The unofficial online home for fans of the University of Cincinnati Bearcats. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

(01-16-2020 01:59 PM)mlb Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 01:58 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 01:35 PM)mlb Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 01:31 PM)airjrdan08 Wrote:  I have lived in South Dayton for a few years now and haven't run into many "bad" UD fans. I was able to go to the VCU game, thanks to a co-worker and the rehab of UD arena was very well done. They are a legit team and will make some noise in March. Fun to watch.

Would love to play them every year!

I agree with this. I think UC wants to act like it is a blue blood when the last 10 years Dayton as had a lot more success. No issue with the UD fans in my neighborhood.

I do agree that UD and WSU should play every year, but they do have 3x as many fans at every game than WSU hence it would be a great deal for the raiders and a crappy deal for Dayton of they lost a home game every year. I'm not sure that TV would be interested in the game either.

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This just isn't true. The Bearcats have 5 more tournaments and have finished higher in the rankings almost every season. UD does have that one great tournament run but UC's been more successful.

Maybe I'm jaded, but UC's failures every year puts them behind Dayton, IMO. Dayton has had 3 coaches in that time frame, but still managed to have the elite 8 run and a NIT championship (I know, I know, Not in Tournament). UC consistently underachieved.

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An NIT championship would be worse than all but one uc season in the lost 10 years. Dayton has one deep run. It was awesome. Loyala had one too. Success isn't measured by one deep run.

I've read so called "experts" who believe that the NIT champ typically would be a sweet 16 team. So... I wouldn't say UC bowing out the 1st weekend is better. That being said, I would not trade a NCAA appearance for a NIT championship.

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(01-16-2020 02:07 PM)mlb Wrote:  I've read so called "experts" who believe that the NIT champ typically would be a sweet 16 team.

A HOF take right here.

(01-16-2020 02:07 PM)mlb Wrote:  I've read so called "experts" who believe that the NIT champ typically would be a sweet 16 team. So... I wouldn't say UC bowing out the 1st weekend is better. That being said, I would not trade a NCAA appearance for a NIT championship.

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Possible, but purely hypothetical. An NIT champ is a team that got hot at almost the right time. By that I mean they didn't perform well enough down the stretch to make the NCAA, but were playing well enough to string together wins in the postseason so they may well have advanced with a couple of wins in the NCAA.

For the universities, financially, and in terms of national exposure any NCAA single game appearance beats advancing in the NIT hands down.

Anyone who thinks Dayton has had more success than UC over the last ten years in college basketball is either an unabashed UD homer or does not understand college basketball. Nine consecutive NCAA tournament appearances, not to mention conference championships and tournament championships, first-team All-Americans (SK), numerous Top 10, Top 20 and Top 25 appearances, etc. certainly trump the one UD run under Archie.

(01-16-2020 03:26 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Anyone who thinks Dayton has had more success than UC over the last ten years in college basketball is either an unabashed UD homer or does not understand college basketball. Nine consecutive NCAA tournament appearances, not to mention conference championships and tournament championships, first-team All-Americans (SK), numerous Top 10, Top 20 and Top 25 appearances, etc. certainly trump the one UD run under Archie.

If you can't win in March then who cares about all of that? Their elite 8 run was more exciting than all 9 UC tourneys during that time.

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All that matters in CBB is how far you go in the tournament.

(01-16-2020 03:14 PM)OKIcat Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 02:07 PM)mlb Wrote:  I've read so called "experts" who believe that the NIT champ typically would be a sweet 16 team. So... I wouldn't say UC bowing out the 1st weekend is better. That being said, I would not trade a NCAA appearance for a NIT championship.

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Possible, but purely hypothetical. An NIT champ is a team that got hot at almost the right time. By that I mean they didn't perform well enough down the stretch to make the NCAA, but were playing well enough to string together wins in the postseason so they may well have advanced with a couple of wins in the NCAA.

For the universities, financially, and in terms of national exposure any NCAA single game appearance beats advancing in the NIT hands down.

Someone has to win the NIT. I think it tells you very little about how they'd do in the NCAA tournament.

The tournament has expanded so much that the last at-large team is somewhere between the 50th and 60th best in the country. If you can't make that cut, you aren't close to a Sweet 16 team. Beating a few teams in the NIT who also didn't make that cut doesn't change that.

(01-16-2020 03:51 PM)levydl Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 03:14 PM)OKIcat Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 02:07 PM)mlb Wrote:  I've read so called "experts" who believe that the NIT champ typically would be a sweet 16 team. So... I wouldn't say UC bowing out the 1st weekend is better. That being said, I would not trade a NCAA appearance for a NIT championship.

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Possible, but purely hypothetical. An NIT champ is a team that got hot at almost the right time. By that I mean they didn't perform well enough down the stretch to make the NCAA, but were playing well enough to string together wins in the postseason so they may well have advanced with a couple of wins in the NCAA.

For the universities, financially, and in terms of national exposure any NCAA single game appearance beats advancing in the NIT hands down.

Someone has to win the NIT. I think it tells you very little about how they'd do in the NCAA tournament.

The tournament has expanded so much that the last at-large team is somewhere between the 50th and 60th best in the country. If you can't make that cut, you aren't close to a Sweet 16 team. Beating a few teams in the NIT who also didn't make that cut doesn't change that.

I mean I think plenty of NIT teams COULD make the Sweet 16. There's a lot of randomness to march and teams around their quality make it somewhat regularly. But I agree winning the NIT is not indicative of a sweet 16 type team.

(01-16-2020 03:44 PM)mlb Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 03:26 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Anyone who thinks Dayton has had more success than UC over the last ten years in college basketball is either an unabashed UD homer or does not understand college basketball. Nine consecutive NCAA tournament appearances, not to mention conference championships and tournament championships, first-team All-Americans (SK), numerous Top 10, Top 20 and Top 25 appearances, etc. certainly trump the one UD run under Archie.

If you can't win in March then who cares about all of that? Their elite 8 run was more exciting than all 9 UC tourneys during that time.

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(01-16-2020 03:51 PM)Dannyboy Wrote:  All that matters in CBB is how far you go in the tournament.

Someone needs to tell all the season ticket holders to quit wasting their time and money on 4 months of exhibition games.

I would never argue that the tournament isn't the most important thing in any given year but it's far from the only important thing. There's no way in hell I'd trade all the accomplishments of the last decade for the hot 3-4 game runs of UD and Loyola.

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(01-16-2020 03:44 PM)mlb Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 03:26 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Anyone who thinks Dayton has had more success than UC over the last ten years in college basketball is either an unabashed UD homer or does not understand college basketball. Nine consecutive NCAA tournament appearances, not to mention conference championships and tournament championships, first-team All-Americans (SK), numerous Top 10, Top 20 and Top 25 appearances, etc. certainly trump the one UD run under Archie.

If you can't win in March then who cares about all of that? Their elite 8 run was more exciting than all 9 UC tourneys during that time.

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If you want to argue it was more exciting, fine. To each their own.

But in no universe has Dayton been more successful over the last decade.

(01-16-2020 03:51 PM)levydl Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 03:14 PM)OKIcat Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 02:07 PM)mlb Wrote:  I've read so called "experts" who believe that the NIT champ typically would be a sweet 16 team. So... I wouldn't say UC bowing out the 1st weekend is better. That being said, I would not trade a NCAA appearance for a NIT championship.

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Possible, but purely hypothetical. An NIT champ is a team that got hot at almost the right time. By that I mean they didn't perform well enough down the stretch to make the NCAA, but were playing well enough to string together wins in the postseason so they may well have advanced with a couple of wins in the NCAA.

For the universities, financially, and in terms of national exposure any NCAA single game appearance beats advancing in the NIT hands down.

Someone has to win the NIT. I think it tells you very little about how they'd do in the NCAA tournament.

The tournament has expanded so much that the last at-large team is somewhere between the 50th and 60th best in the country. If you can't make that cut, you aren't close to a Sweet 16 team. Beating a few teams in the NIT who also didn't make that cut doesn't change that.

The NIT was still a decent tournament when the NCAA was 48 teams, but the expansion of the NCAA to 64 teams and beyond rendered the NIT totally meaningless.

The NIT is like the Poulan Weedeater Bowl.

Entertaining to watch, but it doesn't really matter.

(01-16-2020 11:11 PM)Bruce Monnin Wrote:  The NIT is like the Poulan Weedeater Bowl.

Entertaining to watch, but it doesn't really matter.

I can't remember the last time I watched an NIT game. Well, whenever the last time UC was in one most likely.

(01-16-2020 03:51 PM)Dannyboy Wrote:  All that matters in CBB is how far you go in the tournament.

This. At some point you have to win in March. For the rest of college basketball this is how success is measured. Unfortunately, UC is the king of beating lesser competition and usually bowing to equal/greater competition. Here are some sobering stats against regional competition since 2000.

Overall: 61-54 (outlier is 9-0 against Miami(oh))

UK/UofL/Eggs/That Team from Columbus: 20-31

UD/WVU/Pitt/Butler: 14-19

UC is no longer dominate. Teams do not remember Hugg's teams. They see a potential win on the schedule.

(01-17-2020 08:43 AM)bearcatmill Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 03:51 PM)Dannyboy Wrote:  All that matters in CBB is how far you go in the tournament.

This. At some point you have to win in March. For the rest of college basketball this is how success is measured. Unfortunately, UC is the king of beating lesser competition and usually bowing to equal/greater competition. Here are some sobering stats against regional competition since 2000.

Overall: 61-54 (outlier is 9-0 against Miami(oh))

UK/UofL/Eggs/That Team from Columbus: 20-31

UD/WVU/Pitt/Butler: 14-19

UC is no longer dominate. Teams do not remember Hugg's teams. They see a potential win on the schedule.

And this is why we should all be happy we've moved on from Mick. Onward and Upward.

Terrible decision to play Dayton. Top 5 team, best college player.

(03-04-2020 10:59 PM)mlb Wrote:  Terrible decision to play Dayton. Top 5 team, best college player.

Dayton's offense this year is what I hope UC's can be when brannen gets his guys and more time here.

(01-16-2020 03:26 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Anyone who thinks Dayton has had more success than UC over the last ten years in college basketball is either an unabashed UD homer or does not understand college basketball. Nine consecutive NCAA tournament appearances, not to mention conference championships and tournament championships, first-team All-Americans (SK), numerous Top 10, Top 20 and Top 25 appearances, etc. certainly trump the one UD run under Archie.

Over the 10 years UC has an all american. not plural. And Obi is about to top that and be national player of the year. Daytons elite 8 run managing to beat OSU...something we havent done since way before i was born, not to mention what they have done this year plus the massive mick cronin collapse of nevada....Yea. Im going Dayton more success here.

Making the tournament is great, but if you dont get out of the first round....were you even there?

(03-05-2020 07:54 AM)coachpipe Wrote:  

(01-16-2020 03:26 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  Anyone who thinks Dayton has had more success than UC over the last ten years in college basketball is either an unabashed UD homer or does not understand college basketball. Nine consecutive NCAA tournament appearances, not to mention conference championships and tournament championships, first-team All-Americans (SK), numerous Top 10, Top 20 and Top 25 appearances, etc. certainly trump the one UD run under Archie.

Over the 10 years UC has an all american. not plural. And Obi is about to top that and be national player of the year. Daytons elite 8 run managing to beat OSU...something we havent done since way before i was born, not to mention what they have done this year plus the massive mick cronin collapse of nevada....Yea. Im going Dayton more success here.

Making the tournament is great, but if you dont get out of the first round....were you even there?

And Dayton's (truly) amazing one season run means their coach will be the most marketable nationally come April when desperate major seven conference programs open their checkbooks. Does Dayton have the ability to, or the will to, match dollars? Recent past history (Archie Miller, Brian Gregory) suggests they will not.