The ACC wanted a FB school for Maryland's replacement. Louisville was the obvious choice. It was a bonus that Louisville was also a Basketball school too. UConn, Nova, et al never had a chance. FSU and Clemson were watching and might have bolted to the Big 12 if UConn was selected.

I think only Cincy was a suitable alternate.

I think Georgetown and Villanova tried to market themselves as potential non-fb adds to the ACC. Obviously they didn’t get anywhere

(06-01-2020 11:42 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I think Georgetown and Villanova tried to market themselves as potential non-fb adds to the ACC. Obviously they didn’t get anywhere

It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

(06-01-2020 09:17 AM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 08:06 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 07:20 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  Pretty Good report about UCONN & why they are not in a Power 5 (ACC... talks about the 2003 lawsuit agaisnt BC) also they talk about the 40Miliion in red.... ..

UConn fans who have always insisted that those 2003 lawsuits vs Miami and then BC have nothing to do with no ACC invite have IMO always been fooling themselves. Memories in academia are very long and can become institutionalized even after the particular personalities involved leave the scene.

Heck, this article from 2010, written from the BC point of view and shortly before the major realignment that destroyed the Big East, talks about the "bad blood" between BC and UConn stemming from the suits being very evident on the BC side seven years after those lawsuits were filed. It talks about how despite many efforts over those years (2003 - 2010) by UConn to bury the hatchet, BC was continuing to freeze out UConn:

https://www.bcinterruption.com/2010/5/1/...uits-could

The article is also a good read because it was prescient: It talks about how, because of the bad blood, UConn football could be severely hurt should the B1G poach Rutgers, Syracuse and Pitt, thereby destroying Big East football, as the ACC would be the only good landing spot for UConn and that would likely be precluded. At the time, it was the B1G that was in expansion mode not the ACC, but the ACC and B1G poaching that came within a year or two certainly produced the outcome the writer speculated about, and he obviously was pretty accurate in his speculations about which schools might get invites elsewhere.

I'm not going to argue that the lawsuit helped anything in the long run however, I think UConn not being in the P5 has much more to do with the fact that we didn't even start playing at the FBS level until 2000. There are no P5 members that joined the FBS ranks that recently and it wouldn't surprise me if there never are.

Blumenthal thought he could cow the League with very invasive depositions of the ACC Staff in Greensboro. VERY INVASIVE. That might work in NYC or Philly, but the game is not played that way in NC. Litigation is no big deal, but certain questions in a deposition are a declaration of war.

(06-01-2020 11:23 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  The ACC wanted a FB school for Maryland's replacement. Louisville was the obvious choice. It was a bonus that Louisville was also a Basketball school too. UConn, Nova, et al never had a chance. FSU and Clemson were watching and might have bolted to the Big 12 if UConn was selected.

I think only Cincy was a suitable alternate.

UConn was never going to get the votes from the football schools - Miami, FSU, GT, Clemson, NC State, and VT - none of these schools wanted another annual opponent in the Northeast in a state with no recruits. Add BC to that and you have 7 no votes, minimum.

Cincy could have gotten the votes but FSU and Clemson in particular would not have been happy. Cincy was a better academic fit than Louisville, but Louisville had a 12-15 year head start over Cincy when it came to top level football.

(06-01-2020 09:44 PM)Statefan Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 09:17 AM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 08:06 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 07:20 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  Pretty Good report about UCONN & why they are not in a Power 5 (ACC... talks about the 2003 lawsuit agaisnt BC) also they talk about the 40Miliion in red.... ..

UConn fans who have always insisted that those 2003 lawsuits vs Miami and then BC have nothing to do with no ACC invite have IMO always been fooling themselves. Memories in academia are very long and can become institutionalized even after the particular personalities involved leave the scene.

Heck, this article from 2010, written from the BC point of view and shortly before the major realignment that destroyed the Big East, talks about the "bad blood" between BC and UConn stemming from the suits being very evident on the BC side seven years after those lawsuits were filed. It talks about how despite many efforts over those years (2003 - 2010) by UConn to bury the hatchet, BC was continuing to freeze out UConn:

https://www.bcinterruption.com/2010/5/1/...uits-could

The article is also a good read because it was prescient: It talks about how, because of the bad blood, UConn football could be severely hurt should the B1G poach Rutgers, Syracuse and Pitt, thereby destroying Big East football, as the ACC would be the only good landing spot for UConn and that would likely be precluded. At the time, it was the B1G that was in expansion mode not the ACC, but the ACC and B1G poaching that came within a year or two certainly produced the outcome the writer speculated about, and he obviously was pretty accurate in his speculations about which schools might get invites elsewhere.

I'm not going to argue that the lawsuit helped anything in the long run however, I think UConn not being in the P5 has much more to do with the fact that we didn't even start playing at the FBS level until 2000. There are no P5 members that joined the FBS ranks that recently and it wouldn't surprise me if there never are.

Blumenthal thought he could cow the League with very invasive depositions of the ACC Staff in Greensboro. VERY INVASIVE. That might work in NYC or Philly, but the game is not played that way in NC. Litigation is no big deal, but certain questions in a deposition are a declaration of war.

The lawsuit was settled for a few million. The state government was pissed after investing so much in the football upgrade. It is what it is. It definitely didn’t help but I don’t buy it being the main reason UConn never got an ACC invite.

(06-01-2020 09:44 PM)Statefan Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 09:17 AM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 08:06 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 07:20 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  Pretty Good report about UCONN & why they are not in a Power 5 (ACC... talks about the 2003 lawsuit agaisnt BC) also they talk about the 40Miliion in red.... ..

UConn fans who have always insisted that those 2003 lawsuits vs Miami and then BC have nothing to do with no ACC invite have IMO always been fooling themselves. Memories in academia are very long and can become institutionalized even after the particular personalities involved leave the scene.

Heck, this article from 2010, written from the BC point of view and shortly before the major realignment that destroyed the Big East, talks about the "bad blood" between BC and UConn stemming from the suits being very evident on the BC side seven years after those lawsuits were filed. It talks about how despite many efforts over those years (2003 - 2010) by UConn to bury the hatchet, BC was continuing to freeze out UConn:

https://www.bcinterruption.com/2010/5/1/...uits-could

The article is also a good read because it was prescient: It talks about how, because of the bad blood, UConn football could be severely hurt should the B1G poach Rutgers, Syracuse and Pitt, thereby destroying Big East football, as the ACC would be the only good landing spot for UConn and that would likely be precluded. At the time, it was the B1G that was in expansion mode not the ACC, but the ACC and B1G poaching that came within a year or two certainly produced the outcome the writer speculated about, and he obviously was pretty accurate in his speculations about which schools might get invites elsewhere.

I'm not going to argue that the lawsuit helped anything in the long run however, I think UConn not being in the P5 has much more to do with the fact that we didn't even start playing at the FBS level until 2000. There are no P5 members that joined the FBS ranks that recently and it wouldn't surprise me if there never are.

Blumenthal thought he could cow the League with very invasive depositions of the ACC Staff in Greensboro. VERY INVASIVE. That might work in NYC or Philly, but the game is not played that way in NC. Litigation is no big deal, but certain questions in a deposition are a declaration of war.

Blumenthal was basically the only winner in this. He remained Attorney General for the next six years, then got elected to the US Senate where he remains to this day. Lawsuit was a grandstanding political stunt that worked for him. That's probably the main reason UConn was and remains most closely associated with that lawsuit even though other Big East schools were involved as well - he was loud and brash about it to promote himself.

(06-02-2020 01:06 AM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 09:44 PM)Statefan Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 09:17 AM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 08:06 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 07:20 AM)GTFletch Wrote:  Pretty Good report about UCONN & why they are not in a Power 5 (ACC... talks about the 2003 lawsuit agaisnt BC) also they talk about the 40Miliion in red.... ..

UConn fans who have always insisted that those 2003 lawsuits vs Miami and then BC have nothing to do with no ACC invite have IMO always been fooling themselves. Memories in academia are very long and can become institutionalized even after the particular personalities involved leave the scene.

Heck, this article from 2010, written from the BC point of view and shortly before the major realignment that destroyed the Big East, talks about the "bad blood" between BC and UConn stemming from the suits being very evident on the BC side seven years after those lawsuits were filed. It talks about how despite many efforts over those years (2003 - 2010) by UConn to bury the hatchet, BC was continuing to freeze out UConn:

https://www.bcinterruption.com/2010/5/1/...uits-could

The article is also a good read because it was prescient: It talks about how, because of the bad blood, UConn football could be severely hurt should the B1G poach Rutgers, Syracuse and Pitt, thereby destroying Big East football, as the ACC would be the only good landing spot for UConn and that would likely be precluded. At the time, it was the B1G that was in expansion mode not the ACC, but the ACC and B1G poaching that came within a year or two certainly produced the outcome the writer speculated about, and he obviously was pretty accurate in his speculations about which schools might get invites elsewhere.

I'm not going to argue that the lawsuit helped anything in the long run however, I think UConn not being in the P5 has much more to do with the fact that we didn't even start playing at the FBS level until 2000. There are no P5 members that joined the FBS ranks that recently and it wouldn't surprise me if there never are.

Blumenthal thought he could cow the League with very invasive depositions of the ACC Staff in Greensboro. VERY INVASIVE. That might work in NYC or Philly, but the game is not played that way in NC. Litigation is no big deal, but certain questions in a deposition are a declaration of war.

The lawsuit was settled for a few million. The state government was pissed after investigating so much in the football upgrade. It is what it is. It definitely didn’t help but I don’t buy it being the main reason UConn never got an ACC invite.

It wasn't. The black hole you call a football program was and unless the ACC loses the majority of their football first programs and is in massive rebuild mode will always be the reason why UConn isn't in the ACC.

(06-01-2020 11:23 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  The ACC wanted a FB school for Maryland's replacement. Louisville was the obvious choice. It was a bonus that Louisville was also a Basketball school too. UConn, Nova, et al never had a chance. FSU and Clemson were watching and might have bolted to the Big 12 if UConn was selected.

I think only Cincy was a suitable alternate.

UConn would have been a football school like Syracuse or BC was

(06-02-2020 12:22 PM)Minutemen429 Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:23 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  The ACC wanted a FB school for Maryland's replacement. Louisville was the obvious choice. It was a bonus that Louisville was also a Basketball school too. UConn, Nova, et al never had a chance. FSU and Clemson were watching and might have bolted to the Big 12 if UConn was selected.

I think only Cincy was a suitable alternate.

UConn would have been a football school like Syracuse or BC was

In the 20 years since the turn of the century Boston College has had 17 seasons that ended in a bowl game and is well over .500 in that time frame. BC has carried their own weight. The only people who think Syracuse was a football add are delusional Syracuse and Tobacco Road fans. They weren't and have gone on to amply prove that they weren't a football add with their 19-38 ACC record since joining the conference.

(06-02-2020 03:42 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-02-2020 12:22 PM)Minutemen429 Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:23 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  The ACC wanted a FB school for Maryland's replacement. Louisville was the obvious choice. It was a bonus that Louisville was also a Basketball school too. UConn, Nova, et al never had a chance. FSU and Clemson were watching and might have bolted to the Big 12 if UConn was selected.

I think only Cincy was a suitable alternate.

UConn would have been a football school like Syracuse or BC was

In the 20 years since the turn of the century Boston College has had 17 seasons that ended in a bowl game and is well over .500 in that time frame. BC has carried their own weight. The only people who think Syracuse was a football add are delusional Syracuse and Tobacco Road fans. They weren't and have gone on to amply prove that they weren't a football add with their 19-38 ACC record since joining the conference.

Agreed. Syracuse was a market add with hoops thrown in as an added bonus.

(06-02-2020 03:42 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(06-02-2020 12:22 PM)Minutemen429 Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:23 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  The ACC wanted a FB school for Maryland's replacement. Louisville was the obvious choice. It was a bonus that Louisville was also a Basketball school too. UConn, Nova, et al never had a chance. FSU and Clemson were watching and might have bolted to the Big 12 if UConn was selected.

I think only Cincy was a suitable alternate.

UConn would have been a football school like Syracuse or BC was

In the 20 years since the turn of the century Boston College has had 17 seasons that ended in a bowl game and is well over .500 in that time frame. BC has carried their own weight. The only people who think Syracuse was a football add are delusional Syracuse and Tobacco Road fans. They weren't and have gone on to amply prove that they weren't a football add with their 19-38 ACC record since joining the conference.

Yeah but one of those wins was against Clemson and the game in 2018 wasn't decided to the last minute.

(06-01-2020 12:23 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:42 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I think Georgetown and Villanova tried to market themselves as potential non-fb adds to the ACC. Obviously they didn’t get anywhere

It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

(06-03-2020 10:35 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 12:23 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:42 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I think Georgetown and Villanova tried to market themselves as potential non-fb adds to the ACC. Obviously they didn’t get anywhere

It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

That was when ex-NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, head of Georgetown's Board of Directors, was all-in on the "big schools in big markets" plan. Houston, UCF, SMU? Try Houston, Orlando, DFW. Tagliabue and Swarbrick (Notre DAme AD) were big movers and shakers in the "Big East of Reno" football conference plan.

When "the FBS schools" no longer included Louisville AND UConn, that was the end.

(06-03-2020 01:21 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 10:35 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 12:23 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:42 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I think Georgetown and Villanova tried to market themselves as potential non-fb adds to the ACC. Obviously they didn’t get anywhere

It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

That was when ex-NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, head of Georgetown's Board of Directors, was all-in on the "big schools in big markets" plan. Houston, UCF, SMU? Try Houston, Orlando, DFW. Tagliabue and Swarbrick (Notre DAme AD) were big movers and shakers in the "Big East of Reno" football conference plan.

When "the FBS schools" no longer included Louisville AND UConn, that was the end.

Yeah, and from my understanding, it was Georgetown (Lee Reed) and Marquette (then-AD Larry Williams) that were the big leaders of the breakaway for the C7.

(06-03-2020 02:42 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 01:21 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 10:35 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 12:23 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:42 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I think Georgetown and Villanova tried to market themselves as potential non-fb adds to the ACC. Obviously they didn’t get anywhere

It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

That was when ex-NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, head of Georgetown's Board of Directors, was all-in on the "big schools in big markets" plan. Houston, UCF, SMU? Try Houston, Orlando, DFW. Tagliabue and Swarbrick (Notre DAme AD) were big movers and shakers in the "Big East of Reno" football conference plan.

When "the FBS schools" no longer included Louisville AND UConn, that was the end.

Yeah, and from my understanding, it was Georgetown (Lee Reed) and Marquette (then-AD Larry Williams) that were the big leaders of the breakaway for the C7.

Truth is the plan was a good one and if the C7 were together with all of the football schools added would still represent possibly the best conference in basketball and the brand would have surely added even more power at the p5 table ..... as it sits today the Big East has to try to push for their relevance in the big picture and the American has to work on their own for their voice... what’s interesting they both gain respect in market... but the basketball would be a the most powerful with 10 plus teams per year and regional schedules that would have benifit Ted all from the size of teams in conference.....

(06-03-2020 02:53 PM)pablowow Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 02:42 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 01:21 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 10:35 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 12:23 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

That was when ex-NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, head of Georgetown's Board of Directors, was all-in on the "big schools in big markets" plan. Houston, UCF, SMU? Try Houston, Orlando, DFW. Tagliabue and Swarbrick (Notre DAme AD) were big movers and shakers in the "Big East of Reno" football conference plan.

When "the FBS schools" no longer included Louisville AND UConn, that was the end.

Yeah, and from my understanding, it was Georgetown (Lee Reed) and Marquette (then-AD Larry Williams) that were the big leaders of the breakaway for the C7.

Truth is the plan was a good one and if the C7 were together with all of the football schools added would still represent possibly the best conference in basketball and the brand would have surely added even more power at the p5 table ..... as it sits today the Big East has to try to push for their relevance in the big picture and the American has to work on their own for their voice... what’s interesting they both gain respect in market... but the basketball would be a the most powerful with 10 plus teams per year and regional schedules that would have benifit Ted all from the size of teams in conference.....

I don’t disagree. The conference should not have split. AAC Football performance plus the Big East brand and hoops performance would have been very strong.

(06-03-2020 02:42 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 01:21 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 10:35 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 12:23 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 11:42 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I think Georgetown and Villanova tried to market themselves as potential non-fb adds to the ACC. Obviously they didn’t get anywhere

It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

That was when ex-NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, head of Georgetown's Board of Directors, was all-in on the "big schools in big markets" plan. Houston, UCF, SMU? Try Houston, Orlando, DFW. Tagliabue and Swarbrick (Notre DAme AD) were big movers and shakers in the "Big East of Reno" football conference plan.

When "the FBS schools" no longer included Louisville AND UConn, that was the end.

Yeah, and from my understanding, it was Georgetown (Lee Reed) and Marquette (then-AD Larry Williams) that were the big leaders of the breakaway for the C7.

Thought Villanova was heading the charge to leave the FB schools behind too - if it was not in fact the actual leader of the rebellion. Would have to go back and research this though unless someone has information to the contrary at this point.

(06-03-2020 07:43 PM)HartfordHusky Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 02:53 PM)pablowow Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 02:42 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 01:21 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 10:35 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

That was when ex-NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, head of Georgetown's Board of Directors, was all-in on the "big schools in big markets" plan. Houston, UCF, SMU? Try Houston, Orlando, DFW. Tagliabue and Swarbrick (Notre DAme AD) were big movers and shakers in the "Big East of Reno" football conference plan.

When "the FBS schools" no longer included Louisville AND UConn, that was the end.

Yeah, and from my understanding, it was Georgetown (Lee Reed) and Marquette (then-AD Larry Williams) that were the big leaders of the breakaway for the C7.

Truth is the plan was a good one and if the C7 were together with all of the football schools added would still represent possibly the best conference in basketball and the brand would have surely added even more power at the p5 table ..... as it sits today the Big East has to try to push for their relevance in the big picture and the American has to work on their own for their voice... what’s interesting they both gain respect in market... but the basketball would be a the most powerful with 10 plus teams per year and regional schedules that would have benifit Ted all from the size of teams in conference.....

I don’t disagree. The conference should not have split. AAC Football performance plus the Big East brand and hoops performance would have been very strong.

Strongly agree with this. I would have liked for the OBE to stick together with what ever FB replacements the conference needed. However I didn't have a vote and more than likely would have been voted down anyway if I did.

(06-04-2020 09:42 AM)panite Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 02:42 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 01:21 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(06-03-2020 10:35 AM)TheBasketBallOpinion Wrote:  

(06-01-2020 12:23 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  It was a rumor but the Tobacco Road types don't want too many Yankees to make a push to get MSG as the tournament site

Also a rumor that Georgetown did NOT want to leave the FBS schools and had to be brought kicking and screaming. Honestly love how it turned out tho.

That was when ex-NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue, head of Georgetown's Board of Directors, was all-in on the "big schools in big markets" plan. Houston, UCF, SMU? Try Houston, Orlando, DFW. Tagliabue and Swarbrick (Notre DAme AD) were big movers and shakers in the "Big East of Reno" football conference plan.

When "the FBS schools" no longer included Louisville AND UConn, that was the end.

Yeah, and from my understanding, it was Georgetown (Lee Reed) and Marquette (then-AD Larry Williams) that were the big leaders of the breakaway for the C7.

Thought Villanova was heading the charge to leave the FB schools behind too - if it was not in fact the actual leader of the rebellion. Would have to go back and research this though unless someone has information to the contrary at this point.

There wasn't really any chatter in the media about who was leading the split. Georgetown had been pushing the hybrid for the basketball schools, until Aresco didn't have anything positive to report about the TV contract.