(09-22-2021 08:17 AM)BeatWestern! Wrote:  Three things the MAC would likely be looking for in expansion to 14 or even 16 is extending its footprint eastward and southward with full sports members, an opportunity to be a multi-bid basketball conference, and an increase to its ESPN contract by doing so.

Consider this 16-team conference broken down by divisions, pods and pairings:

MAC East
ODU JMU
Ohio Marshall

UMass Buffalo
Akron Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

The above might work for Marshall. I would remove UMass and replace them with WKU and rearrange the pods. FWIW: UMass is currently in second place in the current ESPN Bottom Ten Poll. I would guess that ESPN would veto adding UMass. ESPN might give the MAC more money with the new additions?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ny-edition

(09-24-2021 12:37 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  

(09-22-2021 08:17 AM)BeatWestern! Wrote:  Three things the MAC would likely be looking for in expansion to 14 or even 16 is extending its footprint eastward and southward with full sports members, an opportunity to be a multi-bid basketball conference, and an increase to its ESPN contract by doing so.

Consider this 16-team conference broken down by divisions, pods and pairings:

MAC East
ODU JMU
Ohio Marshall

UMass Buffalo
Akron Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

The above might work for Marshall. I would remove UMass and replace them with WKU and rearrange the pods. FWIW: UMass is currently in second place in the current ESPN Bottom Ten Poll. I would guess that ESPN would veto adding UMass. ESPN might give the MAC more money with the new additions?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ny-edition

That poll also has Toledo in the bottom 10.

For the record do not favor the MAC expanding and if they do, a FB only will make financial sense. ESPN is not going to give 2M for each new team as posted in the previous page. NDSU FB only could help the MAC and be ok with 300K for APR from the CFP.

Yes we are unworthy now and underman. The new additional 7 players for transfers will help us to finally get up to 85 scholarships. This time around we are building and recruiting correctly and looking forward to progress, not to mention about 50 million invested in facilities.

Unfortunately being Indy half our schedule was receiving top 25 votes at one time. We have started with Pitt, Boston College, and EMU where the defense did not play well with both NT out and 10 starters from the 2 deep out.

Next up is #17 Coastal. We'll have one RB available for Coastal and probably have to move someone over their. Moving players on the DL just made the communications weak.

Do like the sense of humor in the quote from the bottom 25.

Quote:6. UMass 0-3 Don't look now, but the Minutemen have covered in two straight games. That's practically a winning streak in my eyes, and this week the Minutemen will look to make it three straight covers against Coastal Carolina.

Bottom 25 CBS

(09-24-2021 12:37 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  

(09-22-2021 08:17 AM)BeatWestern! Wrote:  Three things the MAC would likely be looking for in expansion to 14 or even 16 is extending its footprint eastward and southward with full sports members, an opportunity to be a multi-bid basketball conference, and an increase to its ESPN contract by doing so.

Consider this 16-team conference broken down by divisions, pods and pairings:

MAC East
ODU JMU
Ohio Marshall

UMass Buffalo
Akron Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

The above might work for Marshall. I would remove UMass and replace them with WKU and rearrange the pods. FWIW: UMass is currently in second place in the current ESPN Bottom Ten Poll. I would guess that ESPN would veto adding UMass. ESPN might give the MAC more money with the new additions?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ny-edition

Yes, I mentioned this in a post earlier in this thread. If you replace UMass with WKU, then your divisions, pods and pairings would look like this:

MAC East
ODU JMU
WKU Marshall

Akron Buffalo
Ohio Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

(09-24-2021 01:05 PM)BeatWestern! Wrote:  Yes, I mentioned this in a post earlier in this thread. If you replace UMass with WKU, then your divisions, pods and pairings would look like this:

MAC East
ODU JMU
WKU Marshall

Akron Buffalo
Ohio Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

Thanks. That does look interesting. Good job, you should be a consultant for college conferences.

Even if ESPN adds 2 to make it 12M, each core MAC team would lose around 1/3M each in feeding the extra mouths. Looks good, but does not make financial sense.
Round numbers say the CFP without bowl money goes from $15,380,427.86 to 16.5 and ESPN to 12M. (2.115M to 1.781M per team)

(09-24-2021 01:04 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 12:37 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  

(09-22-2021 08:17 AM)BeatWestern! Wrote:  Three things the MAC would likely be looking for in expansion to 14 or even 16 is extending its footprint eastward and southward with full sports members, an opportunity to be a multi-bid basketball conference, and an increase to its ESPN contract by doing so.

Consider this 16-team conference broken down by divisions, pods and pairings:

MAC East
ODU JMU
Ohio Marshall

UMass Buffalo
Akron Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

The above might work for Marshall. I would remove UMass and replace them with WKU and rearrange the pods. FWIW: UMass is currently in second place in the current ESPN Bottom Ten Poll. I would guess that ESPN would veto adding UMass. ESPN might give the MAC more money with the new additions?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ny-edition

That poll also has Toledo in the bottom 10.

For the record do not favor the MAC expanding and if they do, a FB only will make financial sense. ESPN is not going to give 2M for each new team as posted in the previous page. NDSU FB only could help the MAC and be ok with 300K for APR from the CFP.

I think that ESPN will have a lot to say about conference changes. They will be looking for teams that can draw ratings. No offense, but UMASS and NDSU don't move the needle. JMO.

Still like the idea of adding just NDSU as a FB only, but never heard what people think about moving Toledo to the East and rolling with 13.

I would say to add from stripping CUSA & FCS (in order that I'd find better within potential possibilities + within regional reason):

- Marshall
- W Kentucky
- Middle Tenn
- Northern Iowa
- Charlotte
- JMU
- Old Dominion
- Illinois State

? ND State : Too far away, not included. But if that's not much of a problem, would have them at Both Football & BBall -- and at #2 pick.
? SD State : Same reason, but would put just after JMU

(09-23-2021 11:26 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  Would rather have NDSU as they immediately make the MAC better.

I used to think expansion in the East was best, but I agree with this. That's a great football program and a flagship university.

(09-24-2021 01:14 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 01:04 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 12:37 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  

(09-22-2021 08:17 AM)BeatWestern! Wrote:  Three things the MAC would likely be looking for in expansion to 14 or even 16 is extending its footprint eastward and southward with full sports members, an opportunity to be a multi-bid basketball conference, and an increase to its ESPN contract by doing so.

Consider this 16-team conference broken down by divisions, pods and pairings:

MAC East
ODU JMU
Ohio Marshall

UMass Buffalo
Akron Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

The above might work for Marshall. I would remove UMass and replace them with WKU and rearrange the pods. FWIW: UMass is currently in second place in the current ESPN Bottom Ten Poll. I would guess that ESPN would veto adding UMass. ESPN might give the MAC more money with the new additions?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ny-edition

That poll also has Toledo in the bottom 10.

For the record do not favor the MAC expanding and if they do, a FB only will make financial sense. ESPN is not going to give 2M for each new team as posted in the previous page. NDSU FB only could help the MAC and be ok with 300K for APR from the CFP.

I think that ESPN will have a lot to say about conference changes. They will be looking for teams that can draw ratings. No offense, but UMASS and NDSU don't move the needle. JMO.

Winners draw eye balls. NDSU wins big. JMU not far behind.

(09-24-2021 02:13 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  Still like the idea of adding just NDSU as a FB only, but never heard what people think about moving Toledo to the East and rolling with 13.

13 was bad enough as a short term necessity ... it is not tenable as a long term plan. If there was another school that made sense on its own to add to the West, it might be workable.

That might change if NCAA rules change to allow a top two CCG if there are conference schedules with over half of the conference schools, so three regular rivals and five rotating from the balance of the conference becomes possible.

I personally would not mind having Toledo in the East, but I reckon Toledo prefers to be in the West. Indeed, the whole "put Toledo and Bowling Green in the same division" is more for the OTHER MAC schools than for those two schools ... AFAICT, they each like the division they are in.

But it would be risky to add a FB-only and an all-sports member, which can easily enough end up at 13 with a forced add. It should be two full members, or else two FB-only, where each contract only rolls over if both schools continue in the conference.

(09-25-2021 02:55 AM)emu steve Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 01:14 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 01:04 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 12:37 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  

(09-22-2021 08:17 AM)BeatWestern! Wrote:  Three things the MAC would likely be looking for in expansion to 14 or even 16 is extending its footprint eastward and southward with full sports members, an opportunity to be a multi-bid basketball conference, and an increase to its ESPN contract by doing so.

Consider this 16-team conference broken down by divisions, pods and pairings:

MAC East
ODU JMU
Ohio Marshall

UMass Buffalo
Akron Kent St.

MAC West
Miami Ball St.
BGSU Toledo

CMU EMU
WMU NIU

The above might work for Marshall. I would remove UMass and replace them with WKU and rearrange the pods. FWIW: UMass is currently in second place in the current ESPN Bottom Ten Poll. I would guess that ESPN would veto adding UMass. ESPN might give the MAC more money with the new additions?

https://www.espn.com/college-football/st...ny-edition

That poll also has Toledo in the bottom 10.

For the record do not favor the MAC expanding and if they do, a FB only will make financial sense. ESPN is not going to give 2M for each new team as posted in the previous page. NDSU FB only could help the MAC and be ok with 300K for APR from the CFP.

I think that ESPN will have a lot to say about conference changes. They will be looking for teams that can draw ratings. No offense, but UMASS and NDSU don't move the needle. JMO.

Winners draw eye balls. NDSU wins big. JMU not far behind.

Might be true, but name recognition is important. The Marshall Appy game on Thursday night was ranked seventh in the coveted 18-49 demographic with 1,014,000 watching the game. I also believe the Carolina Panthers were playing that night.

From ShowbuzzDaily: https://showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showb...inals.html

(09-24-2021 01:13 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  Even if ESPN adds 2 to make it 12M, each core MAC team would lose around 1/3M each in feeding the extra mouths. Looks good, but does not make financial sense.
Round numbers say the CFP without bowl money goes from $15,380,427.86 to 16.5 and ESPN to 12M. (2.115M to 1.781M per team)

One variable to consider is MAC does not know yet how that CFP money split will be done in the future.

The AAC has made about 40% more than the MAC due to performance to date within the CFP. My guess though in the future conferences like the AAC and MAC will get a base payment with extra for appearances rather than the bowl pool system since they are moving to do away with P5/G5 grouping.

The MAC might not have viable expansion options anyways. CUSA could hold together and invite JMU. WKU, JMU and Marshall could all be off the table.

(09-25-2021 09:18 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  I personally would not mind having Toledo in the East, but I reckon Toledo prefers to be in the West. Indeed, the whole "put Toledo and Bowling Green in the same division" is more for the OTHER MAC schools than for those two schools ... AFAICT, they each like the division they are in.

My sense is Bowling Green prefers the East and a schedule heavy on other Ohio schools. I'm speculating here but Bowling Green might prefer the East Division to the point where our president would regard expansion skeptically if it forced us West again.

My sense is Toledo tolerates the West well enough but would not mind at all moving to a seven-team East to accommodate a western expansion. But I'd be curious to hear from Toledo fans on this.

(09-25-2021 02:55 AM)emu steve Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 01:14 PM)Flat Tire 2 Wrote:  I think that ESPN will have a lot to say about conference changes. They will be looking for teams that can draw ratings. No offense, but UMASS and NDSU don't move the needle. JMO.

Winners draw eye balls. NDSU wins big. JMU not far behind.

Indeed, if you have to pick up teams you pick the best and most proven ones available regardless of where they are located. North Dakota St. has proven its a powerhouse FCS program with staying power.

Matt Brown is saying the SBC will probably just go to 12 and not 14.

https://csnbbs.com/thread-930447.html

CUSA may have told Marshall & ODU that if they have an opening they'll give it to JMU.

(09-26-2021 11:27 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  Matt Brown is saying the SBC will probably just go to 12 and not 14.

https://csnbbs.com/thread-930447.html

CUSA may have told Marshall & ODU that if they have an opening they'll give it to JMU.

Also, ESPN may have "told"{*} them that they'll pay more for the inventory increase from 10 to 12 football members, but the inventory available with 12 is enough and there aren't any more bumps available.

{* Via "media consultants"}

I actually like most of the MAC and wouldn't mind if Marshall went back to the MAC except for one thing....MACTION. Marshall isn't interested in playing multiple games on Tues/Weds nights. It sucks for the actual fan base. It's one of the reasons we left to begin with, and it's amazing to see how much this has killed some of the fan bases in the MAC (NIU for instance.)

I'm not saying you would or even should, but I wouldn't support us going back to the MAC unless we had some sort of special deal where we played at most 1 home game on a Tues/Weds night. Away games are fine I suppose if need be, although part of the reason to go back to the MAC is the close road games we could travel to like we used to. Playing on Tues/Weds nights would limit our ability to travel to away games.

I honestly wish the top teams in the MAC would leave and form a new conference with Marshall and CUSA East. Now that would be awesome. Either way, lots of respect for MAC sports and miss our days in the conference. Sometimes wish we had just stayed, but I think the Tues/Weds games were a big factor then and still are today.

(09-25-2021 09:25 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  

(09-24-2021 01:13 PM)Steve1981 Wrote:  Even if ESPN adds 2 to make it 12M, each core MAC team would lose around 1/3M each in feeding the extra mouths. Looks good, but does not make financial sense.
Round numbers say the CFP without bowl money goes from $15,380,427.86 to 16.5 and ESPN to 12M. (2.115M to 1.781M per team)

One variable to consider is MAC does not know yet how that CFP money split will be done in the future.

The AAC has made about 40% more than the MAC due to performance to date within the CFP. My guess though in the future conferences like the AAC and MAC will get a base payment with extra for appearances rather than the bowl pool system since they are moving to do away with P5/G5 grouping.

The MAC might not have viable expansion options anyways. CUSA could hold together and invite JMU. WKU, JMU and Marshall could all be off the table.

Thought it was the performance, a bit subjective, piece of the revenue share component. Do believe the G5 voted to limit the 1M to the first 10 teams in order to increase the performance pool of the G5 conferences. Any new details are welcome. Think the MAC was around 3rd with the Sunbelt rising and perhaps we are 4th now. We is used loosely as not members but fans. The original formula believe there was a range between 6M and 3.5M but not confident those are the exact ranges. So 500k, 41.7k for each team for a drop or rise in performance pool.

(09-26-2021 10:19 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  I actually like most of the MAC and wouldn't mind if Marshall went back to the MAC except for one thing....MACTION. Marshall isn't interested in playing multiple games on Tues/Weds nights. It sucks for the actual fan base. It's one of the reasons we left to begin with, and it's amazing to see how much this has killed some of the fan bases in the MAC (NIU for instance.)

I'm not saying you would or even should, but I wouldn't support us going back to the MAC unless we had some sort of special deal where we played at most 1 home game on a Tues/Weds night. Away games are fine I suppose if need be, although part of the reason to go back to the MAC is the close road games we could travel to like we used to. Playing on Tues/Weds nights would limit our ability to travel to away games.

I honestly wish the top teams in the MAC would leave and form a new conference with Marshall and CUSA East. Now that would be awesome. Either way, lots of respect for MAC sports and miss our days in the conference. Sometimes wish we had just stayed, but I think the Tues/Weds games were a big factor then and still are today.

I hate to tell you this, but the FunBelt is no different than MACtion. In the Sun Belt if ESPN says you're playing on Tuesday, you'll play on Tuesday.