Everyone on this board thought this team would've a legitimate chance to be A MAC top 4 seed! No one envisioned A 6-19 record, and 3-9 in the MAC! I never envisioned it either, but look at Stan Heath's track record when we hired him! He was FIRED at Arkansas, and South Florida, 82-71 At Arkansas, 97-130 at South Florida, and 16-40 At EMU! Do the math.......195-241 doesn't equal success! Why can't we hire A Jeff Boals, Michael Lewis, John Groce, Tod K, Rob Senderhoff, etc........I want Heath to succeed, but this season will make recruiting really difficult! He does have three more years to improve the program though! Ball St for example last year was 14-17, they fire their coach, they bring in Michael Lewis, and in year one he has them 18-7, and 9-3 in the MAC where it matters!

(02-13-2023 09:52 AM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  Everyone on this board thought this team would've a legitimate chance to be A MAC top 4 seed! No one envisioned A 6-19 record, and 3-9 in the MAC! I never envisioned it either, but look at Stan Heath's track record when we hired him! He was FIRED at Arkansas, and South Florida, 82-71 At Arkansas, 97-130 at South Florida, and 16-40 At EMU! Do the math.......195-241 doesn't equal success! Why can't we hire A Jeff Boals, Michael Lewis, John Groce, Tod K, Rob Senderhoff, etc........I want Heath to succeed, but this season will make recruiting really difficult! He does have three more years to improve the program though! Ball St for example last year was 14-17, they fire their coach, they bring in Michael Lewis, and in year one he has them 18-7, and 9-3 in the MAC where it matters!

If Stan leaves after this year it will be because he chooses to. I don't think he will be fired.

(02-13-2023 10:57 AM)emu79 Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 09:52 AM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  Everyone on this board thought this team would've a legitimate chance to be A MAC top 4 seed! No one envisioned A 6-19 record, and 3-9 in the MAC! I never envisioned it either, but look at Stan Heath's track record when we hired him! He was FIRED at Arkansas, and South Florida, 82-71 At Arkansas, 97-130 at South Florida, and 16-40 At EMU! Do the math.......195-241 doesn't equal success! Why can't we hire A Jeff Boals, Michael Lewis, John Groce, Tod K, Rob Senderhoff, etc........I want Heath to succeed, but this season will make recruiting really difficult! He does have three more years to improve the program though! Ball St for example last year was 14-17, they fire their coach, they bring in Michael Lewis, and in year one he has them 18-7, and 9-3 in the MAC where it matters!

If Stan leaves after this year it will be because he chooses to. I don't think he will be fired.

EMU doesnt pay guys not to coach.

Stan’s body language tells me he will resign. He pretty much crosses his arms and watches the game to appear he’s engaged but again his body language tells me he’s done. The reality he’s now in an unrecoverable position. Allowing players to dominate the ball on offense and not play fundamental D indicates he never got thru to the team.

I like Stan and he seems like a great guy. At his position, you have to demonstrate to everyone that you’re the alpha male. I don’t feel that way anymore.

(02-13-2023 12:22 PM)dansplaining Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 10:57 AM)emu79 Wrote:  If Stan leaves after this year it will be because he chooses to. I don't think he will be fired.

EMU doesnt pay guys not to coach.

100% agreed with both of you. That is standard practice at MAC level. You get a 5 year contract to turn things around, figure things out, etc. Succeed or not. It is assessed at the end of 5 years. There are no interim progress reports.

Have any of you visited StansEMU office just to say "hi"?

(02-13-2023 09:52 AM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  Everyone on this board thought this team would've a legitimate chance to be A MAC top 4 seed! No one envisioned A 6-19 record, and 3-9 in the MAC! I never envisioned it either, but look at Stan Heath's track record when we hired him! He was FIRED at Arkansas, and South Florida, 82-71 At Arkansas, 97-130 at South Florida, and 16-40 At EMU! Do the math.......195-241 doesn't equal success! Why can't we hire A Jeff Boals, Michael Lewis, John Groce, Tod K, Rob Senderhoff, etc........I want Heath to succeed, but this season will make recruiting really difficult! He does have three more years to improve the program though! Ball St for example last year was 14-17, they fire their coach, they bring in Michael Lewis, and in year one he has them 18-7, and 9-3 in the MAC where it matters!

Glory, I don’t disagree with you that Coach Heath has thus far done a very poor job at EMU. But I want to point out a contradiction in your historical reference:

After being MAC-level successful at Ohio, John Groce pretty much performed at Illinois (95-75, 1 NCAA and 3 NIT invitations) as Coach Heath performed at Arkansas (82-71, 2 NCAA and 1 NIT invitations). So, you can’t say John Groce is the type of coach we need, and not Coach Heath.

Further, you can’t OMIT Coach Heath’s winning run at Kent St (as you did above I assume because it was a program on an upward trajectory when he arrived), then INCLUDE his losing record at USF since that is a program/position that is doomed for any Coach.

Again, I am not disagreeing with you. Coach Heath has done a historically poor job his first couple years at EMU. But his historical record has some very significant positives, despite not being entirely clear cut.

Regardless of what we think, he is going to be the EMU coach for the next 3 years. I hope that all he needs to do is to adjust his approach (in various ways) to coaching a college team rather than a g-league team in the future 3 years. Or maybe he will continue to tank. But he will be our coach for the next 3 years, if that is his desire (and I would guess it is). Just my thoughts. Definitely some shared views with you, with slightly differing perspective.

(02-13-2023 03:05 PM)RamyEMU Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 09:52 AM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  Everyone on this board thought this team would've a legitimate chance to be A MAC top 4 seed! No one envisioned A 6-19 record, and 3-9 in the MAC! I never envisioned it either, but look at Stan Heath's track record when we hired him! He was FIRED at Arkansas, and South Florida, 82-71 At Arkansas, 97-130 at South Florida, and 16-40 At EMU! Do the math.......195-241 doesn't equal success! Why can't we hire A Jeff Boals, Michael Lewis, John Groce, Tod K, Rob Senderhoff, etc........I want Heath to succeed, but this season will make recruiting really difficult! He does have three more years to improve the program though! Ball St for example last year was 14-17, they fire their coach, they bring in Michael Lewis, and in year one he has them 18-7, and 9-3 in the MAC where it matters!

Glory, I don’t disagree with you that Coach Heath has thus far done a very poor job at EMU. But I want to point out a contradiction in your historical reference:

After being MAC-level successful at Ohio, John Groce pretty much performed at Illinois (95-75, 1 NCAA and 3 NIT invitations) as Coach Heath performed at Arkansas (82-71, 2 NCAA and 1 NIT invitations). So, you can’t say John Groce is the type of coach we need, and not Coach Heath.

Further, you can’t OMIT Coach Heath’s winning run at Kent St (as you did above I assume because it was a program on an upward trajectory when he arrived), then INCLUDE his losing record at USF since that is a program/position that is doomed for any Coach.

Again, I am not disagreeing with you. Coach Heath has done a historically poor job his first couple years at EMU. But his historical record has some very significant positives, despite not being entirely clear cut.

Regardless of what we think, he is going to be the EMU coach for the next 3 years. I hope that all he needs to do is to adjust his approach (in various ways) to coaching a college team rather than a g-league team in the future 3 years. Or maybe he will continue to tank. But he will be our coach for the next 3 years, if that is his desire (and I would guess it is). Just my thoughts. Definitely some shared views with you, with slightly differing perspective.

"Further, you can’t OMIT Coach Heath’s winning run at Kent St (as you did above I assume because it was a program on an upward trajectory when he arrived), then INCLUDE his losing record at USF since that is a program/position that is doomed for any Coach."

I don't like to impugn the motives of posters, but disregarding an Elite Eight performance and only highlighting cases where Stan took over rebuilding jobs is really not fair.

A career is usually a mix of good fortune (taking over a team winning or about to win) plus some bad fortune (taking over rebuilds). Coaches forever taking over rebuilds usually don't have long careers as HC. Need to occasionally land in a soft spot.

Plus excluding his G-League success.

He has been coach of the year in the MAC and G-League and has been fired. Coach drinks water but doesn't walk on water. We know that.

Heath inherited a complete rebuild. The team has made great strides in all areas except Ws and Ls. John Wooden couldn't win with this group. We all overestimated this team, the smart ones adjusted their expectations with the unpleasant reality that the team is not very good. That said, this team can compete with the upper echelon of the MAC, which is impressive to me.

I agree our front court is very lacking but even on the MAC message board a Toledo poster writes how unbelievable it is to have three of the top 15 players in the league and we can’t even qualify for the MAC tournament.

(02-13-2023 05:19 PM)Luckeyone Wrote:  I agree our front court is very lacking but even on the MAC message board a Toledo poster writes how unbelievable it is to have three of the top 15 players in the league and we can’t even qualify for the MAC tournament.

I think we might be the only two that agree how embarrassing this season has been! 3 out 5 starters are going to be all league players, and we're hoping to make the MAC tournament! Who knows if we do, We might win the whole darn thing!

My comment on this thread:

"Kudos to Wylie for an excellent game and getting us thinking football and away from the next 683 posts on EMU MBB. 03-nutkick"

I guess Super Bowl Sunday is in the rear view mirror and now we are back to the basketball re-hash. The next 683 is now down to...

GloryDays is tough on coaches!! Stan isn't the first to feel the heat in the last six months... I hope I don't see exclamation marks in my sleep tonight. Almost every sentence ends in an exclamation mark or a question which can be thought of as equivalent (e.g., why the hell can't we win?).

" RE: Game Week / Day: Toledo
We sit 5-4, and 2-3 in the MAC! We beat an FCS school, UMass is 1-7, AZ ST is 3-5, W Mich is 3-5, and Ball St is 4-4! We've not beaten A D1 school with a winning record! Is this what everyone wants from A NINTH year coach? We returned soooooo many upperclassmen as well! We lost at home today to Toledo with their backup QB! Creighton simply isn't a winner at the D1 level! His play calling is almost high school level! So, are we supposed to wait for year 10, 11, 12 to see if he can win the MAC? It's time to really consider moving on.......I really appreciate him for making us respectable, but after over 100 games, being respectable shouldn't be the goal! We've a very easy schedule going forward, so 8-4, and 5-3 is very doable, but as a fan and alumni I want what every MAC West school has accomplished except us! "
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 01:07 AM by EMUGLORYDAYSthe90's.

(02-13-2023 05:44 PM)emu steve Wrote:  My comment on this thread:

"Kudos to Wylie for an excellent game and getting us thinking football and away from the next 683 posts on EMU MBB. 03-nutkick"

I guess Super Bowl Sunday is in the rear view mirror and now we are back to the basketball re-hash. The next 683 is now down to...

Steve, these guys are like a broken record. How many different ways can they say the same thing?

(02-13-2023 06:14 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 05:44 PM)emu steve Wrote:  My comment on this thread:

"Kudos to Wylie for an excellent game and getting us thinking football and away from the next 683 posts on EMU MBB. 03-nutkick"

I guess Super Bowl Sunday is in the rear view mirror and now we are back to the basketball re-hash. The next 683 is now down to...

Steve, these guys are like a broken record. How many different ways can they say the same thing?

You know, I am on the fence with this one. Glory and Luckey are raising good points. While we may have overestimated this team particularly with the youth of the frontcourt, not making the MAC tourney with this group is shocking. I very much believe Coach Heath has got to reflect on these last couple years and recalibrate for the coming years. Unfortunately, not much WE can do about it though except hope for the best.

One thing I will say on Coach Heath’s behalf is that this team has played their best basketball in the last 6 games. So he has so far kept the team together despite what should be an even more frustrating season for the players then it has been for us fans. We’ll see if that holds up in the final stretch here.

(02-13-2023 06:11 PM)emu steve Wrote:  GloryDays is tough on coaches!! Stan isn't the first to feel the heat in the last six months... I hope I don't see exclamation marks in my sleep tonight. Almost every sentence ends in an exclamation mark or a question which can be thought of as equivalent (e.g., why the hell can't we win?).

" RE: Game Week / Day: Toledo
We sit 5-4, and 2-3 in the MAC! We beat an FCS school, UMass is 1-7, AZ ST is 3-5, W Mich is 3-5, and Ball St is 4-4! We've not beaten A D1 school with a winning record! Is this what everyone wants from A NINTH year coach? We returned soooooo many upperclassmen as well! We lost at home today to Toledo with their backup QB! Creighton simply isn't a winner at the D1 level! His play calling is almost high school level! So, are we supposed to wait for year 10, 11, 12 to see if he can win the MAC? It's time to really consider moving on.......I really appreciate him for making us respectable, but after over 100 games, being respectable shouldn't be the goal! We've a very easy schedule going forward, so 8-4, and 5-3 is very doable, but as a fan and alumni I want what every MAC West school has accomplished except us! "
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 01:07 AM by EMUGLORYDAYSthe90's.

I'm not hard on coaches! A seasoned coach who has taken THREE teams to the NCAA tournament and has 15 years coaching experience, I sure would hope for better results then this! Basketball is way easier to change the culture then football also! If everyone returns next season then this team will breakthrough! I like the Creighton thread I wrote, and I'll admit Creighton broke through! Look how easy recruiting becomes also. I'm hoping we upset Akron tomorrow! BobW, be nice! I agree with what you say 90% off the time, and your Basketball insight is really good! Miss reading EagleSam reports!

(02-13-2023 08:03 PM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 06:11 PM)emu steve Wrote:  GloryDays is tough on coaches!! Stan isn't the first to feel the heat in the last six months... I hope I don't see exclamation marks in my sleep tonight. Almost every sentence ends in an exclamation mark or a question which can be thought of as equivalent (e.g., why the hell can't we win?).

" RE: Game Week / Day: Toledo
We sit 5-4, and 2-3 in the MAC! We beat an FCS school, UMass is 1-7, AZ ST is 3-5, W Mich is 3-5, and Ball St is 4-4! We've not beaten A D1 school with a winning record! Is this what everyone wants from A NINTH year coach? We returned soooooo many upperclassmen as well! We lost at home today to Toledo with their backup QB! Creighton simply isn't a winner at the D1 level! His play calling is almost high school level! So, are we supposed to wait for year 10, 11, 12 to see if he can win the MAC? It's time to really consider moving on.......I really appreciate him for making us respectable, but after over 100 games, being respectable shouldn't be the goal! We've a very easy schedule going forward, so 8-4, and 5-3 is very doable, but as a fan and alumni I want what every MAC West school has accomplished except us! "
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 01:07 AM by EMUGLORYDAYSthe90's.

I'm not hard on coaches! A seasoned coach who has taken THREE teams to the NCAA tournament and has 15 years coaching experience, I sure would hope for better results then this! Basketball is way easier to change the culture then football also! If everyone returns next season then this team will breakthrough! I like the Creighton thread I wrote, and I'll admit Creighton broke through! Look how easy recruiting becomes also. I'm hoping we upset Akron tomorrow! BobW, be nice! I agree with what you say 90% off the time, and your Basketball insight is really good! Miss reading EagleSam reports!

Beating Akron is going to be...extremely unlikely. I hate that this is where we are at. But we do have Emoni Bates and there is always a chance that he goes off so you can't turn away. This is the most unusual bad team ever. Because we have the best player in the MAC, there is always a chance, without him, there would be absolutely no point in tuning in. If Acuff has another phenomenal game and Emoni returns to greatness, who knows crazier things have happened!

(02-13-2023 08:40 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 08:03 PM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 06:11 PM)emu steve Wrote:  GloryDays is tough on coaches!! Stan isn't the first to feel the heat in the last six months... I hope I don't see exclamation marks in my sleep tonight. Almost every sentence ends in an exclamation mark or a question which can be thought of as equivalent (e.g., why the hell can't we win?).

" RE: Game Week / Day: Toledo
We sit 5-4, and 2-3 in the MAC! We beat an FCS school, UMass is 1-7, AZ ST is 3-5, W Mich is 3-5, and Ball St is 4-4! We've not beaten A D1 school with a winning record! Is this what everyone wants from A NINTH year coach? We returned soooooo many upperclassmen as well! We lost at home today to Toledo with their backup QB! Creighton simply isn't a winner at the D1 level! His play calling is almost high school level! So, are we supposed to wait for year 10, 11, 12 to see if he can win the MAC? It's time to really consider moving on.......I really appreciate him for making us respectable, but after over 100 games, being respectable shouldn't be the goal! We've a very easy schedule going forward, so 8-4, and 5-3 is very doable, but as a fan and alumni I want what every MAC West school has accomplished except us! "
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 01:07 AM by EMUGLORYDAYSthe90's.

I'm not hard on coaches! A seasoned coach who has taken THREE teams to the NCAA tournament and has 15 years coaching experience, I sure would hope for better results then this! Basketball is way easier to change the culture then football also! If everyone returns next season then this team will breakthrough! I like the Creighton thread I wrote, and I'll admit Creighton broke through! Look how easy recruiting becomes also. I'm hoping we upset Akron tomorrow! BobW, be nice! I agree with what you say 90% off the time, and your Basketball insight is really good! Miss reading EagleSam reports!

Beating Akron is going to be...extremely unlikely. I hate that this is where we are at. But we do have Emoni Bates and there is always a chance that he goes off so you can't turn away. This is the most unusual bad team ever. Because we have the best player in the MAC, there is always a chance, without him, there would be absolutely no point in tuning in. If Acuff has another phenomenal game and Emoni returns to greatness, who knows crazier things have happened!

I'm with you, Bob, on your point. Talking about points...

Yes any game Emoni or Tyson may go off for 30+ points. Don't know which. Crazy.

I guess you might be thinking out loud: Could one got off for 30+ and the other 20+? Beat a team we are not supposed to beat?

The corollary question is: Can they BOTH have great nights OR does it mean the one who is hot shoots, shoots and keeps shooting?

(02-13-2023 09:02 PM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 08:40 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 08:03 PM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 06:11 PM)emu steve Wrote:  GloryDays is tough on coaches!! Stan isn't the first to feel the heat in the last six months... I hope I don't see exclamation marks in my sleep tonight. Almost every sentence ends in an exclamation mark or a question which can be thought of as equivalent (e.g., why the hell can't we win?).

" RE: Game Week / Day: Toledo
We sit 5-4, and 2-3 in the MAC! We beat an FCS school, UMass is 1-7, AZ ST is 3-5, W Mich is 3-5, and Ball St is 4-4! We've not beaten A D1 school with a winning record! Is this what everyone wants from A NINTH year coach? We returned soooooo many upperclassmen as well! We lost at home today to Toledo with their backup QB! Creighton simply isn't a winner at the D1 level! His play calling is almost high school level! So, are we supposed to wait for year 10, 11, 12 to see if he can win the MAC? It's time to really consider moving on.......I really appreciate him for making us respectable, but after over 100 games, being respectable shouldn't be the goal! We've a very easy schedule going forward, so 8-4, and 5-3 is very doable, but as a fan and alumni I want what every MAC West school has accomplished except us! "
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 01:07 AM by EMUGLORYDAYSthe90's.

I'm not hard on coaches! A seasoned coach who has taken THREE teams to the NCAA tournament and has 15 years coaching experience, I sure would hope for better results then this! Basketball is way easier to change the culture then football also! If everyone returns next season then this team will breakthrough! I like the Creighton thread I wrote, and I'll admit Creighton broke through! Look how easy recruiting becomes also. I'm hoping we upset Akron tomorrow! BobW, be nice! I agree with what you say 90% off the time, and your Basketball insight is really good! Miss reading EagleSam reports!

Beating Akron is going to be...extremely unlikely. I hate that this is where we are at. But we do have Emoni Bates and there is always a chance that he goes off so you can't turn away. This is the most unusual bad team ever. Because we have the best player in the MAC, there is always a chance, without him, there would be absolutely no point in tuning in. If Acuff has another phenomenal game and Emoni returns to greatness, who knows crazier things have happened!

I'm with you, Bob, on your point. Talking about points...

Yes any game Emoni or Tyson may go off for 30+ points. Don't know which. Crazy.

I guess you might be thinking out loud: Could one got off for 30+ and the other 20+? Beat a team we are not supposed to beat?

The corollary question is: Can they BOTH have great nights OR does it mean the one who is hot shoots, shoots and keeps shooting?

I think to beat Akron both need to have great nights and Farrakhan has to be good too. It is a tall order, no doubt.

(02-13-2023 08:40 PM)Bob Wickersham Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 08:03 PM)EMUGLORYDAYSthe90s Wrote:  

(02-13-2023 06:11 PM)emu steve Wrote:  GloryDays is tough on coaches!! Stan isn't the first to feel the heat in the last six months... I hope I don't see exclamation marks in my sleep tonight. Almost every sentence ends in an exclamation mark or a question which can be thought of as equivalent (e.g., why the hell can't we win?).

" RE: Game Week / Day: Toledo
We sit 5-4, and 2-3 in the MAC! We beat an FCS school, UMass is 1-7, AZ ST is 3-5, W Mich is 3-5, and Ball St is 4-4! We've not beaten A D1 school with a winning record! Is this what everyone wants from A NINTH year coach? We returned soooooo many upperclassmen as well! We lost at home today to Toledo with their backup QB! Creighton simply isn't a winner at the D1 level! His play calling is almost high school level! So, are we supposed to wait for year 10, 11, 12 to see if he can win the MAC? It's time to really consider moving on.......I really appreciate him for making us respectable, but after over 100 games, being respectable shouldn't be the goal! We've a very easy schedule going forward, so 8-4, and 5-3 is very doable, but as a fan and alumni I want what every MAC West school has accomplished except us! "
(This post was last modified: 10-30-2022 01:07 AM by EMUGLORYDAYSthe90's.

I'm not hard on coaches! A seasoned coach who has taken THREE teams to the NCAA tournament and has 15 years coaching experience, I sure would hope for better results then this! Basketball is way easier to change the culture then football also! If everyone returns next season then this team will breakthrough! I like the Creighton thread I wrote, and I'll admit Creighton broke through! Look how easy recruiting becomes also. I'm hoping we upset Akron tomorrow! BobW, be nice! I agree with what you say 90% off the time, and your Basketball insight is really good! Miss reading EagleSam reports!

Beating Akron is going to be...extremely unlikely. I hate that this is where we are at. But we do have Emoni Bates and there is always a chance that he goes off so you can't turn away. This is the most unusual bad team ever. Because we have the best player in the MAC, there is always a chance, without him, there would be absolutely no point in tuning in. If Acuff has another phenomenal game and Emoni returns to greatness, who knows crazier things have happened!

Emoni is not the best player in the MAC. Emoni has the highest ceiling of any MAC player but the jury is out if he’ll reach his potential. If you place Sparks from BSU or Wilson from Ohio on our team , then EMU is at least 0.500 in conference and maybe in the 3rd or 4th spot. There are several players in the MAC that would be more valuable to EMU on offense and defense. Like I said if Noah and Acuff shot the ball as much as Emoni, they could average 20 ppg. I’m sure Sincere Cary or Peyton Sparks or Freeman from Akron could easily avg 20 ppg if they shot as much as Emoni but they play team ball with other very good players. There’s a big reason why EMU has the #1 ranked worst defense. Care to comment on why?