(06-15-2020 11:00 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  . We need a poll

Who does Kaplony/Catdady hate more with the white-hot passion of a thousand burning suns? Syracuse or NCSt

The correct answer is C. The UNC Tar Heels.

(06-15-2020 12:40 PM)Statefan Wrote:  

(06-15-2020 07:33 AM)ColumbusCard Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 05:57 PM)YouPeople Wrote:  State is mediocre as hell but the divisonal lineup doesn't do us any favors. The 2014, 2016 and 2018 National Champs have come from our division.

That excuse would be more believable if you guys werent 6-6 against the Coastal since 2014

In 14 we lost to No. 8 GT (We lost to final ranked 5/8/15/24)
In 15 we lost to no 15 UNC, and an Unranked VT (we lost to final ranked 2/14/15)
In 16 we lost to no 20 Miami (we lost to final ranked 1/8/20/21)
In 17 we lost to final ranked 4 and 6
In 18 we lost to final ranked 1/15/21
It was not until last year in a 4-8 season that we lost to Unranked UNC and GT and lost only to final ranked 2

In the time frame you mention we caught GT with their last great team, UNC with it's last great team, and Miami with it's last "great team". NC State does not have the redundant depth to play four top teams in the span of 8-9 weeks and prevail. We damn sure don't have the depth to play top 10 teams back to back. That's a fact, not an excuse.

So your coaches have failed at an important part of their job for how many decades now?

(06-03-2020 06:59 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 05:57 PM)YouPeople Wrote:  State is mediocre as hell but the divisonal lineup doesn't do us any favors. The 2014, 2016 and 2018 National Champs have come from our division.

And what explains the mediocrity that preceded divisional play being implemented? You don't have a .506 all-time record because of 15 years of divisional play. You don't have no appearances in any top tier bowls because of 15 years of divisional play. You don't have just a single final top 10 ranking all-time because of 15 years of divisional play. You don't have just a single double digit win season all-time because of 15 years of divisional play.

(06-15-2020 12:40 PM)Statefan Wrote:  

(06-15-2020 07:33 AM)ColumbusCard Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 05:57 PM)YouPeople Wrote:  State is mediocre as hell but the divisonal lineup doesn't do us any favors. The 2014, 2016 and 2018 National Champs have come from our division.

That excuse would be more believable if you guys werent 6-6 against the Coastal since 2014

In 14 we lost to No. 8 GT (We lost to final ranked 5/8/15/24)
In 15 we lost to no 15 UNC, and an Unranked VT (we lost to final ranked 2/14/15)
In 16 we lost to no 20 Miami (we lost to final ranked 1/8/20/21)
In 17 we lost to final ranked 4 and 6
In 18 we lost to final ranked 1/15/21
It was not until last year in a 4-8 season that we lost to Unranked UNC and GT and lost only to final ranked 2

In the time frame you mention we caught GT with their last great team, UNC with it's last great team, and Miami with it's last "great team". NC State does not have the redundant depth to play four top teams in the span of 8-9 weeks and prevail. We damn sure don't have the depth to play top 10 teams back to back. That's a fact, not an excuse.

Yes, the fact is you lose to good teams regardless of division, so you cant use being in tbe Atlantic as an excuse for mediocrity when you are mediocre against everyone

In the Big East your average record was 8-5. In the ACC it has fallen to 44-33 or 7.3 - 5.5

Amazingly enough NC State has the same record as you during your time in the ACC 44-33. Of course while you were in the Big East, you didn't have to play Clemson or FSU did you? I'm sure that's not the reason you are on average one win a year worse in the ACC.

(06-15-2020 10:50 PM)Statefan Wrote:  Amazingly enough NC State has the same record as you during your time in the ACC 44-33.

I'm only jumping in to shed light on dubious data. Let's not compare apples and oranges, as including out of conference records is dubious when out of conference P5 matchups since 2014 make up 11 of 24 games for UofL, but only 4 of 24 for NC State.

ACC play since UofL joined the league:
UofL: 26-22 (.500 or better 5 of 6 years)
NC State: 21-27 (.500 or better 2 of 6 years)

I assume both fans bases will tell you they want better and both schools had a year they bottomed out (0-8 in '18 for UofL, 1-7 in '19 for State), but it's not been even production the last six years among the two schools.

(06-16-2020 05:03 PM)CollegeCard Wrote:  

(06-15-2020 10:50 PM)Statefan Wrote:  Amazingly enough NC State has the same record as you during your time in the ACC 44-33.

I'm only jumping in to shed light on dubious data. Let's not compare apples and oranges, as including out of conference records is dubious when out of conference P5 matchups since 2014 make up 11 of 24 games for UofL, but only 4 of 24 for NC State.

ACC play since UofL joined the league:
UofL: 26-22 (.500 or better 5 of 6 years)
NC State: 21-27 (.500 or better 2 of 6 years)

I assume both fans bases will tell you they want better and both schools had a year they bottomed out (0-8 in '18 for UofL, 1-7 in '19 for State), but it's not been even production the last six years among the two schools.

You have non-historic rival UVa as your designated cross over game. UVa is 34-42 over the last 7 years. You other Coastal teams have finished with no better than 8 wins in that span and the one you played have a record of 34-42. So your out of Division slate has been 68-84 these last 7 years.

NC State has it's historic at the throat rival. UNC is 37-39 these last 7 years. But with an 11 win campaign. Our other Coastal foes are 43-34 having caught all but one with winning seasons and one with 11 wins and another with 9. Our out of division slate the last 7 years is 80-71.

Put another way, You have not played a ranked cross division game in the past 7 years and you played the Coastal champ one. State has played Three top 20 ranked Coastal opponents, three of whom won the Coastal. Even UVa in 2018 who finished behind behind Pitt in conference standings, had the most wins in the Coastal

I have no intent to put down Louisville.

Louisville has a much easier draw of cross Division rivals than NC State.

GT has the hardest cross foe - Clemson
Miami has the second hardest - FSU
BC has the third most difficult with VT
State has the fourth most difficult but always the worst luck regarding the second school

Add the average the two best programs in the ACC, with at least the second most difficult cross over slate and you get 2-3 games lost out of the gate. Even if you get one of those taken care of, you have Clemson, FSU, or ND the next week . People forget that when FSU was building their program, they controlled who they played and win. The could schedule a breather.

The disparity between Clemson and the rest of us is such that if Clemson is fully ready and mad, the beating you take will stay with you the next week they will beat you twice.

As they way things are not I think the easiest cross Division permanent rivals are and by easiest I mean the first team has certain advantages over the second - it could be coaching, talent, luck, chip on the shoulder, etc.:

Louisville over UVA
Wake over Duke
Pitt over Syracuse
NCSU over Carolina
VT over BC
FSU over Miami
Clemson over GT

Of course no one really cares for stats. What matters is who much money you can apply to the problem so that you get the best talent in your house. If you are cheap, the results of being cheap show.

The last time I was in Satterfield;s house in Boone, I tried to talk him into coming to State. (You should have seen the cavern that his basement due to the slope of the rock - 18 feet deep).
This was at the time when App had to push Jerry Moore out because he had some players that were misbehaving and App is a defacto "girls" school in many ways and that **** was not tolerated. I talked up State as much as I could. Of course State lets them all get away.

Long story short, Louisville is prepared to spend what it takes to compete and is not in an every ten year fight to get into the AAU. NC State ball players are on short leashes. Hookers and bimbos are not readily available and the young female "boosters" are not as "friendly" as some others. State competes with UNC and Duke, and the Carolina Hurricanes in it's own metro. Louisville is the center and end all be all of western KY and south-side IN. Louisville already has horse money and it has it's billionaires. The University is not elite to the point of turning off people and gives off the image of reconstructed south. There are lots of advantages in Louisville.

NC State will always be no better than Texas A&M was in the SWC or Big12. An NC State exit from the ACC would be healthy but the problem is that NC State is not a southern university, it is Midwestern university constructed like Purdue or Penn State, but with a Southern fan base.

Ideally NC State, VT, GT, and Oklahoma go the Big 10.

GT, NC State, VT, MD, Rutgers, Penn State B10 East
Ohio State, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan, MSU, NW - B10 Central
Oklahaoma, Nebraska, Iowa, Illinois, Wisky, Minnesotta - Big 10 West

ESPN will never allow this

No way NCSt would get invited to the B1G

(06-16-2020 09:17 PM)Statefan Wrote:  The last time I was in Satterfield;s house in Boone, I tried to talk him into coming to State. (You should have seen the cavern that his basement due to the slope of the rock - 18 feet deep).
This was at the time when App had to push Jerry Moore out because he had some players that were misbehaving and App is a defacto "girls" school in many ways and that **** was not tolerated. I talked up State as much as I could. Of course State lets them all get away.

Long story short, Louisville is prepared to spend what it takes to compete and is not in an every ten year fight to get into the AAU. NC State ball players are on short leashes. Hookers and bimbos are not readily available and the young female "boosters" are not as "friendly" as some others. State competes with UNC and Duke, and the Carolina Hurricanes in it's own metro. Louisville is the center and end all be all of western KY and south-side IN. Louisville already has horse money and it has it's billionaires. The University is not elite to the point of turning off people and gives off the image of reconstructed south. There are lots of advantages in Louisville.

NC State will always be no better than Texas A&M was in the SWC or Big12. An NC State exit from the ACC would be healthy but the problem is that NC State is not a southern university, it is Midwestern university constructed like Purdue or Penn State, but with a Southern fan base.

Ideally NC State, VT, GT, and Oklahoma go the Big 10.

GT, NC State, VT, MD, Rutgers, Penn State B10 East
Ohio State, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan, MSU, NW - B10 Central
Oklahaoma, Nebraska, Iowa, Illinois, Wisky, Minnesotta - Big 10 West

ESPN will never allow this

Oklahoma?

(06-16-2020 09:59 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  No way NCSt would get invited to the B1G

Unlike Syracuse, NC State is a graduate research oriented University like other Big 10 schools, but not as large.

What Syracuse has become is a head-scratcher - your NSF R&D is in the 130, and your ARWU rankings are below 650. You must be projecting your long academic slide against State. Was it GT who took your spot in the AAU? The point is, Syracuse is a university in decline so keep your judgement about NC State to yourself.

(06-17-2020 04:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(06-16-2020 09:17 PM)Statefan Wrote:  The last time I was in Satterfield;s house in Boone, I tried to talk him into coming to State. (You should have seen the cavern that his basement due to the slope of the rock - 18 feet deep).
This was at the time when App had to push Jerry Moore out because he had some players that were misbehaving and App is a defacto "girls" school in many ways and that **** was not tolerated. I talked up State as much as I could. Of course State lets them all get away.

Long story short, Louisville is prepared to spend what it takes to compete and is not in an every ten year fight to get into the AAU. NC State ball players are on short leashes. Hookers and bimbos are not readily available and the young female "boosters" are not as "friendly" as some others. State competes with UNC and Duke, and the Carolina Hurricanes in it's own metro. Louisville is the center and end all be all of western KY and south-side IN. Louisville already has horse money and it has it's billionaires. The University is not elite to the point of turning off people and gives off the image of reconstructed south. There are lots of advantages in Louisville.

NC State will always be no better than Texas A&M was in the SWC or Big12. An NC State exit from the ACC would be healthy but the problem is that NC State is not a southern university, it is Midwestern university constructed like Purdue or Penn State, but with a Southern fan base.

Ideally NC State, VT, GT, and Oklahoma go the Big 10.

GT, NC State, VT, MD, Rutgers, Penn State B10 East
Ohio State, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan, MSU, NW - B10 Central
Oklahaoma, Nebraska, Iowa, Illinois, Wisky, Minnesotta - Big 10 West

ESPN will never allow this

Oklahoma?

The Big 10 need help in the west. The closer they get to Texas the better for them. Can OU possibly cheat worse than Ohio State? Remember the took Nebraska knowing that Mary Sue Coleman was about to toss them out of the AAU along with Syracuse.