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8 Team Playoff?
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YNot Online
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Post: #21
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 04:28 PM)NoQuarterBrigade Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 12:34 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  I'm the weirdo that wants a 6 team play-off
[Image: 6-team-bracket-1024x724.jpg]

IMHO you should get something for finishing #1 and #2...and in this set up you do, a bye game.

It would also limit the amount of games games while still allowing 6 teams in. I would say 60% of the time the champ would only have to play 2 games while 40% of the time the champ plays 3 games. Football is tough on these kids bodies so I like limiting the amount of games.

I actually wish they could do 12 teams and have all the NewYears six bowls be apart of it. But take the best four wins decided by some predetermined guidelines, not decided by a committee, because we all know they would screw it up with SEC bias. And finish off with a four team playoff from there. I am a weirdo too I guess.

Automatic bids for all 10 conferences and a handful of wild cards...but like the NCAA basketball tournament, have some play-in games.

PLAY-IN (week after CCGs)
MAC champ at Appalachian State (Sun Belt)
CUSA champ at Boise State (MWC)

ROUND 1 (weekend before Christmas)
Play-In (Boise?) v. Oregon (PAC)
Play-In (App St?) v. SMU (AAC)
Wild Card: LSU v. Notre Dame
Wild Card: Florida v. Penn State

NY4 QUARTERFINALS (New Year's)
Sugar: Round 1 (SMU?) v. Alabama (SEC)
Rose: Round 1 (Oregon?) v. Ohio State (B1G)
Orange: Wild Card v. Clemson (ACC)
Cotton: Wild Card v. Oklahoma (B12)

SEMIFINALS (first Saturday or Monday that is at least one week after New Year's)
NY4 winners at Miami, FL and Indianapolis, IN (future CFP Championship venues)

CHAMPIONSHIP (week after Semifinals)
Seminfinal winners at New Orleans, LA
10-22-2019 07:23 PM
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sfink16 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 07:23 PM)YNot Wrote:  Automatic bids for all 10 conferences and a handful of wild cards...but like the NCAA basketball tournament, have some play-in games.

PLAY-IN (week after CCGs)
MAC champ at Appalachian State (Sun Belt)
CUSA champ at Boise State (MWC)

ROUND 1 (weekend before Christmas)
Play-In (Boise?) v. Oregon (PAC)
Play-In (App St?) v. SMU (AAC)
Wild Card: LSU v. Notre Dame
Wild Card: Florida v. Penn State

NY4 QUARTERFINALS (New Year's)
Sugar: Round 1 (SMU?) v. Alabama (SEC)
Rose: Round 1 (Oregon?) v. Ohio State (B1G)
Orange: Wild Card v. Clemson (ACC)
Cotton: Wild Card v. Oklahoma (B12)

SEMIFINALS (first Saturday or Monday that is at least one week after New Year's)
NY4 winners at Miami, FL and Indianapolis, IN (future CFP Championship venues)

CHAMPIONSHIP (week after Semifinals)
Seminfinal winners at New Orleans, LA

This is "YNot". Let's look at the possibility of Boise making it to the championship game. That's 5 extra games, or 18 total games in the season. With your schedule, when do the students have time for their December exams? After all, these are students are they not? When are fans actually going to tune in or go to games to turn a profit? This is debatable, but it's unlikely in the early rounds. What about travel and places to hold the games. Is it fair for Boise to travel to Orlando to play Florida for example? Is that fair to the fans of Boise, or their students?

And the number one reason, drum-roll please, the P5 controls it and says no way.
10-22-2019 07:36 PM
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Post: #23
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 06:32 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 04:39 PM)8BitPirate Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 01:16 PM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  
(10-20-2019 08:34 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  It's more than a shame. It, the NY6, and the P5/G5 pecking order is a rigged system that violates fundamental principles of equal treatment and fair play intrinsic to the U.S. Constitution.

Our Constitution doesn't have anything to do with Football.

But these public institutions and their actions and activities are bound by the Constitution...I would think....

Aye, that's the point.

As I see it, the AAC and the rest of the G5 and independents have all been a bunch of $ucker$ or pu$$ie$, because they were essentially raped by the P5 and left with nothing but a "take it or leave it" so-called "offer." They had a civil recourse and were either too dumb or too scared to take advantage of it. But it may not be too late to seek constitutional or redress.

The Constitution of the United States establishes America's national government and fundamental laws, and guarantees certain basic rights for its citizens. None of that has anything to do with football, or public institutions, or G5, or, well, you get my point.
10-22-2019 08:14 PM
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Post: #24
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 01:16 PM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  
(10-20-2019 08:34 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  It's more than a shame. It, the NY6, and the P5/G5 pecking order is a rigged system that violates fundamental principles of equal treatment and fair play intrinsic to the U.S. Constitution.

Our Constitution doesn't have anything to do with Football.

I'm not so sure about that.
10-22-2019 08:32 PM
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vick mike Offline
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Post: #25
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 07:36 PM)sfink16 Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 07:23 PM)YNot Wrote:  Automatic bids for all 10 conferences and a handful of wild cards...but like the NCAA basketball tournament, have some play-in games.

PLAY-IN (week after CCGs)
MAC champ at Appalachian State (Sun Belt)
CUSA champ at Boise State (MWC)

ROUND 1 (weekend before Christmas)
Play-In (Boise?) v. Oregon (PAC)
Play-In (App St?) v. SMU (AAC)
Wild Card: LSU v. Notre Dame
Wild Card: Florida v. Penn State

NY4 QUARTERFINALS (New Year's)
Sugar: Round 1 (SMU?) v. Alabama (SEC)
Rose: Round 1 (Oregon?) v. Ohio State (B1G)
Orange: Wild Card v. Clemson (ACC)
Cotton: Wild Card v. Oklahoma (B12)

SEMIFINALS (first Saturday or Monday that is at least one week after New Year's)
NY4 winners at Miami, FL and Indianapolis, IN (future CFP Championship venues)

CHAMPIONSHIP (week after Semifinals)
Seminfinal winners at New Orleans, LA

This is "YNot". Let's look at the possibility of Boise making it to the championship game. That's 5 extra games, or 18 total games in the season. With your schedule, when do the students have time for their December exams? After all, these are students are they not? When are fans actually going to tune in or go to games to turn a profit? This is debatable, but it's unlikely in the early rounds. What about travel and places to hold the games. Is it fair for Boise to travel to Orlando to play Florida for example? Is that fair to the fans of Boise, or their students?

And the number one reason, drum-roll please, the P5 controls it and says no way.

FCS has a 20 team playoff. None of those players will play after college. No reason a 16 team FBS playoff wouldn’t work.
10-22-2019 08:38 PM
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mikeinoki Offline
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Post: #26
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 08:14 PM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 06:32 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 04:39 PM)8BitPirate Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 01:16 PM)BartlettTigerFan Wrote:  
(10-20-2019 08:34 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  It's more than a shame. It, the NY6, and the P5/G5 pecking order is a rigged system that violates fundamental principles of equal treatment and fair play intrinsic to the U.S. Constitution.

Our Constitution doesn't have anything to do with Football.

But these public institutions and their actions and activities are bound by the Constitution...I would think....

Aye, that's the point.

As I see it, the AAC and the rest of the G5 and independents have all been a bunch of $ucker$ or pu$$ie$, because they were essentially raped by the P5 and left with nothing but a "take it or leave it" so-called "offer." They had a civil recourse and were either too dumb or too scared to take advantage of it. But it may not be too late to seek constitutional or redress.

The Constitution of the United States establishes America's national government and fundamental laws, and guarantees certain basic rights for its citizens. None of that has anything to do with football, or public institutions, or G5, or, well, you get my point.

"Sir, in Las Vegas, the boys would say you're trying to make your point the hard way." Lt. Holden, Operation Petticoat, 1959

Forget lawsuits, principles, rights or whatever. The P5 has money and exposure, the whole pie, and we want a slice of it. They're not going to hand it over nicely. You make a deal. They have to get something they want so that we get something we want.
10-22-2019 08:45 PM
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gotigers1 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
If it goes to 8, I'm afraid that would lock the little guy out even more
10-22-2019 09:29 PM
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sfink16 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 08:38 PM)vick mike Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 07:36 PM)sfink16 Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 07:23 PM)YNot Wrote:  Automatic bids for all 10 conferences and a handful of wild cards...but like the NCAA basketball tournament, have some play-in games.

PLAY-IN (week after CCGs)
MAC champ at Appalachian State (Sun Belt)
CUSA champ at Boise State (MWC)

ROUND 1 (weekend before Christmas)
Play-In (Boise?) v. Oregon (PAC)
Play-In (App St?) v. SMU (AAC)
Wild Card: LSU v. Notre Dame
Wild Card: Florida v. Penn State

NY4 QUARTERFINALS (New Year's)
Sugar: Round 1 (SMU?) v. Alabama (SEC)
Rose: Round 1 (Oregon?) v. Ohio State (B1G)
Orange: Wild Card v. Clemson (ACC)
Cotton: Wild Card v. Oklahoma (B12)

SEMIFINALS (first Saturday or Monday that is at least one week after New Year's)
NY4 winners at Miami, FL and Indianapolis, IN (future CFP Championship venues)

CHAMPIONSHIP (week after Semifinals)
Seminfinal winners at New Orleans, LA

This is "YNot". Let's look at the possibility of Boise making it to the championship game. That's 5 extra games, or 18 total games in the season. With your schedule, when do the students have time for their December exams? After all, these are students are they not? When are fans actually going to tune in or go to games to turn a profit? This is debatable, but it's unlikely in the early rounds. What about travel and places to hold the games. Is it fair for Boise to travel to Orlando to play Florida for example? Is that fair to the fans of Boise, or their students?

And the number one reason, drum-roll please, the P5 controls it and says no way.

FCS has a 20 team playoff. None of those players will play after college. No reason a 16 team FBS playoff wouldn’t work.

Jaws went to Youngstown State. Phil Simms went to Moorehead State. Howie Long and Brian Westbrook went to Villanova.

That said, FCS doesn't have a P5 power player. FCS doesn't appear to have divisions in their conferences so they do not play conference championship games. I looked at one team (Sacramento State) and some years they were playing 10 games, other years 11, and this year 12, so I don't know how many games is their normal schedule.
(This post was last modified: 10-22-2019 09:59 PM by sfink16.)
10-22-2019 09:51 PM
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jedclampett Offline
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Post: #29
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
This is "YNot". Let's look at the possibility of Boise making it to the championship game. That's 5 extra games, or 18 total games in the season. With your schedule, when do the students have time for their December exams? After all, these are students are they not? When are fans actually going to tune in or go to games to turn a profit? This is debatable, but it's unlikely in the early rounds. What about travel and places to hold the games. Is it fair for Boise to travel to Orlando to play Florida for example? Is that fair to the fans of Boise, or their students?
[/quote]

4 or 5 extra games is out of the question, no doubt, but there is another alternative - - push the OOC games to the last four games of the regular season, seed them like the NCAA tournament, and play those 4 games as rounds 1-4 of an FBS playoff system.

It's a bit detailed, so I'll post it in a new thread that might be of interest.
10-22-2019 10:05 PM
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mikeinoki Offline
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Post: #30
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 09:29 PM)gotigers1 Wrote:  If it goes to 8, I'm afraid that would lock the little guy out even more

The P5 has this thing sewn up. Paying off Notre Dame with a separate deal and giving them an equal vote with the 10 conferences on the CFP governance committee was genius. The 11 members of the governance committee elect the selection committee. Notre Dame is paid off to vote with the P5. Therefore a voting block of 6 against 5. So, out of the 13 members voted to the selection committee, how many do you imagine are G5 reps this year? One. One stinking member, the Arkansas State AD. Why do you think teams like UCF never ranked higher? Answer: No representation.

The AAC needs to do an end around, a back door negotiation with an underrepresented P5 conference like the PAC. Swing one vote over to negotiate a better deal for an 8 team (or however many) playoff. Maybe it could be done with 2 conferences. Fix it so they believe they will make the playoff every year while guaranteeing at least one non-P5 gets in.

A whole separate issue is the money. The P5 conferences are automatically getting roughly 78.5% of the primary payout, before bonuses for teams making the playoff, APR bonuses, etc.
(This post was last modified: 10-23-2019 12:45 PM by mikeinoki.)
10-22-2019 10:25 PM
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GoOwls111 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 06:44 PM)mustangxc Wrote:  8 team playoff with 5 automatic spots for P5 conference champions. 1 spot for the highest ranked G5 champion. 2 at-large.

So most here are OK with half of the FBS having their champion guaranteed a play of spot and the other half of the FBS fighting for 1 spot?

- I could live with 6 if the AAC was #6 (Don't like 8, it just give 2 A5 more money)
- 10 teams would be the best option with all 10 conference champs being represented (No at-large, those will always go to A5 teams)
(This post was last modified: 10-23-2019 04:30 PM by GoOwls111.)
10-23-2019 07:35 AM
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CoastalJuan Offline
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Post: #32
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 02:29 PM)vick mike Wrote:  Disagree with the requirement that a non-P5 has to by#8 to get in the 8 team playoff. Guess where they would finish every year? #9 by coincidence?
10 team playoff, every conference champ, top 6 get a bye.
12 teams ok also adding 2 at large.
Personally I approve of a 16 team playoff, 10 conference champs plus 6 at large.
FCS has a 20 team playoff.

I do find that part ridiculous. Everyone is worried about the extra game or two, but for a lot of the kids (especially those in the top 25), these are basically their internships to get a job in the league. FCS is playing more games despite having very little chance or those games leading to a career.
10-23-2019 11:16 AM
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YNot Online
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Post: #33
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 10:05 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  This is "YNot". Let's look at the possibility of Boise making it to the championship game. That's 5 extra games, or 18 total games in the season. With your schedule, when do the students have time for their December exams? After all, these are students are they not? When are fans actually going to tune in or go to games to turn a profit? This is debatable, but it's unlikely in the early rounds. What about travel and places to hold the games. Is it fair for Boise to travel to Orlando to play Florida for example? Is that fair to the fans of Boise, or their students?

I agree that it won't happen. But, it would be awesome and the teams, student-athletes, and fans would love it. Neither Boise State nor any other school outside of the top-4 would turn down CFP access, even if it meant the *possibility* of 4 or 5 extra games.

Does anyone think Boise State would play in the National Championship game a month after the first Play-In game? Even Boise State? They would have to beat the CUSA champ at home, then travel to Eugene and beat Oregon. THEN, Boise would need to beat Ohio State in the Rose Bowl AND THEN Clemson, LSU, or Notre Dame in a semifinal game. That would not happen...Boise State starts in the PLAY-IN round because they are the 7th best conference champion (or 4th worst) and ranked outside the top-10.

But, EVEN IF that scenario played out, Boise State would be thrilled to have the chance.

December exams? Red herring. How do the FCS student-athletes do it now? How do the teams that play in CCGS and then mid-December bowl games do it now?

Travel and Logistics? Play-In and early round games would likely be held at home stadiums. This eliminates travel for half of the participants and ensures good attendance.

Television? Fans will absolutely tune in to these games. Everyone loves a knock-out game. The CCGs get fantastic TV ratings in early December and
the pre-Christmas exhibition bowl games among weaker FBS teams get solid TV ratings.
10-23-2019 11:19 AM
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Atlanta Offline
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Post: #34
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-23-2019 07:35 AM)GoOwls111 Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 06:44 PM)mustangxc Wrote:  8 team playoff with 5 automatic spots for P5 conference champions. 1 spot for the highest ranked G5 champion. 2 at-large.

So most here are OK with half of the FBS having their champion guaranteed a play of spot and the other half of the FBS fighting for 1 spot?

- I could live with 6 if the AAC was #6 (Don't like 8, it just give 2 A5 more money)
- 10 teams would be the best option with all 12 conference champs being represented (No at-large, those will always go to A5 teams)

Shouldn't have ANY conference champion guaranteed a slot based upon the conference name. Rather the top 6,8, or 10 conference champions should receive a slot based upon the overall conference strength as measured by some objective measurement at the end of the regular season each year. This would place a value on games played during the regular season both within conference & OOC (SOS). Have non - champions complete the field based upon an objective ranking. And then have a 8 or 16 playoff.
10-23-2019 03:22 PM
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GoOwls111 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
I think the reason we have CFP post season format is because no one trusted the BCS format (and of course more money)...

The reason most fans want a Champion from each FBS conference is because no one trusts the CFP selection comity (and of course more money)...

And I believe that somehow there will be a way to make it work with all the conference Champions to try to quiet the critics, (and of course more money)...
10-23-2019 04:41 PM
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jedclampett Offline
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Post: #36
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
I'm fine with the SEC/Big12/Big10/ACC/AAC/Pac12 getting bids for their champions, plus two at-large.
[/quote]

It would be more equitable if one of those at-large bids goes to the top G4 or independent team.

Yes, the AAC should have the same opportunity that the P5 have, but the 56 G4 and independents should get at least 1/4 of the opportunity that the AAC has. The P5 has treated the G5 in a despicable manner, and it would be hypocritical for the AAC to behave just as despicably toward the G4 once we're fully considered a power conference.


That is different than the 5 P5 champs getting bids, plus two at-large, plus a "G5 rep" even if they are ranked 19th. Not cool with that.
[/quote]

I'm not cool with that either, because the AAC would be in the same situation we're in now. But if we don't want to be as corrupt as the P5, it's only befitting to give one auto-bid to the best G4 or independent team (which would most likely go to schools like BYU, Notre Dame, Army, Boise, etc).

No conference should have an auto-bid. Just play the best 6 teams from 6 different conferences plus 2 at-large. I wouldn't care if it was 4 P5, the AAC and App State.
[/quote]

The problem with that argument is that the AAC, G4, and independents would be left out in the cold until we have a consensus top 6 team. Among these 67 universities, only ND has ever finished in the top 6 during the P5/G5 era. So the AAC would continue to be frozen out of the 8 team series most years, the way we are now.

.
The NCAA Tournament is what it is, because it has always given every conference an auto-bid. No harm would be done if one of 8 playoff bids went to the top G4 or independent team, when you consider that those bids would typically go to teams such as ND, Army, Boise, or BYU.

Beyond that, it would benefit the FBS playoff series by giving it some semblance of fairness & equal treatment. The present system is tainted and corrupt, and an 8 team playoff can become more respectable by including a provision that allows teams at least broadly representative of all conferences.

Auto bids to the AAC and one of the G4/indies would make it impossible to allow another situation like the exclusion of an undefeated G4 or AAC team from the playoff, which happened to UCF recently.
10-23-2019 05:45 PM
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Post: #37
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-22-2019 06:44 PM)mustangxc Wrote:  8 team playoff with 5 automatic spots for P5 conference champions. 1 spot for the highest ranked G5 champion. 2 at-large.

This is the model I'd be in favor of. Most years it would come down just the AAC and MW but this year you'd have the MW, AAC, and Sunbelt all vying for that spot. Great drama.
10-23-2019 05:58 PM
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jedclampett Offline
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Post: #38
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-23-2019 05:58 PM)APPdiesel Wrote:  
(10-22-2019 06:44 PM)mustangxc Wrote:  8 team playoff with 5 automatic spots for P5 conference champions. 1 spot for the highest ranked G5 champion. 2 at-large.

This is the model I'd be in favor of. Most years it would come down just the AAC and MW but this year you'd have the MW, AAC, and Sunbelt all vying for that spot. Great drama.

Since this is the AAC message board, I doubt that many here will agree, because the AAC is as good as one of the P5 conferences this year.

But I do think that the G4 and independents should have an auto-bid. This year, you, Boise, and Notre Dame (if classified as an independent) would be competing for that spot, not against any AAC teams. But to be fairer to the rest, perhaps Notre Dame should be considered as an AAC member.

Why should App St. have to compete with the G4s, independents, and the AAC for a spot? One at-large team, 7 auto-bids, with one from the G4/indies. If you're from App State or any of the G4s, that would make more sense for your team.
10-24-2019 01:58 AM
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Atlanta Offline
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Post: #39
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
All of you guys who are "fine" with the P5...............it's BS. No conference should receive anything based upon some fixed designation that doesn't consider performance of the conference during the current year played - in-conference & OOC. And only the gullible would believe "at-large" has any meaning any other than more P-5 slots. I agree that conference champs should be designated a slot but the conferences should have to compete for their ranking based upon games played, wins, losses & SOS - and then complete the field with the best non-champs without regard to conference based upon their wins, losses & SOS. There needs to be some aspect of SOS receiving substantial weight in the consideration process so that the conferences of so-called bluebloods have to play some more competitive games OOC - to prove they are worthy rather than some ingrown logic based upon tradition. This means Bama, Clemson, UGA, Ohio St etc have to play some competitive OOC games - and that even the Vandy, Indiana, Kansas, & Boston College types have to play competitive OOC games if their conference is to receive a proper ranking to get the auto-slots each year. This should be baked in for an 8 or 16 team playoff.
10-24-2019 09:35 AM
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Post: #40
RE: 8 Team Playoff?
(10-24-2019 09:35 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  All of you guys who are "fine" with the P5...............it's BS. No conference should receive anything based upon some fixed designation that doesn't consider performance of the conference during the current year played - in-conference & OOC. And only the gullible would believe "at-large" has any meaning any other than more P-5 slots. I agree that conference champs should be designated a slot but the conferences should have to compete for their ranking based upon games played, wins, losses & SOS - and then complete the field with the best non-champs without regard to conference based upon their wins, losses & SOS. There needs to be some aspect of SOS receiving substantial weight in the consideration process so that the conferences of so-called bluebloods have to play some more competitive games OOC - to prove they are worthy rather than some ingrown logic based upon tradition. This means Bama, Clemson, UGA, Ohio St etc have to play some competitive OOC games - and that even the Vandy, Indiana, Kansas, & Boston College types have to play competitive OOC games if their conference is to receive a proper ranking to get the auto-slots each year. This should be baked in for an 8 or 16 team playoff.

That's all fine and good, but we're managing expectations. i.e. we expect to have a shot at the playoff if we produce a great team in an 8-team playoff system, but aren't going to throw a (big) tantrum if 5 of those spots are locked up by the more established conferences. That's what most of us mean by "fine".
10-24-2019 11:26 AM
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