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Election Update from Arizona
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Bronco'14 Offline
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Post: #3061
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 02:37 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 12:27 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 12:11 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-23-2023 09:18 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Back to one of the very basic points -- maybe it was a poor idea for her to piss away the McCain wing of the party. It was a very close race.
Its not a good idea---but that has nothing to do with why cheating pays. The reality is it doesnt really matter weather the McCainites vote with her or not as long as the other side is cheating. The cheaters are always going to know how many mail in votes are needed after election day---they just need time to "find them".

I don't know how much was due to fraud and how much was due to pissing off the McCain wing. I suspect some of both. I also suspect that if she had not pissed off the McCain voters, the margin would have been too great to cheat--both numerically and because it would be a whole lot harder to get fraudulent votes into the system if you had the McCain machine on your side looking out for you.

The big story of the 2020 and 2022 election cycles is that establishment republicans in key states stood by and allowed democrats to change the rules to make it easier for fraudulent votes to get cast, apparently because they would rather see Joe Biden as president than Donald Trump as head of the republican party.

The RINOs remind me of suicide bombers dying to make futile points—-but with no real hope of victory. They may be able to temporarily derail the ability of Republicans to win—-but the RINOs are essentially done as they no longer have the ability to even win a primary. They will slowly either mellow into obedient Republicans or become non-voters once they figure out the Democrats are even less representative of their views than real conservatives. Democrats don’t give a crap about them at all....and even the dopiest of the McCainiacs will eventually figure that out. I didn’t much care for McCain, especially his later years, but I suspect even he would think the current destructive and divisive policies of the Biden Administration are far too extreme and in need of being stopped.

That's the only shot we have otherwise they'll stay w/ the D's. We may've been too quick to try to rid them of our Party.
04-11-2023 06:59 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Online
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Post: #3062
RE: Election Update from Arizona
Republicans don't really seem to understand the numbers end of elections. Why do pro-lifers waste time and money supporting pro-lifers in NY and New England? They are never going to win because they can't win. Spend your money supporting candidates who can win. Or even support a pro-choice candidate in those areas just to keep a seat out of democrat hands. A couple of pro-choice republican senators from NY or New England would make a huge difference right now.
04-11-2023 08:56 AM
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tanqtonic Offline
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Post: #3063
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 06:59 AM)Bronco14 Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 02:37 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 12:27 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 12:11 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-23-2023 09:18 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  Back to one of the very basic points -- maybe it was a poor idea for her to piss away the McCain wing of the party. It was a very close race.
Its not a good idea---but that has nothing to do with why cheating pays. The reality is it doesnt really matter weather the McCainites vote with her or not as long as the other side is cheating. The cheaters are always going to know how many mail in votes are needed after election day---they just need time to "find them".

I don't know how much was due to fraud and how much was due to pissing off the McCain wing. I suspect some of both. I also suspect that if she had not pissed off the McCain voters, the margin would have been too great to cheat--both numerically and because it would be a whole lot harder to get fraudulent votes into the system if you had the McCain machine on your side looking out for you.

The big story of the 2020 and 2022 election cycles is that establishment republicans in key states stood by and allowed democrats to change the rules to make it easier for fraudulent votes to get cast, apparently because they would rather see Joe Biden as president than Donald Trump as head of the republican party.

The RINOs remind me of suicide bombers dying to make futile points—-but with no real hope of victory. They may be able to temporarily derail the ability of Republicans to win—-but the RINOs are essentially done as they no longer have the ability to even win a primary. They will slowly either mellow into obedient Republicans or become non-voters once they figure out the Democrats are even less representative of their views than real conservatives. Democrats don’t give a crap about them at all....and even the dopiest of the McCainiacs will eventually figure that out. I didn’t much care for McCain, especially his later years, but I suspect even he would think the current destructive and divisive policies of the Biden Administration are far too extreme and in need of being stopped.

That's the only shot we have otherwise they'll stay w/ the D's. We may've been too quick to try to rid them of our Party.

Maybe even not "stay w/ the Dems". I dont think many 'previously main stream Repubs' will vote Biden. The better alternative is, in the face of a toxic candidate bearing the 'R' label will be to simply abstain from a vote. That is marginally better than a complete swing. A complete swing is a -2 ---- a lost vote and a vote gained by the main opposition. An abstention is a -1 --- a lost vote.
04-11-2023 09:24 AM
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tanqtonic Offline
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Post: #3064
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 08:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Republicans don't really seem to understand the numbers end of elections. Why do pro-lifers waste time and money supporting pro-lifers in NY and New England? They are never going to win because they can't win. Spend your money supporting candidates who can win. Or even support a pro-choice candidate in those areas just to keep a seat out of democrat hands. A couple of pro-choice republican senators from NY or New England would make a huge difference right now.

Because both parties are now nothing more than loyalty chants and dogma purity tests.

Your suggestion is great -- it is what both parties did for pretty much all the time I have been alive.

The republican moderates of the NE (and some on the Pacific Rim) are an extinct species due to strict dogma tests, as are the vast majority of democrat moderates of the South, West, and Midwest of yesteryear.
04-11-2023 09:29 AM
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #3065
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 08:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Republicans don't really seem to understand the numbers end of elections. Why do pro-lifers waste time and money supporting pro-lifers in NY and New England? They are never going to win because they can't win. Spend your money supporting candidates who can win. Or even support a pro-choice candidate in those areas just to keep a seat out of democrat hands. A couple of pro-choice republican senators from NY or New England would make a huge difference right now.

They understand. You have McCainiacs voting for Democrats. You have the Lincoln Project campaigning for Democrats. You have those middle of the roader so called Republican RINOs voting with Democrats on key issue after key issue. Some of us have figured out sending RINOs to Washington ends up with the same result as sending Democrats to Washington. I used to be a loyal soldier whenever a RINO was my parties choice—-but after the backstabbing RINO conduct of the last 6 years (its really been longer than that---its just become worse in the last 6 years)—-never again will I cast a vote for a RINO. Not only will I NOT vote for them—-I will vote for their opponent regardless of party affiliation. Im probably a minority---but from what Ive seen the last few years----it actually wont take very many of us to insure another RINO NEVER takes office.
(This post was last modified: 04-11-2023 11:49 AM by Attackcoog.)
04-11-2023 11:11 AM
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Bronco'14 Offline
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Post: #3066
RE: Election Update from Arizona
The Republican Party does support pro-choice candidates; they still lose.
04-11-2023 11:17 AM
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GoodOwl Offline
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Post: #3067
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 08:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Republicans don't really seem to understand the numbers end of elections. Why do pro-lifers waste time and money supporting pro-lifers in NY and New England? They are never going to win because they can't win. Spend your money supporting candidates who can win. Or even support a pro-choice candidate in those areas just to keep a seat out of democrat hands. A couple of pro-choice republican senators from NY or New England would make a huge difference right now.

Quote:15 And Solomon awoke; and, behold, it was a dream. And he came to Jerusalem, and stood before the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and offered up burnt offerings, and offered peace offerings, and made a feast to all his servants.

16 Then came there two women, that were harlots, unto the king, and stood before him.

17 And the one woman said, O my lord, I and this woman dwell in one house; and I was delivered of a child with her in the house.

18 And it came to pass the third day after that I was delivered, that this woman was delivered also: and we were together; there was no stranger with us in the house, save we two in the house.

19 And this woman's child died in the night; because she overlaid it.

20 And she arose at midnight, and took my son from beside me, while thine handmaid slept, and laid it in her bosom, and laid her dead child in my bosom.

21 And when I rose in the morning to give my child suck, behold, it was dead: but when I had considered it in the morning, behold, it was not my son, which I did bear.

22 And the other woman said, Nay; but the living is my son, and the dead is thy son. And this said, No; but the dead is thy son, and the living is my son. Thus they spake before the king.

23 Then said the king, The one saith, This is my son that liveth, and thy son is the dead: and the other saith, Nay; but thy son is the dead, and my son is the living.

24 And the king said, Bring me a sword. And they brought a sword before the king.

25 And the king said, Divide the living child in two, and give half to the one, and half to the other.

26 Then spake the woman whose the living child was unto the king, for her bowels yearned upon her son, and she said, O my lord, give her the living child, and in no wise slay it. But the other said, Let it be neither mine nor thine, but divide it.

27 Then the king answered and said, Give her the living child, and in no wise slay it: she is the mother thereof.

28 And all Israel heard of the judgment which the king had judged; and they feared the king: for they saw that the wisdom of God was in him, to do judgment.


no baby sacrificing, thank you....
04-11-2023 11:19 AM
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tanqtonic Offline
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Post: #3068
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 11:11 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 08:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Republicans don't really seem to understand the numbers end of elections. Why do pro-lifers waste time and money supporting pro-lifers in NY and New England? They are never going to win because they can't win. Spend your money supporting candidates who can win. Or even support a pro-choice candidate in those areas just to keep a seat out of democrat hands. A couple of pro-choice republican senators from NY or New England would make a huge difference right now.

They understand. You have McCainiacs voting for Democrats. You have the Lincoln Project campaigning for Democrats. You have those middle of the roader so called Republican RINOs voting with Democrats on key issue after key issue. Some of us have figured out sending RINOs to Washington ends up with the same result as sending Democrats to Washington. I used to be a loyal soldier whenever a RINO was my parties choice—-but after the backstabbing RINO conduct of the last 6 years (its really been longer than that---its just become worse in the last 6 years)—-never again will I cast a vote for a RINO. Not only will I NOT vote for them—-I will vote for their opponent regardless of party affiliation. Im probably a minority---but from what Ive seen the last few years----it actually wont take very many of us to insure another RINO NEVER takes office.

And conversely, when you piss off a faction as Lake did with the McCain "RINOS", it doesnt take many of *them* to ensure just the exact same outcome as you outline above.
04-11-2023 12:01 PM
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #3069
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 12:01 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 11:11 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(04-11-2023 08:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  Republicans don't really seem to understand the numbers end of elections. Why do pro-lifers waste time and money supporting pro-lifers in NY and New England? They are never going to win because they can't win. Spend your money supporting candidates who can win. Or even support a pro-choice candidate in those areas just to keep a seat out of democrat hands. A couple of pro-choice republican senators from NY or New England would make a huge difference right now.

They understand. You have McCainiacs voting for Democrats. You have the Lincoln Project campaigning for Democrats. You have those middle of the roader so called Republican RINOs voting with Democrats on key issue after key issue. Some of us have figured out sending RINOs to Washington ends up with the same result as sending Democrats to Washington. I used to be a loyal soldier whenever a RINO was my parties choice—-but after the backstabbing RINO conduct of the last 6 years (its really been longer than that---its just become worse in the last 6 years)—-never again will I cast a vote for a RINO. Not only will I NOT vote for them—-I will vote for their opponent regardless of party affiliation. Im probably a minority---but from what Ive seen the last few years----it actually wont take very many of us to insure another RINO NEVER takes office.

And conversely, when you piss off a faction as Lake did with the McCain "RINOS", it doesnt take many of *them* to ensure just the exact same outcome as you outline above.

There are only so many rich country club Republicrats. Which is why stealing the far more numerous working class voters from the Democrats is the most viable long term solution for replacing unreliable RINO voters. Looks like Democrats are probably going to do a lot of winning until Republicans figure that out. That said, I think Republicans are on the right side of far more issues than the Democrats---but we need to stress those kitchen table issues and do a much better job of getting our vote out during election season (using every available legal option including ballot harvesting, mail in voting, and early voting).
(This post was last modified: 04-11-2023 01:44 PM by Attackcoog.)
04-11-2023 12:52 PM
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umbluegray Offline
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Post: #3070
RE: Election Update from Arizona
Just take note that the Dems now have their dogmatic litmus tests...

We're seeing droves of dems deciding to vote for republicans because the radical left has gone too far left.
04-11-2023 04:16 PM
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tanqtonic Offline
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Post: #3071
RE: Election Update from Arizona
(04-11-2023 04:16 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  Just take note that the Dems now have their dogmatic litmus tests...

I mentioned that above, mind you.

"as are the vast majority of democrat moderates of the South, West, and Midwest of yesteryear."
04-11-2023 04:52 PM
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