Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
Author Message
Bookmark and Share
Paulbintheburg Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 398
Joined: Aug 2014
Reputation: 12
I Root For: Tribe
Location:
Post: #81
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(04-30-2019 07:37 AM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 06:53 AM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 08:03 PM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 07:43 PM)Tribal Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 07:40 PM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  It was for all intents and purposes a job nobody wanted.
Yep. The number of coaches--HC and assistants--who said "no thanks" would blow your mind. Not speculation. Fact.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


I’m not doubting this - I’m not in the know. But I do wonder who would be the source of this information, and then be willing to share with others? Huge knows - and is obviously not going to share this. Is someone on the committee going to talk about how no one wanted the job ... doubtful. So who on the inside would both a) be in the circle to know the details about whom exactly was offered, and b) be willing to share something like that with others that, if true, makes our school / program look really bad? I’ve gotta assume there are a ton of casual conversations with all sorts of people before serious discussions begin about job details and such.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well this is not a "its on the internet so it must be true" sort of thing.

If you want to think differently because its a case of "the truth hurts" then I understand that.

Lets assume for a moment that there is no such info, just speculation (not the case, but lets assume), WM mens hoops was down and out for several years, in the Boyarges era(or as I refer to it, those years where I just handed WM money and the product did not match the description, a 6'10" center who favored 12' jumpers, a PG who couldn't make foul shots or a simple layup. a PF who couldn't do 5 pushups and was more interested in sketching comic books and having his father come on here and berate people who questioned his useless basketball player son for eating up a scholarship) you could go to games and if you spoke above a whisper the scant few people on the other side of the arena could hear you, and for decades the Tribe never even sniffed the title game of any conference they played in. Tony Shaver came in, and within 4 years the Tribe were playing George Mason on ESPN in the CAA Conf Championship game, that was back when the CAA was a top tier mid-conference, not the lowly "one bid, low seed conference" it is today.
Most of what could be deemed success in WM mens hoops has happened in the last 15 years under Tony Shavers watch, he was a missed jumper from making the NCAA's a few years ago, yet with all that, he is dumped and paid to not coach (swirl that one around, this isn't Texas or Bama we are talking about, who pulls this kind of thing all the time, because they have mountains of cash).
So now a supposed "Coaching Search" begins, with a "Committee", and they searched nationally far and wide, and they all came to the same conclusion, that an assistant coach at what is now a low tier program is the answer to getting to the NCAA Xanadu.

You're willing to buy all that?

If so, good for you, just keep in mind that is before the widely known info posted above. Williamsburg is not some sort of Metropolis, everyone is 3 degrees away from knowing someone.

I’m not sure what you’re suggesting I “buy”. No one believes that Huge fired Shaver because she already had Fischer lined up and he was her dream candidate. She decided to fire Shaver (Decision #1). She then found the best coach she could find who wanted to lead our program (Decision #2). These are separate decisions. It’s telling that 3/4 of your response to speculations / facts about the coaching search (Decision #2) is talking about how great Tony is (Decision #1). The emotions are still raw because many of us love Tony and all he did for our program. But it’s clear that those emotions are affecting how many of us are evaluating Decision #2.

Again, I’m not saying it’s not true that many coaches turned us down. In fact, I assume they did. If not, we didn’t search wide/high enough. I’m just challenging any implied statements that our program is a complete dumpster fire and no sensible / quality coach would ever want to be here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

First of all I never used "Great" and "Tony Shaver" in the same sentence, you did.

Secondly, if your program is a big pile of burning shyat for decades with maybe the exception of a random season or two (with still no appearance in a conf championship game of any kind), then a new coach comes in, with a FIVE year contract, and gets you to the CCG in his 4th year, in a highly respected mid-tier conference, then KEEPS your program relevant and respectable for the next decade, and he is suddenly dismissed with no apparent explanation (because we evidently are too stupid to understand it?)
and his replacement is a guy who has never been a HC on any level (much like the person hiring him has never been an AD on any level), that is called "Destabilizing a stable situation", its also exhibit A that any guy with any kind of reputation wanted nothing to do with WM, since WM doesn't give a crap about the one person who dragged a smoldering pile of Moose dung, into respectability.
I'll repeat what someone told me, "Its not the new guy's fault", and that is very true, but the new guy is going to be making about four times what he was making, so that excuse only will last for just so long, for his sake he better have a solid plan and know how to execute it.
04-30-2019 06:10 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Biggjohn43 Online
Special Teams
*

Posts: 736
Joined: Sep 2014
Reputation: 6
I Root For: William & Mary
Location: Lanexa, Va
Post: #82
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(04-30-2019 06:10 PM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 07:37 AM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 06:53 AM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 08:03 PM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 07:43 PM)Tribal Wrote:  Yep. The number of coaches--HC and assistants--who said "no thanks" would blow your mind. Not speculation. Fact.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


I’m not doubting this - I’m not in the know. But I do wonder who would be the source of this information, and then be willing to share with others? Huge knows - and is obviously not going to share this. Is someone on the committee going to talk about how no one wanted the job ... doubtful. So who on the inside would both a) be in the circle to know the details about whom exactly was offered, and b) be willing to share something like that with others that, if true, makes our school / program look really bad? I’ve gotta assume there are a ton of casual conversations with all sorts of people before serious discussions begin about job details and such.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well this is not a "its on the internet so it must be true" sort of thing.

If you want to think differently because its a case of "the truth hurts" then I understand that.

Lets assume for a moment that there is no such info, just speculation (not the case, but lets assume), WM mens hoops was down and out for several years, in the Boyarges era(or as I refer to it, those years where I just handed WM money and the product did not match the description, a 6'10" center who favored 12' jumpers, a PG who couldn't make foul shots or a simple layup. a PF who couldn't do 5 pushups and was more interested in sketching comic books and having his father come on here and berate people who questioned his useless basketball player son for eating up a scholarship) you could go to games and if you spoke above a whisper the scant few people on the other side of the arena could hear you, and for decades the Tribe never even sniffed the title game of any conference they played in. Tony Shaver came in, and within 4 years the Tribe were playing George Mason on ESPN in the CAA Conf Championship game, that was back when the CAA was a top tier mid-conference, not the lowly "one bid, low seed conference" it is today.
Most of what could be deemed success in WM mens hoops has happened in the last 15 years under Tony Shavers watch, he was a missed jumper from making the NCAA's a few years ago, yet with all that, he is dumped and paid to not coach (swirl that one around, this isn't Texas or Bama we are talking about, who pulls this kind of thing all the time, because they have mountains of cash).
So now a supposed "Coaching Search" begins, with a "Committee", and they searched nationally far and wide, and they all came to the same conclusion, that an assistant coach at what is now a low tier program is the answer to getting to the NCAA Xanadu.

You're willing to buy all that?

If so, good for you, just keep in mind that is before the widely known info posted above. Williamsburg is not some sort of Metropolis, everyone is 3 degrees away from knowing someone.

I’m not sure what you’re suggesting I “buy”. No one believes that Huge fired Shaver because she already had Fischer lined up and he was her dream candidate. She decided to fire Shaver (Decision #1). She then found the best coach she could find who wanted to lead our program (Decision #2). These are separate decisions. It’s telling that 3/4 of your response to speculations / facts about the coaching search (Decision #2) is talking about how great Tony is (Decision #1). The emotions are still raw because many of us love Tony and all he did for our program. But it’s clear that those emotions are affecting how many of us are evaluating Decision #2.

Again, I’m not saying it’s not true that many coaches turned us down. In fact, I assume they did. If not, we didn’t search wide/high enough. I’m just challenging any implied statements that our program is a complete dumpster fire and no sensible / quality coach would ever want to be here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

First of all I never used "Great" and "Tony Shaver" in the same sentence, you did.

Secondly, if your program is a big pile of burning shyat for decades with maybe the exception of a random season or two (with still no appearance in a conf championship game of any kind), then a new coach comes in, with a FIVE year contract, and gets you to the CCG in his 4th year, in a highly respected mid-tier conference, then KEEPS your program relevant and respectable for the next decade, and he is suddenly dismissed with no apparent explanation (because we evidently are too stupid to understand it?)
and his replacement is a guy who has never been a HC on any level (much like the person hiring him has never been an AD on any level), that is called "Destabilizing a stable situation", its also exhibit A that any guy with any kind of reputation wanted nothing to do with WM, since WM doesn't give a crap about the one person who dragged a smoldering pile of Moose dung, into respectability.
I'll repeat what someone told me, "Its not the new guy's fault", and that is very true, but the new guy is going to be making about four times what he was making, so that excuse only will last for just so long, for his sake he better have a solid plan and know how to execute it.

I keep going back in my mind and ask. Did we offer the job to the new coach of Elon?? He had.a great resume, a lot better than Fischer's, plus he hired Holms. I think we might have missed the boat on that one!!!
04-30-2019 06:34 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
WMInTheBurg Offline
All American
*

Posts: 3,788
Joined: Oct 2013
Reputation: 34
I Root For: William & Mary
Location:
Post: #83
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(04-30-2019 09:31 AM)Tribe2011 Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 07:52 AM)nj alum Wrote:  Huge was hired to make us better; not to screw it up. She screwed this up. There is no other rational conclusion.

This quote says a lot about this crowd. To be clear, we don't remotely know whether Huge screwed this up. Is it possible she did? Of course. Is it possible that keeping Shaver on for additional years could also have been a mistake? Of course. None of us have any idea, despite the fact that many on here want to tell us exactly what will happen in the future.

In general, I would consider myself someone who errs on the side of Huge being right or let's wait and see. However, I think that nj alum is completely right. That doesn't mean Fischer was a bad hire, but with regard to the firing it was a complete disaster. It's the kind of incident that should result in a serious re-evaluation of Huge's qualifications and certainly follow her around wherever she goes after W&M.
04-30-2019 09:41 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
soccerguy315 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,021
Joined: Apr 2013
Reputation: 17
I Root For: William & Mary
Location:
Post: #84
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(04-30-2019 09:07 AM)Tribal Wrote:  I disagree with several posters a lot but I think...I hope...we all want Tribe Athletics to succeed. I don't live my life to be "right," and I cherish conversations that lead to me learning and being better informed. Some on here can't stand those who don't see things their way. It's cute.

I think Huge should be dismissed. I think her emotional and irrational decisions over, at minimum, the past few months are, at best, negligent. I don't need to see how the dominoes fall to come to that conclusion. Any success in MBB over the next few years will be in spite of her actions, not because of them. Dane has a tall order and I'm 100% behind him.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

interesting choice of words
05-01-2019 12:36 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Paulbintheburg Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 398
Joined: Aug 2014
Reputation: 12
I Root For: Tribe
Location:
Post: #85
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(04-30-2019 06:34 PM)Biggjohn43 Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 06:10 PM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 07:37 AM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 06:53 AM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 08:03 PM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  I’m not doubting this - I’m not in the know. But I do wonder who would be the source of this information, and then be willing to share with others? Huge knows - and is obviously not going to share this. Is someone on the committee going to talk about how no one wanted the job ... doubtful. So who on the inside would both a) be in the circle to know the details about whom exactly was offered, and b) be willing to share something like that with others that, if true, makes our school / program look really bad? I’ve gotta assume there are a ton of casual conversations with all sorts of people before serious discussions begin about job details and such.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well this is not a "its on the internet so it must be true" sort of thing.

If you want to think differently because its a case of "the truth hurts" then I understand that.

Lets assume for a moment that there is no such info, just speculation (not the case, but lets assume), WM mens hoops was down and out for several years, in the Boyarges era(or as I refer to it, those years where I just handed WM money and the product did not match the description, a 6'10" center who favored 12' jumpers, a PG who couldn't make foul shots or a simple layup. a PF who couldn't do 5 pushups and was more interested in sketching comic books and having his father come on here and berate people who questioned his useless basketball player son for eating up a scholarship) you could go to games and if you spoke above a whisper the scant few people on the other side of the arena could hear you, and for decades the Tribe never even sniffed the title game of any conference they played in. Tony Shaver came in, and within 4 years the Tribe were playing George Mason on ESPN in the CAA Conf Championship game, that was back when the CAA was a top tier mid-conference, not the lowly "one bid, low seed conference" it is today.
Most of what could be deemed success in WM mens hoops has happened in the last 15 years under Tony Shavers watch, he was a missed jumper from making the NCAA's a few years ago, yet with all that, he is dumped and paid to not coach (swirl that one around, this isn't Texas or Bama we are talking about, who pulls this kind of thing all the time, because they have mountains of cash).
So now a supposed "Coaching Search" begins, with a "Committee", and they searched nationally far and wide, and they all came to the same conclusion, that an assistant coach at what is now a low tier program is the answer to getting to the NCAA Xanadu.

You're willing to buy all that?

If so, good for you, just keep in mind that is before the widely known info posted above. Williamsburg is not some sort of Metropolis, everyone is 3 degrees away from knowing someone.

I’m not sure what you’re suggesting I “buy”. No one believes that Huge fired Shaver because she already had Fischer lined up and he was her dream candidate. She decided to fire Shaver (Decision #1). She then found the best coach she could find who wanted to lead our program (Decision #2). These are separate decisions. It’s telling that 3/4 of your response to speculations / facts about the coaching search (Decision #2) is talking about how great Tony is (Decision #1). The emotions are still raw because many of us love Tony and all he did for our program. But it’s clear that those emotions are affecting how many of us are evaluating Decision #2.

Again, I’m not saying it’s not true that many coaches turned us down. In fact, I assume they did. If not, we didn’t search wide/high enough. I’m just challenging any implied statements that our program is a complete dumpster fire and no sensible / quality coach would ever want to be here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

First of all I never used "Great" and "Tony Shaver" in the same sentence, you did.

Secondly, if your program is a big pile of burning shyat for decades with maybe the exception of a random season or two (with still no appearance in a conf championship game of any kind), then a new coach comes in, with a FIVE year contract, and gets you to the CCG in his 4th year, in a highly respected mid-tier conference, then KEEPS your program relevant and respectable for the next decade, and he is suddenly dismissed with no apparent explanation (because we evidently are too stupid to understand it?)
and his replacement is a guy who has never been a HC on any level (much like the person hiring him has never been an AD on any level), that is called "Destabilizing a stable situation", its also exhibit A that any guy with any kind of reputation wanted nothing to do with WM, since WM doesn't give a crap about the one person who dragged a smoldering pile of Moose dung, into respectability.
I'll repeat what someone told me, "Its not the new guy's fault", and that is very true, but the new guy is going to be making about four times what he was making, so that excuse only will last for just so long, for his sake he better have a solid plan and know how to execute it.

I keep going back in my mind and ask. Did we offer the job to the new coach of Elon?? He had.a great resume, a lot better than Fischer's, plus he hired Holms. I think we might have missed the boat on that one!!!

Probably because they were at the airport. 04-cheers
05-01-2019 05:36 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
bubbadog57 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,079
Joined: Oct 2016
Reputation: 33
I Root For: William & Mary
Location:
Post: #86
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
This endless speculation, based on little real information, has become boring.
05-01-2019 06:11 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
nj alum Offline
Petulant
*

Posts: 2,380
Joined: Oct 2013
Reputation: 41
I Root For: william & mary
Location:
Post: #87
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 06:11 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  This endless speculation, based on little real information, has become boring.

Still waiting on someone to provide the 2018 and 2019 OTOD MBB numbers.

Are you privy to them? Like to share?

That would be real information and not speculation.
05-01-2019 06:25 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Tribe2011 Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 431
Joined: Apr 2015
Reputation: 13
I Root For: W&M
Location:
Post: #88
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 12:36 AM)soccerguy315 Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 09:07 AM)Tribal Wrote:  I disagree with several posters a lot but I think...I hope...we all want Tribe Athletics to succeed. I don't live my life to be "right," and I cherish conversations that lead to me learning and being better informed. Some on here can't stand those who don't see things their way. It's cute.

I think Huge should be dismissed. I think her emotional and irrational decisions over, at minimum, the past few months are, at best, negligent. I don't need to see how the dominoes fall to come to that conclusion. Any success in MBB over the next few years will be in spite of her actions, not because of them. Dane has a tall order and I'm 100% behind him.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

interesting choice of words

I, too, am curious what was emotional about the decision.
05-01-2019 09:16 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Zorch Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,408
Joined: Feb 2017
Reputation: 33
I Root For: W&M
Location:
Post: #89
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 09:16 AM)Tribe2011 Wrote:  
(05-01-2019 12:36 AM)soccerguy315 Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 09:07 AM)Tribal Wrote:  I disagree with several posters a lot but I think...I hope...we all want Tribe Athletics to succeed. I don't live my life to be "right," and I cherish conversations that lead to me learning and being better informed. Some on here can't stand those who don't see things their way. It's cute.

I think Huge should be dismissed. I think her emotional and irrational decisions over, at minimum, the past few months are, at best, negligent. I don't need to see how the dominoes fall to come to that conclusion. Any success in MBB over the next few years will be in spite of her actions, not because of them. Dane has a tall order and I'm 100% behind him.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

interesting choice of words

I, too, am curious what was emotional about the decision.

I think the emotion came from her being in Charleston and watching the Tribe blow a 14-point halftime lead. That was the tipping point.
05-01-2019 11:24 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Zorch Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,408
Joined: Feb 2017
Reputation: 33
I Root For: W&M
Location:
Post: #90
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(04-30-2019 10:10 AM)mrjoolius Wrote:  ... but change and shakeup are inevitable. Time will tell if it was a wise move. Huge will be held accountable for decisions she's made. Comes with the job.

A lot of people keep saying that Huge will be held accountable for her decisions. She certainly should be held accountable, but I am not sure that she will be held accountable, for two reasons.

1. She appears to not only be on good terms with President Rowe, but I would characterize their relationship as "best buds". That is certainly what I observed in Charleston. So, having the support of the boss goes a long, long way towards keeping your job and avoiding accountability.

2. I still think W&M is no more than a short pit stop for Huge on her way to "bigger and better things". Therefore, every decision she makes is geared towards that goal and "patience" is not an ingredient in any of those decisions, imo. So, I think Huge is likely to be long gone before the smell from the trash heap of her long-term decisions puts the school in the registry of toxic waste sites.
05-01-2019 11:35 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
mrjoolius Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 10,454
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 129
I Root For: William & Mary
Location: Prince Frederick, MD
Post: #91
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 11:35 AM)Zorch Wrote:  2. I still think W&M is no more than a short pit stop for Huge on her way to "bigger and better things". Therefore, every decision she makes is geared towards that goal and "patience" is not an ingredient in any of those decisions, imo. So, I think Huge is likely to be long gone before the smell from the trash heap of her long-term decisions puts the school in the registry of toxic waste sites.

How is that supposed to work? If Huge moves on to bigger and better things, doesn't that mean she has done very well here? If her hires and actions destroy the athletics dept, I'm guessing those P5 schools won't be knocking at the door. I agree that Huge has a good relationship with Rowe. I would hope if it does turn out Huge is botching things, that Rowe would have the backbone to hold Huge accountable. It's part of the job. That is a discussion for another day. Unless Huge is wildly successful, I'd think that accountability would be here.
05-01-2019 11:49 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Tribal Offline
Moderator
*

Posts: 11,839
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 162
I Root For: William & Mary
Location:
Post: #92
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 09:16 AM)Tribe2011 Wrote:  
(05-01-2019 12:36 AM)soccerguy315 Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 09:07 AM)Tribal Wrote:  I disagree with several posters a lot but I think...I hope...we all want Tribe Athletics to succeed. I don't live my life to be "right," and I cherish conversations that lead to me learning and being better informed. Some on here can't stand those who don't see things their way. It's cute.

I think Huge should be dismissed. I think her emotional and irrational decisions over, at minimum, the past few months are, at best, negligent. I don't need to see how the dominoes fall to come to that conclusion. Any success in MBB over the next few years will be in spite of her actions, not because of them. Dane has a tall order and I'm 100% behind him.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

interesting choice of words

I, too, am curious what was emotional about the decision.

Soccer certainly highlighted that part in an effort to lump me in with all the bad boys who see women as overly emotional and irrational. But, to your curiosity, I'll oblige you with an answer:

1. For some reason, she capped 2018 as the season to go to the NCAAT. Irrational.

2. She was so upset about our result in the CAAT, she resolved to firing Tony before having any semblance of a plan in place. Emotional and irrational.



Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
05-01-2019 12:01 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Tribe32 Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,209
Joined: Aug 2014
Reputation: 50
I Root For: Tribe
Location:
Post: #93
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 11:49 AM)mrjoolius Wrote:  
(05-01-2019 11:35 AM)Zorch Wrote:  2. I still think W&M is no more than a short pit stop for Huge on her way to "bigger and better things". Therefore, every decision she makes is geared towards that goal and "patience" is not an ingredient in any of those decisions, imo. So, I think Huge is likely to be long gone before the smell from the trash heap of her long-term decisions puts the school in the registry of toxic waste sites.

How is that supposed to work? If Huge moves on to bigger and better things, doesn't that mean she has done very well here? If her hires and actions destroy the athletics dept, I'm guessing those P5 schools won't be knocking at the door. I agree that Huge has a good relationship with Rowe. I would hope if it does turn out Huge is botching things, that Rowe would have the backbone to hold Huge accountable. It's part of the job. That is a discussion for another day. Unless Huge is wildly successful, I'd think that accountability would be here.

Don't assume that her only way up is to be an AD at a bigger school. I could see her try to make a move to the NCAA, become a conference commissioner, move into pro sports, work for a shoe/apparel company, etc. She's been on a dozen committees and has been growing a big network. She's been really nomadic when you go back and look at her career. She got her law degree in 1997 and started at Illinois three years later. Not sure what she did in between. It doesn't show on her LinkedIn.

Illinois Champlain/Urbana - 2 years
Michigan State - less than 1 year
Wake Forest - 4 years
Georgetown - 3 years
Delaware - 5 years
Texas A&M - 3 years
William and Mary - 2 years

I predict that she will be gone in 2020. That's about the average tenure for her.
05-01-2019 12:23 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
nj alum Offline
Petulant
*

Posts: 2,380
Joined: Oct 2013
Reputation: 41
I Root For: william & mary
Location:
Post: #94
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
Is there an adult in the room who can see what has happened, and is asking the right questions?
05-01-2019 12:55 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
nogretheogre Offline
Lord of Bots & Tots
*

Posts: 2,516
Joined: Jul 2014
Reputation: 46
I Root For: William & Mary
Location:
Post: #95
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
Does the president fire the AD or does the BOV?
05-01-2019 03:07 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Paulbintheburg Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 398
Joined: Aug 2014
Reputation: 12
I Root For: Tribe
Location:
Post: #96
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 06:11 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  This endless speculation, based on little real information, has become boring.

There are countless other threads you can likely get a group hug.
05-01-2019 04:06 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Zorch Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,408
Joined: Feb 2017
Reputation: 33
I Root For: W&M
Location:
Post: #97
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 11:49 AM)mrjoolius Wrote:  
(05-01-2019 11:35 AM)Zorch Wrote:  2. I still think W&M is no more than a short pit stop for Huge on her way to "bigger and better things". Therefore, every decision she makes is geared towards that goal and "patience" is not an ingredient in any of those decisions, imo. So, I think Huge is likely to be long gone before the smell from the trash heap of her long-term decisions puts the school in the registry of toxic waste sites.

How is that supposed to work? If Huge moves on to bigger and better things, doesn't that mean she has done very well here? If her hires and actions destroy the athletics dept, I'm guessing those P5 schools won't be knocking at the door.

Asked (above) and answered (below). It is all about the networking --- not on merit.

(05-01-2019 12:23 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  Don't assume that her only way up is to be an AD at a bigger school. I could see her try to make a move to the NCAA, become a conference commissioner, move into pro sports, work for a shoe/apparel company, etc. She's been on a dozen committees and has been growing a big network.
(This post was last modified: 05-01-2019 04:08 PM by Zorch.)
05-01-2019 04:07 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ttgwm02 Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 689
Joined: Jun 2013
Reputation: 22
I Root For: William and Mar
Location:
Post: #98
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(04-30-2019 06:10 PM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 07:37 AM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 06:53 AM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 08:03 PM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  
(04-28-2019 07:43 PM)Tribal Wrote:  Yep. The number of coaches--HC and assistants--who said "no thanks" would blow your mind. Not speculation. Fact.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


I’m not doubting this - I’m not in the know. But I do wonder who would be the source of this information, and then be willing to share with others? Huge knows - and is obviously not going to share this. Is someone on the committee going to talk about how no one wanted the job ... doubtful. So who on the inside would both a) be in the circle to know the details about whom exactly was offered, and b) be willing to share something like that with others that, if true, makes our school / program look really bad? I’ve gotta assume there are a ton of casual conversations with all sorts of people before serious discussions begin about job details and such.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well this is not a "its on the internet so it must be true" sort of thing.

If you want to think differently because its a case of "the truth hurts" then I understand that.

Lets assume for a moment that there is no such info, just speculation (not the case, but lets assume), WM mens hoops was down and out for several years, in the Boyarges era(or as I refer to it, those years where I just handed WM money and the product did not match the description, a 6'10" center who favored 12' jumpers, a PG who couldn't make foul shots or a simple layup. a PF who couldn't do 5 pushups and was more interested in sketching comic books and having his father come on here and berate people who questioned his useless basketball player son for eating up a scholarship) you could go to games and if you spoke above a whisper the scant few people on the other side of the arena could hear you, and for decades the Tribe never even sniffed the title game of any conference they played in. Tony Shaver came in, and within 4 years the Tribe were playing George Mason on ESPN in the CAA Conf Championship game, that was back when the CAA was a top tier mid-conference, not the lowly "one bid, low seed conference" it is today.
Most of what could be deemed success in WM mens hoops has happened in the last 15 years under Tony Shavers watch, he was a missed jumper from making the NCAA's a few years ago, yet with all that, he is dumped and paid to not coach (swirl that one around, this isn't Texas or Bama we are talking about, who pulls this kind of thing all the time, because they have mountains of cash).
So now a supposed "Coaching Search" begins, with a "Committee", and they searched nationally far and wide, and they all came to the same conclusion, that an assistant coach at what is now a low tier program is the answer to getting to the NCAA Xanadu.

You're willing to buy all that?

If so, good for you, just keep in mind that is before the widely known info posted above. Williamsburg is not some sort of Metropolis, everyone is 3 degrees away from knowing someone.

I’m not sure what you’re suggesting I “buy”. No one believes that Huge fired Shaver because she already had Fischer lined up and he was her dream candidate. She decided to fire Shaver (Decision #1). She then found the best coach she could find who wanted to lead our program (Decision #2). These are separate decisions. It’s telling that 3/4 of your response to speculations / facts about the coaching search (Decision #2) is talking about how great Tony is (Decision #1). The emotions are still raw because many of us love Tony and all he did for our program. But it’s clear that those emotions are affecting how many of us are evaluating Decision #2.

Again, I’m not saying it’s not true that many coaches turned us down. In fact, I assume they did. If not, we didn’t search wide/high enough. I’m just challenging any implied statements that our program is a complete dumpster fire and no sensible / quality coach would ever want to be here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

First of all I never used "Great" and "Tony Shaver" in the same sentence, you did.

Secondly, if your program is a big pile of burning shyat for decades with maybe the exception of a random season or two (with still no appearance in a conf championship game of any kind), then a new coach comes in, with a FIVE year contract, and gets you to the CCG in his 4th year, in a highly respected mid-tier conference, then KEEPS your program relevant and respectable for the next decade, and he is suddenly dismissed with no apparent explanation (because we evidently are too stupid to understand it?)
and his replacement is a guy who has never been a HC on any level (much like the person hiring him has never been an AD on any level), that is called "Destabilizing a stable situation", its also exhibit A that any guy with any kind of reputation wanted nothing to do with WM, since WM doesn't give a crap about the one person who dragged a smoldering pile of Moose dung, into respectability.
I'll repeat what someone told me, "Its not the new guy's fault", and that is very true, but the new guy is going to be making about four times what he was making, so that excuse only will last for just so long, for his sake he better have a solid plan and know how to execute it.

Two comments:

(1) We are paying Fischer 4X what we paid Tony?!?

(2) I agree with everything you said. It was said much more concisely than anyone else.
05-01-2019 05:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ttgwm02 Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 689
Joined: Jun 2013
Reputation: 22
I Root For: William and Mar
Location:
Post: #99
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 12:23 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  
(05-01-2019 11:49 AM)mrjoolius Wrote:  
(05-01-2019 11:35 AM)Zorch Wrote:  2. I still think W&M is no more than a short pit stop for Huge on her way to "bigger and better things". Therefore, every decision she makes is geared towards that goal and "patience" is not an ingredient in any of those decisions, imo. So, I think Huge is likely to be long gone before the smell from the trash heap of her long-term decisions puts the school in the registry of toxic waste sites.

How is that supposed to work? If Huge moves on to bigger and better things, doesn't that mean she has done very well here? If her hires and actions destroy the athletics dept, I'm guessing those P5 schools won't be knocking at the door. I agree that Huge has a good relationship with Rowe. I would hope if it does turn out Huge is botching things, that Rowe would have the backbone to hold Huge accountable. It's part of the job. That is a discussion for another day. Unless Huge is wildly successful, I'd think that accountability would be here.

Don't assume that her only way up is to be an AD at a bigger school. I could see her try to make a move to the NCAA, become a conference commissioner, move into pro sports, work for a shoe/apparel company, etc. She's been on a dozen committees and has been growing a big network. She's been really nomadic when you go back and look at her career. She got her law degree in 1997 and started at Illinois three years later. Not sure what she did in between. It doesn't show on her LinkedIn.

Illinois Champlain/Urbana - 2 years
Michigan State - less than 1 year
Wake Forest - 4 years
Georgetown - 3 years
Delaware - 5 years
Texas A&M - 3 years
William and Mary - 2 years

I predict that she will be gone in 2020. That's about the average tenure for her.

Calling what she got a law degree is generous ... and it died of neglect year ago (judging by her critical reasoning on this situation)
05-01-2019 05:12 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ttgwm02 Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 689
Joined: Jun 2013
Reputation: 22
I Root For: William and Mar
Location:
Post: #100
RE: Tell me again why Tony Shaver was fired
(05-01-2019 11:35 AM)Zorch Wrote:  
(04-30-2019 10:10 AM)mrjoolius Wrote:  ... but change and shakeup are inevitable. Time will tell if it was a wise move. Huge will be held accountable for decisions she's made. Comes with the job.

A lot of people keep saying that Huge will be held accountable for her decisions. She certainly should be held accountable, but I am not sure that she will be held accountable, for two reasons.

1. She appears to not only be on good terms with President Rowe, but I would characterize their relationship as "best buds". That is certainly what I observed in Charleston. So, having the support of the boss goes a long, long way towards keeping your job and avoiding accountability.


2. I still think W&M is no more than a short pit stop for Huge on her way to "bigger and better things". Therefore, every decision she makes is geared towards that goal and "patience" is not an ingredient in any of those decisions, imo. So, I think Huge is likely to be long gone before the smell from the trash heap of her long-term decisions puts the school in the registry of toxic waste sites.

The one thing I will give her as to (1) is that she plays certain cards well and can insinuate herself like a tick with her superiors. But since she can't win on brains, and certainly from this decision can't win on decision-making, I do at least appreciate her playing the card she has.
05-01-2019 05:14 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.