(01-21-2022 12:57 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(01-21-2022 05:48 AM)Statefan Wrote:  ...the region is so poor, owned by too many out of state extractive interests, and too far from any other political/economic engine to bring the area up. An economy based on Coal, Moonshine, Meth, and Opiods is just no way to live.

I've made business trips to Mexico, Puerto Rico, and Communist China, and I made a missionary trip to the coal mining area of Eastern Kentucky. Except for Communist China, E. Kentucky was the poorest area I've ever seen. It hurt my heart to see how those coal miners had to live... and, yes, a good many of them were hooked on pain medicine (think Oxycodone). Very sad.

That doesn't even take into account mine cave ins, methane explosions, Black Lung Disease, lung cancer, air and water pollution, and many other problems.

I grew up in a coal mining family (both sides) in Fayette County, PA, about 35 miles southeast of Pittsburgh.

I experienced all of the above first hand.

(01-16-2022 09:56 AM)esayem Wrote:  By the time 2025/26 comes around with the Portal and NIL - there is a real possibility we could have a College Football Commissioner appointed by the Government (been a lot of talk it could be Greg Sankey), have caps on NIL, no BIG12, 16 member conferences, a 12 team Playoff, Bowl games with no conference tie ins - renegotiated TV contracts making conference revenues more equitable and a college football product none of us will recognize

This isn’t that unbelievable, but if it doesn’t fit your narrative I understand why you’d try to refute it.

I think NIL caps are the most unlikely here, but salary caps might be possible. There is still a lot to figure out.

16-member conferences doesn’t mean there won’t be other smaller conferences that aren’t considered power conferences. The Big XII might exist in a different form.

I’m not convinced there won’t be room for Notre Dame as an Indy in this new paradigm. A ND and maybe TCU pairing has the highest potential for the ACC, but without ND maybe the ACC doubles down on Texas with Baylor as well.

BC
Syracuse
Pitt
Louisville
UVA
VaTech
Carolina
Duke

Wake
State
Clemson
GaTech
FSU
Miami
Baylor
TCU

This looks pretty damn good on paper and actually would make the league more appealing to ND by adding another area outside the footprint.

I have to think the Big Ten adds Kansas and either Kansas St./Iowa St. This pushes Purdue to the east and gets rid of the weird schism.

The Pac gets Texas Tech, Houston, Oklahoma State, and either Kansas St./Iowa State.

That gets all the power teams into four conferences except poor WVU, which makes more sense in Louisville’s place, but oh well.

If TV wanted all of the schools in four conferences they would have done it last summer. Instead TV is helping and protecting the Big 12 as is the Alliance. They do not want to trim down to P4, there is strength in numbers with a P5. ESPN also does not want to add any of the G5 or Big 12 schools to the ACC, they love their current deal with them. It might not be the greatest deal but it's still not terrible for the ACC. P5 realignment is dead until at least 2036 and even then I have my doubts about it starting up again.

I'm not saying it's going to happen, but if it did, I bet it plays out like that or very similar.

As long as Stanford and Cal are in the P-12 the P-12 will not vote to add non-graduate, non-research intensive schools. If you take the NSF rankings for research dollars and the ARWU rankings as a quality volume measure as two numbers, add them up and divide by 2, the average P12 school would generate a number of about 44 with Washington and California schools in the top 20's.

Do that with who is out there west of the Rockies and you get:

71 - Colorado State (better than Oregon, Washington State, and Oregon State)
76 - Kansas (see above)
78 - Nebraska - (see above)
87 - Rice and Iowa State - (see above)
97 - Houston (the new bottom)
112 - New Mexico (the new bottom)
116 - KSU (the new bottom)
130 - Texas Tech (the new bottom)
Oklahoma State, UNLV, and Nevada-Reno are even lower.

I can't see anything above New Mexico being the least bit academically tolerable to the P-12. I include Nebraska because all things being equal, the P12 is where they need to be if the P12 expands. They can be successful there and athletically anchor a mid-western divisions.

(01-15-2022 08:13 AM)nole Wrote:  amazing how someone can be praised while being amazingly incompetent.

Fantastic post.

(01-15-2022 07:39 PM)nole Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 06:50 PM)Statefan Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 03:31 PM)nole Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 03:26 PM)green Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 03:01 PM)nole Wrote:  I honestly don't follow the point you are trying to make.

What did you want answered?

big12 no longer wields power ...

FOR THE HARD OF HEARING

We are reading and writing...hearing has nothing to do with it. Try actually communicating your points.

I have news for you....the Big 12 had a larger payout than the ACC last year:

roughly $32 million for the ACC to $47 million for the Big 12.

NOBODY knows if the newly formed Big 12 will have a payout that falls below what the ACC is at.

REGARDLESS....both are going to be about $40-$50 million behind the P2. There is no award for being say $40 million behind instead of $43 million behind. BOTH those positions are screwed.


And you haven't been paying attention at all....because NEITHER the ACC nor Big 12 wield any power more than the other. Both are NOBODIES in the game of major college athletics now.

You are looking for the tallest person in a midget conference here.

Nole, where are you getting your numbers? Here are mine and where I got them:

2020-21 B12 Revenue Distribution $345 Million
https://cyclonefanatic.com/2021/05/big-1...tribution/
Average per school $34.5 M

2019-2020 B12 Revenue Distribution $409.2 Million
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nc...047216002/
Average per school $40.9 M
Actual payouts ranged from $37-$40 M

2019-20 ACC Revenue Distribution $497.2 Million
https://www.espn.com/college-sports/stor...42-million
Average per school of $35.2 M
Actual payouts ranged from $32-37 M

I can’t find the final distribution for FY 20-21 because the ACC tends not to project distributions but report only actuals. It’s better accounting practice.

FY 20-21 will include UNC's Orange Bowl and Clemson's playoff appearance, as well as ND's donation to the football side. That $28 M, plus $ 6 M, plus plus $ 6 M, only the ND money is "new", but what is new is the additional network money. 20-21 for the ACC will have brought in no less than about $540 M. ND gets a 1/15 share of all the football bowl money - OB plus playoff spots plus other bowls. All together they will get paid about $11 million for the bowl game and basketball. The other 14 will deal with revenue of a 529 M or and average per school of about $37 M and the range will be about $40 M to $35 M.

If you compare the same fiscal year, the ACC is distributing more per school and the B12 in FY 20-21. Now, there will be a hit in 21-22 because there will have been no Orange Bowl and No playoff appearance - that's a $34 M hit, but the ACC will have run a full year.

In 22-23 the ACC network will run a full year, will have Comcast, and will have the Orange Bowl. That will take revenue to about $620 M per year or an average of $44 M per school. I know FSU needs more money, but you need to fix your football program and start winning some games so you can sell the $12K tickets a game that you are not selling. That's $10-12 million a year that is totally on the state of your program.

Great post. I believe one HUGE discrepancy that occurs with the Big 12 is they keep their tier 3 rights. For a top25 program that can be $5-$15 million a year.

I just pulled up something new that had all conferences (so I'm not doing math). Here it is :
https://footballscoop.com/news/heres-how...-last-year

According to documents obtained by USA Today, here is the gross revenue each Power 5 league collected:

1. Big Ten: $768.9 million
2. SEC: $728.9 million
3. Pac-12: $533.8 million
4. ACC: $496.7 million
5. Big 12: $409.2 million

Despite leading the pack, the Big Ten was actually one of the two leagues to earn less money in FY2020 than '19. The Big 12 was the other.

Here are the per-school payouts for full-shared members (i.e., the Big Ten is still shorting Maryland and Rutgers' checks, nearly a decade after they joined):

1. Big Ten: $54.3 million
2. SEC: $45.5 million
3. Big 12: ~$38 million
4. Pac-12: $33.6 million
5. ACC: ~$33 million


So again, the Big 12 makes more than the ACC...they have every single year I have tracked.

But my biggest point on that topic is it does NOT matter. The p3 will all be around $40 million a year behind the SEC/B1G. It means basically NOTHING that one of the p3 might make $3 million a year more against another p3 conference. They are all equally screwed and all equally powerless.



I totally agree with your last point. Please note something I have consistently believe. I feel both FSU and ACC leadership have failed Two things can be true at the same time. A) ACC leadership has completely failed with REVENUE/TV Contracts/Football. B) FSU leadership has completely failed with REVENUE/TV Contracts/Football

I have been as critical or more critical with FSU leadership. The last 3 presidents/ADs were total baffoons when it came to athletics

Watch your terminology! What USA Today reported was Total Media Revenue, not to be confused with Gross Total Revenue which is reported by Equity in Athletics which includes donations, gate, concessions, all of it. I make this distinction because the SEC averages 4.5 million more per school in Gross Total Revenue than the Big 10 does in spite of their 9 million more in media revenue. When counting beans its best always to count all beans and not just one pile.

(01-28-2022 07:51 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 08:13 AM)nole Wrote:  amazing how someone can be praised while being amazingly incompetent.

Fantastic post.

Hear, hear!

(01-27-2022 07:30 PM)CatsClaw1 Wrote:  

(01-16-2022 09:56 AM)esayem Wrote:  By the time 2025/26 comes around with the Portal and NIL - there is a real possibility we could have a College Football Commissioner appointed by the Government (been a lot of talk it could be Greg Sankey), have caps on NIL, no BIG12, 16 member conferences, a 12 team Playoff, Bowl games with no conference tie ins - renegotiated TV contracts making conference revenues more equitable and a college football product none of us will recognize

This isn’t that unbelievable, but if it doesn’t fit your narrative I understand why you’d try to refute it.

I think NIL caps are the most unlikely here, but salary caps might be possible. There is still a lot to figure out.

16-member conferences doesn’t mean there won’t be other smaller conferences that aren’t considered power conferences. The Big XII might exist in a different form.

I’m not convinced there won’t be room for Notre Dame as an Indy in this new paradigm. A ND and maybe TCU pairing has the highest potential for the ACC, but without ND maybe the ACC doubles down on Texas with Baylor as well.

BC
Syracuse
Pitt
Louisville
UVA
VaTech
Carolina
Duke

Wake
State
Clemson
GaTech
FSU
Miami
Baylor
TCU

This looks pretty damn good on paper and actually would make the league more appealing to ND by adding another area outside the footprint.

I have to think the Big Ten adds Kansas and either Kansas St./Iowa St. This pushes Purdue to the east and gets rid of the weird schism.

The Pac gets Texas Tech, Houston, Oklahoma State, and either Kansas St./Iowa State.

That gets all the power teams into four conferences except poor WVU, which makes more sense in Louisville’s place, but oh well.

If TV wanted all of the schools in four conferences they would have done it last summer. Instead TV is helping and protecting the Big 12 as is the Alliance. They do not want to trim down to P4, there is strength in numbers with a P5. ESPN also does not want to add any of the G5 or Big 12 schools to the ACC, they love their current deal with them. It might not be the greatest deal but it's still not terrible for the ACC. P5 realignment is dead until at least 2036 and even then I have my doubts about it starting up again.

https://twitter.com/SatDownSouth/status/...2787727361

HELLO HELLO ANYBODY HOME