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Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
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200yrs2late Offline
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Post: #1
Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
ACC NC State Clemson Florida St Louisville Duke UNC Virigina Miami Wake Forest Georgia Tech Rutgers Boston College Pittsburgh UCONN Syracuse South Florida
Big 12 Texas Kansas St Oklahoma St Texas Tech Oklahoma Iowa St Missouri Texas A&M TCU Baylor Kansas Memphis SMU Houston Rice BYU
Big 10 Minnesota Michigan St Penn St Ohio St Michigan Wisconsin Purdue Iowa Illinois Maryland Indiana Cincinnati Northwestern Nebraska Notre Dame Navy
PAC 12 Stanford Oregon Oregon St California Washington Washington St USC Arizona St Colorado Utah UCLA Arizona San Diego St Fresno St Utah St Boise St
SEC Georgia LSU Tennessee Florida Mississippi St Alabama Aurburn Ole Miss Kentucky South Carolina Arkansas Virginia Tech East Carolina West Virginia Vanderbuilt Central Florida
CUSA Charlotte Ohio Marshall Western Kentucky Temple Middle Tennessee Liberty Army UMASS Miami (OH)
SWC UTSA UAB North Texas Texas St Tulsa UL Monroe Tulane Arkansas St Louisiana Louisiana Tech
MAC Akron Bowling Green Buffalo Kent St Toledo Northern Ill. Eastern Michigan Western Michigan Ball St Central Michigan
MWC New Mexico St Wyoming New Mexico Colorado St Air Force San Jose St Nevada UNLV Hawaii UTEP
Sun Belt Coastal Carolina App St Troy Georgia Southern Georgia St South Alabama Florida International Florida Atlantic Old Dominion JMU

Paired with a 12- team playoff. Power 5 conferences get their two highest ranked teams in, and the two highest ranked from the Lower 5 round out the 12 teams. Teams 1-4 receive a first round bye. L5 teams play lowest ranked P5 teams

Two year relegation system where each P5 that ranks last over two year period drops down and each L5 that ranks highest over two years moves up. This would be football only and revenue would be re-distributed along some ratio that allows original P5 to maintain budget and other sports, but also rewards L5. For example if the relegated P5 earned $20m a year for athletics and the L5 earned $5m, it may be $17.5m for the the relegated P5 and $7.5m for the promoted L5. Teams would simply swap conference schedules.
(This post was last modified: 09-22-2021 12:24 PM by 200yrs2late.)
09-22-2021 12:13 PM
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Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
I honestly don’t know why people always do things like this?

If we’re going to go into Fantasy Land, then let’s go fully into Fantasy Land! That’s not go halfway to Fantasy Land.

If you want to put everyone together geographically or whatever, then fully mix it up! Put all the teams that are in the same state together.

I just don’t understand why people go into Fantasy Land, but then ball at that part and say, “Well, forget about that because the Big Ten or the SEC would never go for it.”

Well, no kidding! Of course they wouldn’t go for it! Nobody would ever go for any of these proposals!
09-22-2021 12:37 PM
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The Roach Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 12:13 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  ACC NC State Clemson Florida St Louisville Duke UNC Virigina Miami Wake Forest Georgia Tech Rutgers Boston College Pittsburgh UCONN Syracuse South Florida
Big 12 Texas Kansas St Oklahoma St Texas Tech Oklahoma Iowa St Missouri Texas A&M TCU Baylor Kansas Memphis SMU Houston Rice BYU
Big 10 Minnesota Michigan St Penn St Ohio St Michigan Wisconsin Purdue Iowa Illinois Maryland Indiana Cincinnati Northwestern Nebraska Notre Dame Navy
PAC 12 Stanford Oregon Oregon St California Washington Washington St USC Arizona St Colorado Utah UCLA Arizona San Diego St Fresno St Utah St Boise St
SEC Georgia LSU Tennessee Florida Mississippi St Alabama Aurburn Ole Miss Kentucky South Carolina Arkansas Virginia Tech East Carolina West Virginia Vanderbuilt Central Florida
CUSA Charlotte Ohio Marshall Western Kentucky Temple Middle Tennessee Liberty Army UMASS Miami (OH)
SWC UTSA UAB North Texas Texas St Tulsa UL Monroe Tulane Arkansas St Louisiana Louisiana Tech
MAC Akron Bowling Green Buffalo Kent St Toledo Northern Ill. Eastern Michigan Western Michigan Ball St Central Michigan
MWC New Mexico St Wyoming New Mexico Colorado St Air Force San Jose St Nevada UNLV Hawaii UTEP
Sun Belt Coastal Carolina App St Troy Georgia Southern Georgia St South Alabama Florida International Florida Atlantic Old Dominion JMU

Paired with a 12- team playoff. Power 5 conferences get their two highest ranked teams in, and the two highest ranked from the Lower 5 round out the 12 teams. Teams 1-4 receive a first round bye. L5 teams play lowest ranked P5 teams

Two year relegation system where each P5 that ranks last over two year period drops down and each L5 that ranks highest over two years moves up. This would be football only and revenue would be re-distributed along some ratio that allows original P5 to maintain budget and other sports, but also rewards L5. For example if the relegated P5 earned $20m a year for athletics and the L5 earned $5m, it may be $17.5m for the the relegated P5 and $7.5m for the promoted L5. Teams would simply swap conference schedules.

So Southern Miss drops to FCS or drops football altogether?

Instead of making up conference scenarios, maybe you should take up knitting. At least then you would have something to show for your efforts.
09-22-2021 12:41 PM
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200yrs2late Offline
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RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 12:41 PM)The Roach Wrote:  So Southern Miss drops to FCS or drops football altogether?

Instead of making up conference scenarios, maybe you should take up knitting. At least then you would have something to show for your efforts.

No, that's an oversight. USM can have JMU's spot in the Sunbelt.
09-22-2021 12:51 PM
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200yrs2late Offline
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RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 12:37 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I honestly don’t know why people always do things like this?

If we’re going to go into Fantasy Land, then let’s go fully into Fantasy Land! That’s not go halfway to Fantasy Land.

If you want to put everyone together geographically or whatever, then fully mix it up! Put all the teams that are in the same state together.

I just don’t understand why people go into Fantasy Land, but then ball at that part and say, “Well, forget about that because the Big Ten or the SEC would never go for it.”

Well, no kidding! Of course they wouldn’t go for it! Nobody would ever go for any of these proposals!

Use that common sense you root for and just don't pay attention to the thread then.
09-22-2021 01:10 PM
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Curtisc83 Offline
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RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
Did someone say FLAME!
09-22-2021 01:27 PM
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Schema Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
As an alum of an ACC school, I'll just focus on that part.

It looks like Virginia Tech was stolen away by the SEC and Notre Dame worked through all of their issues regarding being in a conference and with the B1G in general and has decided to join them. I'm also assuming this is either 10 to 15 years from now or else media Grant of Rights have proven to be powerless. Additionally, this would mean that the scheduling agreement between the ACC and Notre Dame has either ended (2037) or been broken by the Irish. Anyway, in response to the Hokies being plucked away and Notre Dame breaking the ACC's collective hearts, the ACC responds by adding Rutgers, UConn, and USF.

I just don't see any reason for that. Nothing against those universities, but what would adding those three accomplish? The likelihood of conferences with 12 or more members still being forced to have divisions in order to host a conference championship game is slim. However, let's say it remains in place and the ACC needs to replace the Hokies with someone to get back to an even number of schools. Perhaps one or two of those schools could be on a plan B list for getting back to 14 schools, but I don't see any reason that the ACC would need to expand to 16 just because we lost Virginia Tech.
09-22-2021 01:28 PM
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200yrs2late Offline
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RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 01:28 PM)Schema Wrote:  As an alum of an ACC school, I'll just focus on that part.

It looks like Virginia Tech was stolen away by the SEC and Notre Dame worked through all of their issues regarding being in a conference and with the B1G in general and has decided to join them. I'm also assuming this is either 10 to 15 years from now or else media Grant of Rights have proven to be powerless. Additionally, this would mean that the scheduling agreement between the ACC and Notre Dame has either ended (2037) or been broken by the Irish. Anyway, in response to the Hokies being plucked away and Notre Dame breaking the ACC's collective hearts, the ACC responds by adding Rutgers, UConn, and USF.

I just don't see any reason for that. Nothing against those universities, but what would adding those three accomplish? The likelihood of conferences with 12 or more members still being forced to have divisions in order to host a conference championship game is slim. However, let's say it remains in place and the ACC needs to replace the Hokies with someone to get back to an even number of schools. Perhaps one or two of those schools could be on a plan B list for getting back to 14 schools, but I don't see any reason that the ACC would need to expand to 16 just because we lost Virginia Tech.

The alignment is more geographic and culture based than anything wile getting to 16-team super-conferences since it seems inevitable that 16 team power conferences are the end goal with ESPN and maybe one other partner controlling the media rights.

When I undid the Texas and Oklahoma move to the SEC, I added schools in similar "college towns" that have a strong football fanbase and tradition to get them back to 16. Yes I'm an ECU fan and I stuck them in the SEC with Va Tech and Central Florida. Partly homerism, but also the "college town" and tradition. Va Tech and ECU would secure eyeballs in all of NC and VA, while stealing some of the recruiting thunder from the ACC. Central Florida doesn't really fit the SEC model, and there is already a Fl SEC school, but their enrollment and market make them a pretty smart add to combat the number of ACC schools in Fl.

Notre Dame belongs with the Big10, we all know it though the scheduling alliance with the ACC has been interesting so far and I like it. I could see them picking the ACC over the Big 10, but not in my "fantasyland". Rutgers, UCONN, and S. Florida are obviously not an equal trade for ND, but again geography-wise they fit and ND hasn't exactly jumped into the ACC relationship with both feet. The Fl schools would object to S. Florida, but honestly who else is more appealing? You could argue Navy, but that left S. Florida on an island without an obvious home. UCONN would be accepted on Basketball pedigree, while Rutgers and S. Florida bring markets and potential in both basketball and football.

It may be in 15-20 years, but eventually we will all realize it doesn't matter to ESPN which schools they pay the money to, or how the conferences are valued against one another when they are controlling the lion's share of media rights anyways. It's six one way, half dozen the other.

Pairing the 16-team super conferences with the 10-team smaller conferences also sets up the possibility of a geographically based relegation system which I think is the only way to create an equitable playing field. The majority of the time the traditional power schools will stay at the top but relegation allows for upward mobility for smaller schools, even if their financial rewards for moving up are relatively small and likelihood of remaining in the P5 is slim.
ACC/CUSA Big12/SWC Big10/MAC PAC12/MWC SEC/Sunbelt

Just for ***** and giggles in the end. I'm recovering from covid and I'm quite bored.
09-22-2021 02:05 PM
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Frank the Tank Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
OP - with apologies, it doesn't make sense.

Putting aside the radical realignment itself, I'll focus on the last paragraph of the post: as we have gone over many times on this board, there won't ever be a promotion/relegation system based on on-the-field performance in college sports. (A de facto promotion/relegation system based on off-the-field branding and financial value is a different story - that's effectively today's conference realignment.) At the P5 level, schools want to be with their institutional peers. The Pac-12 ain't kicking out Cal and taking in San Jose State just because the latter had a couple of hot seasons.
09-22-2021 02:12 PM
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200yrs2late Offline
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RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 02:12 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  OP - with apologies, it doesn't make sense.

Putting aside the radical realignment itself, I'll focus on the last paragraph of the post: as we have gone over many times on this board, there won't ever be a promotion/relegation system based on on-the-field performance in college sports. (A de facto promotion/relegation system based on off-the-field branding and financial value is a different story - that's effectively today's conference realignment.) At the P5 level, schools want to be with their institutional peers. The Pac-12 ain't kicking out Cal and taking in San Jose State just because the latter had a couple of hot seasons.

They don't have to. They simply have to acknowledge that, at least for the next two years, Cal isn't a football peer but San Jose St just might be.

Someone used to blog about a relegation system in the mid-teens and had a pretty advanced methodology. It's an interesting concept and works well with professional football (soccer) in Europe. IMO it provides more equal opportunities for smaller schools while simultaneously offering protection to the traditional college football blue-bloods.
09-22-2021 02:39 PM
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Frank the Tank Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 02:39 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  
(09-22-2021 02:12 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  OP - with apologies, it doesn't make sense.

Putting aside the radical realignment itself, I'll focus on the last paragraph of the post: as we have gone over many times on this board, there won't ever be a promotion/relegation system based on on-the-field performance in college sports. (A de facto promotion/relegation system based on off-the-field branding and financial value is a different story - that's effectively today's conference realignment.) At the P5 level, schools want to be with their institutional peers. The Pac-12 ain't kicking out Cal and taking in San Jose State just because the latter had a couple of hot seasons.

They don't have to. They simply have to acknowledge that, at least for the next two years, Cal isn't a football peer but San Jose St just might be.

Someone used to blog about a relegation system in the mid-teens and had a pretty advanced methodology. It's an interesting concept and works well with professional football (soccer) in Europe. IMO it provides more equal opportunities for smaller schools while simultaneously offering protection to the traditional college football blue-bloods.

But that's the point: it's not about being a *football* peer, but rather an *institutional* peer. Cal is an elite academic institution and even the most valuable football programs in the Pac-12 like USC, UCLA and Oregon would rather play in a league with a Cal that goes 0-12 than a San Jose State that goes 12-0. These are university presidents making these decisions. I know fans don't want to hear and just want to see it all be determined by on-the-field results, but the off-the-field factors simply matter way more as you go up the food chain.

The promotion/relegation system in Europe is in place due to history and the fact that most countries have very few major metro areas compared to the US. There's not even a chance that London doesn't have multiple clubs in the Premier League in any given year. In contrast, the thought that, say, a New York or Los Angeles team could get relegated and the equivalent of the Durham Bulls could take their place would cause the TV networks to break out in hives in the US. It's just not workable, particularly when the US is about the size of continental Europe itself.

It's instructive that as billionaires from the US and Middle East have started buying more European soccer clubs, you saw the attempted formation of the Super League and seeing pushback on the promotion/relegation system overall. I think we'll see Europe ditch promotion/relegation within a generation - with people paying billions of dollars for clubs, there's a point where they can't risk them going from the New York Yankees to the Scranton Wilkes-Barre RailRiders overnight.
09-22-2021 03:12 PM
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BewareThePhog Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
The issue with the original premise is simply that history has unfolded differently. For amusement I’ve created a structure of what I would like to see in terms of conferences and schools in threads long ago. I think that it’d be more fun to watch that setup than the current one, and I wouldn’t be surprised if many here wouldn’t agree.

But that’s not what happened, nor have many other scenarios that may have some fan appeal and/or adherence to traditional rivalries and the like. We’re stuck with what we’ve got. Whether you like it or not, or whether you think it makes sense unfortunately doesn’t matter. Now perhaps I’m taking this too seriously and it was just intended as a “what-if?” to while away the time - that could be, too.
09-22-2021 04:25 PM
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RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 02:05 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  Just for ***** and giggles in the end. I'm recovering from covid and I'm quite bored.

Sorry to hear you are recovering from Covid. I hope you have a full and speedy recovery.
09-22-2021 04:30 PM
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GreenFreakUAB Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 12:41 PM)The Roach Wrote:  
(09-22-2021 12:13 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  ACC NC State Clemson Florida St Louisville Duke UNC Virigina Miami Wake Forest Georgia Tech Rutgers Boston College Pittsburgh UCONN Syracuse South Florida
Big 12 Texas Kansas St Oklahoma St Texas Tech Oklahoma Iowa St Missouri Texas A&M TCU Baylor Kansas Memphis SMU Houston Rice BYU
Big 10 Minnesota Michigan St Penn St Ohio St Michigan Wisconsin Purdue Iowa Illinois Maryland Indiana Cincinnati Northwestern Nebraska Notre Dame Navy
PAC 12 Stanford Oregon Oregon St California Washington Washington St USC Arizona St Colorado Utah UCLA Arizona San Diego St Fresno St Utah St Boise St
SEC Georgia LSU Tennessee Florida Mississippi St Alabama Aurburn Ole Miss Kentucky South Carolina Arkansas Virginia Tech East Carolina West Virginia Vanderbuilt Central Florida
CUSA Charlotte Ohio Marshall Western Kentucky Temple Middle Tennessee Liberty Army UMASS Miami (OH)
SWC UTSA UAB North Texas Texas St Tulsa UL Monroe Tulane Arkansas St Louisiana Louisiana Tech
MAC Akron Bowling Green Buffalo Kent St Toledo Northern Ill. Eastern Michigan Western Michigan Ball St Central Michigan
MWC New Mexico St Wyoming New Mexico Colorado St Air Force San Jose St Nevada UNLV Hawaii UTEP
Sun Belt Coastal Carolina App St Troy Georgia Southern Georgia St South Alabama Florida International Florida Atlantic Old Dominion JMU

Paired with a 12- team playoff. Power 5 conferences get their two highest ranked teams in, and the two highest ranked from the Lower 5 round out the 12 teams. Teams 1-4 receive a first round bye. L5 teams play lowest ranked P5 teams

Two year relegation system where each P5 that ranks last over two year period drops down and each L5 that ranks highest over two years moves up. This would be football only and revenue would be re-distributed along some ratio that allows original P5 to maintain budget and other sports, but also rewards L5. For example if the relegated P5 earned $20m a year for athletics and the L5 earned $5m, it may be $17.5m for the the relegated P5 and $7.5m for the promoted L5. Teams would simply swap conference schedules.

So Southern Miss drops to FCS or drops football altogether?

Instead of making up conference scenarios, maybe you should take up knitting. At least then you would have something to show for your efforts.

...interesting that a Parrothead would miss USM, where Jimmy B got his history degree... 03-drunk

...personally, as a Blazer, I'd love to have USM end up wherever we do - currently AAC looks to be the potential spot... but on the other hand, USM to the Sun Belt makes gobs of sense, and may sweeten the $$$ deal for that conference down the road, hopefully...
09-22-2021 05:45 PM
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200yrs2late Offline
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RE: Flame away, just don't act like it doesn't make sense
(09-22-2021 04:30 PM)Schema Wrote:  
(09-22-2021 02:05 PM)200yrs2late Wrote:  Just for ***** and giggles in the end. I'm recovering from covid and I'm quite bored.

Sorry to hear you are recovering from Covid. I hope you have a full and speedy recovery.
Thanks. I'm second week after 'recovering'. All is well other than the fatigue. 3 hours of manual labor feels like 10 hours used to feel.

Sent from my SM-A516U using Tapatalk
09-22-2021 05:49 PM
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