(08-03-2020 11:11 AM)MU88 Wrote:  I have always maintained that fans of college sports don't care about specific players. If non-scholarship students at Ohio State play non-scholarship students at Michigan, fans will show up. Universities should scrap athletic scholarships completely. Waste of money. Universities should only offer academic scholarships and financial aid. NCAA should require all students must be blindly admitted to University, without any consideration as to athletic ability, gender, race, religion, finances, etc. Students play students. Fans would still show up for Auburn-Alabama, Army-Navy, etc.

I think I understand what you are saying, but you can't say "blindly admitted to University without any consideration as to athletic ability" and then use Army-Navy as an example. There has to be some sort of physical requirement for the academies.

(08-03-2020 11:03 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  The point everyone is forgetting is that college football is not minor league football.

The universities offer tuition, room, board, and books (valued at well over $100,000) in exchange for the services of an athlete.

If players don’t like that arrangement then they shouldn’t agree to play collegiate football. Go play overseas or in some arena league. It’s not Washington State University’s fault that the NFL refuses to invest in its own minor league nor is it their fault that no one else seems to be able to find a way to operate an unaffiliated minor league in the black.

Regarding NIL—that’s between players and the those third parties but these endorsements should not be including the name of the schools or any images or logos owned by the school. All these deals should be ran by the school first and they should have the ability to nix deals that are unsavory (no endorsing strip clubs, underage players shouldn’t endorse alcohol, etc). Those 3rd parties should be issuing 1099s to the athletes so they can claim that income on their taxes.

Don't forget the coaching and training. They are getting exceptional training and facilities. They also get exposure. For basketball, they have always had the European league options. But the exposure, coaching and training in college makes the NBA caliber players more valuable, much like a college education makes a student more valuable while they pass up earning money.

With the changes in the NBA rules, athletes in every sport other than football have paying alternatives to college sports.

(08-03-2020 11:43 AM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 11:11 AM)MU88 Wrote:  I have always maintained that fans of college sports don't care about specific players. If non-scholarship students at Ohio State play non-scholarship students at Michigan, fans will show up. Universities should scrap athletic scholarships completely. Waste of money. Universities should only offer academic scholarships and financial aid. NCAA should require all students must be blindly admitted to University, without any consideration as to athletic ability, gender, race, religion, finances, etc. Students play students. Fans would still show up for Auburn-Alabama, Army-Navy, etc.

I think I understand what you are saying, but you can't say "blindly admitted to University without any consideration as to athletic ability" and then use Army-Navy as an example. There has to be some sort of physical requirement for the academies.

Okay, I can see that. But, my point is that kids should be admitted to University as regular students. If you could not get into UCLA and Notre Dame without athletics, you should not be admitted. No special consideration for athletes. You can only do that with a blind admission process. The academies have their own rules. So be it. They have factors working against them too.

(08-03-2020 12:10 PM)MU88 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 11:43 AM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 11:11 AM)MU88 Wrote:  I have always maintained that fans of college sports don't care about specific players. If non-scholarship students at Ohio State play non-scholarship students at Michigan, fans will show up. Universities should scrap athletic scholarships completely. Waste of money. Universities should only offer academic scholarships and financial aid. NCAA should require all students must be blindly admitted to University, without any consideration as to athletic ability, gender, race, religion, finances, etc. Students play students. Fans would still show up for Auburn-Alabama, Army-Navy, etc.

I think I understand what you are saying, but you can't say "blindly admitted to University without any consideration as to athletic ability" and then use Army-Navy as an example. There has to be some sort of physical requirement for the academies.

Okay, I can see that. But, my point is that kids should be admitted to University as regular students. If you could not get into UCLA and Notre Dame without athletics, you should not be admitted. No special consideration for athletes. You can only do that with a blind admission process. The academies have their own rules. So be it. They have factors working against them too.

Well there are special dispensations for people with special talents, such as musicians. And if you are an athlete, your chances of admission to the Ivy League are drastically improved.

But it does get abused in FBS and Div. I basketball. Not that it wasn't worse in the past.

Keep in mind from the perspective of the athletes this is the initial bid in a potential negotiation. If they have any sense at all they know they are not going to get everything they ask for but you always ask for more than you are willing to accept to make sure you get what you really want. I would not be surprised that things like 50% of the revenue is something you throw in so that you can make sure you get all the stuff you really want/need by slowing allowing the NCAA to chip away at that number but keeping the other stuff.

(08-03-2020 09:48 AM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 09:28 AM)f1do Wrote:  

(08-03-2020 09:18 AM)Soobahk40050 Wrote:  1. I agree that some of these points are worthwhile, especially health costs.

2. Let's play this out:

In theory, this would have to be instituted on a conference level. If it is:

The good is that all of a sudden the PAC-12 can recruit with the best of them. The other conferences would be left behind because why play in the SEC and not earn 50% of the revenue when you can play in the PAC and earn it.

The bad is: The PAC made 32.2 million per school in 2018-2019 year. Half would be 16.1, divided by 85 full scholarships times 12 schools, or 1,020. That's only about $15,784 per player (I know there are other sources of revenue that I am not counting, but I am using this number to make the case).

Meanwhile, the conference itself and therefore the school is only taking in 16.1 million, compared to the SEC/Big 10's 60 million and the Big 12's 38 million.

Suddenly, the PAC-12 is 20 million a year behind the next conferences, and more than 40 million behind the SEC/Big 10.

And so all of a sudden the Big 12 expands with 4 PAC schools. Say its Arizona/Arizona St., USC and UCLA. The Big 10 takes Colorado and Washington or Colorado and Oregon.

The PAC can't rescind this deal. They have to reexpand with Boise, BYU, San Diego St. to have a 9 team conference, but they are still well behind the others schools and not competitive.

Due to low revenues, other sports are being cut. All of a sudden, Title IX issues come into play and now PAC-12 women's softball and basketball are asking for the same thing.

More sports get cut.

Title IX is a thing. Wouldn't schools have to give equal treatment to all sports? How does it work if your sport operates in the red (most programs out there)?

https://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/

If I am reading this correctly, the only schools that make money off football (i.e, more revenue then expenses) in the PAC are the Arizona schools, Washington and Utah?

You are not looking in the right place:
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/

Every team in the Pac-12 in the 2018-2019 year made a profit from football. Washington made $43 million, Oregon $39 million, Utah $34 million, Washington State $23 million and Arizona $21 million, just to to name a few.

Not surprisingly, this "movement" started on the Cal-Berkeley campus. It will eventually get settled. The Pac-12 will survive this crazy period, they own their own network, their contract is up in four years and they will have a better TV deal. It will be entertaining to watch how they arrive at that next contract.

(08-02-2020 08:50 PM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  The establishment had better hope the boycott doesn't spread to the other conferences. The fans aren't going to tune in to watch FCS replacements.

Actually I don't mind FCS football.

The only reason I don't watch it is because FBS is more accessible.

(08-03-2020 11:11 AM)MU88 Wrote:  I have always maintained that fans of college sports don't care about specific players. If non-scholarship students at Ohio State play non-scholarship students at Michigan, fans will show up. Universities should scrap athletic scholarships completely. Waste of money. Universities should only offer academic scholarships and financial aid. NCAA should require all students must be blindly admitted to University, without any consideration as to athletic ability, gender, race, religion, finances, etc. Students play students. Fans would still show up for Auburn-Alabama, Army-Navy, etc.

This.

I hope something comes from all of this but I hope it's not a bending over for these demands. College football has gotten out of hand and I will agree with them on that.

1. Fans need to stop donating so much money to athletic departments. If you want to give money away then give it a church, a scholarship fund, or something that benefits society.

2. Stop watching ESPN. Schools should pay for their own live streams with the absolutely insane tuition that we pay for our kids to study about fuccin gender. ESPN makes insane amounts of money on advertising and has creates these monsters who want to have their pockets lined with gold. (Including the coaches). It makes no sense that football coaches make more than Doctors.

3. Stop giving athletic scholarships. If someone wants to play football then let them play of their own accord. I play football with my boys because it's fun. As does every other person playing in club teams and non-scholarship leagues.

4. Start treating football players like actual students. Half of these guys are basically passed through classes so they can continue to pretend to be a student.

I will never forget sitting in my freshman ENG 101 class. A football player stood up and said EXCUS ME? WHAT IS A WORKS CITED?


I was like wtf? How is this guy in college?