I’ve warmed up to an expansion scenario I can get behind.

Baylor - pretty self explanatory. They’re tearing it up everywhere you look. Our ivory towers can look the other way since they’d be in the Gulf Coast sub-division.

Houston - I believe they have a higher ceiling than TCU, which is Baylor-West to me with worse basketball. Houston at their best is moving games to Reliant to host FSU and Miami. They’re a public school and I like the balance between private/public for new additions.

Regardless of what happens in the future, adding these two now helps the longevity of the conference because it’s in a position of power vs the Big XII.

I'd have no problem with those adds. ACCN subscriptions alone would nearly pay for them, and the bigger deal is the ability to reopen the main tv contract in this market.

(01-17-2022 07:18 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  I'd have no problem with those adds. ACCN subscriptions alone would nearly pay for them, and the bigger deal is the ability to reopen the main tv contract in this market.

what about exorbitant travel costs ...

STOP & SMELL THE ROSES

Travel shouldn’t be an issue with a pod of Baylor, Houston, Miami, and FSU. You could do a 22-game basketball schedule with a round robin between two “divisions”.

Wake
NC State
Clemson
Georgia Tech
FSU
Miami
Houston
Baylor

Louisville could be switched for Wake or State as well. That could go either way.

I think this needs to be done. It creates great divisions or pretty clean pods:

BC, Syracuse, Pitt, Louisville

Virginia, VaTech, Carolina, Duke

Wake, State, Clemson, GaTech

FSU, Miami, Houston, Baylor

I could be swayed to go for TCU (or even SMU) in place of Houston. What I like about Houston is their potential ceiling is extremely high. I think I read their stadium is expandable to 60k. Plus it’s a huge school in a giant market.

This also ensures if some marquee schools leave that the remnants are in a more desirable conference than the Big XII.

(01-17-2022 10:47 AM)esayem Wrote:  Travel shouldn’t be an issue with a pod of Baylor, Houston, Miami, and FSU. You could do a 22-game basketball schedule with a round robin between two “divisions”.

Wake
NC State
Clemson
Georgia Tech
FSU
Miami
Houston
Baylor

Louisville could be switched for Wake or State as well. That could go either way.

convince student athletes who would bear the brunt schlepping different time zones ...

BIOLOGICAL CLOCK

(01-17-2022 10:55 AM)esayem Wrote:  I think this needs to be done. It creates great divisions or pretty clean pods:

BC, Syracuse, Pitt, Louisville

Virginia, VaTech, Carolina, Duke

Wake, State, Clemson, GaTech

FSU, Miami, Houston, Baylor

I could be swayed to go for TCU (or even SMU) in place of Houston. What I like about Houston is their potential ceiling is extremely high. I think I read their stadium is expandable to 60k. Plus it’s a huge school in a giant market.

This also ensures if some marquee schools leave that the remnants are in a more desirable conference than the Big XII.

baylor, houston, tcu are not headliners ...

SHOWSTOPPERS

Well Baylor has a basketball title and just played in a NYD bowl, so I think they’re one of the hottest properties in the Big XII. I don’t see them letting off the gas so if we get them in the ACC that further weakens the Big XII. Then let’s say FSU leaves, the ACC would be more attractive for a replacement like UCF. It’s not brain surgery, it’s preparing for the worst.

Travel argument is weak. Notre Dame is in the central time zone. Miami flies all over the place anyway and I’m sure Houston isn’t a worse flight than Boston. One hour time difference is nothing.

(01-17-2022 12:03 PM)esayem Wrote:  Well Baylor has a basketball title and just played in a NYD bowl, so I think they’re one of the hottest properties in the Big XII. I don’t see them letting off the gas so if we get them in the ACC that further weakens the Big XII. (irrevocably deballed as is) Then let’s say FSU leaves (don’t let the door hit ya on the way out), the ACC would be more attractive for a replacement like UCF. (would walk barefoot on broken glass) It’s not brain surgery, it’s preparing for the worst.

Travel argument is weak. (easy for keyboard soldiers to say) Notre Dame is in the central eastern time zone. Miami flies all over the place anyway and I’m sure Houston isn’t a worse flight than Boston. One hour time difference is nothing.

CLEAN UP ON AISLE 3

(01-17-2022 11:05 AM)green Wrote:  

(01-17-2022 10:47 AM)esayem Wrote:  Travel shouldn’t be an issue with a pod of Baylor, Houston, Miami, and FSU. You could do a 22-game basketball schedule with a round robin between two “divisions”.

Wake
NC State
Clemson
Georgia Tech
FSU
Miami
Houston
Baylor

Louisville could be switched for Wake or State as well. That could go either way.

convince student athletes who would bear the brunt schlepping different time zones ...

BIOLOGICAL CLOCK

Going back and forth from the Central to Eastern TZ is nothing. West Florida, SW Kentucky and NW and SW Indiana are already in the Central TZ.

As the cable model slowly turns into a streaming model, those schools with massive student bodies and living alumni will get the edge in expansion.

Houston has 47,000 students with over 230,000 living alumni
Baylor has 18,000 students with over 180,000 living alumni



I was curious, so I looked up two other schools that are a better geographic fit and arguably athletic fit given histories of these two schools with existing members ....

West Virginia has 21,000 students with over 210,000 living alumni
Cincinnati has 46,000 students with over 300,000 living alumni


Comparative student body sizes, but WVU and Cincy have roughly 100,000 more living alumni.

But who knows how things will shake out whenever that time comes. Baylor and Houston are good options certainly. But maybe the combo then will be Houston and Cincinnati.



.

(01-17-2022 01:55 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  As the cable model slowly turns into a streaming model, those schools with massive student bodies and living alumni will get the edge in expansion.

Houston has 47,000 students with over 230,000 living alumni (260K)
Baylor has 18,000 students with over 180,000 living alumni



I was curious, so I looked up two other schools that are a better geographic fit and arguably athletic fit given histories of these two schools with existing members ....

West Virginia has 21,000 students with over 210,000 living alumni
Cincinnati has 46,000 students with over 300,000 living alumni


Comparative student body sizes, but WVU and Cincy have roughly 100,000 more living alumni.

WVa does not represent a new market for the ACC and their alums are already diasporaed into the ACC markets. With West Va you are adding a portion of a dying State - Huntington, Parkersburg, Charleston. The rest of West Va sits inside VT's, Pitt's, and UVa's media penetration areas. There are no 4 and 5 star football recruits there and over half the attendance of West Va comes from out of State because West Va is dying.

Cincy is the most ACC - like of the four, followed by Houston, followed by Baylor.

What works in Baylor's favor is being the second school in Texas if and after the ACC took the first one.

(01-17-2022 01:55 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  As the cable model slowly turns into a streaming model, those schools with massive student bodies and living alumni will get the edge in expansion.

Houston has 47,000 students with over 230,000 living alumni
Baylor has 18,000 students with over 180,000 living alumni



I was curious, so I looked up two other schools that are a better geographic fit and arguably athletic fit given histories of these two schools with existing members ....

West Virginia has 21,000 students with over 210,000 living alumni
Cincinnati has 46,000 students with over 300,000 living alumni


Comparative student body sizes, but WVU and Cincy have roughly 100,000 more living alumni.

But who knows how things will shake out whenever that time comes. Baylor and Houston are good options certainly.



.

let me disabuse of this notion ...
neither alumnus nor student necessarily equals fan ...
fan = fan
case in point: yours truly ...
I attended uf undergrad & law ...
don’t give a flying f*ck ‘bout that school ...
a C-A-N-E to the core ...

SOULMATE

(01-17-2022 02:13 PM)green Wrote:  

(01-17-2022 01:55 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  As the cable model slowly turns into a streaming model, those schools with massive student bodies and living alumni will get the edge in expansion.

Houston has 47,000 students with over 230,000 living alumni
Baylor has 18,000 students with over 180,000 living alumni



I was curious, so I looked up two other schools that are a better geographic fit and arguably athletic fit given histories of these two schools with existing members ....

West Virginia has 21,000 students with over 210,000 living alumni
Cincinnati has 46,000 students with over 300,000 living alumni


Comparative student body sizes, but WVU and Cincy have roughly 100,000 more living alumni.

But who knows how things will shake out whenever that time comes. Baylor and Houston are good options certainly.



.

let me disabuse of this notion ...
neither alumnus nor student necessarily equals fan ...
fan = fan
case in point: yours truly ...
I attended uf undergrad & law ...
don’t give a flying f*ck ‘bout that school ...
a C-A-N-E to the core ...

SOULMATE

Anecdotal evidence is nothing more than evidence of anecdotes.

(01-17-2022 01:56 PM)Statefan Wrote:  

(01-17-2022 01:55 PM)Pervis_Griffith Wrote:  As the cable model slowly turns into a streaming model, those schools with massive student bodies and living alumni will get the edge in expansion.

Houston has 47,000 students with over 230,000 living alumni (260K)

Baylor has 18,000 students with over 180,000 living alumni



I was curious, so I looked up two other schools that are a better geographic fit and arguably athletic fit given histories of these two schools with existing members ....

West Virginia has 21,000 students with over 210,000 living alumni
Cincinnati has 46,000 students with over 300,000 living alumni


Comparative student body sizes, but WVU and Cincy have roughly 100,000 more living alumni.

WVa does not represent a new market for the ACC and their alums are already diasporaed into the ACC markets. With West Va you are adding a portion of a dying State - Huntington, Parkersburg, Charleston. The rest of West Va sits inside VT's, Pitt's, and UVa's media penetration areas. There are no 4 and 5 star football recruits there and over half the attendance of West Va comes from out of State because West Va is dying.

Cincy is the most ACC - like of the four, followed by Houston, followed by Baylor.

What works in Baylor's ACC’s favor is being the second school in Texas if and after the ACC took the first one.

GUIDING LIGHT

Green, that thing you do with your posts is funny sometimes, but mostly it's really aggravating and serves to undercut the point you are making.

The biggest problem with TCU is that they are a college, not really a university in the sense of most P-5's. Their doctoral programs are limited to Education and Nursing. That does not mean that TCU is not a great school, but it's not a graduate oriented university. BC and WF have more robust doctoral and or medical programs. TCU just opened a med school.

(01-17-2022 02:20 PM)Statefan Wrote:  Green, that thing you do with your posts is funny sometimes, but mostly it's really aggravating and serves to undercut the point you are making.

I post what interests me ...
I post what I want you to read ...
oh say can you see ...

TOUGH NOOGIE

Green, I hardly need to be a keyboard soldier to tell you the difference between the eastern and central time zone is negligible when traveling and that’s a bad argument. Doesn’t seem to hurt the SEC or Big 10. But thank you, I would have sworn Notre Dame was in the CTZ.

(01-17-2022 02:27 PM)esayem Wrote:  Green, I hardly need to be a keyboard soldier to tell you the difference between the eastern and central time zone is negligible when traveling and that’s a bad argument. Doesn’t seem to hurt the SEC or Big 10. But thank you, I would have sworn Notre Dame was in the CTZ.

Time changes at the County Line in South Bend. But the main ND media market, Chicago, is CTZ of course.

FSU media in Pensacola and Mobile are CTZ. Louisville media in Evansville and Bowling Green are CTZ, ND media in Gary and Chicago are CTZ.

A flight to Houston or Waco is no worse than a bus ride to VT or UVa from UNC, Duke, or NC State.