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Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
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sctvman Offline
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Post: #1
Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
Vaccine requirements for 10 CAA hoops schools:

Northeastern: booster, 1/18
Hofstra: booster, 1/18
Drexel: booster, spring semester
Delaware: booster, 1/24
Towson: 2 shots, 1/10
W&M: booster, 1/18 or a month after eligible
JMU: 2 shots
Elon: 2 shots
UNCW: vax or weekly test
CofC: none (77% vaxxed as of 12/23)
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2022 05:12 PM by sctvman.)
12-24-2021 10:05 PM
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J.B. Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
What I'm actually more curious about is what each CAA school's fan policy is for Covid.

For Drexel,
All spectators must apply for Drexel Visitor Pass within 24 hours of attending event. To get a pass, spectators must attest that they are vaccinated and show no symptoms of Covid. All fans must be masked during the game. Starting on 12/31, no concessions will be sold, and only unsealed water bottles are permitted inside the DAC.
12-27-2021 09:27 AM
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82hawk Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-27-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  What I'm actually more curious about is what each CAA school's fan policy is for Covid.

For Drexel,
All spectators must apply for Drexel Visitor Pass within 24 hours of attending event. To get a pass, spectators must attest that they are vaccinated and show no symptoms of Covid. All fans must be masked during the game. Starting on 12/31, no concessions will be sold, and only unsealed water bottles are permitted inside the DAC.

UNCW doesn't have any of that tyrannical BS. Come to the game, pretend you will wear a mask then take it off, enjoy concessions, enjoy the game, go home and enjoy your life like a US Citizen.
12-28-2021 02:17 PM
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jcohen42 Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-28-2021 02:17 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(12-27-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  What I'm actually more curious about is what each CAA school's fan policy is for Covid.

For Drexel,
All spectators must apply for Drexel Visitor Pass within 24 hours of attending event. To get a pass, spectators must attest that they are vaccinated and show no symptoms of Covid. All fans must be masked during the game. Starting on 12/31, no concessions will be sold, and only unsealed water bottles are permitted inside the DAC.

UNCW doesn't have any of that tyrannical BS. Come to the game, pretend you will wear a mask then take it off, enjoy concessions, enjoy the game, go home and enjoy your life like a US Citizen.

Yeah, because god forbid take any precautions to keep other people safe. There's a reason we're still dealing with this stuff and it's almost 2022: the It's All About Me Attitude.
12-28-2021 04:37 PM
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J.B. Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-28-2021 02:17 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(12-27-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  What I'm actually more curious about is what each CAA school's fan policy is for Covid.

For Drexel,
All spectators must apply for Drexel Visitor Pass within 24 hours of attending event. To get a pass, spectators must attest that they are vaccinated and show no symptoms of Covid. All fans must be masked during the game. Starting on 12/31, no concessions will be sold, and only unsealed water bottles are permitted inside the DAC.

UNCW doesn't have any of that tyrannical BS. Come to the game, pretend you will wear a mask then take it off, enjoy concessions, enjoy the game, go home and enjoy your life like a US Citizen.

Please keep politics out of this. I'm just curious what each school's policy is.

So to translate.
UNCW - all fans must wear a mask, except when actively eating or drinking.

That's all I need to know. Thank you.
12-29-2021 09:24 AM
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70shawk Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-29-2021 09:24 AM)J.B. Wrote:  So to translate.
UNCW - all fans must wear a mask, except when actively eating or drinking.

Hmmm. Theoretically, maybe. In practice it seems to be more personal preference.
Watch the crowds in the video of any home games this year and it is obvious there is more than a little Kabuki Theater going on.

"You pretend to think that masks stop the spread of covid, and we'll pretend to not notice that you aren't wearing one"
12-30-2021 08:21 AM
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J.B. Offline
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RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-30-2021 08:21 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-29-2021 09:24 AM)J.B. Wrote:  So to translate.
UNCW - all fans must wear a mask, except when actively eating or drinking.

Hmmm. Theoretically, maybe. In practice it seems to be more personal preference.
Watch the crowds in the video of any home games this year and it is obvious there is more than a little Kabuki Theater going on.

"You pretend to think that masks stop the spread of covid, and we'll pretend to not notice that you aren't wearing one"

That's the way it is at almost every sporting event, even in Philadelphia. You have to wear a mask to get into the building, but the ushers aren't going to enforce the rule, and more than half will take them off. I'm fine with that too. I want to enjoy the game I'm watching and I don't want ushers yelling at people the entire game. I heard it was like that at Sixers games early last season before vaccines were common. You took your mask off for 10 seconds and there was an usher there to yell at you. Now, they don't care. We'll see if things change now with the new health and safety guidelines in place here.

As far as I'm concerned, if somebody has an issue with another fan not wearing a mask, he/she should keep his/her mask on.

For me, I wear a mask in the concourse or if I'm sitting close to people. But if I'm in the seats with nobody else nearby, I'll pull it down.
12-30-2021 09:27 AM
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Post: #8
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-30-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 08:21 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-29-2021 09:24 AM)J.B. Wrote:  So to translate.
UNCW - all fans must wear a mask, except when actively eating or drinking.

Hmmm. Theoretically, maybe. In practice it seems to be more personal preference.
Watch the crowds in the video of any home games this year and it is obvious there is more than a little Kabuki Theater going on.

"You pretend to think that masks stop the spread of covid, and we'll pretend to not notice that you aren't wearing one"

As far as I'm concerned, if somebody has an issue with another fan not wearing a mask, he/she should keep his/her mask on.

I'm with you, J.B. I personally have become convinced that masks offer little to no protection in the case of covid viruses. But if someone else thinks they do, then by all means they should feel free to mask up.
12-30-2021 10:25 AM
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J.B. Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-30-2021 10:25 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 08:21 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-29-2021 09:24 AM)J.B. Wrote:  So to translate.
UNCW - all fans must wear a mask, except when actively eating or drinking.

Hmmm. Theoretically, maybe. In practice it seems to be more personal preference.
Watch the crowds in the video of any home games this year and it is obvious there is more than a little Kabuki Theater going on.

"You pretend to think that masks stop the spread of covid, and we'll pretend to not notice that you aren't wearing one"

As far as I'm concerned, if somebody has an issue with another fan not wearing a mask, he/she should keep his/her mask on.

I'm with you, J.B. I personally have become convinced that masks offer little to no protection in the case of covid viruses. But if someone else thinks they do, then by all means they should feel free to mask up.

I totally disagree with you on that. Just do a saliva spit test. Have you and somebody else face each other 2 feet apart. Have both of you wear masks. Now spit at the other person. Did any saliva get in their mouth with masks on? Now do that same test with neither of you wearing masks. Now spit in that person's mouth. I'm sure they'll get saliva in their mouth.

I have a family that gets sick a lot with colds. My daughter is immunocompromised and used to get sick several times a year while in school. Last year, she went off to college and has been living in the dorms for 2 years. Mask wearing is required at college and she never gets sick anymore. I would also get frequent colds and got a bad one in February 2020. I went almost 2 years without getting another cold, and I'm certain that it's due to mask wearing and social distancing. Last month, our office fully opened up and we had a lot of people in the office for the first time in 18 months. Guess what? I got really sick again one week after the office reopened. Not with Covid, but it just shows that mask wearing does a lot more than just prevent the spread of Covid. There's a boat load of evidence proving that they work. 100% effective, not really, but better than if nobody wore them.
(This post was last modified: 12-30-2021 11:14 AM by J.B..)
12-30-2021 11:12 AM
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82hawk Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-30-2021 11:12 AM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 10:25 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 08:21 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-29-2021 09:24 AM)J.B. Wrote:  So to translate.
UNCW - all fans must wear a mask, except when actively eating or drinking.

Hmmm. Theoretically, maybe. In practice it seems to be more personal preference.
Watch the crowds in the video of any home games this year and it is obvious there is more than a little Kabuki Theater going on.

"You pretend to think that masks stop the spread of covid, and we'll pretend to not notice that you aren't wearing one"

As far as I'm concerned, if somebody has an issue with another fan not wearing a mask, he/she should keep his/her mask on.

I'm with you, J.B. I personally have become convinced that masks offer little to no protection in the case of covid viruses. But if someone else thinks they do, then by all means they should feel free to mask up.

I totally disagree with you on that. Just do a saliva spit test. Have you and somebody else face each other 2 feet apart. Have both of you wear masks. Now spit at the other person. Did any saliva get in their mouth with masks on? Now do that same test with neither of you wearing masks. Now spit in that person's mouth. I'm sure they'll get saliva in their mouth.

I have a family that gets sick a lot with colds. My daughter is immunocompromised and used to get sick several times a year while in school. Last year, she went off to college and has been living in the dorms for 2 years. Mask wearing is required at college and she never gets sick anymore. I would also get frequent colds and got a bad one in February 2020. I went almost 2 years without getting another cold, and I'm certain that it's due to mask wearing and social distancing. Last month, our office fully opened up and we had a lot of people in the office for the first time in 18 months. Guess what? I got really sick again one week after the office reopened. Not with Covid, but it just shows that mask wearing does a lot more than just prevent the spread of Covid. There's a boat load of evidence proving that they work. 100% effective, not really, but better than if nobody wore them.


Ahem, let me interject here. By shear coincidence in the middle of this Covid madness, I just happen to be married to a woman who worked for a company called Mine Safety Appliances out of Pittsburgh. They started out making safety equipment for coal miners.

Her job for over 25 years was to run a lab that tested face masks and all sorts of respirators her company made. When the "masking up" started, she emphatically declared that there was no possible way that these silly cloth masks would do anything to protect anyone based on her 25 years of testing masks that were at a minimum N95 masks. In fact, MSA stopped making N95 masks because they didn't work and the company was being sued regularly.

The makeup up the material itself was inadequate and the fact the masks weren't sealed made them useless for a virus that spreads in the air. Our parents are in their 80's and we told them they were not to venture into areas of risk with the false promise of "mask protection" from this virus. My concern all along was that people who were at risk were placing trust in these masks to protect them. I have no doubt that a whole bunch of people died because they trusted these masks that don't work and nothing has happened to change my opinion.
12-30-2021 03:34 PM
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J.B. Offline
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RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-30-2021 03:34 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 11:12 AM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 10:25 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 08:21 AM)70shawk Wrote:  Hmmm. Theoretically, maybe. In practice it seems to be more personal preference.
Watch the crowds in the video of any home games this year and it is obvious there is more than a little Kabuki Theater going on.

"You pretend to think that masks stop the spread of covid, and we'll pretend to not notice that you aren't wearing one"

As far as I'm concerned, if somebody has an issue with another fan not wearing a mask, he/she should keep his/her mask on.

I'm with you, J.B. I personally have become convinced that masks offer little to no protection in the case of covid viruses. But if someone else thinks they do, then by all means they should feel free to mask up.

I totally disagree with you on that. Just do a saliva spit test. Have you and somebody else face each other 2 feet apart. Have both of you wear masks. Now spit at the other person. Did any saliva get in their mouth with masks on? Now do that same test with neither of you wearing masks. Now spit in that person's mouth. I'm sure they'll get saliva in their mouth.

I have a family that gets sick a lot with colds. My daughter is immunocompromised and used to get sick several times a year while in school. Last year, she went off to college and has been living in the dorms for 2 years. Mask wearing is required at college and she never gets sick anymore. I would also get frequent colds and got a bad one in February 2020. I went almost 2 years without getting another cold, and I'm certain that it's due to mask wearing and social distancing. Last month, our office fully opened up and we had a lot of people in the office for the first time in 18 months. Guess what? I got really sick again one week after the office reopened. Not with Covid, but it just shows that mask wearing does a lot more than just prevent the spread of Covid. There's a boat load of evidence proving that they work. 100% effective, not really, but better than if nobody wore them.


Ahem, let me interject here. By shear coincidence in the middle of this Covid madness, I just happen to be married to a woman who worked for a company called Mine Safety Appliances out of Pittsburgh. They started out making safety equipment for coal miners.

Her job for over 25 years was to run a lab that tested face masks and all sorts of respirators her company made. When the "masking up" started, she emphatically declared that there was no possible way that these silly cloth masks would do anything to protect anyone based on her 25 years of testing masks that were at a minimum N95 masks. In fact, MSA stopped making N95 masks because they didn't work and the company was being sued regularly.

The makeup up the material itself was inadequate and the fact the masks weren't sealed made them useless for a virus that spreads in the air. Our parents are in their 80's and we told them they were not to venture into areas of risk with the false promise of "mask protection" from this virus. My concern all along was that people who were at risk were placing trust in these masks to protect them. I have no doubt that a whole bunch of people died because they trusted these masks that don't work and nothing has happened to change my opinion.

Not going to say that anything you wrote is wrong. There are good masks and bad masks, and I guess the ones she tested were poorly constructed and thus why her job was important. I wear these spandex masks that have done well in tests, but others might say that they don't work. Who knows? Right now, they're recommending these N95 masks with total seals around them. I won't wear them, because I get hot easily and still like to breath real air besides my own breath. I'll take my changes. So far, my family and I (including parents and in-laws) are 22 months Covid free, and we live our lives normally, so we must all be doing something right.

I just don't like when people say "Masks don't work". That gives people the impression that they are 0% effective and work as well as no mask at all. I'd have a hard time believing that virtually all doctors and scientists are wrong when it comes to masks, and that we'd all be better off not wearing them at all right now.
(This post was last modified: 12-30-2021 03:56 PM by J.B..)
12-30-2021 03:55 PM
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Post: #12
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-30-2021 03:55 PM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 03:34 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 11:12 AM)J.B. Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 10:25 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 09:27 AM)J.B. Wrote:  As far as I'm concerned, if somebody has an issue with another fan not wearing a mask, he/she should keep his/her mask on.

I'm with you, J.B. I personally have become convinced that masks offer little to no protection in the case of covid viruses. But if someone else thinks they do, then by all means they should feel free to mask up.

I totally disagree with you on that. Just do a saliva spit test. Have you and somebody else face each other 2 feet apart. Have both of you wear masks. Now spit at the other person. Did any saliva get in their mouth with masks on? Now do that same test with neither of you wearing masks. Now spit in that person's mouth. I'm sure they'll get saliva in their mouth.

I have a family that gets sick a lot with colds. My daughter is immunocompromised and used to get sick several times a year while in school. Last year, she went off to college and has been living in the dorms for 2 years. Mask wearing is required at college and she never gets sick anymore. I would also get frequent colds and got a bad one in February 2020. I went almost 2 years without getting another cold, and I'm certain that it's due to mask wearing and social distancing. Last month, our office fully opened up and we had a lot of people in the office for the first time in 18 months. Guess what? I got really sick again one week after the office reopened. Not with Covid, but it just shows that mask wearing does a lot more than just prevent the spread of Covid. There's a boat load of evidence proving that they work. 100% effective, not really, but better than if nobody wore them.


Ahem, let me interject here. By shear coincidence in the middle of this Covid madness, I just happen to be married to a woman who worked for a company called Mine Safety Appliances out of Pittsburgh. They started out making safety equipment for coal miners.

Her job for over 25 years was to run a lab that tested face masks and all sorts of respirators her company made. When the "masking up" started, she emphatically declared that there was no possible way that these silly cloth masks would do anything to protect anyone based on her 25 years of testing masks that were at a minimum N95 masks. In fact, MSA stopped making N95 masks because they didn't work and the company was being sued regularly.

The makeup up the material itself was inadequate and the fact the masks weren't sealed made them useless for a virus that spreads in the air. Our parents are in their 80's and we told them they were not to venture into areas of risk with the false promise of "mask protection" from this virus. My concern all along was that people who were at risk were placing trust in these masks to protect them. I have no doubt that a whole bunch of people died because they trusted these masks that don't work and nothing has happened to change my opinion.

Not going to say that anything you wrote is wrong. There are good masks and bad masks, and I guess the ones she tested were poorly constructed and thus why her job was important. I wear these spandex masks that have done well in tests, but others might say that they don't work. Who knows? Right now, they're recommending these N95 masks with total seals around them. I won't wear them, because I get hot easily and still like to breath real air besides my own breath. I'll take my changes. So far, my family and I (including parents and in-laws) are 22 months Covid free, and we live our lives normally, so we must all be doing something right.

I just don't like when people say "Masks don't work". That gives people the impression that they are 0% effective and work as well as no mask at all. I'd have a hard time believing that virtually all doctors and scientists are wrong when it comes to masks, and that we'd all be better off not wearing them at all right now.

When I say they don't work I mean they don't do enough to warrant a mandate. If people want to wear them great, if not that is awesome too. Let people who want to assume risk assume risk
12-30-2021 06:45 PM
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70shawk Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(12-30-2021 06:45 PM)solohawks Wrote:  When I say they don't work I mean they don't do enough to warrant a mandate. If people want to wear them great, if not that is awesome too. Let people who want to assume risk assume risk

If the masks work, the masked should feel very safe wearing their masks - even around the unmasked. If the masked feel that 'two masks are better than one', then they should feel free to double-mask themselves and enjoy the game worry-free.
01-03-2022 06:42 AM
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RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(01-03-2022 06:42 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 06:45 PM)solohawks Wrote:  When I say they don't work I mean they don't do enough to warrant a mandate. If people want to wear them great, if not that is awesome too. Let people who want to assume risk assume risk

If the masks work, the masked should feel very safe wearing their masks - even around the unmasked. If the masked feel that 'two masks are better than one', then they should feel free to double-mask themselves and enjoy the game worry-free.
Yes, a double mask on one person is more effective than a single mask.

Also, a single mask on two individuals is more effective than two masks on one individual and no masks on the other.

Reducing transmission of a pathogen is a matter of playing the percentages. There are several small actions that one can take to dramatically improve these percentages. One of them is to wear a mask, which doesn't eliminate risk completely, but is an easy means to reduce risk substantially. Not merely as a means of keeping the wearer safe, but keeping others safe in the event they are an asymptomatic carrier.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in refusing to wear a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society.
01-03-2022 10:46 AM
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Post: #15
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(01-03-2022 10:46 AM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 06:42 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 06:45 PM)solohawks Wrote:  When I say they don't work I mean they don't do enough to warrant a mandate. If people want to wear them great, if not that is awesome too. Let people who want to assume risk assume risk

If the masks work, the masked should feel very safe wearing their masks - even around the unmasked. If the masked feel that 'two masks are better than one', then they should feel free to double-mask themselves and enjoy the game worry-free.
Yes, a double mask on one person is more effective than a single mask.

Also, a single mask on two individuals is more effective than two masks on one individual and no masks on the other.

Reducing transmission of a pathogen is a matter of playing the percentages. There are several small actions that one can take to dramatically improve these percentages. One of them is to wear a mask, which doesn't eliminate risk completely, but is an easy means to reduce risk substantially. Not merely as a means of keeping the wearer safe, but keeping others safe in the event they are an asymptomatic carrier.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in refusing to wear a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society.

Interesting that CNN is now reporting that the silly cloth masks are indeed nothing more than a "face decoration". What you can now acknowledge is that there are people who do their research and know their facts, despite the propoganda spewed daily. And what you are saying IS opinion. You're trying to apply what you believe to be common sense instead of applying science. Covid spreads as an aerosol because it is so minute and weightless it floats in the air. That's why well ventilated airplanes haven't been the cause of any spread. If you put on a mask, unless it is completely sealed, the vast majority of your air intake and output will be where there is the path of least resistance. And since there is greater force where it is squeezing in and out around the open spaces on the sides and nose, you are actually expelling it further with a mask on than if you had no mask at all and were breathing normally. But even if you used a silly cloth mask and sealed it, the weave tightness of those masks has pretty much no affect on the minute virus being expelled or inhaled right through the cloth. And again, a fully sealed cloth mask causes you to inhale and exhale with greater force through the masks than no mask at all, so any minor protection is negated.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in wearing a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society. Part of being a constructive member of society is to be an informed member of society. That is, if you want a free society.
(This post was last modified: 01-04-2022 01:43 PM by 82hawk.)
01-04-2022 12:06 PM
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Post: #16
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(01-04-2022 12:06 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 10:46 AM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 06:42 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 06:45 PM)solohawks Wrote:  When I say they don't work I mean they don't do enough to warrant a mandate. If people want to wear them great, if not that is awesome too. Let people who want to assume risk assume risk

If the masks work, the masked should feel very safe wearing their masks - even around the unmasked. If the masked feel that 'two masks are better than one', then they should feel free to double-mask themselves and enjoy the game worry-free.
Yes, a double mask on one person is more effective than a single mask.

Also, a single mask on two individuals is more effective than two masks on one individual and no masks on the other.

Reducing transmission of a pathogen is a matter of playing the percentages. There are several small actions that one can take to dramatically improve these percentages. One of them is to wear a mask, which doesn't eliminate risk completely, but is an easy means to reduce risk substantially. Not merely as a means of keeping the wearer safe, but keeping others safe in the event they are an asymptomatic carrier.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in refusing to wear a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society.

Interesting that CNN is now reporting that the silly cloth masks are indeed nothing more than a "face decoration". What you can now acknowledge is that there are people who do their research and know their facts, despite the propoganda spewed daily. And what you are saying IS opinion. You're trying to apply what you believe to be common sense instead of applying science. Covid spreads as an aerosol because it is so minute and weightless it floats in the air. That's why well ventilated airplanes haven't been the cause of any spread. If you put on a mask, unless it is completely sealed, the vast majority of your air intake and output will be where there is the path of least resistance. And since there is greater force where it is squeezing in and out around the open spaces on the sides and nose, you are actually expelling it further with a mask on than if you had no mask at all and were breathing normally. But even if you used a silly cloth mask and sealed it, the weave tightness of those masks has pretty much no affect on the minute virus being expelled or inhaled right through the cloth. And again, a fully sealed cloth mask causes you to inhale and exhale with greater force through the masks than no mask at all, so any minor protection is negated.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in wearing a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society. Part of being a constructive member of society is to be an informed member of society. That is, if you want a free society.

If you have any legitimate scientific research that suggests that wearing a mask produces a higher risk of transmission than not wearing a mask, I'd love to see it. Otherwise, nearly every publication I'm seeing, from the CDC to ACGIH to WHO, has said that masking will reduce pathogen spread, even if the individual effectiveness of the masks used vary. So, at best, the support for your claim requires a great deal of signal-boosting to be at the forefront. At worst, you're just spewing propaganda of your own, where half-truths are being simplified past the point of usefulness.

As for the idea of a "free society", this isn't a political forum. But you're clinging to an ideal that doesn't exist. Using claims of "freedom" as justification for anything is the lazy way out.
01-04-2022 02:34 PM
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82hawk Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(01-04-2022 02:34 PM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-04-2022 12:06 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 10:46 AM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 06:42 AM)70shawk Wrote:  
(12-30-2021 06:45 PM)solohawks Wrote:  When I say they don't work I mean they don't do enough to warrant a mandate. If people want to wear them great, if not that is awesome too. Let people who want to assume risk assume risk

If the masks work, the masked should feel very safe wearing their masks - even around the unmasked. If the masked feel that 'two masks are better than one', then they should feel free to double-mask themselves and enjoy the game worry-free.
Yes, a double mask on one person is more effective than a single mask.

Also, a single mask on two individuals is more effective than two masks on one individual and no masks on the other.

Reducing transmission of a pathogen is a matter of playing the percentages. There are several small actions that one can take to dramatically improve these percentages. One of them is to wear a mask, which doesn't eliminate risk completely, but is an easy means to reduce risk substantially. Not merely as a means of keeping the wearer safe, but keeping others safe in the event they are an asymptomatic carrier.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in refusing to wear a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society.

Interesting that CNN is now reporting that the silly cloth masks are indeed nothing more than a "face decoration". What you can now acknowledge is that there are people who do their research and know their facts, despite the propoganda spewed daily. And what you are saying IS opinion. You're trying to apply what you believe to be common sense instead of applying science. Covid spreads as an aerosol because it is so minute and weightless it floats in the air. That's why well ventilated airplanes haven't been the cause of any spread. If you put on a mask, unless it is completely sealed, the vast majority of your air intake and output will be where there is the path of least resistance. And since there is greater force where it is squeezing in and out around the open spaces on the sides and nose, you are actually expelling it further with a mask on than if you had no mask at all and were breathing normally. But even if you used a silly cloth mask and sealed it, the weave tightness of those masks has pretty much no affect on the minute virus being expelled or inhaled right through the cloth. And again, a fully sealed cloth mask causes you to inhale and exhale with greater force through the masks than no mask at all, so any minor protection is negated.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in wearing a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society. Part of being a constructive member of society is to be an informed member of society. That is, if you want a free society.

If you have any legitimate scientific research that suggests that wearing a mask produces a higher risk of transmission than not wearing a mask, I'd love to see it. Otherwise, nearly every publication I'm seeing, from the CDC to ACGIH to WHO, has said that masking will reduce pathogen spread, even if the individual effectiveness of the masks used vary. So, at best, the support for your claim requires a great deal of signal-boosting to be at the forefront. At worst, you're just spewing propaganda of your own, where half-truths are being simplified past the point of usefulness.

As for the idea of a "free society", this isn't a political forum. But you're clinging to an ideal that doesn't exist. Using claims of "freedom" as justification for anything is the lazy way out.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/...21257385v1

Conclusions Mask mandates and use are not associated with slower state-level COVID-19 spread during COVID-19 growth surges.

Additionally, because of protocols that remove quarantine requirements if everyone is wearing a mask in schools, the results of wearing masks has been falsely equated with fewer people testing positive. I'll give you an example of what happened at my daughters school. Our BOE made the decision to start the school year without a mask requirement. Our quarantine rules mandated that if a student tested positive or had symptoms, then they would have to quarantine and miss school and so did any close contacts. The only way to get back in school was to take a covid test and test negative. Our school was overhwelmed with students being forced to quarantine and as a result parents were overwhelming doctors to get a negative covid test to get back in school. So, there was a massive amount of testing which of course produced a bunch of positives.

BUT, there was an out. If the BOE MANDATED masks, students would not have to quarantine at all if they were a close contact(per the CDC). So, our BOE instituted a mask mandate(despite the fact we had no more positives than our surrounding counties with mask mandates). Viola'!, we had fewer positives in a month by almost 80%. THE MASKS WORKED AND STOPPED THE SPREAD! But, that was a flat out lie. All the masks did was remove the "penalty" of forcing kids to stay home, and therefore it cut testing of kids in school to almost zero, since the incentive to get a negative test to return to school was removed. But what "data" did this produce? Well, it made a correlation that wearing masks reduced kids who tested positive in our school by 80%. It gave the false impression(let's call it what it really was, a lie) that masks reduced covid transmission in our schools.

So, even with the numbers falsely inflated by this "masking" vs. quarantine rule, it has been proven that masking has had no impact on covid transmission. And, the moment the government mandates anything using the force of law it is political whether you iike it or not. There is no way to remove the politics from this unless the government gets out of the mandating business.
(This post was last modified: 01-04-2022 05:39 PM by 82hawk.)
01-04-2022 05:21 PM
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jcohen42 Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(01-04-2022 05:21 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(01-04-2022 02:34 PM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-04-2022 12:06 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 10:46 AM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 06:42 AM)70shawk Wrote:  If the masks work, the masked should feel very safe wearing their masks - even around the unmasked. If the masked feel that 'two masks are better than one', then they should feel free to double-mask themselves and enjoy the game worry-free.
Yes, a double mask on one person is more effective than a single mask.

Also, a single mask on two individuals is more effective than two masks on one individual and no masks on the other.

Reducing transmission of a pathogen is a matter of playing the percentages. There are several small actions that one can take to dramatically improve these percentages. One of them is to wear a mask, which doesn't eliminate risk completely, but is an easy means to reduce risk substantially. Not merely as a means of keeping the wearer safe, but keeping others safe in the event they are an asymptomatic carrier.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in refusing to wear a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society.

Interesting that CNN is now reporting that the silly cloth masks are indeed nothing more than a "face decoration". What you can now acknowledge is that there are people who do their research and know their facts, despite the propoganda spewed daily. And what you are saying IS opinion. You're trying to apply what you believe to be common sense instead of applying science. Covid spreads as an aerosol because it is so minute and weightless it floats in the air. That's why well ventilated airplanes haven't been the cause of any spread. If you put on a mask, unless it is completely sealed, the vast majority of your air intake and output will be where there is the path of least resistance. And since there is greater force where it is squeezing in and out around the open spaces on the sides and nose, you are actually expelling it further with a mask on than if you had no mask at all and were breathing normally. But even if you used a silly cloth mask and sealed it, the weave tightness of those masks has pretty much no affect on the minute virus being expelled or inhaled right through the cloth. And again, a fully sealed cloth mask causes you to inhale and exhale with greater force through the masks than no mask at all, so any minor protection is negated.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in wearing a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society. Part of being a constructive member of society is to be an informed member of society. That is, if you want a free society.

If you have any legitimate scientific research that suggests that wearing a mask produces a higher risk of transmission than not wearing a mask, I'd love to see it. Otherwise, nearly every publication I'm seeing, from the CDC to ACGIH to WHO, has said that masking will reduce pathogen spread, even if the individual effectiveness of the masks used vary. So, at best, the support for your claim requires a great deal of signal-boosting to be at the forefront. At worst, you're just spewing propaganda of your own, where half-truths are being simplified past the point of usefulness.

As for the idea of a "free society", this isn't a political forum. But you're clinging to an ideal that doesn't exist. Using claims of "freedom" as justification for anything is the lazy way out.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/...21257385v1

Conclusions Mask mandates and use are not associated with slower state-level COVID-19 spread during COVID-19 growth surges.

Additionally, because of protocols that remove quarantine requirements if everyone is wearing a mask in schools, the results of wearing masks has been falsely equated with fewer people testing positive. I'll give you an example of what happened at my daughters school. Our BOE made the decision to start the school year without a mask requirement. Our quarantine rules mandated that if a student tested positive or had symptoms, then they would have to quarantine and miss school and so did any close contacts. The only way to get back in school was to take a covid test and test negative. Our school was overhwelmed with students being forced to quarantine and as a result parents were overwhelming doctors to get a negative covid test to get back in school. So, there was a massive amount of testing which of course produced a bunch of positives.

BUT, there was an out. If the BOE MANDATED masks, students would not have to quarantine at all if they were a close contact(per the CDC). So, our BOE instituted a mask mandate(despite the fact we had no more positives than our surrounding counties with mask mandates). Viola'!, we had fewer positives in a month by almost 80%. THE MASKS WORKED AND STOPPED THE SPREAD! But, that was a flat out lie. All the masks did was remove the "penalty" of forcing kids to stay home, and therefore it cut testing of kids in school to almost zero, since the incentive to get a negative test to return to school was removed. But what "data" did this produce? Well, it made a correlation that wearing masks reduced kids who tested positive in our school by 80%. It gave the false impression(let's call it what it really was, a lie) that masks reduced covid transmission in our schools.

So, even with the numbers falsely inflated by this "masking" vs. quarantine rule, it has been proven that masking has had no impact on covid transmission. And, the moment the government mandates anything using the force of law it is political whether you iike it or not. There is no way to remove the politics from this unless the government gets out of the mandating business.

From the article you linked: "Mask use predicted lower case growth at low, but not high transmission rates."

Whether or not mask mandates work is a separate discussion. There are many factors at play when addressing transmission, and masks are only one part of the puzzle. If a mandate only results in 70% compliance or a similar rate, then it's not going to accomplish its goal. That doesn't mean that masks are suddenly useless.

You are pretending that masks have no impact. That is false, and has proven to be false time and time again. Are they effective enough to eliminate spread from a carrier in a crowded school environment? No, of course not. But would COVID have spread more easily and more widespread without the mask? 100%.

You keep saying that this is all somehow "proof" that masks don't work. I'm sorry, but that's not how proof works. If you want to say that mask mandates don't work, that's a fine hypothesis and one you can successfully argue for. But "masks have no impact" is misinformation, and you should stop spreading it.
01-05-2022 11:11 AM
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82hawk Offline
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Posts: 8,431
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I Root For: UN CW
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Post: #19
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
(01-05-2022 11:11 AM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-04-2022 05:21 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(01-04-2022 02:34 PM)jcohen42 Wrote:  
(01-04-2022 12:06 PM)82hawk Wrote:  
(01-03-2022 10:46 AM)jcohen42 Wrote:  Yes, a double mask on one person is more effective than a single mask.

Also, a single mask on two individuals is more effective than two masks on one individual and no masks on the other.

Reducing transmission of a pathogen is a matter of playing the percentages. There are several small actions that one can take to dramatically improve these percentages. One of them is to wear a mask, which doesn't eliminate risk completely, but is an easy means to reduce risk substantially. Not merely as a means of keeping the wearer safe, but keeping others safe in the event they are an asymptomatic carrier.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in refusing to wear a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society.

Interesting that CNN is now reporting that the silly cloth masks are indeed nothing more than a "face decoration". What you can now acknowledge is that there are people who do their research and know their facts, despite the propoganda spewed daily. And what you are saying IS opinion. You're trying to apply what you believe to be common sense instead of applying science. Covid spreads as an aerosol because it is so minute and weightless it floats in the air. That's why well ventilated airplanes haven't been the cause of any spread. If you put on a mask, unless it is completely sealed, the vast majority of your air intake and output will be where there is the path of least resistance. And since there is greater force where it is squeezing in and out around the open spaces on the sides and nose, you are actually expelling it further with a mask on than if you had no mask at all and were breathing normally. But even if you used a silly cloth mask and sealed it, the weave tightness of those masks has pretty much no affect on the minute virus being expelled or inhaled right through the cloth. And again, a fully sealed cloth mask causes you to inhale and exhale with greater force through the masks than no mask at all, so any minor protection is negated.

I have not presented any opinions here. These are all facts. Thus, if someone takes pride in wearing a mask, I can only question their interest in being a constructive member of society. Part of being a constructive member of society is to be an informed member of society. That is, if you want a free society.

If you have any legitimate scientific research that suggests that wearing a mask produces a higher risk of transmission than not wearing a mask, I'd love to see it. Otherwise, nearly every publication I'm seeing, from the CDC to ACGIH to WHO, has said that masking will reduce pathogen spread, even if the individual effectiveness of the masks used vary. So, at best, the support for your claim requires a great deal of signal-boosting to be at the forefront. At worst, you're just spewing propaganda of your own, where half-truths are being simplified past the point of usefulness.

As for the idea of a "free society", this isn't a political forum. But you're clinging to an ideal that doesn't exist. Using claims of "freedom" as justification for anything is the lazy way out.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/...21257385v1

Conclusions Mask mandates and use are not associated with slower state-level COVID-19 spread during COVID-19 growth surges.

Additionally, because of protocols that remove quarantine requirements if everyone is wearing a mask in schools, the results of wearing masks has been falsely equated with fewer people testing positive. I'll give you an example of what happened at my daughters school. Our BOE made the decision to start the school year without a mask requirement. Our quarantine rules mandated that if a student tested positive or had symptoms, then they would have to quarantine and miss school and so did any close contacts. The only way to get back in school was to take a covid test and test negative. Our school was overhwelmed with students being forced to quarantine and as a result parents were overwhelming doctors to get a negative covid test to get back in school. So, there was a massive amount of testing which of course produced a bunch of positives.

BUT, there was an out. If the BOE MANDATED masks, students would not have to quarantine at all if they were a close contact(per the CDC). So, our BOE instituted a mask mandate(despite the fact we had no more positives than our surrounding counties with mask mandates). Viola'!, we had fewer positives in a month by almost 80%. THE MASKS WORKED AND STOPPED THE SPREAD! But, that was a flat out lie. All the masks did was remove the "penalty" of forcing kids to stay home, and therefore it cut testing of kids in school to almost zero, since the incentive to get a negative test to return to school was removed. But what "data" did this produce? Well, it made a correlation that wearing masks reduced kids who tested positive in our school by 80%. It gave the false impression(let's call it what it really was, a lie) that masks reduced covid transmission in our schools.

So, even with the numbers falsely inflated by this "masking" vs. quarantine rule, it has been proven that masking has had no impact on covid transmission. And, the moment the government mandates anything using the force of law it is political whether you iike it or not. There is no way to remove the politics from this unless the government gets out of the mandating business.

From the article you linked: "Mask use predicted lower case growth at low, but not high transmission rates."

Whether or not mask mandates work is a separate discussion. There are many factors at play when addressing transmission, and masks are only one part of the puzzle. If a mandate only results in 70% compliance or a similar rate, then it's not going to accomplish its goal. That doesn't mean that masks are suddenly useless.

You are pretending that masks have no impact. That is false, and has proven to be false time and time again. Are they effective enough to eliminate spread from a carrier in a crowded school environment? No, of course not. But would COVID have spread more easily and more widespread without the mask? 100%.

You keep saying that this is all somehow "proof" that masks don't work. I'm sorry, but that's not how proof works. If you want to say that mask mandates don't work, that's a fine hypothesis and one you can successfully argue for. But "masks have no impact" is misinformation, and you should stop spreading it.

I need no more proof than that provided by my wife who tested masks for a living for almost 30 years. Since you don't know her and have no way of knowing if what I said is true or not, I provided proof that false evidence of mask effectiveness has invalidated the data and i've also provided proof that mask mandates have had no affect on spread.

And spare me all the sanctimonious viture signaling that you can't seem to help yourself from spewing. There is no valid or definitive proof that these silly cloth masks have protected anybody from anything, so it is you that needs to stop spreading misinformation. And all you need to do is read the news right now to discover that doctors are confirming that cloth masks are useless. It's all over the news right now. But you hang on to the lies you've been told and have gobbled up wholesale. I understand it's hard to admit you've been lied to and fooled, but you've been lied to and fooled.

We were told from the very start masks didn't work and nothing has changed.

https://wsau.com/2020/07/31/masks-dont-s...the-proof/
(This post was last modified: 01-05-2022 03:35 PM by 82hawk.)
01-05-2022 03:34 PM
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82hawk Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Vaccine requirements for CAA schools
01-05-2022 05:47 PM
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