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TribeFan1983 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: The Scar
If the NCAA implements its immediate eligibility for first transfer rule, I expect a massive re-shuffling of the deck in the CAA. P-5 coaches will pounce on Jalen Ray, Hunter McIntosh & Matt Lewis, just to name a few. Clubs like Elon and JMU, with all their young talent, don't look so good after a few big names are gone. Then it becomes a race to poach the underused P-5 players. If Dane has his list of disgruntled P-5'ers ready to go, there's no reason why we can't be competitive next year.
03-10-2020 04:00 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #22
RE: The Scar
(03-10-2020 02:26 PM)nj alum Wrote:  
(03-10-2020 01:19 PM)Rocco Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 11:04 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  Had Coach Shaver stayed and led this team to this exact same finish, I think more of us would be more accepting of a decision NOW by AD Huge to move on. But - alas - that is not the case.

No, people would simply say that 2022 would be the year, and it's unfair to judge Shaver. You know how I know?

https://csnbbs.com/thread-872117-post-15...id15964665

"Given what Dane accomplished this year, and the circumstances under which he accomplished same, in his rookie season, he’s my coach for as long as he wants to coach here.

Guess what?

Given what Tony accomplished in 16 years, and the circumstances under which he accomplished same, he’s my coach for as long as he wants to coach here.

The CAAT/Dance is Fool’s Gold, and distorts everything that is the Tribe MBB program, including whether to retain capable head coaches.

It’s going to take Dane five years to re-load the program with his players and his style, while he applies bandaids on an annual basis to keep the wolves at bay. He’s got those five years, and then some, from me.".

Me. From yesterday. Post #17 on the "Perspective" thread.

It's not a matter of judging. It's a matter of both men, Tony and Dane, have earned my respect and my loyalty. That may not be your cup of tea.

So, borrowing your phrase, you know less than you know.

Congrats on completely missing the point. Thanks.
03-10-2020 04:45 PM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #23
RE: The Scar
(03-10-2020 04:45 PM)Rocco Wrote:  Congrats on completely missing the point. Thanks.

Spell it out for me so I can say whether I agree or disagree.
03-10-2020 05:24 PM
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Rocco Offline
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Post: #24
RE: The Scar
(03-10-2020 05:24 PM)nj alum Wrote:  
(03-10-2020 04:45 PM)Rocco Wrote:  Congrats on completely missing the point. Thanks.

Spell it out for me so I can say whether I agree or disagree.

The point was that the idea anyone mad about Shaver getting canned after 2019 would be okay with replacing Shaver after 2020 if it didn't end in a tourney bid was a canard.
03-10-2020 05:39 PM
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nj alum Offline
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Post: #25
RE: The Scar
(03-10-2020 05:39 PM)Rocco Wrote:  
(03-10-2020 05:24 PM)nj alum Wrote:  
(03-10-2020 04:45 PM)Rocco Wrote:  Congrats on completely missing the point. Thanks.

Spell it out for me so I can say whether I agree or disagree.

The point was that the idea anyone mad about Shaver getting canned after 2019 would be okay with replacing Shaver after 2020 if it didn't end in a tourney bid was a canard.

Thanks!

Can't agree/disagree.

A year ago, 2022 was the next high water mark ... not any more after the transfers of Audige and Owens.

After Tony was dismissed, and Nathan decided to come back, 2020 was the high water mark ... there is no high water mark in the near future that I can point to.
03-10-2020 06:17 PM
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Dukesfan1971 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: The Scar
(03-10-2020 04:00 PM)TribeFan1983 Wrote:  If the NCAA implements its immediate eligibility for first transfer rule, I expect a massive re-shuffling of the deck in the CAA. P-5 coaches will pounce on Jalen Ray, Hunter McIntosh & Matt Lewis, just to name a few. Clubs like Elon and JMU, with all their young talent, don't look so good after a few big names are gone. Then it becomes a race to poach the underused P-5 players. If Dane has his list of disgruntled P-5'ers ready to go, there's no reason why we can't be competitive next year.

JMU has young talent? Or any talent for that matter.
03-10-2020 06:26 PM
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Marshall Wythe Offline
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Post: #27
RE: The Scar
(03-09-2020 12:52 PM)Zorch Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 11:04 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  Had Coach Shaver stayed and led this team to this exact same finish, I think more of us would be more accepting of a decision NOW by AD Huge to move on.

It is clear that I am pro-Shaver and anti-Huge. However, opposite to what some posters have generally inferred about us as a group, I was not rooting for failure but was rooting really really hard for a CAAT championship this year. Not just for the obvious reasons that that is what a W&M fan would do -- but also because I wanted to avoid the exact feeling that I have right now. A deep DEEP disappointment and sadness about what might have been if the Shaver firing had not occurred. Now we will never know, and Tony never got the chance he deserved. If we had won this year under Fischer, it would have been easier to take and, in the minds of some but not all, Huge's move may have even been justified. Now, as NJ Alum said, there is no justification for the move because, obviously, a Tribe collapse cannot simply be attributed to Tony's coaching.

Re the post at the top: yes, many of us last spring said that Tony deserved another year and if he then failed, then okay, make a change. Are you requiring us to go back and find those posts, too? (Still waiting for that tip of the cap you promised ....).

Zorch, it's funny how you and I agree here, but you still have to take a shot at me. And you deserve no tip of the cap. Like the rest of us, before the season started, you did not predict this level of success for Coach Fischer. Predicting better than a 7th or 8th place finish is not the same.
03-11-2020 06:16 AM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #28
RE: The Scar
(03-11-2020 06:16 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 12:52 PM)Zorch Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 11:04 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  Had Coach Shaver stayed and led this team to this exact same finish, I think more of us would be more accepting of a decision NOW by AD Huge to move on.

It is clear that I am pro-Shaver and anti-Huge. However, opposite to what some posters have generally inferred about us as a group, I was not rooting for failure but was rooting really really hard for a CAAT championship this year. Not just for the obvious reasons that that is what a W&M fan would do -- but also because I wanted to avoid the exact feeling that I have right now. A deep DEEP disappointment and sadness about what might have been if the Shaver firing had not occurred. Now we will never know, and Tony never got the chance he deserved. If we had won this year under Fischer, it would have been easier to take and, in the minds of some but not all, Huge's move may have even been justified. Now, as NJ Alum said, there is no justification for the move because, obviously, a Tribe collapse cannot simply be attributed to Tony's coaching.

Re the post at the top: yes, many of us last spring said that Tony deserved another year and if he then failed, then okay, make a change. Are you requiring us to go back and find those posts, too? (Still waiting for that tip of the cap you promised ....).

Zorch, it's funny how you and I agree here, but you still have to take a shot at me. And you deserve no tip of the cap. Like the rest of us, before the season started, you did not predict this level of success for Coach Fischer. Predicting better than a 7th or 8th place finish is not the same.

The phrase I used was "much" better. So, a second place finish (only one game out of first) IS much better than the 7th place projection. If the Tribe had finished 4th, 5th, or 6th then you would have a point.

The fact that you don't admit that .... I attribute to your being a lawyer (at least, I assume that you are based on your Marshall-Wythe moniker and my keen reasoning skills acquired at W&M). Lawyers are conditioned, taught, and trained to never give in and to never admit that the other side is right --- even when the other side IS right. But, not wanting to insult more lawyers than necessary, I'll just say that there are more Saul Goodmans out there than John Marshalls or George Wythes.
03-11-2020 07:15 AM
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Marshall Wythe Offline
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Post: #29
RE: The Scar
(03-11-2020 07:15 AM)Zorch Wrote:  
(03-11-2020 06:16 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 12:52 PM)Zorch Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 11:04 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  Had Coach Shaver stayed and led this team to this exact same finish, I think more of us would be more accepting of a decision NOW by AD Huge to move on.

It is clear that I am pro-Shaver and anti-Huge. However, opposite to what some posters have generally inferred about us as a group, I was not rooting for failure but was rooting really really hard for a CAAT championship this year. Not just for the obvious reasons that that is what a W&M fan would do -- but also because I wanted to avoid the exact feeling that I have right now. A deep DEEP disappointment and sadness about what might have been if the Shaver firing had not occurred. Now we will never know, and Tony never got the chance he deserved. If we had won this year under Fischer, it would have been easier to take and, in the minds of some but not all, Huge's move may have even been justified. Now, as NJ Alum said, there is no justification for the move because, obviously, a Tribe collapse cannot simply be attributed to Tony's coaching.

Re the post at the top: yes, many of us last spring said that Tony deserved another year and if he then failed, then okay, make a change. Are you requiring us to go back and find those posts, too? (Still waiting for that tip of the cap you promised ....).

Zorch, it's funny how you and I agree here, but you still have to take a shot at me. And you deserve no tip of the cap. Like the rest of us, before the season started, you did not predict this level of success for Coach Fischer. Predicting better than a 7th or 8th place finish is not the same.

The phrase I used was "much" better. So, a second place finish (only one game out of first) IS much better than the 7th place projection. If the Tribe had finished 4th, 5th, or 6th then you would have a point.

The fact that you don't admit that .... I attribute to your being a lawyer (at least, I assume that you are based on your Marshall-Wythe moniker and my keen reasoning skills acquired at W&M). Lawyers are conditioned, taught, and trained to never give in and to never admit that the other side is right --- even when the other side IS right. But, not wanting to insult more lawyers than necessary, I'll just say that there are more Saul Goodmans out there than John Marshalls or George Wythes.

3rd or 4th place also is much better than 7th place. 17 or 19 wins also would be much better than what the usual 7th place finisher gets. So, no, you did not predict the level of success (i.e. tied for most wins ever) that Coach Fischer achieved. But I doubt anyone else on this board cares about your irrational hatred for me. So, I will no longer reply to your insults or pleas for hat tips.
03-11-2020 07:28 AM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #30
RE: The Scar
(03-11-2020 07:28 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  
(03-11-2020 07:15 AM)Zorch Wrote:  
(03-11-2020 06:16 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 12:52 PM)Zorch Wrote:  
(03-09-2020 11:04 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  Had Coach Shaver stayed and led this team to this exact same finish, I think more of us would be more accepting of a decision NOW by AD Huge to move on.

It is clear that I am pro-Shaver and anti-Huge. However, opposite to what some posters have generally inferred about us as a group, I was not rooting for failure but was rooting really really hard for a CAAT championship this year. Not just for the obvious reasons that that is what a W&M fan would do -- but also because I wanted to avoid the exact feeling that I have right now. A deep DEEP disappointment and sadness about what might have been if the Shaver firing had not occurred. Now we will never know, and Tony never got the chance he deserved. If we had won this year under Fischer, it would have been easier to take and, in the minds of some but not all, Huge's move may have even been justified. Now, as NJ Alum said, there is no justification for the move because, obviously, a Tribe collapse cannot simply be attributed to Tony's coaching.

Re the post at the top: yes, many of us last spring said that Tony deserved another year and if he then failed, then okay, make a change. Are you requiring us to go back and find those posts, too? (Still waiting for that tip of the cap you promised ....).

Zorch, it's funny how you and I agree here, but you still have to take a shot at me. And you deserve no tip of the cap. Like the rest of us, before the season started, you did not predict this level of success for Coach Fischer. Predicting better than a 7th or 8th place finish is not the same.

The phrase I used was "much" better. So, a second place finish (only one game out of first) IS much better than the 7th place projection. If the Tribe had finished 4th, 5th, or 6th then you would have a point.

The fact that you don't admit that .... I attribute to your being a lawyer (at least, I assume that you are based on your Marshall-Wythe moniker and my keen reasoning skills acquired at W&M). Lawyers are conditioned, taught, and trained to never give in and to never admit that the other side is right --- even when the other side IS right. But, not wanting to insult more lawyers than necessary, I'll just say that there are more Saul Goodmans out there than John Marshalls or George Wythes.

3rd or 4th place also is much better than 7th place. 17 or 19 wins also would be much better than what the usual 7th place finisher gets. So, no, you did not predict the level of success (i.e. tied for most wins ever) that Coach Fischer achieved. But I doubt anyone else on this board cares about your irrational hatred for me. So, I will no longer reply to your insults or pleas for hat tips.

Your first sentence just proved my point about lawyers, quibbling about how much is "much". I do not hate you -- I don't even know you. I have no clue as to why you would say such a thing. The whole point of my "pleas" was to see if you would "man up". You said that if anyone could show you such a post that you would tip your cap. I presented a post from a month before the season that appeared to fit the bill. Your proper play would have been to acknowledge it and everyone moves on. Your failure to see that or do that is indicative of ....
03-11-2020 07:37 AM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: The Scar
It is indicative of the fact we are a depressed fanbase. Some of us are depressed because Coach Shaver didn't get to finish the job, some because Nathan Knight went out in the qrts after a great career, some because its another year of 40+ years in the wilderness, some because we don't play enough defense, some because we don't score enough, some because our AD doesn't get it, some because one of our chief rivals who only plays 5 pkayers and no defense just won the title, some because JMU is a dumpster fire but still managed to win one title, some because our delusions were exposed as reality, and finally some because W&M sports are not relevant to the level we hope they can be.

We need hope and a vision for the future. Players and students live for the now, the hope, and the vision. Let's hope together and get over it. Let's all agree to pull for Dane, wait on bated breath for recruiting news, and long for the day when Tribal, Rocco, Tribester, and bubbadog57 are all happy together at the same time. Let's be like Luke who cared enough to be really upset when he lost his coach but also gave his all this past season. Tennessee didn't win it all with Manning and uva didn't win it all with Ralph either, but they shocked the sports wirld the next season.
03-11-2020 08:47 AM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #32
RE: The Scar
(03-11-2020 08:47 AM)TribePride91 Wrote:  It is indicative of the fact we are a depressed fanbase. Some of us are depressed because Coach Shaver didn't get to finish the job, some because Nathan Knight went out in the qrts after a great career, some because its another year of 40+ years in the wilderness, some because we don't play enough defense, some because we don't score enough, some because our AD doesn't get it, some because one of our chief rivals who only plays 5 pkayers and no defense just won the title, some because JMU is a dumpster fire but still managed to win one title, some because our delusions were exposed as reality, and finally some because W&M sports are not relevant to the level we hope they can be.

We need hope and a vision for the future. Players and students live for the now, the hope, and the vision. Let's hope together and get over it. Let's all agree to pull for Dane, wait on bated breath for recruiting news, and long for the day when Tribal, Rocco, Tribester, and bubbadog57 are all happy together at the same time. Let's be like Luke who cared enough to be really upset when he lost his coach but also gave his all this past season. Tennessee didn't win it all with Manning and uva didn't win it all with Ralph either, but they shocked the sports wirld the next season.

Excellent post. I'll claim 1% credit for giving you such a great lead-in.

Re: "We need hope and a vision for the future": How about the women's basketball team? Seeded third in the tourney and playing tomorrow. Let's all get behind them!
03-11-2020 09:00 AM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: The Scar
As you should. I'll give you 50% and MW 50%. Look, just for fun, maybe karma is actually for the women to be the first. Ultimately that probably fits Samantha's vision and hope 100%. Doesn't mean that we all don't want the guys to be the best program in the CAA, but it would be fantastic if the Tribe women were the first. They have had a great season too!
03-11-2020 09:21 AM
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Marshall Wythe Offline
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Post: #34
RE: The Scar
(03-11-2020 09:21 AM)TribePride91 Wrote:  As you should. I'll give you 50% and MW 50%. Look, just for fun, maybe karma is actually for the women to be the first. Ultimately that probably fits Samantha's vision and hope 100%. Doesn't mean that we all don't want the guys to be the best program in the CAA, but it would be fantastic if the Tribe women were the first. They have had a great season too!

Thanks, 91. The women's team could be the salve we're all looking for. I just hope they don't cancel the tournament!
03-11-2020 10:12 AM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: The Scar
(03-11-2020 09:00 AM)Zorch Wrote:  
(03-11-2020 08:47 AM)TribePride91 Wrote:  It is indicative of the fact we are a depressed fanbase. Some of us are depressed because Coach Shaver didn't get to finish the job, some because Nathan Knight went out in the qrts after a great career, some because its another year of 40+ years in the wilderness, some because we don't play enough defense, some because we don't score enough, some because our AD doesn't get it, some because one of our chief rivals who only plays 5 pkayers and no defense just won the title, some because JMU is a dumpster fire but still managed to win one title, some because our delusions were exposed as reality, and finally some because W&M sports are not relevant to the level we hope they can be.

We need hope and a vision for the future. Players and students live for the now, the hope, and the vision. Let's hope together and get over it. Let's all agree to pull for Dane, wait on bated breath for recruiting news, and long for the day when Tribal, Rocco, Tribester, and bubbadog57 are all happy together at the same time. Let's be like Luke who cared enough to be really upset when he lost his coach but also gave his all this past season. Tennessee didn't win it all with Manning and uva didn't win it all with Ralph either, but they shocked the sports wirld the next season.

Excellent post. I'll claim 1% credit for giving you such a great lead-in.

Re: "We need hope and a vision for the future": How about the women's basketball team? Seeded third in the tourney and playing tomorrow. Let's all get behind them!

(03-11-2020 10:12 AM)Marshall Wythe Wrote:  
(03-11-2020 09:21 AM)TribePride91 Wrote:  As you should. I'll give you 50% and MW 50%. Look, just for fun, maybe karma is actually for the women to be the first. Ultimately that probably fits Samantha's vision and hope 100%. Doesn't mean that we all don't want the guys to be the best program in the CAA, but it would be fantastic if the Tribe women were the first. They have had a great season too!

Thanks, 91. The women's team could be the salve we're all looking for. I just hope they don't cancel the tournament!

So true. The angst and anxiety(while warranted for some) is not helping anything right now. Trying to convince my girls to head over to Elon. Will be following it closely either way. Then, will pull for baseball like always.
03-11-2020 10:16 AM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #36
RE: The Scar
(03-11-2020 08:47 AM)TribePride91 Wrote:  It is indicative of the fact we are a depressed fanbase. Some of us are depressed because Coach Shaver didn't get to finish the job, some because Nathan Knight went out in the qrts after a great career, some because its another year of 40+ years in the wilderness, some because we don't play enough defense, some because we don't score enough, some because our AD doesn't get it, some because one of our chief rivals who only plays 5 pkayers and no defense just won the title, some because JMU is a dumpster fire but still managed to win one title, some because our delusions were exposed as reality, and finally some because W&M sports are not relevant to the level we hope they can be.

We need hope and a vision for the future. Players and students live for the now, the hope, and the vision. Let's hope together and get over it. Let's all agree to pull for Dane, wait on bated breath for recruiting news, and long for the day when Tribal, Rocco, Tribester, and bubbadog57 are all happy together at the same time. Let's be like Luke who cared enough to be really upset when he lost his coach but also gave his all this past season. Tennessee didn't win it all with Manning and uva didn't win it all with Ralph either, but they shocked the sports world the next season.
04-10-2020 09:51 AM
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