(03-04-2022 08:15 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 03:28 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 02:51 PM)PureGold Wrote:  Doesn't FCS schools only have 65 scholarship players? They won't have the same depth needed to compete on FBS levels immediately, will they? I'd say 3-5 or better would be a surprise. As early as it is, I predict 1, maybe 2.

63, but JMU was already closer to the 85 FBS is allowed than 63 due to extra COVID scholarships and JMU will be at 85 this year. Depth won't be as much of an issue as it'd normally be in the first year transitioning, but quality of depth should obviously improve in the next few years.

Depth isn’t in the numbers. It’s in the quality. How many of those 85 would be considered FBS players?

All of them. They’re on an FBS roster.

Top 5 FCS programs could go blow for blow with at least the bottom half of the G5. NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:15 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 03:28 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 02:51 PM)PureGold Wrote:  Doesn't FCS schools only have 65 scholarship players? They won't have the same depth needed to compete on FBS levels immediately, will they? I'd say 3-5 or better would be a surprise. As early as it is, I predict 1, maybe 2.

63, but JMU was already closer to the 85 FBS is allowed than 63 due to extra COVID scholarships and JMU will be at 85 this year. Depth won't be as much of an issue as it'd normally be in the first year transitioning, but quality of depth should obviously improve in the next few years.

Depth isn’t in the numbers. It’s in the quality. How many of those 85 would be considered FBS players?

All of them. They’re on an FBS roster.

Top 5 FCS programs could go blow for blow with at least the bottom half of the G5. NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

How many were recruited to FBS teams? I.e. played at this level. Everyone of the current FBS teams in this conference are loaded with guys with P5 “offers”. Sure, your top end guys 1-22 can go “blow for blow” with some G5 teams. But what about guys 23-85? JMU has a solid foundation to be successful long term. But if you think that you have the depth to match up with the rest of the SBC East week in and week out, all I can say is that I admire your optimism.

(03-04-2022 08:54 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:15 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 03:28 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 02:51 PM)PureGold Wrote:  Doesn't FCS schools only have 65 scholarship players? They won't have the same depth needed to compete on FBS levels immediately, will they? I'd say 3-5 or better would be a surprise. As early as it is, I predict 1, maybe 2.

63, but JMU was already closer to the 85 FBS is allowed than 63 due to extra COVID scholarships and JMU will be at 85 this year. Depth won't be as much of an issue as it'd normally be in the first year transitioning, but quality of depth should obviously improve in the next few years.

Depth isn’t in the numbers. It’s in the quality. How many of those 85 would be considered FBS players?

All of them. They’re on an FBS roster.

Top 5 FCS programs could go blow for blow with at least the bottom half of the G5. NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

How many were recruited to FBS teams? I.e. played at this level. Everyone of the current FBS teams in this conference are loaded with guys with P5 “offers”. Sure, your top end guys 1-22 can go “blow for blow” with some G5 teams. But what about guys 23-85? JMU has a solid foundation to be successful long term. But if you think that you have the depth to match up with the rest of the SBC East week in and week out, all I can say is that I admire your optimism.

They may be glad to have 11 games instead of 12.

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

There were a couple years over the past decade where they were good enough to be ranked at the FBS level. In 2018, Massey had them at #13 and Sagarin had them at #19. Similar numbers from both in 2013. Absolute juggernaut of a program. They play Arizona this year and it's going to be the biggest blowout of an FCS vs P5 ever.

(03-04-2022 09:50 AM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

There were a couple years over the past decade where they were good enough to be ranked at the FBS level. In 2018, Massey had them at #13 and Sagarin had them at #19. Similar numbers from both in 2013. Absolute juggernaut of a program. They play Arizona this year and it's going to be the biggest blowout of an FCS vs P5 ever.

I’m calling it now. NDSU will beat Arizona. It would be an upset if Arizona won. It actually won’t even be close.

(03-04-2022 08:54 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:15 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 03:28 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 02:51 PM)PureGold Wrote:  Doesn't FCS schools only have 65 scholarship players? They won't have the same depth needed to compete on FBS levels immediately, will they? I'd say 3-5 or better would be a surprise. As early as it is, I predict 1, maybe 2.

63, but JMU was already closer to the 85 FBS is allowed than 63 due to extra COVID scholarships and JMU will be at 85 this year. Depth won't be as much of an issue as it'd normally be in the first year transitioning, but quality of depth should obviously improve in the next few years.

Depth isn’t in the numbers. It’s in the quality. How many of those 85 would be considered FBS players?

All of them. They’re on an FBS roster.

Top 5 FCS programs could go blow for blow with at least the bottom half of the G5. NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

How many were recruited to FBS teams? I.e. played at this level. Everyone of the current FBS teams in this conference are loaded with guys with P5 “offers”. Sure, your top end guys 1-22 can go “blow for blow” with some G5 teams. But what about guys 23-85? JMU has a solid foundation to be successful long term. But if you think that you have the depth to match up with the rest of the SBC East week in and week out, all I can say is that I admire your optimism.

I don’t have an exhaustive and readily available notebook of every player on our roster’s recruiting history. However, JMU regularly recruits head to head with the G5 and occasionally with the P5. They also more than win their share of those recruiting battles. We’ve signed HS players with scholarship offers at Kentucky in the past, for example. I think one had a WVU offer in the past. Some had ODU, app, coastal. Some Mac offers.

There’s FBS talent all over our roster. We’ve been all but a G5 program for the past 20 years.

This will be a fun thread to revisit in December.

(03-04-2022 08:57 AM)Porcine Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:54 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:15 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 03:28 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  63, but JMU was already closer to the 85 FBS is allowed than 63 due to extra COVID scholarships and JMU will be at 85 this year. Depth won't be as much of an issue as it'd normally be in the first year transitioning, but quality of depth should obviously improve in the next few years.

Depth isn’t in the numbers. It’s in the quality. How many of those 85 would be considered FBS players?

All of them. They’re on an FBS roster.

Top 5 FCS programs could go blow for blow with at least the bottom half of the G5. NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

How many were recruited to FBS teams? I.e. played at this level. Everyone of the current FBS teams in this conference are loaded with guys with P5 “offers”. Sure, your top end guys 1-22 can go “blow for blow” with some G5 teams. But what about guys 23-85? JMU has a solid foundation to be successful long term. But if you think that you have the depth to match up with the rest of the SBC East week in and week out, all I can say is that I admire your optimism.

They may be glad to have 11 games instead of 12.

(03-04-2022 10:50 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:54 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:15 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 03:28 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  63, but JMU was already closer to the 85 FBS is allowed than 63 due to extra COVID scholarships and JMU will be at 85 this year. Depth won't be as much of an issue as it'd normally be in the first year transitioning, but quality of depth should obviously improve in the next few years.

Depth isn’t in the numbers. It’s in the quality. How many of those 85 would be considered FBS players?

All of them. They’re on an FBS roster.

Top 5 FCS programs could go blow for blow with at least the bottom half of the G5. NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

How many were recruited to FBS teams? I.e. played at this level. Everyone of the current FBS teams in this conference are loaded with guys with P5 “offers”. Sure, your top end guys 1-22 can go “blow for blow” with some G5 teams. But what about guys 23-85? JMU has a solid foundation to be successful long term. But if you think that you have the depth to match up with the rest of the SBC East week in and week out, all I can say is that I admire your optimism.

I don’t have an exhaustive and readily available notebook of every player on our roster’s recruiting history. However, JMU regularly recruits head to head with the G5 and occasionally with the P5. They also more than win their share of those recruiting battles. We’ve signed HS players with scholarship offers at Kentucky in the past, for example. I think one had a WVU offer in the past. Some had ODU, app, coastal. Some Mac offers.

There’s FBS talent all over our roster. We’ve been all but a G5 program for the past 20 years.

Good for you. No one is rooting for your failure on this board. You aren’t Coastal. My point about the offers is that not all offers are true offers. Some are placeholders. Now if you beat some G5s or P5s with “committable” or “take” offers, then you should have no problem winning the conference next year. That doesn’t happen very often.

I am not sure what JMU returns this year, but I will just say that they probably win more than what people think. Give them 3-4 years to adjust and look out. So happy we took them instead of letting CUSA have them.

(03-01-2022 05:30 PM)We Are the Dukes of JMU Wrote:  

(03-01-2022 04:26 PM)TroyFootball05 Wrote:  

(03-01-2022 04:02 PM)Cnelson203 Wrote:  In looking at history with SB teams with similar winning tradition transitions, it looks promising for JMU. If my research is right:

Marshall entered FBS in 1997 and went 8-1 (MAC) and won the conference championship and played in Motor City Bowl

Appalachian State came to SB in 2014 and went 6-2 losing only to Georgia Southern and South Alabama.

Georgia Southern came to SB in 2014 took home all the marbles, going 8-0 winning the conference championship but was not yet eligible for a bowl win. Looking forward to our match up in Harrisonburg.

That's a phenomenal record of success, and I recognize that the SB is quite a bit stronger today. But if history is any judge, then anything LESS than 4-4 would be a stumble out of the gate...but the East is going to be tough for all of us.

App State, Georgia Southern, and Marshall were all gods among men in 1-AA football when they made the move to FBS. JMU is close to that caliber, but not quite the same I don't think. I do think they'll be very good if they can find a QB and an OL, though. The east is the best G5 division in the country, however, and that could make all the difference.

A couple of thoughts. First, it's a little hard to this JMU season to those App State or Georgia Southern seasons. JMU is in it's first transition year, while both of those schools were in their second transition year. On the one hand, JMU is helped by the covid exemption that allowed us to carry more than the FCS maximum scholarship limit, but on the other hand we've had less time to recruit FBS caliber players than either of those schools. Either way, it's not quite apples to apples.

Also, I would say that the recent histories of JMU, App State, and Georgia Southern weren't all that different at the time they made the move. Both schools had more championships than JMU historically, but weren't necessarily stronger teams at the time of transition. Marshall is the exception. Here's each program's last five seasons in FCS/I-AA...

JMU
12-2 (Semifinal loss - NDSU)
7-1 (Semifinal loss, covid season)
14-2 (Championship loss - NDSU)
9-4 (Second round loss)
14-1 (Championship loss - NDSU)

Georgia Southern
5-4 (No playoffs, ineligible)
10-4 (Semifinal loss - NDSU)
11-3 (Semifinal loss - NDSU)
10-5 (Semifinal loss)
5-6 (No playoffs)

App State
4-8 (No playoffs, ineligible)
8-4 (Second round loss)
8-4 (Second round loss)
10-3 (Quarterfinal loss)
11-3 (Semifinal loss)

Marshall
15-0 (National championship win)
12-3 (Championship loss)
12-2 (Semifinal loss)
11-4 (Championship loss)
12-3 (Championship win)

I would say that JMU's program was about as strong at the time of transition as any SBC school but Marshall. Georgia Southern and JMU both just kept running into the NDSU buzz saw in our final FCS seasons. Marshall was the equivalent of the NDSU buzz saw. JMU only lost more than one regular season game in one of our last five FCS seasons.

Good research but you are not joining the same Sun Belt App and GS did. The conference is a good bit stronger overall now. If GS turns it around this year it is going to be way tougher than when GS / App joined. No more Idaho and NMSU to pencil in two conference wins. Also now throw in CCU.

I think the number of scholarships will be deceiving. We may be at close to 85, but we're going to have a lot of holes that need a year or two of recruiting at the FBS level.

From a timing standpoint I actually think this year hits at a weird moment in time for JMU. Have heard from various places that previous staff's recruits are getting beat out for spots which will be great in a few years, but for now I fear JMU hits perfect storm of stepping up and working through some growing pains both from transition to FBS and between previous coaching staff's recruiting classes to current staff's all at the same time.

(03-04-2022 10:50 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:54 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:24 AM)Potomac Wrote:  

(03-04-2022 08:15 AM)Appst94 Wrote:  

(03-03-2022 03:28 PM)KickItToScotty Wrote:  63, but JMU was already closer to the 85 FBS is allowed than 63 due to extra COVID scholarships and JMU will be at 85 this year. Depth won't be as much of an issue as it'd normally be in the first year transitioning, but quality of depth should obviously improve in the next few years.

Depth isn’t in the numbers. It’s in the quality. How many of those 85 would be considered FBS players?

All of them. They’re on an FBS roster.

Top 5 FCS programs could go blow for blow with at least the bottom half of the G5. NDSU would be a top 5 G5 program immediately.

How many were recruited to FBS teams? I.e. played at this level. Everyone of the current FBS teams in this conference are loaded with guys with P5 “offers”. Sure, your top end guys 1-22 can go “blow for blow” with some G5 teams. But what about guys 23-85? JMU has a solid foundation to be successful long term. But if you think that you have the depth to match up with the rest of the SBC East week in and week out, all I can say is that I admire your optimism.

I don’t have an exhaustive and readily available notebook of every player on our roster’s recruiting history. However, JMU regularly recruits head to head with the G5 and occasionally with the P5. They also more than win their share of those recruiting battles. We’ve signed HS players with scholarship offers at Kentucky in the past, for example. I think one had a WVU offer in the past. Some had ODU, app, coastal. Some Mac offers.

There’s FBS talent all over our roster. We’ve been all but a G5 program for the past 20 years.

All I know is that in at least 2 of those 20 years, there was at least one FCS program you couldn't beat. Looking forward to a lot of really good ODU / JMU rivalry games in the coming years. I think the SBC is the best thing that could happen for both of our programs. Cheers!

Regarding "scholarship" depth - While JMU will be at 85, won't the other teams still be higher due to the same COVID exemptions and the super super senior impact, or will that net back to normal this fall?

(03-04-2022 12:40 PM)jmu007 Wrote:  I think the number of scholarships will be deceiving. We may be at close to 85, but we're going to have a lot of holes that need a year or two of recruiting at the FBS level.

From a timing standpoint I actually think this year hits at a weird moment in time for JMU. Have heard from various places that previous staff's recruits are getting beat out for spots which will be great in a few years, but for now I fear JMU hits perfect storm of stepping up and working through some growing pains both from transition to FBS and between previous coaching staff's recruiting classes to current staff's all at the same time.

This.

We're going to see some disappointment at times this year because of these very reasons, particularly late in games. Just growing pains. Depth reinforcement and maturation of youth, throw in some quick fixes from the portal... I think we'll be making 'some' noise this year and definitely making noise in year two.

(03-04-2022 11:04 AM)HTOWN_HERD Wrote:  I am not sure what JMU returns this year, but I will just say that they probably win more than what people think. Give them 3-4 years to adjust and look out. So happy we took them instead of letting CUSA have them.

I can say with some certainty that JMU would never have joined CUSA after the most recent realignment. I have been screaming JMU to 1A for 15 years and I could ot say with a straight face that JMU to CUSA could ever be a good idea.

(03-04-2022 03:02 PM)DoubleDogDare Wrote:  Regarding "scholarship" depth - While JMU will be at 85, won't the other teams still be higher due to the same COVID exemptions and the super super senior impact, or will that net back to normal this fall?

They would have last year, if I'm not mistaken everyone has to be back to the normal amount this year. So it worked out to make last year almost like a first transition year for us but now we'll be even with other FBS teams as far as number of scholarships.

I think they go 2-6 in Conference. 4-6 overall. It's the Sun Belt East they are in. Very tough division. I just don't see them getting to 6-6 the first year.

Maybe the year after when they have a post season to play for and their team has experience against the Sun Belt east teams.

(03-01-2022 12:22 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Since they're the new guys not just to the SBC but FBS, I'm curious how JMU fans and everyone else see them competing.

9/3 MTSU
9/10 Norfolk St
9/24 @App State
10/1 Texas State
10/8 @Ark State
10/15 @Georgia Southern
10/22 Marshall
11/5 Louisville
11/12 @ODU
11/19 Georgia State
11/26 Coastal Carolina

I think they can beat any SBC team on the schedule but can't mark most of them down as wins.

The game in Norfolk is an L. Dollars to donuts.

(03-05-2022 11:38 PM)Monarch Pride Wrote:  

(03-01-2022 12:22 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  Since they're the new guys not just to the SBC but FBS, I'm curious how JMU fans and everyone else see them competing.

9/3 MTSU
9/10 Norfolk St
9/24 @App State
10/1 Texas State
10/8 @Ark State
10/15 @Georgia Southern
10/22 Marshall
11/5 Louisville
11/12 @ODU
11/19 Georgia State
11/26 Coastal Carolina

I think they can beat any SBC team on the schedule but can't mark most of them down as wins.

The game in Norfolk is an L. Dollars to donuts.

What, l least bet ODU has a chance. You can't go into a game thinking that way!

One game versus FBS programs versus 10 is very different.