I would imagine a 16 team league if they talent coming in is better would have a 2 bid league. A-10 style

(01-26-2022 03:09 PM)DrachenFire Wrote:  If 14-16 is the ultimate goal, I think I'd like to see the league pause and get these three integrated and just go with 12 next year, allow some time for the changes coming to the NCAA to come a bit more in focus, get the new media deal ironed out and then see if all of that may shake some other candidates loose. If not, then you can circle back to some of the other names that have been floated during this current process.

Well, maybe there isn't any reason to pause before going past 12. At this point, would seem to be any other southern members would be coming from the Big South.
https://soconsports.com/news/2022/1/27/g...ision.aspx

Smart move by the SoCon. 2M is not out of the question though if they really wanted out. I would agree, the 2 leagues are close enough in stature that the exit fee is probably enough of a deterrent to stay put.

Guess that means if we are going further than the current 12: Campbell, A&T, Howard, Winthrop or High Point would likely be the only schools on the southern list.

Hearing some rumblings out there.....

1. Patriot makes play for W&M & NU
2. AE makes play for Quinnipiac and Fairfield

Don't shoot the messenger.

You really should have the decency to cite Dane96 instead of just showing up here and spouting his info off as your own.
https://www.basketballforum.com/threads/...t-15360811

I would hate to lose NU thats for sure.

(01-28-2022 11:35 AM)mainejeff Wrote:  Hearing some rumblings out there.....

1. Patriot makes play for W&M & NU
2. AE makes play for Quinnipiac and Fairfield

Don't shoot the messenger.

If W&M wanted the Patriot they would already be there. I don't see them going anywhere. Some think they are more likely to stay after these changes, not less...

NU... Eh. I don't know that BU wants them, or that they want BU. If that would get worked out they would still need to want to go. Possible, but I don't view it as likely.

AE can have Fairfield. I think CAA has interest in Q, if thats true, then why would Q choose AE over CAA? They've spent a decade dumping money into athletics to not go to the highest level available to them?


Jeff, its cute that you walk onto our board with your rumors, that as Drachen notes may or may not even be your own, but if you come into this house, be prepared to back it up and show your work.

I have my doubts that W&M is interested in the Patriot League because of football. The CAA is leagues above the Patriot. Granted, if they feel like they can dominate the Patriot, maybe it makes sense from that angle, but teams rarely "move down".

Northeastern would be an unfortunate loss. They would be the largest school in the Patriot, but the "big fish in a small pond" effect might be mitigated by the academic prestige of the conference, and they don't have football to consider. Certainly, it would be strange timing, with the CAA making a clear northern move. Personally, I think Drexel is a more similar school to Northeastern than any school in the Patriot.

EDIT: Also, have to take anything that Jeff says with a HUGE grain of salt. He's been pretty transparent in his desire to see the CAA fall apart. Most likely, this is a case of him trying to manifest something into the void.

WM balks at PL because of some of their rules, like not red shirting, not because the CAA is better, though the different rules do make the CAA better. If the PL changed some of those rules, I think that would change WM's calculus and if they were to leave you could see some of the football affiliate members go with them that would flip the PL to being better, or at least closer to par, with the CAA in football.

The Patriot League was created in the 90's as a sort of poor man's Ivy League. William and Mary fits the academic profile of a Patriot League team, even more so than many of the current PL teams. If William and Mary really wanted to join the Patriot League, they would have done so years ago.

(01-28-2022 02:45 PM)J.B. Wrote:  The Patriot League was created in the 90's as a sort of poor man's Ivy League. William and Mary fits the academic profile of a Patriot League team, even more so than many of the current PL teams. If William and Mary really wanted to join the Patriot League, they would have done so years ago.

Absolutely correct! Football, to this point, has been the number 1 sport for William and Mary of the revenue sports. While it gets kicked around on our board every year or two, I don't think there is any real support moving to a lower league. The PL has less scholarships than the CAA among many other issues that make it less attractive for football. I think the PL becomes an option if and only if the CAA falls apart. Clearly, the recent move to add Monmouth, Stony Brook, and Hampton makes that less likely. Maine Jeff always has interesting sources. In the last month or so, he had the Tribe moving to the SoCon. I have no idea if our leadership wants any move. But, our message board is even split between wanting to stay in the CAA or move to the SoCon. We are always behind against our conference mates in spending on athletics and I guess some feel that being in a league where all schools play football would level the playing field. I am not sure that is the case, nor am I sure that the level of commitment to sports for the leadership is the same as the student body or the alumni. Likely more alums still value football over the other sports, although we do have a loyal fanbase for the nonrevenue sports(see all of the Tribe 7 details). That threat to eliminate those sports led to the dismissal of our previous AD which may have saved all of W&M athletics in the long run.

Nice win for the Dragons last night. I still think Drexel has as much talent as any squad this year.

(01-27-2022 04:32 AM)Dragon For Life Wrote:  I would imagine a 16 team league if they talent coming in is better would have a 2 bid league. A-10 style

I am not sure that would be the case. 3 things have really hurt CAA basketball. One is the enormous success with George Mason and VCU reaching the Final 4. With that level of success, the league was raided and it also hurt scheduling for the league as a whole in the nonconference.
Two, the lack of any dominant program in the league. It is great for hardcore followers of the league that any school feels like it has a chance each year, but the CAA has no long term track record to try and get an at large bid. In 2010, W&M had a great resume and had the lowest RPI to not get an at large bid and we all remember the shaft Drexel got the year VCU went to the final four. But, since VCU and ODU left, the league has had every school win the title once except W&M, Towson and Elon. Only Towson has failed to make the final of the CAA tourney and only 2 schools(UNCW and NU) have won twice. Mid-majors get less at large representation each year and when they do, they are underseeded and placed against each other in the first round frequently. Apparently, no one wants another George Mason or VCU.
Finally, the third thing and perhaps most damaging is the horrible TV/Streaming deal. No one watches our games. Unlike the A10, SoCon and others that get lots of TV exposure, our schools get Flo. And Flo doesn't cover ANY other conferences to even allow crossover exposure. Without the exposure, anyone looking at our league sees no dominant teams, many teams with mediocre records, and they haven't seen any of the teams play. Not the path for at large bids at all.

(01-28-2022 04:02 PM)TribePride91 Wrote:  Maine Jeff always has interesting sources.

He has no sources. He frequents a bunch of different boards, sees a rumor on one and then goes to another to stir things up.

Everyone here should just ignore him.

(01-28-2022 02:20 PM)metsox Wrote:  

(01-28-2022 11:35 AM)mainejeff Wrote:  Hearing some rumblings out there.....

1. Patriot makes play for W&M & NU
2. AE makes play for Quinnipiac and Fairfield

Don't shoot the messenger.

If W&M wanted the Patriot they would already be there. I don't see them going anywhere. Some think they are more likely to stay after these changes, not less...

NU... Eh. I don't know that BU wants them, or that they want BU. If that would get worked out they would still need to want to go. Possible, but I don't view it as likely.

AE can have Fairfield. I think CAA has interest in Q, if thats true, then why would Q choose AE over CAA? They've spent a decade dumping money into athletics to not go to the highest level available to them?


Jeff, its cute that you walk onto our board with your rumors, that as Drachen notes may or may not even be your own, but if you come into this house, be prepared to back it up and show your work.

What's cute is that you think that William & Mary would already be in the Patriot with that leagues' scholarship and red-shirt limitations.

(01-28-2022 02:38 PM)DrachenFire Wrote:  WM balks at PL because of some of their rules, like not red shirting, not because the CAA is better, though the different rules do make the CAA better. If the PL changed some of those rules, I think that would change WM's calculus and if they were to leave you could see some of the football affiliate members go with them that would flip the PL to being better, or at least closer to par, with the CAA in football.

Bingo.

(01-29-2022 02:50 PM)JonP Wrote:  

(01-28-2022 04:02 PM)TribePride91 Wrote:  Maine Jeff always has interesting sources.

He has no sources. He frequents a bunch of different boards, sees a rumor on one and then goes to another to stir things up.

Everyone here should just ignore him.

How would you know that I frequent a bunch of boards.....because you do as well?

(01-29-2022 05:03 PM)mainejeff Wrote:  

(01-29-2022 02:50 PM)JonP Wrote:  

(01-28-2022 04:02 PM)TribePride91 Wrote:  Maine Jeff always has interesting sources.

He has no sources. He frequents a bunch of different boards, sees a rumor on one and then goes to another to stir things up.

Everyone here should just ignore him.

How would you know that I frequent a bunch of boards.....because you do as well?

Come on, Jeff. We know you're everywhere. If you did women the way you do message boards, we'd be calling you Maine Don Juan.

It’s kind of sad what has happened to patriot league football. Lehigh, Colgate, and occasionally other teams like Lafayette were actually a threat to win fcs playoff games. They are doormats now. Lehigh went 0 for their non-conference schedule and wasn’t in Villanova’s zip code. Even the Ivy is at a much higher level.

If competitive football is what w&m wsnts…they’ll be with us for a while.

I also appreciate the constructive criticism of flo beyond “the feed sucks”. I still question how many people would seek our games out…and we are on cbs sports network.

Completely agree on needing a flagship.

(01-30-2022 06:16 AM)hiroshimacarp Wrote:  It’s kind of sad what has happened to patriot league football. Lehigh, Colgate, and occasionally other teams like Lafayette were actually a threat to win fcs playoff games. They are doormats now. Lehigh went 0 for their non-conference schedule and wasn’t in Villanova’s zip code. Even the Ivy is at a much higher level.

If competitive football is what w&m wsnts…they’ll be with us for a while.

I also appreciate the constructive criticism of flo beyond “the feed sucks”. I still question how many people would seek our games out…and we are on cbs sports network.

Completely agree on needing a flagship.

There are so many streaming services and Flo doesn't deserve it haha.

(01-30-2022 06:16 AM)hiroshimacarp Wrote:  It’s kind of sad what has happened to patriot league football. Lehigh, Colgate, and occasionally other teams like Lafayette were actually a threat to win fcs playoff games. They are doormats now. Lehigh went 0 for their non-conference schedule and wasn’t in Villanova’s zip code. Even the Ivy is at a much higher level.

If competitive football is what w&m wsnts…they’ll be with us for a while.

I also appreciate the constructive criticism of flo beyond “the feed sucks”. I still question how many people would seek our games out…and we are on cbs sports network.

Completely agree on needing a flagship.

So you want more reasons why Aunt Flo sucks? Let's see. It's double the price of their main competitor, even with the league's $12.50/month discounted rates, quadruple the price without the discount. CAA games are buried within high school games and are sometimes hard to find. It doesn't tell you if it's a MBB, WBB, hockey game, high school game, volleyball, etc. All you see is two teams logos, and no organization within the interface. It's tough to head into the game on delay. Say you're an hour late to watching the game, it doesn't let you start from the beginning. Replays on the TV app are hard to come by. The only replay a few games.

I'm not one of the people screaming that it's ESPN or nothing. I'd rather the CAA get creative, like syndicate their games on various RSN's like NBC and Bally Sports, or stream games on Peacock or another high profile streaming service. But Aunt Flo is clearly not the answer for the league's future success.