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CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
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ibby10 Offline
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CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
They are a lot of speculations and rumors about whether CAA will stay at 12 or expand further to 14 or even to 16!

As a new comer, we probably don’t have much clout in the say, but I hope CAA stays at 12. The travel is not that bad now for southern school. For a one-bid conference, 14/16 is too big of a conference. Thoughts?
02-07-2022 09:59 AM
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J.B. Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
I agree that 14-16 is way too big and prefer to stay at 12 if the conference plans to remain as it is. But it depends on what the CAA's long term plans are. Is the league planning on eventually splitting up into two separate conferences? If so, then they need to gather up as much inventory as they can.
02-07-2022 10:18 AM
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tke75hawk Offline
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CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Need to add 2 southern schools or uncw needs to look at leaving the caa..

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02-07-2022 10:58 AM
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jcohen42 Online
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Long-term I am fairly confident that the conference aims to expand to 14 or 16. I think they are aiming for an Atlantic-10 model that also features FCS football. Time will tell if it comes to fruition.

As for the immediate future, I wouldn't be surprised if the CAA goes into next year with 12. They're secure for now, so they're probably waiting for the rest of the conference realignment to shake out, and that might not happen for a bit.
02-07-2022 01:30 PM
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ibby10 Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Even if CAA expands to 14/16, it’s going to very difficult follow what A10 is doing. Their bball budget is lot more than of of what CAA schools. Having 14/16 teams with mid to low major bball spending won’t bring in a second bid.

Here’s some bball budget info from a link that was shared on realignment board long time ago.
https://www.three-man-weave.com/3mw/coll...gets-2020?
2 years old outdated data, but still gives a picture of CAA vs A10… yearly bball budgets in $:

CAA:
William & Mary 3,970,949
Charleston 3,289,426
Elon Colonial 3,221,829
Northeastern 3,207,255
Hofstra 2,939,154
Monmouth 2,795,919
Delaware 2,785,559
Drexel 2,760,011
Stony Brook 2,392,346
UNCW 2,317,837
Towson 2,259,918
Hampton 1,460,137

Further expansion candidates:
High Point 3,369,936
Fairfield 3,280,514
Quinnipiac 3,203,013
Furman 2,293,070
UNCG 2,275,162
UMBC 2,222,771
Campbell 2,085,182
Albany 1,799,859
Winthrop 1,780,882
NC A&T 1,409,516
Howard 1,338,284

A10 on the other hand:
Dayton 7,434,825
St. Louis 7,428,566
St. Joseph's 6,152,876
VCU. 6,102,633
Duquesne 5,612,982
Fordham 5,075,355
Richmond 4,782,542
Rhode Island 4,745,208
George Mason 4,287,689
Loyola Chi 4,348,837
Umass 4,025,395
St. Bonaventure 3,832,105
La Salle 3,558,014
George Washington 3,548,937
Davidson 3,297,453
(This post was last modified: 02-07-2022 04:58 PM by ibby10.)
02-07-2022 03:30 PM
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ibby10 Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?




Based on this video, looks like our MBB budget is more than what I saw in the link from last post.. SBU is 5th in CAA, Monmouth 2nd and Hampton 12th. Does t guarantee success but shows our commitment to bball.
(This post was last modified: 02-07-2022 04:21 PM by ibby10.)
02-07-2022 04:20 PM
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JonP Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
I hope the CAA stops at 12. I don't see the need to go bigger. Even 12 will limit travel a ton for all sports. The NCAA tourney payouts start getting awfully small at 16 vs. 12. And 12 still gives you some leeway if some school or schools leave.

But I do suspect the CAA could still be looking for 2 more. I could live with that, as long as they are good fits. (No Georgia State types). Personally, I would be happy with High Point and Howard, given the current lay of the land.

With either 12 or 14, you can protect your top seeds in the basketball conference tourneys a bit, which is something a mid-major league should take into account.

I don't buy this idea that the CAA is somehow going to go to 16 so it can split. Is there even a mechanism in which the NCAA would let a non-power league do that? And why do that? So you can have two 8-team leagues teetering on the edge of extinction?
02-07-2022 04:38 PM
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Sitting bull Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Agree, I think 12 total with 7 sponsoring football (9 when you include Richmond and Villanova locked as affiliates) is exactly the structure the league needed. It’s stable and a strong core of schools.

I believe the expansion is complete for now. While the CAA could still attract another 15-20 interested options, they really don’t need any further adds.

IF the CAA moved to 14, I would like to see NC A&T and Fairfield. These specific adds would add some new value. Both are good schools, attractive geography for the league (CT and Greensboro NC) and improve on travel partners:
Northeastern/Fairfield
Hofstra/Stony Brook
Monmouth/Towson
Delaware/Drexel
W&M/Hampton
Elon/NC A&T
Charleston/UNCW

NC A&T also pushes to 8 football members (with 2 affiliates), ranking in the top ten in attendance within FCS.
02-07-2022 05:38 PM
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82hawk Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
I can't see the CAA staying at 12. Divisional setup is the plan and 12 teams still requres a whole lot of travel for all teams, but especially those in the South. A N/S divisional setup needs to get to at least 14 and 16 allows for true in division play only for all teams.

The Howard/A&T rumor is really intriguing for multiple reasons. The CAA has lacked an identity we had in the good ole' days for awhile. We could become a semi HBCU conference with these additions, which would create a great deal of national appeal for the networks covering athletics. Howard brings in the DC market and creates a great intra city/area rivalry for Towson. NC A&T would be a great lure for UNCG to come on board and creates another great rivalry setup with Elon, UNCG and A&T all located in the third biggest city in NC and all within 25 minutes of each other. But if Howard and A&T come, they are both football schools and we are still at an uneven number in football. Which is why I think the CAA goes to 16 if those two commit.

Here is a scenario i'd love to see. Howard and A&T commit behind the scenes. This committment entices UNCG to come on board as well, which means the CAA needs a fourth addition to bring expansion to 16 and that fourth team needs to have football. Campbell is that fourth team and after a bunch of behind the scenes activity, the CAA announces Howard, NC A&T, UNCG and Campbell are coming to the CAA.

That leads to the following N/S divisions for all sports but CAA football.

South - Hampton, W&M, Elon, UNCG, NC A&T, Campbell, UNCW, College of Charleston
North- Howard, Towson, Delaware, Drexel, Monmouth, Stony Brook, Hofstra, Northeastern

This setup recreates what the CAA had in it's glory days with five teams in the southern division in North Carolina(There were five teams in the Virginia area in the CAA at one time). That will create some media buzz in a state that is known for basketball. If UNCG balks, High Point could replace UNCG as a basketball only school and they would jump at the opportunity if offered. It also creates a North division with some great rivalries in big cities and the lure of Howard in the DC area.

That's a best of all worlds scenario for the CAA. True divisional play in all sports with some great metro rivalries, HBCU rivalries, big city TV markets, budget friendly travel for student athletes and fans and east coast coverage. This conference arrangement could actually lead to a legitimate TV deal for the conference that could rival the A10. And if, in the future, there is a desire to form separate conferences in the North and South, this divisional setup is a solid basis for that change. This setup will be far more attractive to add teams in the future to offset any future losses, and it adds flexibility as well. And instead of a bunch of schools pining for an invite to the A10, this would set up the CAA to rival the A10.
(This post was last modified: 02-08-2022 05:28 AM by 82hawk.)
02-08-2022 05:16 AM
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JonP Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
(02-08-2022 05:16 AM)82hawk Wrote:  Divisional setup is the plan and 12 teams still requres a whole lot of travel for all teams, but especially those in the South.

Not necessarily. Nothing says that, say, the soccer teams have to play every single other CAA team in the regular season. You could still play only 8-9 league games, even if there are 12 teams. (This is what the A-10 does.) Or even do home-and-home intra-division (10 games) and only meet the other half of the conference in postseason tourneys.

Basketball will be interesting. 16 might be too few league games for a regular season (10 home-and-home intra-division, 6 home-or-away vs. other division teams). But that's easily solved: Maybe you get one or two additional cross-division home-and-home games. Still would allow for fewer long trips in total.

Point being, I think 12 is enough if travel is your concern.
02-08-2022 11:31 AM
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solohawks Online
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Queens University at Charlotte just voted to go D1. There was an out of left field rumor they were talking to the CAA awhile back. Could they be CAA South #7 to pair with A&T?
02-08-2022 11:33 AM
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Sitting bull Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
(02-08-2022 11:33 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Queens University at Charlotte just voted to go D1. There was an out of left field rumor they were talking to the CAA awhile back. Could they be CAA South #7 to pair with A&T?

You really need to elevate your standards. There would be about 50 options for the CAA ahead of Queens in Charlotte. At best, they would be Big South material.

I don’t think the CAA is in any further rush at this point anyway.
02-08-2022 11:42 AM
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EvanJ Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Let them start in the Big South or Atlantic Sun and try to get them later if they turn out to be good.
02-08-2022 11:43 AM
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solohawks Online
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
(02-08-2022 11:42 AM)Sitting bull Wrote:  
(02-08-2022 11:33 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Queens University at Charlotte just voted to go D1. There was an out of left field rumor they were talking to the CAA awhile back. Could they be CAA South #7 to pair with A&T?

You really need to elevate your standards. There would be about 50 options for the CAA ahead of Queens in Charlotte. At best, they would be Big South material.

I don’t think the CAA is in any further rush at this point anyway.

I'm not saying that's who I would pick. Just throwing it out there as a possibility based on current events
02-08-2022 11:50 AM
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JonP Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
(02-08-2022 11:33 AM)solohawks Wrote:  There was an out of left field rumor they were talking to the CAA awhile back.

I have a hunch that Queens itself was the source of that rumor.

I cannot see any scenario where the CAA takes a D2 call-up. There is no good reason for the league to do that.
02-08-2022 01:15 PM
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82hawk Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Based on all the options available, I can't see that school(whoever they are), getting a thumbs up from any current CAA schools. They may be a nice fill in for any conference the CAA poaches, but not the CAA.
(This post was last modified: 02-08-2022 02:44 PM by 82hawk.)
02-08-2022 02:43 PM
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Just my opinion, but I think this would be the best case to consolidate a bit in terms of travel.

CAA adds Howard and Fairfield to get to 14, but UNCW and CoC decide the further northward expansion is the last straw and leave for SoCon keeping CAA at 12 in Olympic sports and football at 14. Then you get this format for football and Olympic sports

North:
Monmouth
Stony Brook
Drexel (Oly.)/Villanova (FB)
Fairfield (Oly.)/Rhode Island (FB)
Hofstra (Oly.)/Albany (FB)
Northeastern (Oly.)/Maine (FB)
New Hampshire (FB)

South:
Delaware
Elon
Hampton
Howard
Towson
William & Mary
Richmond (FB)

Obviously it’s not a guarantee UNCW and CoC leave so if they stay and CAA stays at 14, then I could see Delaware (Oly.) more to the North division while Delaware (FB) stays south).


Different topic: If NCA&T is added instead of Fairfield, Delaware obviously moves north in Olympic sports, then I think football goes to 3 pods of 5.

North:
Albany
Maine
New Hampshire
Rhode Island
Stony Brook

Central:
Delaware
Howard
Monmouth
Towson
Villanova

South:
Elon
Hampton
NCA&T
Richmond
William & Mary
02-10-2022 07:10 AM
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wmmii Offline
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CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
(02-08-2022 05:16 AM)82hawk Wrote:  I can't see the CAA staying at 12. Divisional setup is the plan and 12 teams still requres a whole lot of travel for all teams, but especially those in the South. A N/S divisional setup needs to get to at least 14 and 16 allows for true in division play only for all teams.

The Howard/A&T rumor is really intriguing for multiple reasons. The CAA has lacked an identity we had in the good ole' days for awhile. We could become a semi HBCU conference with these additions, which would create a great deal of national appeal for the networks covering athletics. Howard brings in the DC market and creates a great intra city/area rivalry for Towson. NC A&T would be a great lure for UNCG to come on board and creates another great rivalry setup with Elon, UNCG and A&T all located in the third biggest city in NC and all within 25 minutes of each other. But if Howard and A&T come, they are both football schools and we are still at an uneven number in football. Which is why I think the CAA goes to 16 if those two commit.

Here is a scenario i'd love to see. Howard and A&T commit behind the scenes. This committment entices UNCG to come on board as well, which means the CAA needs a fourth addition to bring expansion to 16 and that fourth team needs to have football. Campbell is that fourth team and after a bunch of behind the scenes activity, the CAA announces Howard, NC A&T, UNCG and Campbell are coming to the CAA.

That leads to the following N/S divisions for all sports but CAA football.

South - Hampton, W&M, Elon, UNCG, NC A&T, Campbell, UNCW, College of Charleston
North- Howard, Towson, Delaware, Drexel, Monmouth, Stony Brook, Hofstra, Northeastern

This setup recreates what the CAA had in it's glory days with five teams in the southern division in North Carolina(There were five teams in the Virginia area in the CAA at one time). That will create some media buzz in a state that is known for basketball. If UNCG balks, High Point could replace UNCG as a basketball only school and they would jump at the opportunity if offered. It also creates a North division with some great rivalries in big cities and the lure of Howard in the DC area.

That's a best of all worlds scenario for the CAA. True divisional play in all sports with some great metro rivalries, HBCU rivalries, big city TV markets, budget friendly travel for student athletes and fans and east coast coverage. This conference arrangement could actually lead to a legitimate TV deal for the conference that could rival the A10. And if, in the future, there is a desire to form separate conferences in the North and South, this divisional setup is a solid basis for that change. This setup will be far more attractive to add teams in the future to offset any future losses, and it adds flexibility as well. And instead of a bunch of schools pining for an invite to the A10, this would set up the CAA to rival the A10.


+1


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02-13-2022 01:48 AM
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82hawk Offline
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
Rumors circulating at UNCW last night that CofC is leaving, which leaves a really interesting potential scenario IF it's true and IF UNCW isn't leaving as well. UNCG comes on board with NC A&T,, Campbell and High Point in the south, making an even tighter footprint in the South with CofC gone. Basically, UNCG switches spots with CofC as a non football school, and High Point provided the non football school needed to complete the southern division of the CAA. High Point is pretty much a suburb of Greensboro, which means High Point, UNCG, NC A&T and Elon would all be within 45 minutes of each other, with UNCG and NC A&T three mile apart.

South - UNCW, UNCG, High Point, NC A&T, Elon, Campbell, William and Mary, Hampton

North - Towson, Howard, Delaware, Drexel, Monmouth, Stony Brook, Hofstra, Northeastern
02-13-2022 01:06 PM
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RE: CAA expansion: stay at 12, or expand to 14/16?
I don't want more than 12 teams. If Charleston leaves, let one NC school replace them.
02-13-2022 06:32 PM
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