(09-08-2021 07:58 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-08-2021 02:08 PM)schmolik Wrote:  Big 12 TV Ratings Update:

(All in Millions)
Louisiana at Texas: 2.879 (FOX 4:30p)
Oklahoma at Tulane: 2.526 (ABC noon)

West Virginia at Maryland: 1.350 (ESPN 3:30p)
Stanford vs. Kansas State at Arlington: 0.312 (FS1 noon)

Obviously Texas and Oklahoma were OTA and West Virginia and Kansas State were on cable. But West Virginia and Kansas State played P5 opponents while Texas and Oklahoma played G5's and ESPN is pretty close to ABC or FOX in terms of availability. Texas and Oklahoma doubled West Virginia's viewership and unless there's more UL or Tulane fans than I think those schools did it mostly by themselves while WV's viewership included Maryland's fans. Stanford/Kansas State? It's one week but that's not going to help KSU get into any other conference. The AAC wouldn't want that viewership.

It was FS1. Those ratings are always low, similar to ESPNU.

Last year Penn State-Nebraska got 1.72M on FS1 (11/14 noon). They outdrew TCU-West Virginia on FOX head to head (1.37M).

Last year FS1 got 549K for a 10/24 matchup between Utah State and Boise State.

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college...v-ratings/

Even last year 312K was low. This year that's going to really be low.

Week 2 SMW (Sports Media Watch) Ratings Summary:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...rship-fox/

"For the second-straight week, Ohio State football delivered in the ratings.

Oregon-Ohio State averaged a 4.25 rating and 7.73 million viewers on FOX “Big Noon Saturday” over the weekend, marking the sixth-largest college football audience ever on the network, excluding bowl and conference championship games. The Buckeyes have now played in the top six FOX games and ten of the top 12."

"For the season, it ranks as the third game in just two weeks to top seven million viewers. That surpasses all of last season (two), excluding the bowls and conference championships."

Only one game in Week 2 had over 5 million viewers compared to five in the first week. The next highest were "Washington-Michigan game, which drew a 2.55 and 4.75 million ", Texas A&M-Colorado, 4.50 million, and Iowa-Iowa State game, 3.89M.

Next week I expect Alabama-Florida and Auburn-Penn State to join the 5 million viewers club with Alabama-Florida possibly taking the lead for the season (currently 8.863M).

I had expected better numbers for Air Force/Navy and Utah/BYU with these so called “national fan bases” they keep trumpeting about.

(09-08-2021 07:55 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-07-2021 02:08 PM)bgwisc Wrote:  

(09-07-2021 09:24 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(09-07-2021 09:09 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  This is an example of why I think it will be really close which league gets the better per school payout between the B1G and SEC. Right now, the B1G makes more than the SEC, and the B1G is due to get even more than it is already getting because it will be up for new media contracts in a few short years... The SEC needed to expand to *catch up* to the B1G.

**Credit to Frank the Tank. I'm virtually plagiarizing him right now.

Well, I think that "naturally", the SEC should - without TX and OU - be making more than the B1G. As popular as the B1G is, IIRC, the SEC is even moreso, gets better football TV ratings than the B1G.

IMO, the reason the B1G makes more media money than the SEC - considerably more - right now is because the B1G signed smarter deals in the late 2000s than did the SEC. The 2006-2007 deals that Delany signed, which were for shorter terms and included B1G equity ownership with the creation of the BTN, was a smarter deal than the 2008 deal that the SEC made with ESPN, which was an all-in deal and for a much longer term - IIRC, 15 years compared to the six-year deals the B1G has been signing. That has allowed the B1G to retain ownership and to capitalize on the ever-escalating rise in football rights value, while the SEC has basically been owned by ESPN since 2008 and will be so for the next 12-15 years.

So IMO, while the B1G does make more, and could very well continue to make more than the SEC does after it signs its new 2023 deal even with the new SEC 2023 deal for its old CBS rights, it isn't because the B1G is fundamentally more valuable.

The SEC, even without Texas and OU, is fundamentally more valuable than the B1G. It just signed dumber deals. The bargaining table is just very important. You can fail to realize what you are worth, or realize more than you are worth, with bad or good bargaining.

Well said. Does anyone have insight as to why the SEC choose longer deals, with a single media partner, while also failing to negotiate any equity in the SEC Network? A 9 game conference slate in the B1G also provides more match ups to sell to broadcast partners. Those four decisions seem to be the main reasons the B1G has made more and appears poised to continue to make more (if the projections in Forbes and The Athletic are believed).

I think the question of which conference is "worth more" is complicated. The B1G as a whole has almost 190,000 more students than the SEC. Even with the additions of Texas and Oklahoma, the B1G will still have something like 115k more students a year than the SEC. More students means more alumni, and thus a larger addressable market although you could argue they aren't as fervent college football fans as SEC fans. If the question is which football conference should be worth more, I think it's the SEC without question. Their failure to maximize their value is one that's always confused me. Why make it rain for ESPN without ensuring you're fully compensated?

SEC and ACC bet on long term security. So did the Big 12 and Pac (12 years) Only the Big 10 did shorter deals.

Not taking equity may have been ESPN's idea. Or it may have been a smart play given the decline in cable. The Pac has had a disaster keeping all the equity.

If you look at TV ratings, clearly the SEC is "worth" more. Big 10 has some really big games, but doesn't have the consistency across the lineup. Someone did an average of all the conferences a few years back and while these aren't the exact numbers, it was something like SEC 3.0, Big 10 1.9, Big 12/ACC 1.4, Pac 1.1.

Yeah, FWIW, I didn't mean to say that the SEC should have retained all equity. As you say, the PAC kept all equity in their network and it's been a disaster. To the extent the PAC has made P-level media money, it has been because of the rights it did sell to the networks.

The B1G seems to have hit the sweet spot - they retained half of their network equity for themselves, while the media partner got half. That was the better move than having no equity (like the SEC and ACC) or all of the network equity (like the PAC).

(09-15-2021 05:23 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Week 2 SMW (Sports Media Watch) Ratings Summary:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...rship-fox/

"For the second-straight week, Ohio State football delivered in the ratings.

What surprised me about these numbers is that TAMU vs Colorado beat Iowa vs Iowa State. The latter game involved two top-10 teams, whereas the former did not, and the latter was a much better game, the former was a turgid, low scoring affair.

I guess that's the power of the TAMU brand.

(09-15-2021 07:00 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I had expected better numbers for Air Force/Navy and Utah/BYU with these so called “national fan bases” they keep trumpeting about.

The service academies are IMO massively overrated on these forums in terms of appeal. Maybe I'm biased, but I grew up during a time - the 70s and 80s - when the service academies were regarded, in strictly athletic terms, as the weakest of weak sisters in division I football. The fastest way for a major power to get accused of padding its schedule was to play a service academy, and these games had no appeal at all (I was then and still am also aware that in the distant past, before the 1960s, the situation was very different, with Army and Navy sometimes being national powers, but that was way before my time).

So it continues to surprise me when folks say things like "the AAC must do whatever Navy wants to keep them from leaving", as if Navy is the Texas of the AAC or something. Or say that any conference would want to add Army, because of their putative national appeal and the like.

I love and respect the service academies as institutions, but as athletic entities, I see nowhere near the value that some/many around here seem to. Obviously the Army-Navy game has large, and unique, appeal. But after that?

(09-15-2021 07:14 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 05:23 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Week 2 SMW (Sports Media Watch) Ratings Summary:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...rship-fox/

"For the second-straight week, Ohio State football delivered in the ratings.

What surprised me about these numbers is that TAMU vs Colorado beat Iowa vs Iowa State. The latter game involved two top-10 teams, whereas the former did not, and the latter was a much better game, the former was a turgid, low scoring affair.

I guess that's the power of the TAMU brand.

I think some of that is lead in of the Ohio St game. And also at the end people wanting to be around for the Mets/Yankees 9/11 game.

(09-15-2021 07:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 07:14 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 05:23 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Week 2 SMW (Sports Media Watch) Ratings Summary:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...rship-fox/

"For the second-straight week, Ohio State football delivered in the ratings.

What surprised me about these numbers is that TAMU vs Colorado beat Iowa vs Iowa State. The latter game involved two top-10 teams, whereas the former did not, and the latter was a much better game, the former was a turgid, low scoring affair.

I guess that's the power of the TAMU brand.

I think some of that is lead in of the Ohio St game. And also at the end people wanting to be around for the Mets/Yankees 9/11 game.

A lead-in can matter, but IIRC, the Mets/Yankees game didn't draw all that well, maybe about 2 million viewers? I think the Washington-Michigan game it went head to head with beat it easily, so not sure about that being a factor.

(09-15-2021 07:21 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 07:14 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 05:23 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Week 2 SMW (Sports Media Watch) Ratings Summary:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...rship-fox/

"For the second-straight week, Ohio State football delivered in the ratings.

What surprised me about these numbers is that TAMU vs Colorado beat Iowa vs Iowa State. The latter game involved two top-10 teams, whereas the former did not, and the latter was a much better game, the former was a turgid, low scoring affair.

I guess that's the power of the TAMU brand.

I think some of that is lead in of the Ohio St game. And also at the end people wanting to be around for the Mets/Yankees 9/11 game.

It was a unique week for ABC as the games were 1pm, 4:30pm, and 8pm because of the 9/11 tribute. So fans watching Oregon/Ohio State couldn't immediately switch to Iowa/Iowa State and wound up watching Texas A&M/Colorado and were too lazy to switch back to ABC. Often times FOX starts its late game at 4pm and that hurts them as well. Fans could switch from the noon game to the 3:30pm ABC (or CBS) game. The other factor could be Texas vs. Iowa.

(09-15-2021 07:20 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 07:00 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I had expected better numbers for Air Force/Navy and Utah/BYU with these so called “national fan bases” they keep trumpeting about.

The service academies are IMO massively overrated on these forums in terms of appeal. Maybe I'm biased, but I grew up during a time - the 70s and 80s - when the service academies were regarded, in strictly athletic terms, as the weakest of weak sisters in division I football. The fastest way for a major power to get accused of padding its schedule was to play a service academy, and these games had no appeal at all (I was then and still am also aware that in the distant past, before the 1960s, the situation was very different, with Army and Navy sometimes being national powers, but that was way before my time).

So it continues to surprise me when folks say things like "the AAC must do whatever Navy wants to keep them from leaving", as if Navy is the Texas of the AAC or something. Or say that any conference would want to add Army, because of their putative national appeal and the like.

I love and respect the service academies as institutions, but as athletic entities, I see nowhere near the value that some/many around here seem to. Obviously the Army-Navy game has large, and unique, appeal. But after that?

I had HOPED that AirForce at Navy would push two million, but not EXPECTED.

I started out saying that number is right in line with past ratings...but it's actually worse. Most of the "other two" CiC games have been on CBSSN: Navy's old independent contract and now the AAC-CBSSN contract for games at Navy, the mwc contract for AF allowed some CBSSN pulls even when ESPN was the primary, and Army's independent CBSSN contract. In the past -- 2012-2013 -- CBS pulled up a couple AirForce-Navy games from CBSSN and they did slightly over a million viewers. Air Force at Army got pulled up to CBS in 2014 and did a million-and-a-half viewers.

There was an Army at Air Force in those few years I was looking at that got left on ESPNU at noon...and performed accordingly

Unsurprisingly Alabama-Florida won the week.

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college...v-ratings/

(09-15-2021 07:14 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 05:23 AM)schmolik Wrote:  Week 2 SMW (Sports Media Watch) Ratings Summary:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...rship-fox/

"For the second-straight week, Ohio State football delivered in the ratings.

What surprised me about these numbers is that TAMU vs Colorado beat Iowa vs Iowa State. The latter game involved two top-10 teams, whereas the former did not, and the latter was a much better game, the former was a turgid, low scoring affair.

I guess that's the power of the TAMU brand.

Or maybe the power of having matchups that involve more than one state. Would a ranked Iowa St. vs. a ranked Illinois/Minnesota/Wisconsin do a lot better than Iowa/ISU?

(09-21-2021 11:02 AM)Hokie4Skins Wrote:  Unsurprisingly Alabama-Florida won the week.

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college...v-ratings/

1. SEC vs. SEC (AL-FL)
2. SEC vs. Big 10 (Auburn-PSU)
3. Big 12 vs. Big 10 (OU-NU)
4. Big 10 vs. ACC (MSU-Miami FL)
5. Big 10 vs. Ind (PU-ND)
6. SEC vs. SEC (UGA-USCe)

Big 10 or SEC in all the top 6, although OU was probably the bigger draw vs. NU.

(09-15-2021 07:20 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(09-15-2021 07:00 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I had expected better numbers for Air Force/Navy and Utah/BYU with these so called “national fan bases” they keep trumpeting about.

The service academies are IMO massively overrated on these forums in terms of appeal. Maybe I'm biased, but I grew up during a time - the 70s and 80s - when the service academies were regarded, in strictly athletic terms, as the weakest of weak sisters in division I football. The fastest way for a major power to get accused of padding its schedule was to play a service academy, and these games had no appeal at all (I was then and still am also aware that in the distant past, before the 1960s, the situation was very different, with Army and Navy sometimes being national powers, but that was way before my time).

So it continues to surprise me when folks say things like "the AAC must do whatever Navy wants to keep them from leaving", as if Navy is the Texas of the AAC or something. Or say that any conference would want to add Army, because of their putative national appeal and the like.

I love and respect the service academies as institutions, but as athletic entities, I see nowhere near the value that some/many around here seem to. Obviously the Army-Navy game has large, and unique, appeal. But after that?

I remember as late as the late 90s Army and Navy were playing multiple 1-AA teams a year. And regularly lost to them. For example in 1991 Army alone played Colgate, Harvard and The Citadel. They beat Harvard by one, and lost to The Citadel. Army in fact lost to The Citadel back to back years…

CSTV started showing all the Navy home games in ‘05 and that’s when they took off. Army meanwhile was on ESPN Classic and ESPNU back when ESPNU was basically unavailable outside DirecTV.

Army went to CBS College Sports in ‘09.

Sports Media Watch Week 3 Summary:
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...enn-state/

"Last Saturday’s Alabama-Florida and Auburn-Penn State college football games were the fourth and fifth of the college football season to cross the seven million viewer mark, the most in the first three weeks of play since 2016 (also five). Last season, it took until mid-October before a single game averaged even six million."

"FS1 scored its best performance of the young season with a 0.9 and 1.83 million for Tulsa-Ohio State, up 47% and 57% respectively from 2019 (Iowa-Iowa State: 0.6, 1.17M) and its top game since Penn State-Indiana last October (1.0, 2.07M)."

Not only does FOX get higher viewership from the Big 10, so does FS1. How good was OSU's FS1 number? Two games that directly competed with the game were USC-Washington State (1.58 million on FOX, FS1 actually outdrew the OTA network!) and Florida State-Wake Forest (689K on ESPN, yikes!) Florida State can't even draw 1 million viewers at 3:30pm on ESPN now? Cincinnati-Indiana got 1.68M for a noon game. UCF-Louisville got 1.88M for a Friday night game.

"Rounding out the broadcast network coverage, Purdue-Notre Dame drew a 1.5 and 2.58 million on NBC — down 38% and 40% respectively from the network’s first Notre Dame game last season, against Duke (2.4, 4.32M)."

So Notre Dame's ratings are down from the pandemic year? Not a good sign. Duke is not that more popular than Purdue in football.

(09-22-2021 01:51 PM)schmolik Wrote:  Sports Media Watch Week 3 Summary:
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...enn-state/

"Last Saturday’s Alabama-Florida and Auburn-Penn State college football games were the fourth and fifth of the college football season to cross the seven million viewer mark, the most in the first three weeks of play since 2016 (also five). Last season, it took until mid-October before a single game averaged even six million."

"FS1 scored its best performance of the young season with a 0.9 and 1.83 million for Tulsa-Ohio State, up 47% and 57% respectively from 2019 (Iowa-Iowa State: 0.6, 1.17M) and its top game since Penn State-Indiana last October (1.0, 2.07M)."

Not only does FOX get higher viewership from the Big 10, so does FS1. How good was OSU's FS1 number? Two games that directly competed with the game were USC-Washington State (1.58 million on FOX, FS1 actually outdrew the OTA network!) and Florida State-Wake Forest (689K on ESPN, yikes!) Florida State can't even draw 1 million viewers at 3:30pm on ESPN now? Cincinnati-Indiana got 1.68M for a noon game. UCF-Louisville got 1.88M for a Friday night game.

"Rounding out the broadcast network coverage, Purdue-Notre Dame drew a 1.5 and 2.58 million on NBC — down 38% and 40% respectively from the network’s first Notre Dame game last season, against Duke (2.4, 4.32M)."

So Notre Dame's ratings are down from the pandemic year? Not a good sign. Duke is not that more popular than Purdue in football.

No one gives a damn about Purdue.

The Duke game last year was the opening game of a season that many thought would not happen.

(09-26-2021 09:14 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(09-22-2021 01:51 PM)schmolik Wrote:  Sports Media Watch Week 3 Summary:
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...enn-state/

"Last Saturday’s Alabama-Florida and Auburn-Penn State college football games were the fourth and fifth of the college football season to cross the seven million viewer mark, the most in the first three weeks of play since 2016 (also five). Last season, it took until mid-October before a single game averaged even six million."

"FS1 scored its best performance of the young season with a 0.9 and 1.83 million for Tulsa-Ohio State, up 47% and 57% respectively from 2019 (Iowa-Iowa State: 0.6, 1.17M) and its top game since Penn State-Indiana last October (1.0, 2.07M)."

Not only does FOX get higher viewership from the Big 10, so does FS1. How good was OSU's FS1 number? Two games that directly competed with the game were USC-Washington State (1.58 million on FOX, FS1 actually outdrew the OTA network!) and Florida State-Wake Forest (689K on ESPN, yikes!) Florida State can't even draw 1 million viewers at 3:30pm on ESPN now? Cincinnati-Indiana got 1.68M for a noon game. UCF-Louisville got 1.88M for a Friday night game.

"Rounding out the broadcast network coverage, Purdue-Notre Dame drew a 1.5 and 2.58 million on NBC — down 38% and 40% respectively from the network’s first Notre Dame game last season, against Duke (2.4, 4.32M)."

So Notre Dame's ratings are down from the pandemic year? Not a good sign. Duke is not that more popular than Purdue in football.

No one gives a damn about Purdue.

The Duke game last year was the opening game of a season that many thought would not happen.

How come Chicago wasn't a top market for the Notre Dame-Wisconsin game, TerryD?? I thought the Irish were a huge draw in the Windy City!!!

(09-26-2021 10:12 PM)DawgNBama Wrote:  

(09-26-2021 09:14 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(09-22-2021 01:51 PM)schmolik Wrote:  Sports Media Watch Week 3 Summary:
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/09...enn-state/

"Last Saturday’s Alabama-Florida and Auburn-Penn State college football games were the fourth and fifth of the college football season to cross the seven million viewer mark, the most in the first three weeks of play since 2016 (also five). Last season, it took until mid-October before a single game averaged even six million."

"FS1 scored its best performance of the young season with a 0.9 and 1.83 million for Tulsa-Ohio State, up 47% and 57% respectively from 2019 (Iowa-Iowa State: 0.6, 1.17M) and its top game since Penn State-Indiana last October (1.0, 2.07M)."

Not only does FOX get higher viewership from the Big 10, so does FS1. How good was OSU's FS1 number? Two games that directly competed with the game were USC-Washington State (1.58 million on FOX, FS1 actually outdrew the OTA network!) and Florida State-Wake Forest (689K on ESPN, yikes!) Florida State can't even draw 1 million viewers at 3:30pm on ESPN now? Cincinnati-Indiana got 1.68M for a noon game. UCF-Louisville got 1.88M for a Friday night game.

"Rounding out the broadcast network coverage, Purdue-Notre Dame drew a 1.5 and 2.58 million on NBC — down 38% and 40% respectively from the network’s first Notre Dame game last season, against Duke (2.4, 4.32M)."

So Notre Dame's ratings are down from the pandemic year? Not a good sign. Duke is not that more popular than Purdue in football.

No one gives a damn about Purdue.

The Duke game last year was the opening game of a season that many thought would not happen.

How come Chicago wasn't a top market for the Notre Dame-Wisconsin game, TerryD?? I thought the Irish were a huge draw in the Windy City!!!

Nope. This reveals the truth that not a single ND fan lives in or near Chicago.

You have busted this thing wide open.

You should let the networks in on this Truth. They probably think that ND has fans there.

(I am always amazed that every single time for decades that there is good news about ND, someone will always find the negative in it, without fail. Bravo to you, sir)

Whatever TerryD. I was genuinely curious and surprised that Chicago didn't show up as a top market for the Notre Dame-Wisconsin game, given South Bend's proximity to the Windy City.

(09-27-2021 06:58 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  Whatever TerryD. I was genuinely curious and surprised that Chicago didn't show up as a top market for the Notre Dame-Wisconsin game, given South Bend's proximity to the Windy City.

Whatever, Dawg.

ND beat a ranked Big Ten team by 28 points and had the highest TV ratings in the nation last Saturday, and you focused on that (and did it with some snark, I might add).

South Bend wasn't on that list, either. Another scoop.

Take care.