile High. And previous AF-Army games have been in Texas (I think with both giving up a true home game). And Navy has hosted Air Force at FedEx Field. Your new idea isn't.

Home games are good. Seven of Navy's top ten NMCMS attendance games are Air Force games. This year's all-time high, with premium ticket prices got about $3 million. Tickets alone, not counting concessions, increased parking prices, etc. That's close to the gate guarantee we get for moving Notre Dame games around, when we give up concessions and parking money. With ND and Army-Navy off campus, we are already down to five home games every other year. And, yes, that's one of the reasons (one) Army has had 2 FCS as often as they have. No thanks to losing NMCMS or Michie games.

The calendar works fine. We have a nice rhythm for these three games: First week of October, First week of November, Second Saturday in December. We have moved occasionally - a couple weeks shift in October this year, when we honored 9/11 two years ago, etc. The TV partners and the conferences seem to be fine with this. The other Cliff Clavin ideas for dates don't do ANYTHING that these dates don't already do. For Navy, add in Notre Dame last of October ("home") / first of November (South Bend), and the year flows well.
Also, the 12-team CFP won't impinge on the second Saturday of December, despite how much realignment board regulars want it to.

i hate to say this, but i disagree with you,
AF vs academies is way behind Army-Navy, the date is impossible to replicate

however, Denver/ Dallas-Rutherford/Baltimore would work,
and if your making the same money, that good place to start.

as for the date, Labor day wkend, Fox gives Akron vs Mich, NBC goes with Charlotte vs MD
as for 2nd date, alot tougher, OCT when everybody has bye, or thanksgiving wkend, or veterans day wkend

would Veterans day wk in Chicago new dome stadium