Just cut the BS already. If college FB is to "evolve", then remove the evolution part and just design the future now without the incremental shuffling. Pretty obvious that when all the smoke clears we're going to have a new division of I'll guess 32 teams. Get another 16 thru a combination of the SEC and ACC. Someone else can do that or knowing how this board operates pull out whatever past thread you choose and repost it. Best of Big12 already carved out so who cares about that lot.

Let's get NFL LITE started off correctly. Tried to minimize overlap but you can't do when it comes to CA. So half of the West resides in 1 state. It is what it is.

Below is my new merger conference: BIG PAC

WEST
Arizona
CAL
UCLA
USC
Oregon
Washington
Stanford
Colorado

EAST
OSU
Mich
PSU
Maryland
Indiana
Wisconsin
Iowa
Nebraska

We suggested/discussed this long ago on here. B1G apparently said "no way; markets are too small." So they invited NU, UMd, and RU instead.

(11-03-2023 03:28 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  We suggested/discussed this long ago on here. B1G apparently said "no way; markets are too small." So they invited NU, UMd, and RU instead.

They did grab half of the Pac 12, with a decent chance that a couple more get in within 10-15 years. So not quite a merger, more like the hostile takeover that the SEC performed upon the Big 12. The fun thing about the ACC is that nobody is CERTAIN which of the P2 has the upper hand. I mean, I think that we do, and I have plenty of reasons to support my position, but there are plenty of B1G fans and independent 3rd parties who aren't so sure. Also, depending on the timing of it, there might be 17 new ACC Presidents by the time the ApACColypse actually comes to pass, so nobody today can predict with certainty the final shakeout.

(11-03-2023 03:34 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:28 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  We suggested/discussed this long ago on here. B1G apparently said "no way; markets are too small." So they invited NU, UMd, and RU instead.

They did grab half of the Pac 12, with a decent chance that a couple more get in within 10-15 years. So not quite a merger, more like the hostile takeover that the SEC performed upon the Big 12. The fun thing about the ACC is that nobody is CERTAIN which of the P2 has the upper hand. I mean, I think that we do, and I have plenty of reasons to support my position, but there are plenty of B1G fans and independent 3rd parties who aren't so sure. Also, depending on the timing of it, there might be 17 new ACC Presidents by the time the ApACColypse actually comes to pass, so nobody today can predict with certainty the final shakeout.

The SEC has an enormous advantage of geography; both in how tight the conference boundry is, and having a hammerlock on the enormous southern college football viewing audience.

And their next move could be to go up the atlantic coast, keeping their boundry tight while hitting enormous markets.

If you look at the recent additions to the SEC, the worst add is probably Missouri, which wasnt really that bad.

The B1g is all over the freaking place. And a chunk of their recent adds were football flops. (Nebraska, Maryland, and Rutgers.) UscLa, while great for markets and performance, was proving to be horrible for travel. They may have alleviated that travel pain a bit by adding Wash and OR. But it appears to be a rag-tag ginormous group of teams from all over, with a lot of football dead weight.

(11-03-2023 06:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:34 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:28 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  We suggested/discussed this long ago on here. B1G apparently said "no way; markets are too small." So they invited NU, UMd, and RU instead.

They did grab half of the Pac 12, with a decent chance that a couple more get in within 10-15 years. So not quite a merger, more like the hostile takeover that the SEC performed upon the Big 12. The fun thing about the ACC is that nobody is CERTAIN which of the P2 has the upper hand. I mean, I think that we do, and I have plenty of reasons to support my position, but there are plenty of B1G fans and independent 3rd parties who aren't so sure. Also, depending on the timing of it, there might be 17 new ACC Presidents by the time the ApACColypse actually comes to pass, so nobody today can predict with certainty the final shakeout.

The SEC has an enormous advantage of geography; both in how tight the conference boundry is, and having a hammerlock on the enormous southern college football viewing audience.

And their next move could be to go up the atlantic coast, keeping their boundry tight while hitting enormous markets.

If you look at the recent additions to the SEC, the worst add is probably Missouri, which wasnt really that bad.

The B1g is all over the freaking place. And a chunk of their recent adds were football flops. (Nebraska, Maryland, and Rutgers.) UscLa, while great for markets and performance, was proving to be horrible for travel. They may have alleviated that travel pain a bit by adding Wash and OR. But it appears to be a rag-tag ginormous group of teams from all over, with a lot of football dead weight.

Yes, but dead weight disguised as conference games pads the win records of Michigan, Ohio State and Penn State. If USC gets good it is still disproportional for the top 4.

That’s not how this works

It doesnt make dollars, it doesnt make sense.

Show me the MONEY!

(11-03-2023 06:27 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 06:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:34 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:28 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  We suggested/discussed this long ago on here. B1G apparently said "no way; markets are too small." So they invited NU, UMd, and RU instead.

They did grab half of the Pac 12, with a decent chance that a couple more get in within 10-15 years. So not quite a merger, more like the hostile takeover that the SEC performed upon the Big 12. The fun thing about the ACC is that nobody is CERTAIN which of the P2 has the upper hand. I mean, I think that we do, and I have plenty of reasons to support my position, but there are plenty of B1G fans and independent 3rd parties who aren't so sure. Also, depending on the timing of it, there might be 17 new ACC Presidents by the time the ApACColypse actually comes to pass, so nobody today can predict with certainty the final shakeout.

The SEC has an enormous advantage of geography; both in how tight the conference boundry is, and having a hammerlock on the enormous southern college football viewing audience.

And their next move could be to go up the atlantic coast, keeping their boundry tight while hitting enormous markets.

If you look at the recent additions to the SEC, the worst add is probably Missouri, which wasnt really that bad.

The B1g is all over the freaking place. And a chunk of their recent adds were football flops. (Nebraska, Maryland, and Rutgers.) UscLa, while great for markets and performance, was proving to be horrible for travel. They may have alleviated that travel pain a bit by adding Wash and OR. But it appears to be a rag-tag ginormous group of teams from all over, with a lot of football dead weight.

Yes, but dead weight disguised as conference games pads the win records of Michigan, Ohio State and Penn State. If USC gets good it is still disproportional for the top 4.

I'm not high on Riley per se, but USC should end up fine long term, regardless of the coach. Despite their recent "struggles", they still have 3 top 10s in the past 7 years, and they were 2 points away from making the CFP last year. They've been ranked in the final poll in 8 of the past 10 years and 17 of the past 21. Go back further and there's a whole lot of Glory Days. USC is like Miami, only if Miami had continued to win big and be relevant up until this very day. They'll certainly be able to Ryan Day, PSU and the Cheaters all they can handle long term.

This is not, technically, a merger. It is a break off. The MWC is the most recent historical example, though the creation of the Big 12 may be most analogous (however they kept all members of the stronger conference).

To merge, that would have meant that the B1G was recognizing the PAC as their equals.

That aint happening.

(11-03-2023 03:34 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:28 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  We suggested/discussed this long ago on here. B1G apparently said "no way; markets are too small." So they invited NU, UMd, and RU instead.

They did grab half of the Pac 12

Half?

(11-04-2023 07:09 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  To merge, that would have meant that the B1G was recognizing the PAC as their equals.

That aint happening.

On the field The PAC has been more than equal, they’ve been better.

The PAC leads The Big Ten in regular season and bowl game victories, head to head.

http://mcubed.net/ncaaf/tvc/big10/pac12...._article=1

The B1G-PAC alliance, which the B1G pushed hard for and the PAC turned down, inferred the two as equals. I'm not sure if it came from the B1G offices or one of the school leaders claiming (or suggesting) that the UMD-RU expansion was a result of the PAC passing on the arrangement. So, there's that.

It didn't need to get to a merger and a super-conference. But, PAC's gonna PAC...

(11-04-2023 08:37 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  

(11-04-2023 07:09 AM)Bear Catlett Wrote:  To merge, that would have meant that the B1G was recognizing the PAC as their equals.

That aint happening.

On the field The PAC has been more than equal, they’ve been better.

The PAC leads The Big Ten in regular season and bowl game victories, head to head.

http://mcubed.net/ncaaf/tvc/big10/pac12...._article=1

My point was more about attitude than achievement.

I can tell you don't know a whole lot of Ohio State people.

That's not how the rules of conference re-alignment work.

You add programs based on media rights contracts and you have to feed all of those who are currently in your conference. If you add too many programs the money doesn't work. THe AD is a business.

In other words...follow the money.

(11-04-2023 10:41 AM)HP-TBDPITL Wrote:  That's not how the rules of conference re-alignment work.

You add programs based on media rights contracts and you have to feed all of those who are currently in your conference. If you add too many programs the money doesn't work. THe AD is a business.

In other words...follow the money.

That’s been the same model in effect since the first ACC raid on the Big East. That’s close to 20 years. Also Disney appears to want to divest itself of ESPN. The cable model is continuing to decline. One thing that kept it relevant was broadband since cable is highly efficient at offering bandwidth for data transfer. Mobile phone carriers are now starting to add their own broadband now that 5G is widespread. How will this play out? Don’t know. But I would not be betting on cable for the long term. Much of the conference TV contracts were forced upon consumers thru their cable provider. Sure just switch to streaming. But with that, it’s purely voluntary and no longer forced on consumers like it is with cable.

(11-03-2023 06:27 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 06:09 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:34 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(11-03-2023 03:28 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  We suggested/discussed this long ago on here. B1G apparently said "no way; markets are too small." So they invited NU, UMd, and RU instead.

They did grab half of the Pac 12, with a decent chance that a couple more get in within 10-15 years. So not quite a merger, more like the hostile takeover that the SEC performed upon the Big 12. The fun thing about the ACC is that nobody is CERTAIN which of the P2 has the upper hand. I mean, I think that we do, and I have plenty of reasons to support my position, but there are plenty of B1G fans and independent 3rd parties who aren't so sure. Also, depending on the timing of it, there might be 17 new ACC Presidents by the time the ApACColypse actually comes to pass, so nobody today can predict with certainty the final shakeout.

The SEC has an enormous advantage of geography; both in how tight the conference boundry is, and having a hammerlock on the enormous southern college football viewing audience.

And their next move could be to go up the atlantic coast, keeping their boundry tight while hitting enormous markets.

If you look at the recent additions to the SEC, the worst add is probably Missouri, which wasnt really that bad.

The B1g is all over the freaking place. And a chunk of their recent adds were football flops. (Nebraska, Maryland, and Rutgers.) UscLa, while great for markets and performance, was proving to be horrible for travel. They may have alleviated that travel pain a bit by adding Wash and OR. But it appears to be a rag-tag ginormous group of teams from all over, with a lot of football dead weight.

Yes, but dead weight disguised as conference games pads the win records of Michigan, Ohio State and Penn State. If USC gets good it is still disproportional for the top 4.

All the major conferences have dead weight, though some more so than others. B1G for the longest time was OSU, Mich and everyone else. Sometimes PSU, Iowa and Wiscy would threaten but not typically.

Like it or not, as long as Ohio State and Michigan own the Big 10 the Big 10 will be more of an Eastern Conference than a Western Conference. Maryland and Rutgers are closer geographically to Ohio State and Michigan than Washington and Oregon are. Heck, Maryland and Rutgers are closer geographically to Ohio State and Michigan than Nebraska is yet everyone thinks Nebraska belongs in the Big Ten and Maryland and Rutgers don't. I'm sure some people think Nebraska belongs in the Big Ten more than Penn State which is completely ridiculous. The Big Ten West Division in nine years has literally never won the Big Ten Championship Game (Wisconsin won two titles when it was Leaders vs. Legends and one of those titles was vs. Nebraska) and it's not like Ohio State has won it every year. In 2015 MICHIGAN STATE won the Big Ten Championship. You Western crap couldn't even win the Big Ten when all of the Big Three were out?

Penn State joined the Big Ten in 1993. Since then, they've missed bowl games seven times, two of them because of the Sandusky scandal and they would have been bowl eligible both years.

Nebraska joined the Big Ten in 2014 and has missed a bowl game six straight seasons.

Who belongs in the Big Ten more, the Eastern school or the Western one?

Maybe when the Pacific schools join the balance of power will shift but this is why we (the Eastern schools) don't want them.

(11-05-2023 10:30 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Nebraska joined the Big Ten in 2014 and has missed a bowl game six straight seasons.

NU would be welcomed back to the Big XII. Give them a free pass out of the B1G?