(03-20-2019 08:17 AM)gdunn Wrote:  Sorry I work hard to support myself and my family. I don’t want to work hard to support my family and your family because you’re worthless.

(03-20-2019 09:57 AM)miko33 Wrote:  Here is what people fail to understand when they say "just do what the Scandinavian countries do". Those countries have low population figures plus they have access to their own oil that makes it a permanent export for them. On top of that, the U.S. basically subsidizes the rest of the world in a whole slew of things: Defense spending, running trade deficits that exports currency to the rest of the world and pay the full costs of drug development while the rest of the world pays less for these new drugs. There are others, but THIS is why the Scandinavian countries can act the way they do. It would be impossible for the U.S. to emulate an export driven model plus a large welfare state - because we ARE the piggy bank that the other countries use...

This is why Bernie is such a slimy POS and his supporters are retards.

Exactly, take away the US footing the bill for their defense and security and you'll see them rapidly run out of money as they have to spend it on other things.

It's like a 18yo kid living at home buying a $3000 dollar computer to play games on. He can afford that with his job, because he's not paying rent, utilities, food, etc.
If he had to pay for those, he wouldn't be able to save up to buy his expensive toys.

(03-20-2019 07:01 AM)fsquid Wrote:  People need to stop calling what the nordic countries have, socialism.

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(03-20-2019 11:44 AM)GoodOwl Wrote:  

(03-20-2019 07:01 AM)fsquid Wrote:  People need to stop calling what the nordic countries have, socialism.

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those purple and white walls...

where are all the black folk? (as I depart from Salt Lake)....

(03-20-2019 05:46 AM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  http://www.theforecaster.net/the-univers...u-want-it/

The socialism espoused by Americans in 2019 is not state socialism, government ownership of the means of production, centralized economies and collective farms. The new American socialism looks to Scandinavia, perhaps the most successful societies the world has ever known; free-market economies that share the wealth so that all citizens can have an education, health care, a living wage and housing.

Yeah... if there is ever going to be another civil war, it isn't going to be some race war that the MSM likes to talk about. It is going to be when the government decides to start taking private property from people on a massive scale to give it to (or to pay for services for) people who aren't willing to work, or are in the country illegally.

(03-20-2019 01:05 PM)ECUGrad07 Wrote:  Yeah... if there is ever going to be another civil war, it isn't going to be some race war that the MSM likes to talk about. It is going to be when the government decides to start taking private property from people on a massive scale to give it to (or to pay for services for) people who aren't willing to work, or are in the country illegally.

I don't disagree, but they'll absolutely do their best to justify that along racial lines. They've been working that angle for years now. It's money in the bank now because Dems are more and more playing the race card into every political discussion point.

(03-20-2019 11:41 AM)q5sys Wrote:  

(03-20-2019 09:57 AM)miko33 Wrote:  Here is what people fail to understand when they say "just do what the Scandinavian countries do". Those countries have low population figures plus they have access to their own oil that makes it a permanent export for them. On top of that, the U.S. basically subsidizes the rest of the world in a whole slew of things: Defense spending, running trade deficits that exports currency to the rest of the world and pay the full costs of drug development while the rest of the world pays less for these new drugs. There are others, but THIS is why the Scandinavian countries can act the way they do. It would be impossible for the U.S. to emulate an export driven model plus a large welfare state - because we ARE the piggy bank that the other countries use...

This is why Bernie is such a slimy POS and his supporters are retards.

Exactly, take away the US footing the bill for their defense and security and you'll see them rapidly run out of money as they have to spend it on other things.

It's like a 18yo kid living at home buying a $3000 dollar computer to play games on. He can afford that with his job, because he's not paying rent, utilities, food, etc.
If he had to pay for those, he wouldn't be able to save up to buy his expensive toys.

You just offended a lot of fingers typing on $3000 computers in this community.....

Why couldn't some smaller blue states try out what is working in Scandinavia? Seems like Vermont and Hawaii could be great states to give it a go.

(03-20-2019 06:35 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  Unlike most of my neighbors, I am not a fan of guns. I am fairly sure that I am the only unarmed resident on my street.

Overlooked and tangentially related: Admiral Yamamoto and a few other big WWII axis types remarked that a land invasion of the US was simply not plausible because the population is already armed enough to fight you from coast to coast before they even have the military show up.

(03-20-2019 01:57 PM)SoMs Eagle Wrote:  

(03-20-2019 11:41 AM)q5sys Wrote:  

(03-20-2019 09:57 AM)miko33 Wrote:  Here is what people fail to understand when they say "just do what the Scandinavian countries do". Those countries have low population figures plus they have access to their own oil that makes it a permanent export for them. On top of that, the U.S. basically subsidizes the rest of the world in a whole slew of things: Defense spending, running trade deficits that exports currency to the rest of the world and pay the full costs of drug development while the rest of the world pays less for these new drugs. There are others, but THIS is why the Scandinavian countries can act the way they do. It would be impossible for the U.S. to emulate an export driven model plus a large welfare state - because we ARE the piggy bank that the other countries use...

This is why Bernie is such a slimy POS and his supporters are retards.

Exactly, take away the US footing the bill for their defense and security and you'll see them rapidly run out of money as they have to spend it on other things.

It's like a 18yo kid living at home buying a $3000 dollar computer to play games on. He can afford that with his job, because he's not paying rent, utilities, food, etc.
If he had to pay for those, he wouldn't be able to save up to buy his expensive toys.

You just offended a lot of fingers typing on $3000 computers in this community.....

If they're 18 and living in their parents house I dont really care. They'll get over it.

If they are adults that have a job and pay their own bills... clearly i wasnt talking about them.

(03-20-2019 02:25 PM)YNot Wrote:  Why couldn't some smaller blue states try out what is working in Scandinavia? Seems like Vermont and Hawaii could be great states to give it a go.

Two big problems with that:
1) "What is working in Scandinavia" is very different from what the left keeps telling us is working there; it's way more capitalistic and less socialistic than what Bernie and AOC are proposing, and
2) "What is working in Scandinavia" isn't really working all that well; it would do better it were even less socialistic, and its leaders are moving that way.

(03-20-2019 07:01 AM)fsquid Wrote:  People need to stop calling what the nordic countries have, socialism.

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Maybe this is "insensitive" to say, but Imma say it anyway, because it is the truth. You are correct, and one huge reason is that the nordic countries have ONE nationality (read skin tone) that reduces the problems they battle to just classism. They all have pretty much the same culture. Additionally, they are MUCH smaller. Comparing them to the United States is ludicrous. They are more comparable to ONE of our states. Like, if you decided to try Socialism in Pennsylvania, it would be a whole lot easier than trying it for the whole US. Not it would work anyway (due to Penn's proximity to other free states, and their racial, social, and cultural diversity).

(03-20-2019 05:46 AM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  http://www.theforecaster.net/the-univers...u-want-it/

The socialism espoused by Americans in 2019 is not state socialism, government ownership of the means of production, centralized economies and collective farms. The new American socialism looks to Scandinavia, perhaps the most successful societies the world has ever known; free-market economies that share the wealth so that all citizens can have an education, health care, a living wage and housing.

Yea, I remember reading about the industrial revolution, cotton gin, combustion engine, jets, land moonings, and PC's and Apple whatever's coming from Denmark and Iceland.

Capitalism sucks, just ask the trust fund kiddos at occupy stupid street.
Day-um.

(03-20-2019 02:25 PM)YNot Wrote:  Why couldn't some smaller blue states try out what is working in Scandinavia? Seems like Vermont and Hawaii could be great states to give it a go.

Vermont tried. Look it up.

Lasted about 20 months or so. Socilaism don' work.

(03-20-2019 05:46 AM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  http://www.theforecaster.net/the-univers...u-want-it/
The socialism espoused by Americans in 2019 is not state socialism, government ownership of the means of production, centralized economies and collective farms. The new American socialism looks to Scandinavia, perhaps the most successful societies the world has ever known; free-market economies that share the wealth so that all citizens can have an education, health care, a living wage and housing.

Actually, no it doesn't. Scandinavia is inherently NOT about sharing the wealth. I can accumulate wealth faster in Scandinavia than I can in the US, at least I could before the 2017 tax act. Scandinavia is not about taxing the wealthy to subsidize the poor. It is about everybody paying (a lot) and everybody receiving (benefits). The "rich" don't pay a lot more there than they do here (and less than they would pay here under Bernie's or AOC's proposals), and corporations pay less, but the poor and middle class pay a hell of a lot more. Sweden has a top tax rate of 60%, but that kicks in at about US$75,000, and you pay 55% starting at around US$50,000, and below that you pay 35%. And they have a "regressive" consumption tax and their "regressive" social security tax is a lot more than ours. But if you own a business, you can incorporate and earn profits that are taxed at a lower rate than here (used to be much lower, roughly half), and accumulate your wealth inside the corporation (that you still control).

The new socialism is not government ownership of the means of production and collective farms. It is about centralized economies, with nominal private ownership but with intrusive micromanagement by government regulators, and massive redistribution of profits. There is a name for that kind of economic system--fascism. That is inherent in the very name. Fascism derives its name from the Roman fascis/fasces, "bundle," a bound bundle of wooden rods, sometimes including an axe with its blade emerging, symbolizing how government and business are bound together.

(03-20-2019 06:35 AM)AdoptedMonarch Wrote:  Unlike most of my neighbors, I am not a fan of guns. I am fairly sure that I am the only unarmed resident on my street.

But if I see socialism taking hold in America, I promise you that I will arm myself to the teeth. It is evil and it is dangerous.

Why wait until it may be too late? I love guns, the mechanical action of them is fascinating and the result is almost always as intended if your aim is good. I don't care for the damage they inflict when wielded by bad guys but that's not the fault of the gun.

(03-20-2019 07:44 AM)BadgerMJ Wrote:  

(03-20-2019 05:46 AM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  http://www.theforecaster.net/the-univers...u-want-it/

The socialism espoused by Americans in 2019 is not state socialism, government ownership of the means of production, centralized economies and collective farms. The new American socialism looks to Scandinavia, perhaps the most successful societies the world has ever known; free-market economies that share the wealth so that all citizens can have an education, health care, a living wage and housing.

We already have that. It's called OWNERSHIP.

If you want a larger "share of the wealth" you have options.

1) Increase your value to an employer thru education, skills, experience, etc.
2) Start and own a business.

Take OWNERSHIP of your life and your path, don't just sit back and expect government to "fix" your issues for you.

Doing nothing and expecting something used to have a name.

LAZINESS.

You're on a roll today

(03-20-2019 08:07 AM)swagsurfer11 Wrote:  i know I want it! They haven’t been doing it right!

Must.Not.Neg.Rep...

You got one part right, they haven't been doing it right. I'll leave you to ponder why. Hint - it isn't for lack of trying.

(03-20-2019 08:52 AM)Jugnaut Wrote:  

(03-20-2019 05:46 AM)Ohio Poly Wrote:  http://www.theforecaster.net/the-univers...u-want-it/

The socialism espoused by Americans in 2019 is not state socialism, government ownership of the means of production, centralized economies and collective farms. The new American socialism looks to Scandinavia, perhaps the most successful societies the world has ever known; free-market economies that share the wealth so that all citizens can have an education, health care, a living wage and housing.

First, what the Dems are espousing in 2019 is state socialism with government control over the economy. Just look at the new green deal. Secondly, while Americans may want a more robust social safety net they are unwilling to pay more taxes to get it. Moreover, the US is already in poor government fiscal health and cannot afford additional social spending. Our financial situation requires cuts to benefits not expansion. And finally, the US has little in common with small european, overwhelmingly white homogenous cultures which rely on the protection of the US to subsize their social spending. Even with that huge boon, those countries are still degrading finacially and their social system is unsustainable. Recently, the government of Finland resigned over the issue.

What Dems are offering is fools good. If they are successful, it will end the same way it has every time with untold human suffering through socialism.

+3