A small Dukes NIL collective could give JMU a better shot at guys like Nickel. I wonder if there are talks to a public facing effort outside of something like the Alpha Dogs for basketball.

I was hoping to not be reading too much into Tyree's body language but he looked pretty unhappy even the latter half of the year when he was playing more. I hope he finds somewhere he can thrive.

(03-20-2023 02:49 PM)CarRamrod Wrote:  I was hoping to not be reading too much into Tyree's body language but he looked pretty unhappy even the latter half of the year when he was playing more. I hope he finds somewhere he can thrive.

Tyree and Strickland were a dynamic duo on D, and I wonder how much of Strickland’s decision impacted Tyree’s decision.

The incoming High School recruit out of Houston (Archie?) is also supposed to be a stud. Given his potential, and a returning Xavier Brown, I wonder if Tyree thought his minutes would stay the same, or even get cut.

Edit to link on Archie: https://jmusports.com/news/2022/11/9/men...23-24.aspx

It's going to be a struggle getting guys who like to play with ball movement to stay in this system. Ihenacho isn't the first and I don't think he'll be the last.

A little surprised by Ihenacho, but not TOO much.
It felt like he was more of a factor last year. Perhaps his injury played into it, or perhaps he just wasn't buying in or happy.
Either way, I think it's best for both parties. Wish him the best.
And while unfortunate, it does leave room to bring in another player that may fit our need more.

I didn't expect him to go because of possibly having to sit out a year. Glad it's not Amadi or Edwards, but there's nobody I wanted to see leave. Hope he does well wherever he lands.

Lots of scholarships to fill. I hope we can get some guys with more than 1 year left to play.

Tyler with 3 left would be nice!

the coaches caravan should be interesting.

(03-20-2023 03:21 PM)Newduke Wrote:  It's going to be a struggle getting guys who like to play with ball movement to stay in this system. Ihenacho isn't the first and I don't think he'll be the last.

Can you elaborate on what you mean by “play with ball movement”…do you mean “a system with set plays” and that passes?

The entire JMU offensive system this past couple of years (if you can call it a “system”) strikes me as a free-form, Pell-mell, move individuals around a lot and see what happens kinda deal. As such the movement is there…sans passing and set plays…and then it becomes stagnant when forced into half court sets.

Many of today’s best players seem to like the freedom to improvise on O, so I wouldn’t think it would be hard to recruit to that kind of offense. The issue, however, is that unless Coach B hits the lottery and signs just the right combo of superior and unselfish athletes, a free-form O can result in “Hero” ball…which at its worse is hard to watch and more often than not doesn’t win the big games.

Asked Mettlen if he expects this to be it for transfers out, sounds like we'll hopefully get an answer on that from Byington tomorrow:

(03-20-2023 06:55 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  

(03-20-2023 03:21 PM)Newduke Wrote:  It's going to be a struggle getting guys who like to play with ball movement to stay in this system. Ihenacho isn't the first and I don't think he'll be the last.

Can you elaborate on what you mean by “play with ball movement”…do you mean “a system with set plays” and that passes?

The entire JMU offensive system this past couple of years (if you can call it a “system”) strikes me as a free-form, Pell-mell, move individuals around a lot and see what happens kinda deal. As such the movement is there…sans passing and set plays…and then it becomes stagnant when forced into half court sets.

Many of today’s best players seem to like the freedom to improvise on O, so I wouldn’t think it would be hard to recruit to that kind of offense. The issue, however, is that unless Coach B hits the lottery and signs just the right combo of superior and unselfish athletes, a free-form O can result in “Hero” ball…which at its worse is hard to watch and more often than not doesn’t win the big games.

Sure. I meant an offense that generates shots and driving lanes by passing and ball movement instead of constant one on one isolation or dribbling.

I have no idea why Ihenacho is transferring, but if it’s because didn’t want to waste another year of his career standing around watching other guys dribble and throw up wild shots (and then have that type of play be praised), I don’t blame him.

If By can't design an offense himself, he needs to hire someone who can. His "street ball" offense just isn't working. Imagine that!

(03-20-2023 09:25 PM)Purple Wrote:  If By can't design an offense himself, he needs to hire someone who can. His "street ball" offense just isn't working. Imagine that!

Truth.....this work's when you get top tier players, and even then it's crapshoot...set plays makes everyone - and their stats - look better, sweat less, and avoids wild shots

This isn't next level bball ....I think we have plateaued so I hope By is paying attention and is able to admit that this is mediocrity - time to adjust

(03-20-2023 06:55 PM)Longhorn Wrote:  

(03-20-2023 03:21 PM)Newduke Wrote:  It's going to be a struggle getting guys who like to play with ball movement to stay in this system. Ihenacho isn't the first and I don't think he'll be the last.

Can you elaborate on what you mean by “play with ball movement”…do you mean “a system with set plays” and that passes?

The entire JMU offensive system this past couple of years (if you can call it a “system”) strikes me as a free-form, Pell-mell, move individuals around a lot and see what happens kinda deal. As such the movement is there…sans passing and set plays…and then it becomes stagnant when forced into half court sets.

Many of today’s best players seem to like the freedom to improvise on O, so I wouldn’t think it would be hard to recruit to that kind of offense. The issue, however, is that unless Coach B hits the lottery and signs just the right combo of superior and unselfish athletes, a free-form O can result in “Hero” ball…which at its worse is hard to watch and more often than not doesn’t win the big games.

Chemistry may have a little bit to do with it as well. You see some of these teams in the NCAAT with shorter rotations but mesh better together because they've got great chemistry. Hard to build that with a 10 man rotation. And the injuries didn't help this year either with the offense taking different shapes when Vado was out and Tak became the primary handler for a bit.

Think there needs to be a blend of set plays and free flow. Need the set plays to be able to break the zone D that we struggled against (hard to break zone when you're playing 4 out), and more free flow and letting things develop when teams aren't in zone.

(03-20-2023 09:25 PM)Purple Wrote:  If By can't design an offense himself, he needs to hire someone who can. His "street ball" offense just isn't working. Imagine that!

All he'd have to do is remember how his college team played. Maybe four years at Wilmington has caught up with him

Wow, tough crowd here....this is literally the most successful mens basketball season (22-11) in 2 decades. This team backed up a regular season top 4 finish with a trip to the semi-finals in the conference tournament. And all of a sudden the team is mediocre, the system sucks, and the team has no talent.

What I have seen is a coach that has moved this program from a complete train-wreck to being a respectable mid-major program in 3 years, while navigating a conference move, COVID issues, and the transfer portal. The team went from playing zero defense and absolutely no scheme on offense to consistently playing tough, solid defense, rebounding well, and having an offensive system (which is a rather fun offense to watch most of the time). It comes down to what you prefer to watch, this offensive system is what I would say the majority of teams in college basketball run these days or something similar....it is en vogue....kinda like the RPO offenses in college football is the 'hot' thing). Also in 3 years I think Coach B has consistently addressed needs for the team and as a whole has increased the level of talent on the team from what he inherited.

I think I will wait to bash the guy until the program actually regresses and/or consistently performs below expectations.

For the schedule folks, it takes 2 teams to actually schedule a game and most every teams plays the D2/D3 games these days since the NCAA no longer allows pre-season exhibition games and the NCAA counts them. Oh and JMU played 2 ACC P5's on the road this year and was in each game.

this^

I think we're exactly where we want our bottom to be... which is so much better than where we've been for decades. Demonstrating some consistency at this point over some years is a step in the right direction. Keep building!

(03-21-2023 08:30 AM)ShadyP Wrote:  Wow, tough crowd here....this is literally the most successful mens basketball season (22-11) in 2 decades. This team backed up a regular season top 4 finish with a trip to the semi-finals in the conference tournament. And all of a sudden the team is mediocre, the system sucks, and the team has no talent.

What I have seen is a coach that has moved this program from a complete train-wreck to being a respectable mid-major program in 3 years, while navigating a conference move, COVID issues, and the transfer portal. The team went from playing zero defense and absolutely no scheme on offense to consistently playing tough, solid defense, rebounding well, and having an offensive system (which is a rather fun offense to watch most of the time). It comes down to what you prefer to watch, this offensive system is what I would say the majority of teams in college basketball run these days or something similar....it is en vogue....kinda like the RPO offenses in college football is the 'hot' thing). Also in 3 years I think Coach B has consistently addressed needs for the team and as a whole has increased the level of talent on the team from what he inherited.

I think I will wait to bash the guy until the program actually regresses and/or consistently performs below expectations.

For the schedule folks, it takes 2 teams to actually schedule a game and most every teams plays the D2/D3 games these days since the NCAA no longer allows pre-season exhibition games and the NCAA counts them. Oh and JMU played 2 ACC P5's on the road this year and was in each game.

Well I wouldn't say it's "all of a sudden"..... hard to lean on our 22 wins given the very light opposition... what IS our system on O? I just dont buy that we will ever have the talent for dribble drive wild shots over and over ...maybe it's why good players are leaving? This is exhausting bball.... fundamentals any day

(03-21-2023 08:56 AM)bcp_jmu Wrote:  

(03-21-2023 08:30 AM)ShadyP Wrote:  Wow, tough crowd here....this is literally the most successful mens basketball season (22-11) in 2 decades. This team backed up a regular season top 4 finish with a trip to the semi-finals in the conference tournament. And all of a sudden the team is mediocre, the system sucks, and the team has no talent.

What I have seen is a coach that has moved this program from a complete train-wreck to being a respectable mid-major program in 3 years, while navigating a conference move, COVID issues, and the transfer portal. The team went from playing zero defense and absolutely no scheme on offense to consistently playing tough, solid defense, rebounding well, and having an offensive system (which is a rather fun offense to watch most of the time). It comes down to what you prefer to watch, this offensive system is what I would say the majority of teams in college basketball run these days or something similar....it is en vogue....kinda like the RPO offenses in college football is the 'hot' thing). Also in 3 years I think Coach B has consistently addressed needs for the team and as a whole has increased the level of talent on the team from what he inherited.

I think I will wait to bash the guy until the program actually regresses and/or consistently performs below expectations.

For the schedule folks, it takes 2 teams to actually schedule a game and most every teams plays the D2/D3 games these days since the NCAA no longer allows pre-season exhibition games and the NCAA counts them. Oh and JMU played 2 ACC P5's on the road this year and was in each game.

Well I wouldn't say it's "all of a sudden"..... hard to lean on our 22 wins given the very light opposition... what IS our system on O? I just dont buy that we will ever have the talent for dribble drive wild shots over and over ...maybe it's why good players are leaving? This is exhausting bball.... fundamentals any day

Here comes the schedule crowd. Our RPI, Net rating is the highest it has been in years so I don't buy that our schedule is a major issue. Also kinda tough when conferences like the A-10 refuse to schedule and/or back out of deals. As I said it takes 2 to schedule a game, just b/c JMU wants to play them that does not mean we can simply dictate a game. And I agree JMU should accept no less than a home and home with the likes of A-10 schools GMU/VCU/Richmond/etc.

The style of offense in the cliff notes version is a 4 out - 1 style with multple players capable of dribble drives and if not there dribble and kick for the 3 ball. It may not be what you desire in an old school Indiana offense, but that is the style most prevalant in college basketball, particularly mid-majors where finding a dominant 5 player is next to impossible. It is pretty much the exact same concept that FDU ran very well this past weekend taking out a #1 seed, it is the same concept that Saint Peter ran last year to much success in the tournament. It one thing to say you don't care for a freedom of movement, 4 out 1 in system and style of play and to say the there is no offensive system.

As for good players leaving welcome the 2023 and the transfer portal, it literally happens everywhere and JMU is not immune. You don't have to like the portal (I personally don't care for what the NCAA has put in place) but it is a reality and you better have a coaching staff that can embrace and use it to you benefit. For the recent players that have left (Ihenacho, Strickland, Hodge, freshmen from last year) I will gladly take what we have gotten from the portal as more talented players (Morse, Offerrum, Friedal, Molson). You say our good players are leaving, I see quite the opposite, players leaving that want more PT b/c they know where they slot in with returning/new players next season. I would be much more concerned if Xavier Brown entered the portal vs Ihenacho or Edwards.

As for this past season players that can effectively dribble drive in this offense and finish....i guess you did not watch many game b/c Edwards is superb in this offense and Offerrum, Wooden and Molson were also pretty dang good at dibble drive and finish......and Morse, Friedel, Molson, Edwards, and Wooden were all not too shabby on the kickout three portion of this offense.

Different takes on this..(and c'mon...FD is some serious anecdotal cherry picking :) ...but no disagreement with that last paragraph at all - but it's just no sustainable bball ...guys are fresh after 30 games when an offense is loaded with easier, smarter shots.