Too many of the MAC teams fall into the 7 win category.

Deserving of a bowl but not deserving to win.

Only Ohio, Buffalo and NIU belonged winning their bowl games. Ohio did it. Buffalo was close. NIU totally failed. The MAC champion should be able to win its bowl game.

(12-27-2018 07:37 AM)beefcake0520 Wrote:  

(12-26-2018 10:52 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  

(12-26-2018 08:59 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  

(12-25-2018 11:12 PM)cleveland Wrote:  

(12-25-2018 10:54 PM)kreed5120 Wrote:  Not saying it would. I don't feel it impacts it either way.

NFL scouts say - with few exceptions - they don't focus on scouting MAC players until the league starts playing midweek in November ...

Not sure what point you're trying to make. I haven't seen the product on the field improve comparing the pre-midweek era to now. If it has improved at all its marginal. Moving the games to midweek was a money grab and I'm okay with it because MAC athletic departments need to do what is required to minimize its budget deficits. It's a necessary evil I understand that. All I'm asking for is honesty. Steinbrecher just tries to sugarcoat the situation.

The product hasn't improved at all. That much is obvious. So the only benefit is the money, let's just admit that, can't we? Nobody is watching ESPNU games, just look at the ratings for college football games on ESPNU, for any conference. they suck.

The money can't make up for shortcomings it causes at the live gate. If it changes attendance by 5k fans showing up on a saturday vs. on a tuesday, that can be a healthy chunk of change.

+1

Overall attendance shift/$ it would likely make up for the contract-money difference.

There are so many digital platforms these days, many looking for content. Can't we sign on with someone other than ESPNP5 and only guarantee a few weekday games in Dec.?

Just curious, how many MAC teams have had 4 midweek games including all the biggest games for the past decade or so?

(12-30-2018 09:42 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Too many of the MAC teams fall into the 7 win category.

Deserving of a bowl but not deserving to win.

Only Ohio, Buffalo and NIU belonged winning their bowl games. Ohio did it. Buffalo was close. NIU totally failed. The MAC champion should be able to win its bowl game.

But plenty of NIU fans think the bowl game is just an exhibition and it doesn't matter if we fail miserably in every bowl game. It looks like that attitude has rubbed off on the coaches and maybe the players.

Quote:But plenty of NIU fans think the bowl game is just an exhibition and it doesn't matter if we fail miserably in every bowl game. It looks like that attitude has rubbed off on the coaches and maybe the players.

Failing miserably in a bowl game is going to be worse than failing miserably in a random regular season game. Image means a lot when everyone's watching, and it's not some Tuesday night MAC game on ESPNU. :)

(12-31-2018 05:33 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  

(12-30-2018 09:42 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Too many of the MAC teams fall into the 7 win category.

Deserving of a bowl but not deserving to win.

Only Ohio, Buffalo and NIU belonged winning their bowl games. Ohio did it. Buffalo was close. NIU totally failed. The MAC champion should be able to win its bowl game.

But plenty of NIU fans think the bowl game is just an exhibition and it doesn't matter if we fail miserably in every bowl game. It looks like that attitude has rubbed off on the coaches and maybe the players.

I agree, but I would reverse that, fans don't care anymore because the coaches and players do not seem to care anymore in NIU's case.

My personal take on bowl games, they carry zero meaning in terms of it being considered "post-season" or some grander meaning than a regular season game. Bowl games to me are just a 1 game extension of the non-conf season. The games are as meaningful as any September non-conf game. There is not enough correlation to quality of year and quality of reward in this game for it to be considered post-season. The number of bowl games also dilutes any other meaning outside of a 1 game extension of non-conf season.

It's a grey area.

Given there is a certain criteria to play a bowl game (even if it's loose), it qualifies it as post-season. And unlike MLB and NFL 'exhibitions,' bowl game outcomes, stats, etc., count to your overall record.

Still, obviously college football is unique in that the games are all one-and-done, regardless of win or lose. So that gives it an exhibition flavor to it. Not to mention the sheer number of bowls tends to water down interest, especially with tie-ins that don't make much geographical sense (MAC should be a primary tie to Detroit, not Boise).

In a sense, making a bowl is more important than the outcome itself, although you don't want to be a Purdue or Houston and get annihilated. The four extra weeks of popping up in media lists, the 3-hour block of national TV time, extra practices, recruiting tools, and so on.

September OOC games, in itself, are more exciting because all fans seem to care more.

I would say making a bowl is less important than winning the bowl if you're in one, because there are so many bowls now that making a bowl is not an accomplishment anymore.

(01-02-2019 09:19 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  I would say making a bowl is less important than winning the bowl if you're in one, because there are so many bowls now that making a bowl is not an accomplishment anymore.

I agree making a bowl isn't an accomplishment unless your name is EMU, Kent, Akron or Buffalo all of which have made only a couple of bowls ever.

Particularly now that MAC bowls are not tilts with the SEC like they were in the 70's but against CUSA or SBC level programs.

Actually winning the bowl is a big accomplishment for a MAC school as we can see from the results over the years it is difficult to do.

(01-02-2019 09:59 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  

(01-02-2019 09:19 AM)NIU007 Wrote:  I would say making a bowl is less important than winning the bowl if you're in one, because there are so many bowls now that making a bowl is not an accomplishment anymore.

I agree making a bowl isn't an accomplishment unless your name is EMU, Kent, Akron or Buffalo all of which have made only a couple of bowls ever.

Particularly now that MAC bowls are not tilts with the SEC like they were in the 70's but against CUSA or SBC level programs.

Actually winning the bowl is a big accomplishment for a MAC school as we can see from the results over the years it is difficult to do.

Can confirm. People on Akron's board were trying to justify not firing Bowden because he made 2 bowls in 7 years failing to realize that's an underachievement and actually a reason to fire him considering 62% of teams make bowls these days.

I wonder what percentage of G5 teams, and more specifically MAC teams, make bowls each year.
30%? Lower? Higher?

(01-02-2019 11:57 AM)axeme Wrote:  I wonder what percentage of G5 teams, and more specifically MAC teams, make bowls each year.
30%? Lower? Higher?

Going back to the start of CFP, here are the number of MAC teams that made bowl games per year.

2015 - 5
2016 - 7
2017 - 6
2018 - 5
2019 - 6

That averages out to 5.8 per year which equates to 48.3%

(01-02-2019 09:59 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Particularly now that MAC bowls are not tilts with the SEC like they were in the 70's but against CUSA or SBC level programs.

I honestly don't mind playing peer CUSA and Sun Belt teams [although WMU has only played 1 team from those conferences in our last 6 bowls]. What's become embarrassing is how badly we've been getting exposed in recent years. Ohio aside, of course.

There are plenty of "David/Goliath" opportunities in September if we want to test our mettle against P5. I went to our USC game in 2017 and it had a bowl atmosphere to it among our traveling fan contingent in L.A.

(12-29-2018 04:33 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  

(12-25-2018 09:45 PM)kreed5120 Wrote:  Steinbrecher is aware the MAC is 2-16 over the last 3 years in bowl games, right? I'm not buying mid-week games help recruiting.

kreed5120 is aware that bowl games are exhibition games, right? And exhibition games that are sometimes true neutral site games but often quasi-away games?

If you are selling bowl games being the best barometer of recruiting, I'm not buying.

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(12-27-2018 07:59 AM)thanksjim Wrote:  I know this would cost money, but I would love to see more football/basketball combos for arenas in the MAC. Hopefully would quiet the attendance argument about it being.....too cold or whatever else excuse there is.

It'd also be great if ifs and buts were candies and nuts ... then we'd all have a Merry Christmas.

Seriously, if money were to fall out of the sky to allow Kent to build a football/BBall dome. Playing all of their BBall games in a cavernous arena because it's in a combo dome is surrendering too much home court advantage in advance.

I came a crossed this post in another thread. It shows each conferences OOC winning % over the last 5 years against FBS, P5, and G5. The MAC finished 9th out of 10 in overal FBS winning percentage and dead last in G5 winning %. Credit to Ken D for creating.

Conf....vs FBS...vs P5...vs G5

SEC........770......579......906
B1G........681......517......824
PAC........648......506......773
XII.........621......443......833
ACC........591.....435......769

AAC........428.....328......545
MWC.......381.....190......551
USA........331.....078......558
MAC........273....170......380
SBC........257.....048......421

ND..........688.....627......923
BYU.........533.....391.....622

For purposes of this exercise, games against Notre Dame are counted as P5 games, and those against BYU are G5 games. For the ACC, all Notre Dame games are considered OOC.

Quote:AAC........428.....328......545
MWC.......381.....190......551
USA........331.....078......558
MAC........273....170......380
SBC........257.....048......421

That. We can do just fine comparatively against the P5. But when we play the G5s, we're bottom of the barrel.

If we'd win the MAC vs CUSA Champ bowl games often enough, that'd at least make this less of a big deal.