Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
Author Message
Statefan Offline
Banned

Posts: 3,511
Joined: May 2018
I Root For: .
Location:
Post: #21
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 03:25 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  This Carolina team is still very talented. Would not surprise me if they caught fire in the ACC tournament and grabbed the automatic bid.

So you think Carolina can win 5 games and win the ACC Title?

01-wingedeagle
02-21-2020 04:54 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Statefan Offline
Banned

Posts: 3,511
Joined: May 2018
I Root For: .
Location:
Post: #22
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
Duke to NIKE and Adidas investigations the normal amount of money being peddled to buy players, especially at NIKE schools is down. There is also more scrutiny on some schools that aren't used to scrutiny. But most importantly there is not a top flight guard in the league this year, NC State was stupid and held a player out against GT then proceeded to have three concussions to players, while Carolina lost half it's team to injury, and a better than advertised GT lost players to start the year. The result is the ACC pigeon holed in the rankings and few buttons to press.
02-21-2020 04:58 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Captain Bearcat Offline
All-American in Everything
*

Posts: 9,478
Joined: Jun 2010
Reputation: 766
I Root For: UC
Location: IL & Cincinnati, USA
Post: #23
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
Boston College was good when it could play in front of local recruits in Providence, Hartford, Madison Square Garden, South Orange NJ, and New Brunswick. Even Philadelphia is closer to BC than Syracuse is.

Syracuse (and Pitt as well) faces similar problems. They used to have great local rivalries. But this year Syracuse didn't play a single road football game in the Northeast, and they only played 2 road basketball games in the Northeast. In the past two years Syracuse has resorted to using their nonconference tournament exception on "neutral" site games in New York City against the likes of Oklahoma State and Oregon.
02-21-2020 05:15 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
quo vadis Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 50,018
Joined: Aug 2008
Reputation: 2372
I Root For: USF/Georgetown
Location: New Orleans
Post: #24
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 04:54 PM)Statefan Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 03:25 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  This Carolina team is still very talented. Would not surprise me if they caught fire in the ACC tournament and grabbed the automatic bid.

So you think Carolina can win 5 games and win the ACC Title?

Do I think it's likely? No. Would it shock me if it happened? No.

07-coffee3
02-21-2020 05:44 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
CarlSmithCenter Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 931
Joined: Jun 2014
Reputation: 86
I Root For: Ball So Hard U
Location:
Post: #25
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 05:44 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 04:54 PM)Statefan Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 03:25 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  This Carolina team is still very talented. Would not surprise me if they caught fire in the ACC tournament and grabbed the automatic bid.

So you think Carolina can win 5 games and win the ACC Title?

Do I think it's likely? No. Would it shock me if it happened? No.

07-coffee3

Agreed. Also, the ACC has 3 teams ranked in the top 11. The SEC has 2 in the top 25. The ACC may be down this year but it has and always will be a better top-to-bottom basketball league than the SEC (no disrespect to UK). Arguing otherwise is is ahistorical and asinine.
02-21-2020 10:33 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
JRsec Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 37,901
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 7737
I Root For: SEC
Location:
Post: #26
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 10:33 PM)CarlSmithCenter Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 05:44 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 04:54 PM)Statefan Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 03:25 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  This Carolina team is still very talented. Would not surprise me if they caught fire in the ACC tournament and grabbed the automatic bid.

So you think Carolina can win 5 games and win the ACC Title?

Do I think it's likely? No. Would it shock me if it happened? No.

07-coffee3

Agreed. Also, the ACC has 3 teams ranked in the top 11. The SEC has 2 in the top 25. The ACC may be down this year but it has and always will be a better top-to-bottom basketball league than the SEC (no disrespect to UK). Arguing otherwise is is ahistorical and asinine.

Well there sport then why is the ACC 3-9 vs the SEC this year? The tourney will out. I'm not saying the SEC wins the tourney either, but Auburn blew out North Carolina last year and if a double dribble at the end of the game is called against Virginia then that one turns out differently as well. Just saying, things are changing and it's neither asinine nor hysterical to point that out. As for rankings other than Louisville they are over ranked, as usual.
02-21-2020 11:02 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
cuseroc Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 15,262
Joined: Mar 2005
Reputation: 546
I Root For: Syracuse
Location: Rochester/Sarasota

Donators
Post: #27
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
You can come to such a conclusion based off of one or 2 years? PLEASE!
02-21-2020 11:33 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
JRsec Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 37,901
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 7737
I Root For: SEC
Location:
Post: #28
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 11:33 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  You can come to such a conclusion based off of one or 2 years? PLEASE!

I can come to this conclusion because of what is happening, and will continue to happen. All the whining from the peanut gallery just makes it more fun!

There are no complete teams in the ACC or SEC this year. There are very few in the nation. Baylor is playing the most complete basketball right now. And there are several in the Big East that can make a run. I'd say the same for the Big 10 but they've been inconsistent as well, but with some moments of brilliance. I think this year's tournament will be wide open. There is a dearth in basketball talent to go along with a growing dearth in football talent. Now whether that is a blip or a trend remains to be seen. But with a dearth in talent in any sport the demand for the top players will be more acute and facilities and other amenities will be making a difference.
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2020 11:42 PM by JRsec.)
02-21-2020 11:36 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
cuseroc Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 15,262
Joined: Mar 2005
Reputation: 546
I Root For: Syracuse
Location: Rochester/Sarasota

Donators
Post: #29
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 11:36 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:33 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  You can come to such a conclusion based off of one or 2 years? PLEASE!

I can come to this conclusion because of what is happening, and will continue to happen. All the whining from the peanut gallery just makes it more fun!

Theres no whinning except you trying to convince everyone that the SEC is going to take the ACC place in basketball. Just be happy that the SEC is tops in football. Leave the roundball ro the ACC. And its not just ACC fans who think its funny.
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2020 11:41 PM by cuseroc.)
02-21-2020 11:39 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
JRsec Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 37,901
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 7737
I Root For: SEC
Location:
Post: #30
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 11:39 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:36 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:33 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  You can come to such a conclusion based off of one or 2 years? PLEASE!

I can come to this conclusion because of what is happening, and will continue to happen. All the whining from the peanut gallery just makes it more fun!

Theres no whinning except you trying to convince everyone that the SEC is going to take the ACC place in basketball. Just be happy that the SEC is tops in football. Leave the roundball ro the ACC. And its not just ACC fans who think its funny.
I'm not whining. I'm stating. I'll be enjoying this more later. The ACC needs a strong showing in this tournament more than ever. Louisville is the best bet. And you should read the rest of my edited post. But your talent level is way down, some of that due to injury, but some of it due to recruiting. And the coaching jobs are only going to get more competitive for dollars. It simply is the first tangible evidence that football money rolled over into hoops is making a difference not only within the ACC, but outside of it as well. And it's not going away.
02-21-2020 11:48 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
cuseroc Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 15,262
Joined: Mar 2005
Reputation: 546
I Root For: Syracuse
Location: Rochester/Sarasota

Donators
Post: #31
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 11:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:39 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:36 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:33 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  You can come to such a conclusion based off of one or 2 years? PLEASE!

I can come to this conclusion because of what is happening, and will continue to happen. All the whining from the peanut gallery just makes it more fun!

Theres no whinning except you trying to convince everyone that the SEC is going to take the ACC place in basketball. Just be happy that the SEC is tops in football. Leave the roundball ro the ACC. And its not just ACC fans who think its funny.
I'm not whining. I'm stating. I'll be enjoying this more later. The ACC needs a strong showing in this tournament more than ever. Louisville is the best bet. And you should read the rest of my edited post. But your talent level is way down, some of that due to injury, but some of it due to recruiting. And the coaching jobs are only going to get more competitive for dollars. It simply is the first tangible evidence that football money rolled over into hoops is making a difference not only within the ACC, but outside of it as well. And it's not going away.

We will see. But its much more probable that the ACC is in a down cycle rather than the SEC taking the ACC's place. Only folks who think that UNC, Syracuse and Virginia will continue to be down would consider your line of reasoning. No other league has a combo like Duke/UNC and no other league has a top four like Duke/UNC/Cuse/Ville with more than 50 final fours and 13 national championships between them. That doesnt even include NC State or Virginia
(This post was last modified: 02-22-2020 12:02 AM by cuseroc.)
02-21-2020 11:57 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
JRsec Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 37,901
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 7737
I Root For: SEC
Location:
Post: #32
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 11:57 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:39 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:36 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:33 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  You can come to such a conclusion based off of one or 2 years? PLEASE!

I can come to this conclusion because of what is happening, and will continue to happen. All the whining from the peanut gallery just makes it more fun!

Theres no whinning except you trying to convince everyone that the SEC is going to take the ACC place in basketball. Just be happy that the SEC is tops in football. Leave the roundball ro the ACC. And its not just ACC fans who think its funny.
I'm not whining. I'm stating. I'll be enjoying this more later. The ACC needs a strong showing in this tournament more than ever. Louisville is the best bet. And you should read the rest of my edited post. But your talent level is way down, some of that due to injury, but some of it due to recruiting. And the coaching jobs are only going to get more competitive for dollars. It simply is the first tangible evidence that football money rolled over into hoops is making a difference not only within the ACC, but outside of it as well. And it's not going away.

We will see. But its much more probable that the ACC is in a down cycle rather than the SEC taking the ACC's place. Only folks who think that UNC, Syracuse and Virginia will continue to be down. No other league has a combo like Duke/UNC and no other league has a top four like Duke/UNC/Cuse/Ville with more than 50 final fours and 13 national championships between them. That doesnt even include NC State or Virginia

And of those Syracuse, Duke, and North Carolina will be retiring legends of coaches and then competing with better funded schools for the new ones. And why should you mention Virginia and N.C. State they just haven't been there very often. Was Valvano the last N.C. State coach to do it?

The door is going to be wide open. The SEC made it a priority the last year Slive was around. We're making steady progress. The Big East is looking stronger. The Big 10 is putting more money in to it as well and the evidence of what happens when a conference falls behind in salaries is fairly evident in the PAC. Time, Pressure and Economic Disparity have been changing things since 1992 and the beat goes on. But yes, we'll see.

By the way you should google the most recent Mercury News piece on UCLA and the administrative issues constraining the PAC. UCLA has had red ink in the last two seasons totaling 32 million. That's approaching UConn red ink levels prior to their departure to the NBE.
(This post was last modified: 02-22-2020 12:11 AM by JRsec.)
02-22-2020 12:07 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
cuseroc Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 15,262
Joined: Mar 2005
Reputation: 546
I Root For: Syracuse
Location: Rochester/Sarasota

Donators
Post: #33
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-22-2020 12:07 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:57 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:39 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:36 PM)JRsec Wrote:  I can come to this conclusion because of what is happening, and will continue to happen. All the whining from the peanut gallery just makes it more fun!

Theres no whinning except you trying to convince everyone that the SEC is going to take the ACC place in basketball. Just be happy that the SEC is tops in football. Leave the roundball ro the ACC. And its not just ACC fans who think its funny.
I'm not whining. I'm stating. I'll be enjoying this more later. The ACC needs a strong showing in this tournament more than ever. Louisville is the best bet. And you should read the rest of my edited post. But your talent level is way down, some of that due to injury, but some of it due to recruiting. And the coaching jobs are only going to get more competitive for dollars. It simply is the first tangible evidence that football money rolled over into hoops is making a difference not only within the ACC, but outside of it as well. And it's not going away.

We will see. But its much more probable that the ACC is in a down cycle rather than the SEC taking the ACC's place. Only folks who think that UNC, Syracuse and Virginia will continue to be down. No other league has a combo like Duke/UNC and no other league has a top four like Duke/UNC/Cuse/Ville with more than 50 final fours and 13 national championships between them. That doesnt even include NC State or Virginia

And of those Syracuse, Duke, and North Carolina will be retiring legends of coaches and then competing with better funded schools for the new ones. And why should you mention Virginia and N.C. State they just haven't been there very often. Was Valvano the last N.C. State coach to do it?

The door is going to be wide open. The SEC made it a priority the last year Slive was around. We're making steady progress. The Big East is looking stronger. The Big 10 is putting more money in to it as well and the evidence of what happens when a conference falls behind in salaries is fairly evident in the PAC. Time, Pressure and Economic Disparity have been changing things since 1992 and the beat goes on. But yes, we'll see.

By the way you should google the most recent Mercury News piece on UCLA and the administrative issues constraining the PAC. UCLA has had red ink in the last two seasons totaling 32 million. That's approaching UConn red ink levels prior to their departure to the NBE.

The BIG and the SEC have always made alot more money than ACC schools. It didnt matter as the ACC is the best bb league, just like the SEC is the best fb league. From 2014 to 2017 ACC football was running close to SEC football. Then the bottom fell off of ACC football in 2018 and 2019. SEC bb likely will have a similar dropoff while ACC basketball will regain its form. And since you want to talk about economics, I do believe the ACC has the highest paid college fb coach and the highest paid college basketball coach. None of the ACC schools are struggling like Uconn or UCLA. And Syracuse, Duke and UNC have enough money and bb clout that they can poach alot of P5 bb coaches.

And its nice of you to acknowledge how BE schools are doing so well inspite of the fact that they have alot less money than any P5 school, particularly your exalted SEC.
(This post was last modified: 02-22-2020 12:51 AM by cuseroc.)
02-22-2020 12:46 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Kit-Cat Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 10,000
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 125
I Root For: Championships
Location:

CrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappies
Post: #34
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-21-2020 05:44 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 04:54 PM)Statefan Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 03:25 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  This Carolina team is still very talented. Would not surprise me if they caught fire in the ACC tournament and grabbed the automatic bid.

So you think Carolina can win 5 games and win the ACC Title?

Do I think it's likely? No. Would it shock me if it happened? No.

07-coffee3

That would be a big deal for anyone to do from that record, even for a blueblood.
02-22-2020 12:48 AM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BatonRougeEscapee Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,179
Joined: Nov 2003
Reputation: 111
I Root For: GEAUX TIGERS &
Location:
Post: #35
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-22-2020 12:46 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-22-2020 12:07 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:57 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:39 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  Theres no whinning except you trying to convince everyone that the SEC is going to take the ACC place in basketball. Just be happy that the SEC is tops in football. Leave the roundball ro the ACC. And its not just ACC fans who think its funny.
I'm not whining. I'm stating. I'll be enjoying this more later. The ACC needs a strong showing in this tournament more than ever. Louisville is the best bet. And you should read the rest of my edited post. But your talent level is way down, some of that due to injury, but some of it due to recruiting. And the coaching jobs are only going to get more competitive for dollars. It simply is the first tangible evidence that football money rolled over into hoops is making a difference not only within the ACC, but outside of it as well. And it's not going away.

We will see. But its much more probable that the ACC is in a down cycle rather than the SEC taking the ACC's place. Only folks who think that UNC, Syracuse and Virginia will continue to be down. No other league has a combo like Duke/UNC and no other league has a top four like Duke/UNC/Cuse/Ville with more than 50 final fours and 13 national championships between them. That doesnt even include NC State or Virginia

And of those Syracuse, Duke, and North Carolina will be retiring legends of coaches and then competing with better funded schools for the new ones. And why should you mention Virginia and N.C. State they just haven't been there very often. Was Valvano the last N.C. State coach to do it?

The door is going to be wide open. The SEC made it a priority the last year Slive was around. We're making steady progress. The Big East is looking stronger. The Big 10 is putting more money in to it as well and the evidence of what happens when a conference falls behind in salaries is fairly evident in the PAC. Time, Pressure and Economic Disparity have been changing things since 1992 and the beat goes on. But yes, we'll see.

By the way you should google the most recent Mercury News piece on UCLA and the administrative issues constraining the PAC. UCLA has had red ink in the last two seasons totaling 32 million. That's approaching UConn red ink levels prior to their departure to the NBE.

The BIG and the SEC have always made alot more money than ACC schools. It didnt matter as the ACC is the best bb league, just like the SEC is the best fb league. From 2014 to 2017 ACC football was running close to SEC football. Then the bottom fell off of ACC football in 2018 and 2019. SEC bb likely will have a similar dropoff while ACC basketball will regain its form. And since you want to talk about economics, I do believe the ACC has the highest paid college fb coach and the highest paid college basketball coach. None of the ACC schools are struggling like Uconn or UCLA. And Syracuse, Duke and UNC have enough money and bb clout that they can poach alot of P5 bb coaches.

And its nice of you to acknowledge how BE schools are doing so well inspite of the fact that they have alot less money than any P5 school, particularly your exalted SEC.

This entire argument is asinine and inane. Schools with budgets well over $100 million are not going to become noncompetitive in sports that matter. If monetary inequity worsens, schools will just cut unimportant sports. It certainly won't affect the ACC in basketball where the highest # of bluebloods reside.

I've said it before and I'll repeat it again: if the inequity worsens the BIG 10 and SEC MIGHT win a NCAA basketball title in the next 10 years (if Calipari ever learns to coach) and they might get multiple consistent elite programs within 20 years, but they won't supplant the ACC or even the Big East.
02-22-2020 01:07 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
JRsec Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 37,901
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 7737
I Root For: SEC
Location:
Post: #36
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-22-2020 12:46 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-22-2020 12:07 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:57 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:39 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  Theres no whinning except you trying to convince everyone that the SEC is going to take the ACC place in basketball. Just be happy that the SEC is tops in football. Leave the roundball ro the ACC. And its not just ACC fans who think its funny.
I'm not whining. I'm stating. I'll be enjoying this more later. The ACC needs a strong showing in this tournament more than ever. Louisville is the best bet. And you should read the rest of my edited post. But your talent level is way down, some of that due to injury, but some of it due to recruiting. And the coaching jobs are only going to get more competitive for dollars. It simply is the first tangible evidence that football money rolled over into hoops is making a difference not only within the ACC, but outside of it as well. And it's not going away.

We will see. But its much more probable that the ACC is in a down cycle rather than the SEC taking the ACC's place. Only folks who think that UNC, Syracuse and Virginia will continue to be down. No other league has a combo like Duke/UNC and no other league has a top four like Duke/UNC/Cuse/Ville with more than 50 final fours and 13 national championships between them. That doesnt even include NC State or Virginia

And of those Syracuse, Duke, and North Carolina will be retiring legends of coaches and then competing with better funded schools for the new ones. And why should you mention Virginia and N.C. State they just haven't been there very often. Was Valvano the last N.C. State coach to do it?

The door is going to be wide open. The SEC made it a priority the last year Slive was around. We're making steady progress. The Big East is looking stronger. The Big 10 is putting more money in to it as well and the evidence of what happens when a conference falls behind in salaries is fairly evident in the PAC. Time, Pressure and Economic Disparity have been changing things since 1992 and the beat goes on. But yes, we'll see.

By the way you should google the most recent Mercury News piece on UCLA and the administrative issues constraining the PAC. UCLA has had red ink in the last two seasons totaling 32 million. That's approaching UConn red ink levels prior to their departure to the NBE.

The BIG and the SEC have always made alot more money than ACC schools. It didnt matter as the ACC is the best bb league, just like the SEC is the best fb league. From 2014 to 2017 ACC football was running close to SEC football. Then the bottom fell off of ACC football in 2018 and 2019. SEC bb likely will have a similar dropoff while ACC basketball will regain its form. And since you want to talk about economics, I do believe the ACC has the highest paid college fb coach and the highest paid college basketball coach. None of the ACC schools are struggling like Uconn or UCLA. And Syracuse, Duke and UNC have enough money and bb clout that they can poach alot of P5 bb coaches.

And its nice of you to acknowledge how BE schools are doing so well inspite of the fact that they have alot less money than any P5 school, particularly your exalted SEC.

We will see how far the slipping goes. As to the Big East they don't have football budgets to support. They have more to spend on hoops and hoops coaches. And they are in a talent rich area for basketball. It's not lost on me that Clemson is improving in hoops and that Florida State has grown strong in it. Louisville will be fine. But those are schools that normally excel in football as well. And yes the football money is making a difference Cuseroc and it's about to be massively different. So I'd what the ACC was able to do relative to the Big 10 and SEC in the past isn't going to be exactly the same circumstances moving forward. By the time 2024 rolls around the SEC and Big 10 could easily be North of 70 million in per team media payouts. We know the bottom for the SEC will be ~66 million plus 4 more years of escalators. The Big 10's contract even if it receives a 5% bump will be right there too. And at that level we aren't talking a 10 million dollar gap. We are talking gaps approaching 30 million.
02-22-2020 01:15 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Kit-Cat Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 10,000
Joined: Jun 2002
Reputation: 125
I Root For: Championships
Location:

CrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappies
Post: #37
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-22-2020 01:15 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-22-2020 12:46 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-22-2020 12:07 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:57 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:48 PM)JRsec Wrote:  I'm not whining. I'm stating. I'll be enjoying this more later. The ACC needs a strong showing in this tournament more than ever. Louisville is the best bet. And you should read the rest of my edited post. But your talent level is way down, some of that due to injury, but some of it due to recruiting. And the coaching jobs are only going to get more competitive for dollars. It simply is the first tangible evidence that football money rolled over into hoops is making a difference not only within the ACC, but outside of it as well. And it's not going away.

We will see. But its much more probable that the ACC is in a down cycle rather than the SEC taking the ACC's place. Only folks who think that UNC, Syracuse and Virginia will continue to be down. No other league has a combo like Duke/UNC and no other league has a top four like Duke/UNC/Cuse/Ville with more than 50 final fours and 13 national championships between them. That doesnt even include NC State or Virginia

And of those Syracuse, Duke, and North Carolina will be retiring legends of coaches and then competing with better funded schools for the new ones. And why should you mention Virginia and N.C. State they just haven't been there very often. Was Valvano the last N.C. State coach to do it?

The door is going to be wide open. The SEC made it a priority the last year Slive was around. We're making steady progress. The Big East is looking stronger. The Big 10 is putting more money in to it as well and the evidence of what happens when a conference falls behind in salaries is fairly evident in the PAC. Time, Pressure and Economic Disparity have been changing things since 1992 and the beat goes on. But yes, we'll see.

By the way you should google the most recent Mercury News piece on UCLA and the administrative issues constraining the PAC. UCLA has had red ink in the last two seasons totaling 32 million. That's approaching UConn red ink levels prior to their departure to the NBE.

The BIG and the SEC have always made alot more money than ACC schools. It didnt matter as the ACC is the best bb league, just like the SEC is the best fb league. From 2014 to 2017 ACC football was running close to SEC football. Then the bottom fell off of ACC football in 2018 and 2019. SEC bb likely will have a similar dropoff while ACC basketball will regain its form. And since you want to talk about economics, I do believe the ACC has the highest paid college fb coach and the highest paid college basketball coach. None of the ACC schools are struggling like Uconn or UCLA. And Syracuse, Duke and UNC have enough money and bb clout that they can poach alot of P5 bb coaches.

And its nice of you to acknowledge how BE schools are doing so well inspite of the fact that they have alot less money than any P5 school, particularly your exalted SEC.

We will see how far the slipping goes. As to the Big East they don't have football budgets to support. They have more to spend on hoops and hoops coaches. And they are in a talent rich area for basketball. It's not lost on me that Clemson is improving in hoops and that Florida State has grown strong in it. Louisville will be fine. But those are schools that normally excel in football as well. And yes the football money is making a difference Cuseroc and it's about to be massively different. So I'd what the ACC was able to do relative to the Big 10 and SEC in the past isn't going to be exactly the same circumstances moving forward. By the time 2024 rolls around the SEC and Big 10 could easily be North of 70 million in per team media payouts. We know the bottom for the SEC will be ~66 million plus 4 more years of escalators. The Big 10's contract even if it receives a 5% bump will be right there too. And at that level we aren't talking a 10 million dollar gap. We are talking gaps approaching 30 million.

There is also an escalator aspect to the salaries. At some schools it politically not feasible to pay 5 million for a coach.

I believe it will be a factor down the road as the SEC is comfortable with salaries at that level while its further than a lot of Big East schools can handle.
02-22-2020 02:43 AM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
JRsec Offline
Super Moderator
*

Posts: 37,901
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 7737
I Root For: SEC
Location:
Post: #38
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
(02-22-2020 02:43 AM)Kit-Cat Wrote:  
(02-22-2020 01:15 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-22-2020 12:46 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  
(02-22-2020 12:07 AM)JRsec Wrote:  
(02-21-2020 11:57 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  We will see. But its much more probable that the ACC is in a down cycle rather than the SEC taking the ACC's place. Only folks who think that UNC, Syracuse and Virginia will continue to be down. No other league has a combo like Duke/UNC and no other league has a top four like Duke/UNC/Cuse/Ville with more than 50 final fours and 13 national championships between them. That doesnt even include NC State or Virginia

And of those Syracuse, Duke, and North Carolina will be retiring legends of coaches and then competing with better funded schools for the new ones. And why should you mention Virginia and N.C. State they just haven't been there very often. Was Valvano the last N.C. State coach to do it?

The door is going to be wide open. The SEC made it a priority the last year Slive was around. We're making steady progress. The Big East is looking stronger. The Big 10 is putting more money in to it as well and the evidence of what happens when a conference falls behind in salaries is fairly evident in the PAC. Time, Pressure and Economic Disparity have been changing things since 1992 and the beat goes on. But yes, we'll see.

By the way you should google the most recent Mercury News piece on UCLA and the administrative issues constraining the PAC. UCLA has had red ink in the last two seasons totaling 32 million. That's approaching UConn red ink levels prior to their departure to the NBE.

The BIG and the SEC have always made alot more money than ACC schools. It didnt matter as the ACC is the best bb league, just like the SEC is the best fb league. From 2014 to 2017 ACC football was running close to SEC football. Then the bottom fell off of ACC football in 2018 and 2019. SEC bb likely will have a similar dropoff while ACC basketball will regain its form. And since you want to talk about economics, I do believe the ACC has the highest paid college fb coach and the highest paid college basketball coach. None of the ACC schools are struggling like Uconn or UCLA. And Syracuse, Duke and UNC have enough money and bb clout that they can poach alot of P5 bb coaches.

And its nice of you to acknowledge how BE schools are doing so well inspite of the fact that they have alot less money than any P5 school, particularly your exalted SEC.

We will see how far the slipping goes. As to the Big East they don't have football budgets to support. They have more to spend on hoops and hoops coaches. And they are in a talent rich area for basketball. It's not lost on me that Clemson is improving in hoops and that Florida State has grown strong in it. Louisville will be fine. But those are schools that normally excel in football as well. And yes the football money is making a difference Cuseroc and it's about to be massively different. So I'd what the ACC was able to do relative to the Big 10 and SEC in the past isn't going to be exactly the same circumstances moving forward. By the time 2024 rolls around the SEC and Big 10 could easily be North of 70 million in per team media payouts. We know the bottom for the SEC will be ~66 million plus 4 more years of escalators. The Big 10's contract even if it receives a 5% bump will be right there too. And at that level we aren't talking a 10 million dollar gap. We are talking gaps approaching 30 million.

There is also an escalator aspect to the salaries. At some schools it politically not feasible to pay 5 million for a coach.

I believe it will be a factor down the road as the SEC is comfortable with salaries at that level while its further than a lot of Big East schools can handle.

No doubt. And it will wrought many changes some which I'm sure will not be welcomed. I think it will lead to different strata for competition than we know now and at the upper echelon will likely lead to athletics which will be compensated. And whether that alters the relationship between players and schools will likely determine how it alters the relationship of the fan to the player and of the fan to the sport.
02-22-2020 04:05 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
sierrajip Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,697
Joined: May 2011
Reputation: 187
I Root For: UCF
Location:
Post: #39
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
Is the recruiting among the ACC schools at a higher standard educationally than the SEC. That would be a big reason for the difference. The BIG has only one team that has been in the playoffs that has really made a difference. What are the different standards for each conference and does it make a difference in the current statuses.
02-22-2020 04:28 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
The Cutter of Bish Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 7,281
Joined: Mar 2013
Reputation: 217
I Root For: the little guy
Location:
Post: #40
RE: The OBE to ACC teams - floundering
For the ACC in general, I don't think the conference really challenged themselves in the non-conference. Some exceptions, of course, but, a bad non-conference SOS will hurt the metrics. Looking at the OBE's, it's mostly pretty lousy. Below is the NCSOS according to KenPom:

Syracuse: 223
Pitt: 299
VTech: 351
Miami: 157
BC: 240
Louisville: 214
Notre Dame: 350

And, is the ACC really "down" or is it a better year for parity? Maybe it's just both. When the success (or even challenges) aren't there in the non-conference, it kind of puts a ceiling in place for the conference. If you don't have a lot of representation in the top 25-30 of NET, I suspect there's little that can be done for the rest to really distinguish themselves, especially if the parity is there.
(This post was last modified: 02-22-2020 07:13 AM by The Cutter of Bish.)
02-22-2020 07:11 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.