A most unfortunate situation, I hope they can get it together and not head into a long-term decline.

Certainly every school that plays FBS football is unique, but Hawai'i is more unique than most. If they were forced to drop down or drop football altogether to me it would be a much bigger loss than most G5 programs.

IMO Hawaii football will be fine long term but with short term pain. Recruiting will be difficult for a while due to the current issues but the state will not let the program be demoted or seriously hurt. Once the new stadium is completed and a new coaching staff is on board, Hawaii football will be in good shape.

(12-08-2021 04:12 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-08-2021 03:03 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(12-08-2021 01:38 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-08-2021 01:21 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(12-08-2021 11:01 AM)ArmoredUpKnight Wrote:  Hawaii going to pay for his buyout? I mean, you either catch him red handed or pay the man.

Unless some well-heeled boosters magically appear, a buyout won’t happen. The athletic department lacks the cash after emptying its pockets to get the temporary on-campus stadium built. That’s why I said Matlin and the lawyers are likely looking at whether there’s sufficient evidence of player abuse to support a firing for cause. If there isn’t, I expect Graham to keep his job for at least another season regardless of how many players are unhappy.

As for the Hawaii Bowl, it’s beginning to look like rumors of players skipping practices were overblown and right now it appears the game is on. If so it will be interesting to see whether Memphis wins in a cakewalk or the UH players muster up enough pride to make it a contest.

When I hear players talking about "verbal abuse," those are players I would WANT to hit the portal. They're soft mentally.

There are second hand allegations that some players have been subjected to racial slurs. To be clear, this is only hearsay and NOT confirmed by any authoritative source. But the university is obligated to investigate. There are lines even an "old school" coach cannot cross.

There are lines. But in real life, you do run into people who are rude and who verbally harrass you, in the work place and in the city. So this sounds like just some people who have been worshipped all their life suddenly being criticized (maybe a lot) and not knowing how to handle it.

Four schools in seven years does not sound like a problem with the kids.

That's four reported schools. Rule of thumb, for every reported there are two to four unreported. That suggests it's more like a dozen at this moment going on, or closer to 10%. In many cases we don't hear about incidents, such as some of the stunts Urban Meyer did at Florida until many years later. If you are winning consistently, you tend to hear less about the abuses.

I meant that Graham had been at four schools in seven years as a head coach. That's abnormal, and I think most would see it as a red flag.

(01-11-2022 03:49 PM)UAB Band Dad Wrote:  I meant that Graham had been at four schools in seven years as a head coach. That's abnormal, and I think most would see it as a red flag.

My bad. Misread it.

Agree totally. I'd fire the guy yesterday and eat the contract. Every day he is there is a problem. The other alternative is to replace his assistants directly as AD, then give him a leave and turn the running of the team over to one of the assistants for the year so you don;t have to eat too much of the severance immediately.

From the Hawaii Athletics website:

Todd Graham has resigned as head football coach at the University of Hawai'i. Graham was hired in January 2020 and had just completed the second year of a five-year contract.

"Todd informed me of his decision to resign," said UH Athletics Director David Matlin. "We enjoyed many successes under his leadership even as he faced pandemic conditions, the withdrawal of Aloha Stadium, and the prohibition of any fans for nearly all his time with us. Todd's tireless efforts as a coach have made a positive impact on many student-athletes. We have talked at length, and it is clear he has taken this action so that the football program can thrive moving forward."

The search for the new head coach begins immediately. Graham issued the following statement:

I am grateful to have had the opportunity to serve as the Head Football Coach at the University of Hawai'i for the past two seasons. After much prayer and reflection with my family, I have come to the conclusion that I will step away as head coach of the Rainbow Warriors, with a very heavy heart. I want to give my thanks and appreciation to the players, staff and coaches who persevered through all the challenges of 2020 and 2021. It wasn't easy, but they all fought the good fight and we did things the right way.

Our staff poured our hearts and souls into our players and truly made a difference in their lives. I could not have asked more of their commitment, work ethic and love for our players and football program. But it is clear to me that I must step away and do what is best for me and my family and my health. I honor, value and love all of my players and coaches and I wish you the very best. The University has not asked me to step down. I am leaving solely for my family and my health. We have laid a strong foundation for future success, and I will always be cheering you on!

May God Bless You, Coach Todd Graham

Graham resigned so aside from normal reimbursements and compensation earned, no additional monies will be owed to the coach. He was 11-11 in two seasons with the Rainbow Warriors and qualified for bowl games in both years, defeating Houston 28-14 in the New Mexico Bowl on Christmas Eve in 2020. Hawai'i also qualified for the EasyPost Hawaiʻi Bowl in 2021. This past season, the Rainbow Warriors also upset nationally ranked Fresno State and defeated Wyoming on the road for the first time since 1991.

lol Hawaii qualified for the Hawaii Bowl my ass. They got gifted it because no one wanted to come to Hawaii so they added an extra game so the unqualified Hawaii team could play a home game and allowed the 83 teams that did qualify to have a home.

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  lol Hawaii qualified for the Hawaii Bowl my ass. They got gifted it because no one wanted to come to Hawaii so they added an extra game so the unqualified Hawaii team could play a home game and allowed the 83 teams that did qualify to have a home.

Was UH gifted? Yes.

Was it because no one wanted to come to Hawall? No. It was because one more team qualified to play in a bowl than the number of bowl berths available, and that gave ESPN an excuse to bankroll an extra bowl game to pad its holiday season viewership numbers.

At least UH backed into the 84th berth with six wins. Any other team selected would have had just five.

(01-15-2022 12:54 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  lol Hawaii qualified for the Hawaii Bowl my ass. They got gifted it because no one wanted to come to Hawaii so they added an extra game so the unqualified Hawaii team could play a home game and allowed the 83 teams that did qualify to have a home.

Was UH gifted? Yes.

Was it because no one wanted to come to Hawall? No. It was because one more team qualified to play in a bowl than the number of bowl berths available, and that gave ESPN an excuse to bankroll an extra bowl game to pad its holiday season viewership numbers.

At least UH came into the game with six wins. Any other invitee would have come in with just five.

They were a losing team. A losing team isn't a qualifying team per the rules. Hawaii was not a qualifying team. Period, the end.

(01-15-2022 12:57 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 12:54 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  lol Hawaii qualified for the Hawaii Bowl my ass. They got gifted it because no one wanted to come to Hawaii so they added an extra game so the unqualified Hawaii team could play a home game and allowed the 83 teams that did qualify to have a home.

Was UH gifted? Yes.

Was it because no one wanted to come to Hawall? No. It was because one more team qualified to play in a bowl than the number of bowl berths available, and that gave ESPN an excuse to bankroll an extra bowl game to pad its holiday season viewership numbers.

At least UH came into the game with six wins. Any other invitee would have come in with just five.

They were a losing team. A losing team isn't a qualifying team per the rules. Hawaii was not a qualifying team. Period, the end.

I don’t dispute that they weren’t qualified. I agreed with you that they were gifted.

I disagreed with your explanation for the gift. It had nothing to do with Hawaii being an unattractive bowl destination. The Memphis players were happy to be in Waikiki in December, and I have no doubt Nevada would have preferred joining them to being sent to Detroit. Rather it happened because ESPN saw an opportunity to make more money. Period, the end.

Qualified? These are freaking exhibition games.

Glad to see the Graham walked away. Serious rebuild starts with all the departures. Good luck Rainbow Warriors.

AD should be on the outs as well. Making a bad hire is one thing. Keeping and defending a bad hire is way worse.

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  lol Hawaii qualified for the Hawaii Bowl my ass. They got gifted it because no one wanted to come to Hawaii so they added an extra game so the unqualified Hawaii team could play a home game and allowed the 83 teams that did qualify to have a home.

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  They were a losing team. A losing team isn't a qualifying team per the rules. Hawaii was not a qualifying team. Period, the end.

It may not be what you meant, but it sounds almost like you're saying that the rules weren't followed and Hawai'i was just inserted into the bowl game. That is not the case at all, Hawai'i DID qualify under the pre-existing rules given the circumstances that existed in 2021. From wikipedia "Bowl Eligibility":

1. The team must have at least as many wins as overall losses. Wins against non-Division I teams do not count toward the number of wins.
2. No more than one win against an FCS team may count toward that win total, and only if the FCS team has awarded at least 90% of the scholarships that FCS rules allowed it to award over the last two years.(Currently, that means that wins against Ivy League, Georgetown, Pioneer Football League, and some Northeast Conference teams do not count.) The requirement that the FCS team must have awarded 90% of its allowed scholarships may be waived if a "unique or catastrophic situation" prevented the FCS team from meeting that requirement.
3. A team that has a losing record only because it lost its conference championship game remains eligible for a bowl.

If there are not enough eligible teams to fill all the bowl slots, additional teams may be selected, according to the following priorities, which must be applied in descending order:

1. Teams which would have met the eligibility criteria if not for the fact that they had one win against an FCS team that did not meet the scholarship requirement and no waiver was granted.
2. Teams which played 13 games during the regular season and finished with a 6–7 record. (This criterion normally applies only to Hawaii and some of its home opponents.)
3. Teams in their second year of reclassification from FCS to FBS football.
4. Teams with at least 5 wins and no more than 7 losses, in order of their Academic Progress Rates.

Rutgers also stepped in to save the Gator Bowl when A&M was unable to play, under the fourth rule to be applied when there are not enough eligible teams to fill all the bowl slots. Had Rutgers declined, Cal would have been offered the slot next.

So Hawai'is selection was higher up the chain than Rutgers, or than any of the other 5-7 teams who have qualified for bowl games under this rule since it was put in place in 2012 (Nebraska, Minnesota, San Jose State, Mississippi State, North Texas). Had Hawai'i not already been placed in the Hawai'i Bowl, they would have received the Gator Bowl invitation that went to Rutgers.

(01-15-2022 01:34 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Glad to see the Graham walked away. Serious rebuild starts with all the departures. Good luck Rainbow Warriors.

I am surprised but pleased to see that Graham didn't cling to his contract and Hawai'i can start to move past this situation. Certainly there are still many challenges ahead, I wish you luck as well!

(01-15-2022 10:30 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  lol Hawaii qualified for the Hawaii Bowl my ass. They got gifted it because no one wanted to come to Hawaii so they added an extra game so the unqualified Hawaii team could play a home game and allowed the 83 teams that did qualify to have a home.

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  They were a losing team. A losing team isn't a qualifying team per the rules. Hawaii was not a qualifying team. Period, the end.

It may not be what you meant, but it sounds almost like you're saying that the rules weren't followed and Hawai'i was just inserted into the bowl game. That is not the case at all, Hawai'i DID qualify under the pre-existing rules given the circumstances that existed in 2021. From wikipedia "Bowl Eligibility":

1. The team must have at least as many wins as overall losses. Wins against non-Division I teams do not count toward the number of wins.
2. No more than one win against an FCS team may count toward that win total, and only if the FCS team has awarded at least 90% of the scholarships that FCS rules allowed it to award over the last two years.(Currently, that means that wins against Ivy League, Georgetown, Pioneer Football League, and some Northeast Conference teams do not count.) The requirement that the FCS team must have awarded 90% of its allowed scholarships may be waived if a "unique or catastrophic situation" prevented the FCS team from meeting that requirement.
3. A team that has a losing record only because it lost its conference championship game remains eligible for a bowl.

If there are not enough eligible teams to fill all the bowl slots, additional teams may be selected, according to the following priorities, which must be applied in descending order:

1. Teams which would have met the eligibility criteria if not for the fact that they had one win against an FCS team that did not meet the scholarship requirement and no waiver was granted.
2. Teams which played 13 games during the regular season and finished with a 6–7 record. (This criterion normally applies only to Hawaii and some of its home opponents.)
3. Teams in their second year of reclassification from FCS to FBS football.
4. Teams with at least 5 wins and no more than 7 losses, in order of their Academic Progress Rates.

Rutgers also stepped in to save the Gator Bowl when A&M was unable to play, under the fourth rule to be applied when there are not enough eligible teams to fill all the bowl slots. Had Rutgers declined, Cal would have been offered the slot next.

So Hawai'is selection was higher up the chain than Rutgers, or than any of the other 5-7 teams who have qualified for bowl games under this rule since it was put in place in 2012 (Nebraska, Minnesota, San Jose State, Mississippi State, North Texas). Had Hawai'i not already been placed in the Hawai'i Bowl, they would have received the Gator Bowl invitation that went to Rutgers.

(01-15-2022 01:34 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Glad to see the Graham walked away. Serious rebuild starts with all the departures. Good luck Rainbow Warriors.

I am surprised but pleased to see that Graham didn't cling to his contract and Hawai'i can start to move past this situation. Certainly there are still many challenges ahead, I wish you luck as well!

Hawaii and Rutgers were alternates. They were not qualified teams. Even people who initially said that Hawaii was Bowl eligible and qualified because of 6 wins backed off that.

(01-15-2022 01:34 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Qualified? These are freaking exhibition games.

Glad to see the Graham walked away. Serious rebuild starts with all the departures. Good luck Rainbow Warriors.

There are rules. If you are a losing team you don't deserve to go to a bowl game. The NCAA sees it like that and makes it that it's just in case.

What are odds either June Jones or Rolo come back?

(01-15-2022 10:54 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  What are odds either June Jones or Rolo come back?

with the vaccine status of Rolo don't think he'd be allowed back.

June Jones would be something else. He's actually younger than I thought he was- he's "only" 68(I thought he was mid 70's).

(01-15-2022 10:48 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 10:30 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  lol Hawaii qualified for the Hawaii Bowl my ass. They got gifted it because no one wanted to come to Hawaii so they added an extra game so the unqualified Hawaii team could play a home game and allowed the 83 teams that did qualify to have a home.

(01-15-2022 12:35 AM)stever20 Wrote:  They were a losing team. A losing team isn't a qualifying team per the rules. Hawaii was not a qualifying team. Period, the end.

It may not be what you meant, but it sounds almost like you're saying that the rules weren't followed and Hawai'i was just inserted into the bowl game. That is not the case at all, Hawai'i DID qualify under the pre-existing rules given the circumstances that existed in 2021. From wikipedia "Bowl Eligibility":

1. The team must have at least as many wins as overall losses. Wins against non-Division I teams do not count toward the number of wins.
2. No more than one win against an FCS team may count toward that win total, and only if the FCS team has awarded at least 90% of the scholarships that FCS rules allowed it to award over the last two years.(Currently, that means that wins against Ivy League, Georgetown, Pioneer Football League, and some Northeast Conference teams do not count.) The requirement that the FCS team must have awarded 90% of its allowed scholarships may be waived if a "unique or catastrophic situation" prevented the FCS team from meeting that requirement.
3. A team that has a losing record only because it lost its conference championship game remains eligible for a bowl.

If there are not enough eligible teams to fill all the bowl slots, additional teams may be selected, according to the following priorities, which must be applied in descending order:

1. Teams which would have met the eligibility criteria if not for the fact that they had one win against an FCS team that did not meet the scholarship requirement and no waiver was granted.
2. Teams which played 13 games during the regular season and finished with a 6–7 record. (This criterion normally applies only to Hawaii and some of its home opponents.)
3. Teams in their second year of reclassification from FCS to FBS football.
4. Teams with at least 5 wins and no more than 7 losses, in order of their Academic Progress Rates.

Rutgers also stepped in to save the Gator Bowl when A&M was unable to play, under the fourth rule to be applied when there are not enough eligible teams to fill all the bowl slots. Had Rutgers declined, Cal would have been offered the slot next.

So Hawai'is selection was higher up the chain than Rutgers, or than any of the other 5-7 teams who have qualified for bowl games under this rule since it was put in place in 2012 (Nebraska, Minnesota, San Jose State, Mississippi State, North Texas). Had Hawai'i not already been placed in the Hawai'i Bowl, they would have received the Gator Bowl invitation that went to Rutgers.

(01-15-2022 01:34 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Glad to see the Graham walked away. Serious rebuild starts with all the departures. Good luck Rainbow Warriors.

I am surprised but pleased to see that Graham didn't cling to his contract and Hawai'i can start to move past this situation. Certainly there are still many challenges ahead, I wish you luck as well!

Hawaii and Rutgers were alternates. They were not qualified teams. Even people who initially said that Hawaii was Bowl eligible and qualified because of 6 wins backed off that.

I agree alternates is probably the best term, and via the performance-based rules for selecting alternates first Hawai'i and then Rutgers qualified as bowl-eligible and were thus invited to bowl games. Alternates explains the process of how they got there, but it doesn't change the fact that they did and it wasn't because they were names drawn out of a hat. What did we call Gerald Ford and Suzette Charles after Richard Nixon and Vanessa Williams resigned? They were, respectively, the President of the United States and Miss America.