(05-24-2022 08:00 PM)Meatwad Wrote:  

If those #s are anywhere near correct, the B12 is just fine moving forward.

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

I like your revisions

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

As a uc fan, i'd love to see games, in a continuous basis, with louisville and pitt. both are easy drives for the fanbases, and both would resurrect the old big east rivalries.

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

Louisville won’t agree to it as long as they have the series with Kentucky. They don’t want two OOC rivalry games.

I think UC will rotate OOC power conference opponents. Some names I’d like to see are Michigan State, Northwestern (a lot of UC alums in Chicago), Pitt, Tennessee and Georgia Tech.

(05-25-2022 06:30 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

Louisville won’t agree to it as long as they have the series with Kentucky. They don’t want two OOC rivalry games.

I think UC will rotate OOC power conference opponents. Some names I’d like to see are Michigan State, Northwestern (a lot of UC alums in Chicago), Pitt, Tennessee and Georgia Tech.

You're probably right. Well, VT doesn't have a non-conference rival...

I was listening to Sirius XM Big 12 today, and one of the hosts suggested that as a way to increase the value of media rights, the Big 12 should go to a 10 game conference season with one of the two non conference games be against another P5 school.

(05-01-2022 12:05 PM)KnightLight Wrote:  ESPN's Rece Davis already starting the non-P5 narrative for new Big 12 so the value of the conf will drop and ESPN can save $20-$40 Million off the next TV Deal since the network "says" its not really a P5 Conf.

Big 12 needs FOX, Amazon, Turner and even NBC to get involved to have a share of the next deal to help maximize revenue for the conf. (ESPN should be there too, hopefully, but they would like to save $$$ by damaging the brand BEFORE signing the next deal).

From what I've heard, the Big 12 is entrenched as a P5. Has nothing to do with teams coming, and going...but its always been a P5.

What P5 means is to have voting rights within the P5....thats not going away.

Has nothing to do with the TV Contracts, either.

Sent from my SM-N975U using CSNbbs mobile app

(05-25-2022 08:34 PM)Realigned Wrote:  I was listening to Sirius XM Big 12 today, and one of the hosts suggested that as a way to increase the value of media rights, the Big 12 should go to a 10 game conference season with one of the two non conference games be against another P5 school.

Sure...I mean, why not? It's better than playing FCS teams. I would have no issue with TTU scheduling an Arizona/WSU, etc type team.

HOWEVER...these contracts need to be written, and agreed upon such as that with a H&H series...these other teams can't cancel out of them without a MAJOR penalty....or buyout of the game.

It's easy to say that, but how many other teams in other conferences want to travel to the other teams Homefield. I mean would Kentucky? They have their own conference schedule to worry about, too.

Would Minnesota?

These other teams would have to agree to it....its not just one-sided here.

Sent from my SM-N975U using CSNbbs mobile app

(05-26-2022 02:38 AM)McGuiresRaiders Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 08:34 PM)Realigned Wrote:  I was listening to Sirius XM Big 12 today, and one of the hosts suggested that as a way to increase the value of media rights, the Big 12 should go to a 10 game conference season with one of the two non conference games be against another P5 school.

Sure...I mean, why not? It's better than playing FCS teams. I would have no issue with TTU scheduling an Arizona/WSU, etc type team.

HOWEVER...these contracts need to be written, and agreed upon such as that with a H&H series...these other teams can't cancel out of them without a MAJOR penalty....or buyout of the game.

It's easy to say that, but how many other teams in other conferences want to travel to the other teams Homefield. I mean would Kentucky? They have their own conference schedule to worry about, too.

Would Minnesota?

These other teams would have to agree to it....its not just one-sided here.

Sent from my SM-N975U using CSNbbs mobile app

All teams already schedule an non- conference P5 school so that wouldn’t change. To go to ten conference games, they would have to give up an easier G5 or FCS opponent.

(05-25-2022 08:11 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 06:30 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

Louisville won’t agree to it as long as they have the series with Kentucky. They don’t want two OOC rivalry games.

I think UC will rotate OOC power conference opponents. Some names I’d like to see are Michigan State, Northwestern (a lot of UC alums in Chicago), Pitt, Tennessee and Georgia Tech.

You're probably right. Well, VT doesn't have a non-conference rival...

I like your changes. I wasn't quite sure about UCF or Baylor

For Cincy, I thought about Pitt, Louisville, and Ohio State but I knew Pitt already had WVU and I was trying not to double up; for Louisville, Kentucky as discussed above; and I figured Ohio State would never agree to play UC.

I had the same thought for K-State...who? I flipped a coin between Nebraska and Colorado

Obviously maximizing digital rights is key but at worse I'm betting that the market shifts upward meaning the Big 12's currebt deal will be "outdated" so I'm betting that the New Big 12 retains its current TV contract value with the on,y change being that it will expand to pay 12 teams so the continuing 8 won't lose any revenue at all. The key is maximizing digital rights and basketball thereby increasing revenue which I see happening. My prediction, the Big 12 will retain its current TV deal, paying the New Big 12 members the same amount per member that the current 10 are getting, and they will double their digital rights from 5 million per team to 10 million per member.

(05-25-2022 08:11 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 06:30 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

Louisville won’t agree to it as long as they have the series with Kentucky. They don’t want two OOC rivalry games.

I think UC will rotate OOC power conference opponents. Some names I’d like to see are Michigan State, Northwestern (a lot of UC alums in Chicago), Pitt, Tennessee and Georgia Tech.

You're probably right. Well, VT doesn't have a non-conference rival...

I'm down. Tell Whit to give John Cunningham a call.

(05-25-2022 06:30 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

Louisville won’t agree to it as long as they have the series with Kentucky. They don’t want two OOC rivalry games.

I think UC will rotate OOC power conference opponents. Some names I’d like to see are Michigan State, Northwestern (a lot of UC alums in Chicago), Pitt, Tennessee and Georgia Tech.

You're right about Louisville. Charlie Strong who was the coach at the time said that they didn't want to beat themselves up with two strong OOC rivals. I've advocated for Pitt, and UC has a home and home with them in 2023 in Pittsburgh and in 2024 in Cincinnati but it looks like the Backyard Brawl might resume so there is no chance of an annual rivalry there. There is no chance of a home and home with Michigan State much less an annual series, they recruit this area and they want to hold themselves as above UC. But now with Luke's success and UC's move to the Big 12 Michigan State will do everything possible to avoid UC, especially after the bad optics of losing out on a coach to an AAC Cincinnati. I would love to see an annual, or near annual, series with Indiana or Purdue. We're finishing up a home and home with Indiana and Purdue had no qualms with playing a home and home with UC during Cincinnati's Big East days.

(05-27-2022 03:02 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 06:30 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

Louisville won’t agree to it as long as they have the series with Kentucky. They don’t want two OOC rivalry games.

I think UC will rotate OOC power conference opponents. Some names I’d like to see are Michigan State, Northwestern (a lot of UC alums in Chicago), Pitt, Tennessee and Georgia Tech.

You're right about Louisville. Charlie Strong who was the coach at the time said that they didn't want to beat themselves up with two strong OOC rivals. I've advocated for Pitt, and UC has a home and home with them in 2023 in Pittsburgh and in 2024 in Cincinnati but it looks like the Backyard Brawl might resume so there is no chance of an annual rivalry there. There is no chance of a home and home with Michigan State much less an annual series, they recruit this area and they want to hold themselves as above UC. But now with Luke's success and UC's move to the Big 12 Michigan State will do everything possible to avoid UC, especially after the bad optics of losing out on a coach to an AAC Cincinnati. I would love to see an annual, or near annual, series with Indiana or Purdue. We're finishing up a home and home with Indiana and Purdue had no qualms with playing a home and home with UC during Cincinnati's Big East days.

As you recall, we were supposed to play a four game series with Purdue from 2013-2016. When the Big East blew up Purdue canceled two of the games, so we only played 2013 and 2016.

I would love to play a home and home with one or both of those two. Perhaps Illinois again as well since this staff recruits so much in the Land of Lincoln.

(05-27-2022 03:11 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-27-2022 03:02 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 06:30 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 09:10 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 03:18 PM)UNT15 Wrote:  ...If the idea is just to have an OOC rival for each team:

Oklahoma State v OU
Kansas v Mizzou
UCF v FloridaMiami
WVU v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Iowa State v Iowa
Cincy v Miami (OH)Louisville
TCU v SMU
Texas Tech v Texas
Houston v Rice
Baylor v Wake ForestDuke
Kansas State v Nebraska

I made a few suggested changes. While I think most of these are correct, some of your OOC opponents have too many standing non-conference rivalries already for them to be adding another one. I also felt like Cincinnati was aiming too low (TCU and Houston might need better "rivals" too). Finally, while I don't love K-State vs Nebraska, who else are they going to play?

Louisville won’t agree to it as long as they have the series with Kentucky. They don’t want two OOC rivalry games.

I think UC will rotate OOC power conference opponents. Some names I’d like to see are Michigan State, Northwestern (a lot of UC alums in Chicago), Pitt, Tennessee and Georgia Tech.

You're right about Louisville. Charlie Strong who was the coach at the time said that they didn't want to beat themselves up with two strong OOC rivals. I've advocated for Pitt, and UC has a home and home with them in 2023 in Pittsburgh and in 2024 in Cincinnati but it looks like the Backyard Brawl might resume so there is no chance of an annual rivalry there. There is no chance of a home and home with Michigan State much less an annual series, they recruit this area and they want to hold themselves as above UC. But now with Luke's success and UC's move to the Big 12 Michigan State will do everything possible to avoid UC, especially after the bad optics of losing out on a coach to an AAC Cincinnati. I would love to see an annual, or near annual, series with Indiana or Purdue. We're finishing up a home and home with Indiana and Purdue had no qualms with playing a home and home with UC during Cincinnati's Big East days.

As you recall, we were supposed to play a four game series with Purdue from 2013-2016. When the Big East blew up Purdue canceled two of the games, so we only played 2013 and 2016.

I would love to play a home and home with one or both of those two. Perhaps Illinois again as well since this staff recruits so much in the Land of Lincoln.

You're right, I forgot about that. The 2016 games was UC blowing them out at West Lafayette during the whole dog and pony show with the Big 12 that year. Illinois would be fun again!

I thought about it a little longer and came up with pretty much the same stuff as we all did off the cuff. In summary, a few of the new Big 12 teams will either have to develop OOC rivalries or battle against G5 historical rivals.

No brainers (these are all at, or near the top, in terms of most games played):
Kansas v Mizzou
Oklahoma State v OU
West Virginia v Pitt
BYU v Utah
Texas Tech v Texas
Iowa State v Iowa

G5 that make sense:
TCU v SMU (most played rivalry outside of conference for, Baylor. Nearby school. Just makes sense to keep it)

UCF v ECU (most played rivalry; evenly split. If they could land a P5 in-state rival, that would be awesome. If not, this is a nice alternative)

Cincy v Miami (OH) (the other candidates already have long-term OOC rivalries as documented in this thread)

Others:
Baylor and Kansas State are both unique because their most-played rivalries are already in the Big 12 or spoken for. KSU already has KU, ISU, OSU and OU/Mizzou are already claimed here. That leaves Nebraska or Colorado by default because their other top ten rivals are still in Big 12 or spoken for. Same for Baylor. One could make an argument for Arkansas or Texas A&M here.

However, Houston v Rice makes sense for all the reasons listed above for TCU-SMU EXCEPT Tulsa is their most played rivalry (instead of Baylor). If you give Rice to Baylor (3rd most played), then UH could slide over to Tulsa.

Anyways, I out too much thought into this, even for an off-season topic.

KSU- Nebraska
Baylor -Rice (or Duke or Wake)
Houston-Tulsa (or Rice)

(05-25-2022 09:03 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 08:00 PM)Meatwad Wrote:  

If those #s are anywhere near correct, the B12 is just fine moving forward.

Yes, and I think that they are right because the Big 12 will see a rise in their Tier 3 Digital Rights now that they can sell it as a 12 team conference package instead of an 8 team partial conference deal. As Bob Bowlsby stated the 5 million per member on ESPN+ is severely undervalued but Texas and Oklahoma kneecapped the conference by not joining in. The addition of Cincinnati, BYU, UCF and Houston should cause a dramatic rise in value as far as their Tier 3/Digital Rights deal. I mentioned that the Big 12 should pursue some form of a digital conference network and they maybe doing that by creating a Big 12 football studio show on the Big 12 NOW network on ESPN+.

(05-26-2022 09:39 AM)Realigned Wrote:  All teams already schedule an non- conference P5 school so that wouldn’t change. To go to ten conference games, they would have to give up an easier G5 or FCS opponent.

Which means they would also have to give up a home game, which is why it won't happen.

(05-29-2022 06:43 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  

(05-25-2022 09:03 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  

(05-24-2022 08:00 PM)Meatwad Wrote:  

If those #s are anywhere near correct, the B12 is just fine moving forward.

Yes, and I think that they are right because the Big 12 will see a rise in their Tier 3 Digital Rights now that they can sell it as a 12 team conference package instead of an 8 team partial conference deal. As Bob Bowlsby stated the 5 million per member on ESPN+ is severely undervalued but Texas and Oklahoma kneecapped the conference by not joining in. The addition of Cincinnati, BYU, UCF and Houston should cause a dramatic rise in value as far as their Tier 3/Digital Rights deal. I mentioned that the Big 12 should pursue some form of a digital conference network and they maybe doing that by creating a Big 12 football studio show on the Big 12 NOW network on ESPN+.

The eight remaining schools gave up their own tier 3 deals and took the discount offer espn offered for big XII now/espn plus so the league could get the money it was looking for regarding the football championship game after fox dropped there 1/2. I know wvu was making more money working with IMG/regional sports network in Pittsburgh/and producing their own games online. I would guess Kansas, Oklahoma St and many others took a loss as well to keep Texas and OU happy. Remember in the big 12 each school can do what it wants with tier 3, there not automatically bundled together when the current tv deal ends

Jackson