2 NJCAA schools announced they where drooping yesterday. Northland and Dakota College at Bottinuea. Another add the sport as well at Sussex County CC in New Jersey. If the cost of travel was so bad? They could have added scholarships and get Stetson to join them and join the A-Sun part of the Big South. That would save some money. But, you also have North Florida in the same town and conference. They might be able to handle FCS football better. They could used the Pro stadium if they get an invite to FBS. Jacksonville did not have the ceiling to get to a higher conference, but UNF does.

(12-03-2019 11:54 AM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 11:32 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 10:37 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  They should focus on becoming a mid-major basketball power like they once were.

I had to look it up. Apparently they were pretty good 40 years ago.

They were good in the Sun Belt. They had Dee Brown.

They had Artis Gilmore who took them to the title game vs. UCLA.

(12-03-2019 01:49 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 11:54 AM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 11:32 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 10:37 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  They should focus on becoming a mid-major basketball power like they once were.

I had to look it up. Apparently they were pretty good 40 years ago.

They were good in the Sun Belt. They had Dee Brown.

They had Artis Gilmore who took them to the title game vs. UCLA.

That they did. Brown was foremost in my mind because he played for JU when they were in the Belt with ODU and VCU. Man, talk about a wacky conference: two Virginia schools, two Florida schools, two Alabama schools, one in North Carolina and Kentucky, and I think the league rule was you had to play basketball in a 10,000-seat arena.

Football can be a very pricy sport for small schools, especially if they are not in a conference where mostly bus travel is possible.

(12-03-2019 02:00 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Man, talk about a wacky conference: two Virginia schools, two Florida schools, two Alabama schools, one in North Carolina and Kentucky, and I think the league rule was you had to play basketball in a 10,000-seat arena.

Don’t forget New Orleans and Georgia State, although UNO got booted for the exact reason you mentioned.

If you check out some old articles, the Sun Belt was formed to be a southern version of the Big East, with basketball leading the way.

There was a push for a merger with the Metro in the 90’s. Instead, the Metro just plucked a few members until disintegrating.

(12-03-2019 03:20 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 02:00 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Man, talk about a wacky conference: two Virginia schools, two Florida schools, two Alabama schools, one in North Carolina and Kentucky, and I think the league rule was you had to play basketball in a 10,000-seat arena.

Don’t forget New Orleans and Georgia State, although UNO got booted for the exact reason you mentioned.

If you check out some old articles, the Sun Belt was formed to be a southern version of the Big East, with basketball leading the way.

There was a push for a merger with the Metro in the 90’s. Instead, the Metro just plucked a few members until disintegrating.

New Orleans got invited to joined the Southland after they announced that they would turn the club team to an FCS varsity team. 2015 was supposed to be their first year unless they used a carrot to get an invite, and once they got it and joined? They dropped the plan.

This is why A-Sun should pursue to go after the southern MEAC schools and D2 schools to form another FCS football conference. Staying at this number is not healthy when the football members would leave for another conference for all sports. At the lower level of D1? Inviting more members to join in your footprint could help cut the cost of travel for all sports. Jacksonville would still have football if more schools in their conference had football.

Pioneer Football is basically D-III football. The primary reason would be to attract more male students who pay full or most tuition. Alternately you have it because there is demand from the student body (boys already on campus). There is no revenue and it's very cheap to operate, except for equipment, liability insurance and travel. There is also the overhead and compliance, which while not huge, does drain time and some money from the athletic department. There is no fan base, and no revenue; so arguments based on that for it's existence are not valid.

It basically comes down to the department being willing to subsidize it a bit and spend some cycles administering it. Jacksonville decided it wasn't worth the hassle.

(12-03-2019 04:07 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Pioneer Football is basically D-III football. The primary reason would be to attract more male students who pay full or most tuition. Alternately you have it because there is demand from the student body (boys already on campus). There is no revenue and it's very cheap to operate, except for equipment, liability insurance and travel. There is also the overhead and compliance, which while not huge, does drain time and some money from the athletic department. There is no fan base, and no revenue; so arguments based on that for it's existence are not valid.

It basically comes down to the department being willing to subsidize it a bit and spend some cycles administering it. Jacksonville decided it wasn't worth the hassle.

The only reason we have non-scholarship football in DI is the DIII schools got tired of teams like Dayton and Wagner spending DI March Madness money on DIII football so the DIII schools pushed them out.

(12-03-2019 04:26 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 04:07 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Pioneer Football is basically D-III football. The primary reason would be to attract more male students who pay full or most tuition. Alternately you have it because there is demand from the student body (boys already on campus). There is no revenue and it's very cheap to operate, except for equipment, liability insurance and travel. There is also the overhead and compliance, which while not huge, does drain time and some money from the athletic department. There is no fan base, and no revenue; so arguments based on that for it's existence are not valid.

It basically comes down to the department being willing to subsidize it a bit and spend some cycles administering it. Jacksonville decided it wasn't worth the hassle.

The only reason we have non-scholarship football in DI is the DIII schools got tired of teams like Dayton and Wagner spending DI March Madness money on DIII football so the DIII schools pushed them out.

And bringing guys in on recruiting visits for the big basketball games when the arena was full or close to it for a game against someone the kids likely had heard of.

(12-03-2019 02:00 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 01:49 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 11:54 AM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 11:32 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 10:37 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  They should focus on becoming a mid-major basketball power like they once were.

I had to look it up. Apparently they were pretty good 40 years ago.

They were good in the Sun Belt. They had Dee Brown.

They had Artis Gilmore who took them to the title game vs. UCLA.

That they did. Brown was foremost in my mind because he played for JU when they were in the Belt with ODU and VCU. Man, talk about a wacky conference: two Virginia schools, two Florida schools, two Alabama schools, one in North Carolina and Kentucky, and I think the league rule was you had to play basketball in a 10,000-seat arena.

I was at USF in the 1980s when we were part of that Sun Belt. It really was a Fun Belt. Despite the wide-ranging geography, there was a common "sun belt" theme and the conference was tight-knit, just eight schools - USF, JAX, ODU, VCU, USA, UAB, WKU, UNCC.

Still miss it.

(12-03-2019 01:11 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 12:48 PM)panama Wrote:  I wonder what the alumni take is?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

If the alumni want a football program at expensive tiny private schools that no one has ever heard of, they need to step up and open their checkbooks. This is going to be the first of many of these dominoes to fall.

I've heard of Jacksonville. They have more basketball history than most non-FBS schools.

(12-03-2019 04:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I was at USF in the 1980s when we were part of that Sun Belt. It really was a Fun Belt. Despite the wide-ranging geography, there was a common "sun belt" theme and the conference was tight-knit, just eight schools - USF, JAX, ODU, VCU, USA, UAB, WKU, UNCC.

Still miss it.

I can see those four CSUA schools, plus MTSU breaking off and forming a more compact Basketball first FBS conference. Throw in a JMU, Marshall, Ohio U, maybe Miami U and you have something. ESPN ending many G5 Bowl tie-ins would make as split like this more attractive.

(12-03-2019 03:30 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 03:20 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 02:00 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Man, talk about a wacky conference: two Virginia schools, two Florida schools, two Alabama schools, one in North Carolina and Kentucky, and I think the league rule was you had to play basketball in a 10,000-seat arena.

Don’t forget New Orleans and Georgia State, although UNO got booted for the exact reason you mentioned.

If you check out some old articles, the Sun Belt was formed to be a southern version of the Big East, with basketball leading the way.

There was a push for a merger with the Metro in the 90’s. Instead, the Metro just plucked a few members until disintegrating.

New Orleans got invited to joined the Southland after they announced that they would turn the club team to an FCS varsity team. 2015 was supposed to be their first year unless they used a carrot to get an invite, and once they got it and joined? They dropped the plan.

This is why A-Sun should pursue to go after the southern MEAC schools and D2 schools to form another FCS football conference. Staying at this number is not healthy when the football members would leave for another conference for all sports. At the lower level of D1? Inviting more members to join in your footprint could help cut the cost of travel for all sports. Jacksonville would still have football if more schools in their conference had football.

I was talking about when they got booted in the early 80’s.

Another fun fact: UCF joined the Sun Belt in the early 90’s, but promptly quit a year later because they weren’t allowed to keep their own media deal or something.

(12-03-2019 04:45 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 04:36 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  I was at USF in the 1980s when we were part of that Sun Belt. It really was a Fun Belt. Despite the wide-ranging geography, there was a common "sun belt" theme and the conference was tight-knit, just eight schools - USF, JAX, ODU, VCU, USA, UAB, WKU, UNCC.

Still miss it.

I can see those four CSUA schools, plus MTSU breaking off and forming a more compact Basketball first FBS conference. Throw in a JMU, Marshall, Ohio U, maybe Miami U and you have something. ESPN ending many G5 Bowl tie-ins would make as split like this more attractive.

I really do not see Ohio and Miami being interested in that.

(12-03-2019 01:11 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 12:48 PM)panama Wrote:  I wonder what the alumni take is?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

If the alumni want a football program at expensive tiny private schools that no one has ever heard of, they need to step up and open their checkbooks. This is going to be the first of many of these dominoes to fall.

I doubt that. I mean Shorter and Reinhardt have football

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

(12-03-2019 03:20 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 02:00 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Man, talk about a wacky conference: two Virginia schools, two Florida schools, two Alabama schools, one in North Carolina and Kentucky, and I think the league rule was you had to play basketball in a 10,000-seat arena.

Don’t forget New Orleans and Georgia State, although UNO got booted for the exact reason you mentioned.

If you check out some old articles, the Sun Belt was formed to be a southern version of the Big East, with basketball leading the way.

There was a push for a merger with the Metro in the 90’s. Instead, the Metro just plucked a few members until disintegrating.

I think it was the largest arena in the area over 10k. Whatever way it was worded they wanted us in the Omni.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

With the Pioneer League as spread out as it is it's a miracle that it has remained intact for so long. With Presbyterian joining soon, I was thinking that the league was finally trying to become more regional.

Makes one wonder if Stetson’s next, of if it knew this was coming and they pitched themselves to the Patriot.

(12-03-2019 04:39 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 01:11 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(12-03-2019 12:48 PM)panama Wrote:  I wonder what the alumni take is?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

If the alumni want a football program at expensive tiny private schools that no one has ever heard of, they need to step up and open their checkbooks. This is going to be the first of many of these dominoes to fall.

I've heard of Jacksonville. They have more basketball history than most non-FBS schools.

Yeah nobody cares. They’ve made it to the tournament 4 times since their championship game appearance. No wins after that and no appearances since 1986.