(12-10-2022 04:31 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  

(12-10-2022 04:22 PM)H2Oville Rocket Wrote:  I’m watching the game and the TV guy says “Canisius has a chance for a road win against a quality opponent”. Anyone know who he was talking about?

Also, can one of you referees explain why Shumate’s last foul was flagrant? No one seemed to argue but to me it looked like a questionable call even as a regular foul.

He had the defensive player's arm pinned. Its the horse collar of b-ball. Dangerous. Looked inadvertent but still.

The replay might not have been the best angle but that looked waaaaaayy less dangerous than Shu’s elbow to the throat/ head earlier. But like I said, no one argued it so it must have been the right call.

(12-10-2022 04:45 PM)H2Oville Rocket Wrote:  

(12-10-2022 04:31 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  

(12-10-2022 04:22 PM)H2Oville Rocket Wrote:  I’m watching the game and the TV guy says “Canisius has a chance for a road win against a quality opponent”. Anyone know who he was talking about?

Also, can one of you referees explain why Shumate’s last foul was flagrant? No one seemed to argue but to me it looked like a questionable call even as a regular foul.

He had the defensive player's arm pinned. Its the horse collar of b-ball. Dangerous. Looked inadvertent but still.

The replay might not have been the best angle but that looked waaaaaayy less dangerous than Shu’s elbow to the throat/ head earlier. But like I said, no one argued it so it must have been the right call.

True it might kill someone but it doesn't in the immediate sense restrict their movement so it's not "flagrant."

First game I've seen live, followed the rest either on TV or Radio. I was hoping to see the team that played Richmond, but saw a team that would have trouble with Stranhan Elementary. We will lose some MAC games playing like that.

Lots of ugly turnovers, poor shooting and some selfish 1-on-1 playing. Never got into an offensive rhythm. I'd have to see the replay on JT's 5th foul. It looked like a standard, scrum for a loose ball. I really wanted to see Maddox and Cochran. Maddox had a rough night and Cochran is still hurt. Everyone hit below their average, except Ray J. Farmer had some athletic moves. Definitely like him coming off the bench with energy. The Swede, didn't provide much of anything.




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Can Adu contribute more over time this year?

(12-10-2022 05:18 PM)emanoh Wrote:  First game I've seen live, followed the rest either on TV or Radio. I was hoping to see the team that played Richmond, but saw a team that would have trouble with Stranhan Elementary. We will lose some MAC games playing like that.

Lots of ugly turnovers, poor shooting and some selfish 1-on-1 playing. Never got into an offensive rhythm. I'd have to see the reply on JT's 5th foul. It looked like a standard, scrum for a loose ball. I really wanted to see Maddox and Cochran. Maddox had rough night and Cochran is still hurt. Everyone hit below their average, except Ray J. Farmer had some athletic moves. Definitely like him coming off the bench with energy. The Swede, didn't provide much of anything.




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That's a pretty good description. JT's 5th foul (the technical) would have been hard to see unless you had the right angle. TV had a good angle of him pinching the guys arm (who was going for a rebound) against himself, limiting that arms use to help get the ball. He definitely held his arm.

I'm not a ref, but I don't know why that is flagrant, but apparently it is. But that wouldn't be the only thing that doesn't make sense in college basketball. :-)

I'm just happy for the win, although, as we have discussed here - the only way to the Big Dance is to win in Cleveland. Let's hope they continue to improve and mesh as a team. Coach K said in post-game they need a break (been on the road and have exams next week as well) so maybe that will get them back to focusing on the rest of the season.

Not a very good showing but I still think the Rockets will be a good MAC team. I could see first or second place, but they lack the mental fortitude to make it through the conference tournament. One thing is certain, there won’t be any rational talk about votes for being ranked or the possibility of an at-large bid to the dance.

(12-10-2022 04:27 PM)utrocks84 Wrote:  UT look flat from the beginning. Really need to step up prep and rotation or we may be witnessing a mediocre MAC season. And what a shame it would be with the talent that came back.

One bad game that they still win and the doom and gloom instantly start. JFC.

Cochran is still injured. Once he returns the starters will get more rest and Cochran brings lots of energy.

Just got to find a way to win and that's what the Rockets did! Despite many missed free throws earlier in the game by the team, Dennis was clutch down the stretch, sealing the game with free throws.

The team has definitely been inconsistent so far this season. Cochran's injury has certainly hurt, so getting him back will help for sure. Some of the Rocket teams in the past have played really well in December and January, but not in the crucial month of March. Hopefully, this team will continue to get better and better and will peak in March to get that elusive NCAA bid!

Seemed like UT looked at Canisius' record and thought they could mail it in.

(12-10-2022 05:56 PM)utpotts Wrote:  

(12-10-2022 04:27 PM)utrocks84 Wrote:  UT look flat from the beginning. Really need to step up prep and rotation or we may be witnessing a mediocre MAC season. And what a shame it would be with the talent that came back.

One bad game that they still win and the doom and gloom instantly start. JFC.

Almost like the small 38-0 win over LIU in fb. In reality we suck vs. quad 4. It's the 3rd real bad game we have had.

This team plays down to opponents who like a slow pace. Kent will pound us if we play like that. Then again, surviving stretches without Shumate will help down the line.

It doesn't matter in all likelihood. I'd take the 8 seed if it meant 3 straight in Cleveland.

I think that's a great point, and a good way to put it; they play to their opponent.

I think this team can still get it done.

Canisius played well, give them credit. they deserved to win, just missed a couple bunnies late. The Shumate call was garbage. yes, a foul, but a very brief hold. I hate replay. Sure, if you look at the play at 1/30 speed it looks bad, but in reality he held the guy for a half second and it was not flagrant. that could have decided the game. otherwise, poor intensity, played down to opponent, but got the win, yeesh. Team looks like it needs a break to recharge. Big game next Saturday, hope cochran is ready for it.

(12-10-2022 07:07 PM)pono Wrote:  Canisius played well, give them credit. they deserved to win, just missed a couple bunnies late. The Shumate call was garbage. yes, a foul, but a very brief hold. I hate replay. Sure, if you look at the play at 1/30 speed it looks bad, but in reality he held the guy for a half second and it was not flagrant. that could have decided the game. otherwise, poor intensity, played down to opponent, but got the win, yeesh. Team looks like it needs a break to recharge. Big game next Saturday, hope cochran is ready for it.

You think they looked at replay just in case? Or to confirm what they thought they saw? It's flagrant by definition, not by intent. I don't know why they call it that. Looking at the replay, I don't think they had a choice but to call it.

(12-10-2022 07:07 PM)pono Wrote:  Canisius played well, give them credit. they deserved to win, just missed a couple bunnies late. The Shumate call was garbage. yes, a foul, but a very brief hold. I hate replay. Sure, if you look at the play at 1/30 speed it looks bad, but in reality he held the guy for a half second and it was not flagrant. that could have decided the game. otherwise, poor intensity, played down to opponent, but got the win, yeesh. Team looks like it needs a break to recharge. Big game next Saturday, hope cochran is ready for it.

I agree with that, and I'm not trying to make this into the refs. We were like 15 point favs. Should have got it done and not got to that.

But I don't know how they define that as a flagrant? They reviewed it so it must be.

(12-10-2022 07:37 PM)Screwball Wrote:  

(12-10-2022 07:07 PM)pono Wrote:  Canisius played well, give them credit. they deserved to win, just missed a couple bunnies late. The Shumate call was garbage. yes, a foul, but a very brief hold. I hate replay. Sure, if you look at the play at 1/30 speed it looks bad, but in reality he held the guy for a half second and it was not flagrant. that could have decided the game. otherwise, poor intensity, played down to opponent, but got the win, yeesh. Team looks like it needs a break to recharge. Big game next Saturday, hope cochran is ready for it.

I agree with that, and I'm not trying to make this into the refs. We were like 15 point favs. Should have got it done and not got to that.

But I don't know how they define that as a flagrant? They reviewed it so it must be.

Because "flagrant" doesn't seem to mean "intentional" or "purposeful" or any other normal definition of "flagrant." It means only impedes physically. Trapping a guy's arm will do that.

Quote:FF1 – is called if a player interferes with his opponent in an unnecessary physical way.

Seems to fit what happened.

This was your basic pre finals stinker. Kids thought they could throw shoes on the floor and win. Radio call was fun


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(12-10-2022 07:51 PM)eastisbest Wrote:  

(12-10-2022 07:37 PM)Screwball Wrote:  

(12-10-2022 07:07 PM)pono Wrote:  Canisius played well, give them credit. they deserved to win, just missed a couple bunnies late. The Shumate call was garbage. yes, a foul, but a very brief hold. I hate replay. Sure, if you look at the play at 1/30 speed it looks bad, but in reality he held the guy for a half second and it was not flagrant. that could have decided the game. otherwise, poor intensity, played down to opponent, but got the win, yeesh. Team looks like it needs a break to recharge. Big game next Saturday, hope cochran is ready for it.

I agree with that, and I'm not trying to make this into the refs. We were like 15 point favs. Should have got it done and not got to that.

But I don't know how they define that as a flagrant? They reviewed it so it must be.

Because "flagrant" doesn't seem to mean "intentional" or "purposeful" or any other normal definition of "flagrant." It means only impedes physically. Trapping a guy's arm will do that.

Quote:FF1 – is called if a player interferes with his opponent in an unnecessary physical way.

Seems to fit what happened.

Yea, I'm with you. I like "normal." Giggle. It's not like we aren't trying to keep them from scoring, and we didn't tackle the guy.

But it is what it is.

I was at the game, Rockets led early 11-4 and I thought that was a start of the blow out, but The Golden Griffins thought otherwise. I mentioned earlier that the Griffins had some tall foreign players who did a good job of rebounding and intimidating UT's shooters as they were driving to the basket. Their tall 6-10 center, Fritz had I believe 12 points and 12 rebounds. Just some bad shooting on the part Rockets and 16 turnovers to boot. Sometimes I saw the Rockets driving to the basket with no option to pass, creating turnovers. The Sandusky Ohio freshman, #44 who scored 19 points did well against the Rockets.

Give Canisius credit, they played hard nose defense in their half court offenseand it wasn't easy for the Rockets. This was by far the best game the Griffins play on the road, other than the win in overtime against the Bonnie's of St. Bonaventure. They have now lost 5 in a row and deserved to win. i did wonder why TK didn't pressed in the front court late in the game. I noticed Cochran in a walking boot, didn't know that before. That doesn't look good.

As TK said on the post game show today, this was a "grinder" half court type of game and not the open court type of game which Toledo has excelled in this season. Not much to brag about on the offense end other than Shumate's play in the first half and Dennis's play in the second half -- especially in crunch time. His Stat Line was impressive with 29 points, 9 rebounds, 6 assists and 2 steals. One bright spot in the game was Toledo causing 21 Canisius turnovers. In College Basketball, you are not going to bring your A game each night. Just look at top Mid Major Drake losing at struggling Richmond today by 30 points! Yes, Toledo is going to need to play better then today if they want to contend for a MAC Conference and Tournament Championship. But a mark of a good team is to "gut out" wins like today when you are not playing at your best.