(04-20-2020 08:27 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 08:11 PM)Itinerant Texan Wrote:  [quote='NMSUPistolPete' pid='16787154' dateline='1587423905']
Well average attendance in the WAC for 2020 is as follows...

Grand Canyon (cap. 7,000) - 6,978 (largest - 7,170 in 2019)
New Mexico State (cap. 12,572) - 6,503 (largest - 10,545 in 1991)
California Baptist (cap. 5,050) - 3,181 (largest - 3,181 in 2020)
Dixie State* (cap. 4,779) - 2,432 (largest - 3,081 in 2014)
Utah Valley (cap. 8,500) - 2,311 (largest - 3,412 in 2018)
Tarleton State* (cap. 2,400) - 1,306 (largest - 2,097 in 2015)
UT Rio Grande Valley (cap. 2,500) - 1,289 (largest - 3,537 in 1990)
Seattle University (cap. 999) - 834 (largest - 4,614 in 2011)
Chicago State (cap. 7,000) - 323 (largest - 1,739 in 1989)

(*) Against D2 competition with regional rivalries.

Dixie State and Tarleton State need to ask how much attendance will grow now being in D1 and in the WAC. Will a new D1 enthusiasm increase fan support? Or, will the tougher competition and mounting losses disenchant fan support over time?
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Tarleton has never done a good job keeping/promoting official records or web maintenance. No way in hades 2,097 is Tarleton's largest attendance, and pretty sure max-MAX capacity is like 3,200, and some change.
But I digress....the real interesting stat would be official attendance average percentage of max capacity. Using your numbers Tarleton would be an average of 54%, NMSU 52%, CBU 63%, GCU 99.6% (Yikes). Especially in the near-term it makes more sense for Tarleton to do a practical upgrade (as wisdomgymrat as been saying) and utilize Dickies arena for big games and challenge tournaments. I have feeling TSU fans would flock to those events in droves just as they did when Football played in Cowboys stadium.

I used the highest documented "average" attendance numbers I could find for Tarleton State basketball. Those highs are season "average" attendance; not single game attendance.

Oh ok gotcha, that makes much more sense.

(04-20-2020 08:26 PM)chrisattsu Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 07:12 PM)gleadley Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 06:05 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  Well average attendance in the WAC for 2020 is as follows...

Grand Canyon (cap. 7,000) - 6,978 (largest - 7,170 in 2019)
New Mexico State (cap. 12,572) - 6,503 (largest - 10,545 in 1991)
California Baptist (cap. 5,050) - 3,181 (largest - 3,181 in 2020)
Dixie State* (cap. 4,779) - 2,432 (largest - 3,081 in 2014)
Utah Valley (cap. 8,500) - 2,311 (largest - 3,412 in 2018)
Tarleton State* (cap. 2,400) - 1,306 (largest - 2,097 in 2015)
UT Rio Grande Valley (cap. 2,500) - 1,289 (largest - 3,537 in 1990)
Seattle University (cap. 999) - 834 (largest - 4,614 in 2011)
Chicago State (cap. 7,000) - 323 (largest - 1,739 in 1989)

(*) Against D2 competition with regional rivalries.

Dixie State and Tarleton State need to ask how much attendance will grow now being in D1 and in the WAC. Will a new D1 enthusiasm increase fan support? Or, will the tougher competition and mounting losses disenchant fan support over time?

Every market is a little different but it looks like both GCU and CBU saw their biggest attendance gains from opening new buildings, not necessarily only going D1. CBU went from 791 to 1499 in attendance (+189.5%) in the first season the CBU Event Center was opened. GCU increased average attendance by 99.2% (+585) and 93.9% (+1103) in the first two seasons after opening the GCU arena.

Both schools saw their next biggest increases in attendance during that first season of D1. CBU bumped from 2290 to 3075 (+34.3%) in Year 1, while GCU saw a jump from 2396 to 4373 (+82.5%) in average attendance. What does that all mean for DSU and TSU? Probably not much, if they don't also have folks out in the community building those bridges and hustling to get eyes on their product. I think those are areas where GCU and CBU have excelled. If nothing else, at least the incoming WACmates have a blueprint.

I think new facilities can only help. People take the old stuff for granted and dont come out. New is bright and shiny, reminds people why they feel in love with it in the first place.

The thing I question about the WAC is how much impact it will have on the Stephenville community and attendance versus our LSC conference mates. Does Seattle or Utah state draw more than West Texas or Angelo State.

All is forgotten if you win.

JUST. WIN. BABY.

Yes, winning solves alot of problems. No doubt about that.

(04-20-2020 08:01 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 07:12 PM)gleadley Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 06:05 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  Well average attendance in the WAC for 2020 is as follows...

Grand Canyon (cap. 7,000) - 6,978 (largest - 7,170 in 2019)
New Mexico State (cap. 12,572) - 6,503 (largest - 10,545 in 1991)
California Baptist (cap. 5,050) - 3,181 (largest - 3,181 in 2020)
Dixie State* (cap. 4,779) - 2,432 (largest - 3,081 in 2014)
Utah Valley (cap. 8,500) - 2,311 (largest - 3,412 in 2018)
Tarleton State* (cap. 2,400) - 1,306 (largest - 2,097 in 2015)
UT Rio Grande Valley (cap. 2,500) - 1,289 (largest - 3,537 in 1990)
Seattle University (cap. 999) - 834 (largest - 4,614 in 2011)
Chicago State (cap. 7,000) - 323 (largest - 1,739 in 1989)

(*) Against D2 competition with regional rivalries.

Dixie State and Tarleton State need to ask how much attendance will grow now being in D1 and in the WAC. Will a new D1 enthusiasm increase fan support? Or, will the tougher competition and mounting losses disenchant fan support over time?

Every market is a little different but it looks like both GCU and CBU saw their biggest attendance gains from opening new buildings, not necessarily only going D1. CBU went from 791 to 1499 in attendance (+189.5%) in the first season the CBU Event Center was opened. GCU increased average attendance by 99.2% (+585) and 93.9% (+1103) in the first two seasons after opening the GCU arena.

Both schools saw their next biggest increases in attendance during that first season of D1. CBU bumped from 2290 to 3075 (+34.3%) in Year 1, while GCU saw a jump from 2396 to 4373 (+82.5%) in average attendance. What does that all mean for DSU and TSU? Probably not much, if they don't also have folks out in the community building those bridges and hustling to get eyes on their product. I think those are areas where GCU and CBU have excelled. If nothing else, at least the incoming WACmates have a blueprint.

Well, both Dixie State and Tarleton State are entering the WAC with existing basketball facilities. So, the fan intrigue of moving to D1 will need to be the driving force to grow in attendance. With both schools participating in football and being public schools, the blueprint will be different than that of GCU and CBU; being non-football, well funded private Christian schools. FCS Football will be the cash cow that funds most of Dixie State's and Tarleton State's athletics; a model closer to what NMSU's operates. I do feel Tarleton State will eventually need to increase to size of Wisdom Gym to fund a healthy basketball program. But other infrastructure projects are probably a higher priority there right now. Tarleton State looks to be banking a lot on its newly renovated football stadium. As a whole, Dixie State's facilities are probably in better sharp than Tarleton State's. And, St. George is have a big surge in growth. So, Dixie State is setup well for entry into the WAC.





With Division I in sight, Dixie State plans more renovations for Trailblazer stadium

At the end of the day, I have to admit Tarleton and Dixie do have alot in common. I think we are a more established athletic program as a whole, only because we've won some things at the D2 level. Having said that, I'm always wary of an up-and-comer, and on paper, they seem ready and eager to make a splash in D1. Who knows, Tarleton/Dixie might end up being a thing as far as rivalries go. I really wish there were some Dixie folks on here to talk shop. I want to know more about their mindset. They'll be coming to Stephenville next season in Football, will be interesting to see how well they travel, and how good their team is.

(04-20-2020 09:22 PM)Itinerant Texan Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 08:01 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 07:12 PM)gleadley Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 06:05 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  Well average attendance in the WAC for 2020 is as follows...

Grand Canyon (cap. 7,000) - 6,978 (largest - 7,170 in 2019)
New Mexico State (cap. 12,572) - 6,503 (largest - 10,545 in 1991)
California Baptist (cap. 5,050) - 3,181 (largest - 3,181 in 2020)
Dixie State* (cap. 4,779) - 2,432 (largest - 3,081 in 2014)
Utah Valley (cap. 8,500) - 2,311 (largest - 3,412 in 2018)
Tarleton State* (cap. 2,400) - 1,306 (largest - 2,097 in 2015)
UT Rio Grande Valley (cap. 2,500) - 1,289 (largest - 3,537 in 1990)
Seattle University (cap. 999) - 834 (largest - 4,614 in 2011)
Chicago State (cap. 7,000) - 323 (largest - 1,739 in 1989)

(*) Against D2 competition with regional rivalries.

Dixie State and Tarleton State need to ask how much attendance will grow now being in D1 and in the WAC. Will a new D1 enthusiasm increase fan support? Or, will the tougher competition and mounting losses disenchant fan support over time?

Every market is a little different but it looks like both GCU and CBU saw their biggest attendance gains from opening new buildings, not necessarily only going D1. CBU went from 791 to 1499 in attendance (+189.5%) in the first season the CBU Event Center was opened. GCU increased average attendance by 99.2% (+585) and 93.9% (+1103) in the first two seasons after opening the GCU arena.

Both schools saw their next biggest increases in attendance during that first season of D1. CBU bumped from 2290 to 3075 (+34.3%) in Year 1, while GCU saw a jump from 2396 to 4373 (+82.5%) in average attendance. What does that all mean for DSU and TSU? Probably not much, if they don't also have folks out in the community building those bridges and hustling to get eyes on their product. I think those are areas where GCU and CBU have excelled. If nothing else, at least the incoming WACmates have a blueprint.

Well, both Dixie State and Tarleton State are entering the WAC with existing basketball facilities. So, the fan intrigue of moving to D1 will need to be the driving force to grow in attendance. With both schools participating in football and being public schools, the blueprint will be different than that of GCU and CBU; being non-football, well funded private Christian schools. FCS Football will be the cash cow that funds most of Dixie State's and Tarleton State's athletics; a model closer to what NMSU's operates. I do feel Tarleton State will eventually need to increase to size of Wisdom Gym to fund a healthy basketball program. But other infrastructure projects are probably a higher priority there right now. Tarleton State looks to be banking a lot on its newly renovated football stadium. As a whole, Dixie State's facilities are probably in better sharp than Tarleton State's. And, St. George is have a big surge in growth. So, Dixie State is setup well for entry into the WAC.





With Division I in sight, Dixie State plans more renovations for Trailblazer stadium

At the end of the day, I have to admit Tarleton and Dixie do have alot in common. I think we are a more established athletic program as a whole, only because we've won some things at the D2 level. Having said that, I'm always wary of an up-and-comer, and on paper, they seem ready and eager to make a splash in D1. Who knows, Tarleton/Dixie might end up being a thing as far as rivalries go. I really wish there were some Dixie folks on here to talk shop. I want to know more about their mindset. They'll be coming to Stephenville next season in Football, will be interesting to see how well they travel, and how good their team is.

I agree with you. I hope we get some Dixie posters. I'd like to get their POV. Most on this board thought Dixie had a big advantage over Tarleton coming into D1, but the Tarleton posters have filled us all in the on the history of Tarleton athletics.

I suspect NMSU will schedule Tarleton in the near future for a FB game. We already have Dixie on a future schedule.

(04-21-2020 02:23 PM)PojoaquePosse Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 09:22 PM)Itinerant Texan Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 08:01 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 07:12 PM)gleadley Wrote:  

(04-20-2020 06:05 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  Well average attendance in the WAC for 2020 is as follows...

Grand Canyon (cap. 7,000) - 6,978 (largest - 7,170 in 2019)
New Mexico State (cap. 12,572) - 6,503 (largest - 10,545 in 1991)
California Baptist (cap. 5,050) - 3,181 (largest - 3,181 in 2020)
Dixie State* (cap. 4,779) - 2,432 (largest - 3,081 in 2014)
Utah Valley (cap. 8,500) - 2,311 (largest - 3,412 in 2018)
Tarleton State* (cap. 2,400) - 1,306 (largest - 2,097 in 2015)
UT Rio Grande Valley (cap. 2,500) - 1,289 (largest - 3,537 in 1990)
Seattle University (cap. 999) - 834 (largest - 4,614 in 2011)
Chicago State (cap. 7,000) - 323 (largest - 1,739 in 1989)

(*) Against D2 competition with regional rivalries.

Dixie State and Tarleton State need to ask how much attendance will grow now being in D1 and in the WAC. Will a new D1 enthusiasm increase fan support? Or, will the tougher competition and mounting losses disenchant fan support over time?

Every market is a little different but it looks like both GCU and CBU saw their biggest attendance gains from opening new buildings, not necessarily only going D1. CBU went from 791 to 1499 in attendance (+189.5%) in the first season the CBU Event Center was opened. GCU increased average attendance by 99.2% (+585) and 93.9% (+1103) in the first two seasons after opening the GCU arena.

Both schools saw their next biggest increases in attendance during that first season of D1. CBU bumped from 2290 to 3075 (+34.3%) in Year 1, while GCU saw a jump from 2396 to 4373 (+82.5%) in average attendance. What does that all mean for DSU and TSU? Probably not much, if they don't also have folks out in the community building those bridges and hustling to get eyes on their product. I think those are areas where GCU and CBU have excelled. If nothing else, at least the incoming WACmates have a blueprint.

Well, both Dixie State and Tarleton State are entering the WAC with existing basketball facilities. So, the fan intrigue of moving to D1 will need to be the driving force to grow in attendance. With both schools participating in football and being public schools, the blueprint will be different than that of GCU and CBU; being non-football, well funded private Christian schools. FCS Football will be the cash cow that funds most of Dixie State's and Tarleton State's athletics; a model closer to what NMSU's operates. I do feel Tarleton State will eventually need to increase to size of Wisdom Gym to fund a healthy basketball program. But other infrastructure projects are probably a higher priority there right now. Tarleton State looks to be banking a lot on its newly renovated football stadium. As a whole, Dixie State's facilities are probably in better sharp than Tarleton State's. And, St. George is have a big surge in growth. So, Dixie State is setup well for entry into the WAC.





With Division I in sight, Dixie State plans more renovations for Trailblazer stadium

At the end of the day, I have to admit Tarleton and Dixie do have alot in common. I think we are a more established athletic program as a whole, only because we've won some things at the D2 level. Having said that, I'm always wary of an up-and-comer, and on paper, they seem ready and eager to make a splash in D1. Who knows, Tarleton/Dixie might end up being a thing as far as rivalries go. I really wish there were some Dixie folks on here to talk shop. I want to know more about their mindset. They'll be coming to Stephenville next season in Football, will be interesting to see how well they travel, and how good their team is.

I agree with you. I hope we get some Dixie posters. I'd like to get their POV. Most on this board thought Dixie had a big advantage over Tarleton coming into D1, but the Tarleton posters have filled us all in the on the history of Tarleton athletics.

I suspect NMSU will schedule Tarleton in the near future for a FB game. We already have Dixie on a future schedule.

The earliest we could schedule them is 2022. Still need an FCS game to complete that schedule.

For those of you talking about Tareltons gym size and our need for a new facility, I present you with this video of our 2014 televised game against Kingsville.

We dont have a large arena like NMSU, we dont have razzle like GCU but we have spirit.

As GymRat noted, our student section lines on the line and is regularly in the opposing teams ear, back pocket and eventually their head.




https://vimeo.com/410650248?fbclid=IwAR3...SMjdPZYP_I

Has Tarleton State ever had a D1 team play at Wisdom Gym? I suspect Tarleton State will have a hard time getting D1 programs to play in their gym this coming season. So, Tarleton will be on the road a lot if it wants to meet the NCAA D1 transition criteria. I don't think Tarleton State will be allowed to schedule more than four D2 games within their first D1 (WAC) season. A typical D1 season consists of 28-30 regular season games. So, if Tarleton plays four D2 home games and sixteen WAC conference games (eight at home), That means BCG will need to coax a few D1 programs to come to Stephenville. Or the Texans will be playing on the road a lot initial. Because of COVID19 and possibly limited plane travel, BCG will probably try to schedule mostly SLC and SWAC schools; with bigger conferences (C-USA, SBC, Big XII) expecting Tarleton State to travel to their arena. It is possible NMSU could be the strongest D1 team Texan fans get to see in their gym all season; baring any dramatic improvement from some of the other WAC schools.

(04-22-2020 09:01 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  Has Tarleton State ever had a D1 team play at Wisdom Gym? I suspect Tarleton State will have a hard time getting D1 programs to play in their gym this coming season. So, Tarleton will be on the road a lot if it wants to meet the NCAA D1 transition criteria. I don't think Tarleton State will be allowed to schedule more than four D2 games within their first D1 (WAC) season. A typical D1 season consists of 28-30 regular season games. So, if Tarleton plays four D2 home games and sixteen WAC conference games (eight at home), That means BCG will need to coax a few D1 programs to come to Stephenville. Or the Texans will be playing on the road a lot initial. Because of COVID19 and possibly limited plane travel, BCG will probably try to schedule mostly SLC and SWAC schools; with bigger conferences (C-USA, SBC, Big XII) expecting Tarleton State to travel to their arena. It is possible NMSU could be the strongest D1 team Texan fans get to see in their gym all season; baring any dramatic improvement from some of the other WAC schools.

UNT and UTA would likely play in Stephenville with very little coaxing. ACU for sure, and SFA a probability. Maybe UTEP. I don't think it will be that difficult for Tarleton to schedule games,

(04-22-2020 10:32 PM)Itinerant Texan Wrote:  

(04-22-2020 09:01 PM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  Has Tarleton State ever had a D1 team play at Wisdom Gym? I suspect Tarleton State will have a hard time getting D1 programs to play in their gym this coming season. So, Tarleton will be on the road a lot if it wants to meet the NCAA D1 transition criteria. I don't think Tarleton State will be allowed to schedule more than four D2 games within their first D1 (WAC) season. A typical D1 season consists of 28-30 regular season games. So, if Tarleton plays four D2 home games and sixteen WAC conference games (eight at home), That means BCG will need to coax a few D1 programs to come to Stephenville. Or the Texans will be playing on the road a lot initial. Because of COVID19 and possibly limited plane travel, BCG will probably try to schedule mostly SLC and SWAC schools; with bigger conferences (C-USA, SBC, Big XII) expecting Tarleton State to travel to their arena. It is possible NMSU could be the strongest D1 team Texan fans get to see in their gym all season; baring any dramatic improvement from some of the other WAC schools.

UNT and UTA would likely play in Stephenville with very little coaxing. ACU for sure, and SFA a probability. Maybe UTEP. I don't think it will be that difficult for Tarleton to schedule games,

UTA would do home-and-home with Tarleton. We are a pretty dang good university, but we don't think we are too good for anybody. Tarleton is a nice Texas university, close, and, for those in-the-know, a big rival in ancient days.

(04-22-2020 07:36 PM)chrisattsu Wrote:  For those of you talking about Tareltons gym size and our need for a new facility, I present you with this video of our 2014 televised game against Kingsville.

We dont have a large arena like NMSU, we dont have razzle like GCU but we have spirit.

As GymRat noted, our student section lines on the line and is regularly in the opposing teams ear, back pocket and eventually their head.




https://vimeo.com/410650248?fbclid=IwAR3...SMjdPZYP_I

I like. Still need a bigger arena.

(04-23-2020 11:22 AM)dancingNMSUaggie Wrote:  

(04-22-2020 07:36 PM)chrisattsu Wrote:  For those of you talking about Tareltons gym size and our need for a new facility, I present you with this video of our 2014 televised game against Kingsville.

We dont have a large arena like NMSU, we dont have razzle like GCU but we have spirit.

As GymRat noted, our student section lines on the line and is regularly in the opposing teams ear, back pocket and eventually their head.




https://vimeo.com/410650248?fbclid=IwAR3...SMjdPZYP_I

I like. Still need a bigger arena.

Yeah we could stand to increase the size but I Wisdoms coziness.

If there is a way to turn Wisdom Gym into horseshoe seating (as someone suggested), that would add enough capacity to cover any fans support increases. And, add another element of fan intimidation with Texan fans sitting behind the opposition's basket during the second half of games. I figure making Wisdom Gym into a horseshoe could add another 600-1000 seats. But even with no capacity increase, Tarleton State's gym is bigger than some long time D1 programs...

Current configuration would have visiting team shooting into the horseshoe during the first half.

There’s our answer on Conference tournament

https://twitter.com/jthesportsdude/statu...27265?s=21

(04-27-2020 01:44 PM)wisdomgymrat Wrote:  There’s our answer on Conference tournament

https://twitter.com/jthesportsdude/statu...27265?s=21

Unless the NCAA also shorten the time probationary time period to compete in the NCAA Tournament, there has to be a WAC clause that if Cal Baptist, Tarleton State, or Dixie State win the WAC tournament, they would forfeit the NCAA automatic bid to the highest qualifying WAC finisher in the Tournament.

(04-25-2020 03:31 PM)wisdomgymrat Wrote:  Current configuration would have visiting team shooting into the horseshoe during the first half.

When is Prez Hurley supposed to release his strategic plan? As chris mentioned, I do believe a modest wisdom expansion and facelift was approved and funded a while back by Dottavio, but obviously has been put on the backburner. Point is, they do have some system money to throw at it.

(04-27-2020 10:13 PM)Itinerant Texan Wrote:  

(04-25-2020 03:31 PM)wisdomgymrat Wrote:  Current configuration would have visiting team shooting into the horseshoe during the first half.

When is Prez Hurley supposed to release his strategic plan? As chris mentioned, I do believe a modest wisdom expansion and facelift was approved and funded a while back by Dottavio, but obviously has been put on the backburner. Point is, they do have some system money to throw at it.

If Tarleton where to renovate and add seats on one side, to fix the direction the opponent shoots free-throws in the second half, Tarleton State simply needs to move the team benches to the opposite side of the of the gymnasium. NMSU has the majority of the student section and pep band behind the opponent's basket (with signs and various distractions) during the second half.

Our student section will always be located along the opposite sideline until they build a new arena. Yes more students could be placed in the new addition horseshoe, but the majority will still sit court side sideline.

(04-27-2020 10:13 PM)Itinerant Texan Wrote:  

(04-25-2020 03:31 PM)wisdomgymrat Wrote:  Current configuration would have visiting team shooting into the horseshoe during the first half.

When is Prez Hurley supposed to release his strategic plan? As chris mentioned, I do believe a modest wisdom expansion and facelift was approved and funded a while back by Dottavio, but obviously has been put on the backburner. Point is, they do have some system money to throw at it.

In Oct 2019 he did an interview with the local news paper saying that the horseshoe was coming on the 3-5 year range.

However hes also looking at a new parking garage, new residence halls in the immediate future.

I also assume the A&M Mothership will want to make sure that he is committing resources to the Fort Worth Campus now that the weve thrown considerable money at it.

(04-27-2020 11:09 PM)chrisattsu Wrote:  

(04-27-2020 10:13 PM)Itinerant Texan Wrote:  

(04-25-2020 03:31 PM)wisdomgymrat Wrote:  Current configuration would have visiting team shooting into the horseshoe during the first half.

When is Prez Hurley supposed to release his strategic plan? As chris mentioned, I do believe a modest wisdom expansion and facelift was approved and funded a while back by Dottavio, but obviously has been put on the backburner. Point is, they do have some system money to throw at it.

In Oct 2019 he did an interview with the local news paper saying that the horseshoe was coming on the 3-5 year range.

However hes also looking at a new parking garage, new residence halls in the immediate future.

I also assume the A&M Mothership will want to make sure that he is committing resources to the Fort Worth Campus now that the weve thrown considerable money at it.

That's the cool thing. Once they (Tarleton) asks for funds for a particular project, and it gets approved by the BOR..that money is forever tied to that project until completed. They can request an additional amount to supplement the alotted funds, but can't detract to move to another project. Hurley's plan will be aggressive, knowing he needs to lock down as much as he can.