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Game 9: At Old Dominion
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ColonelEbirt Offline
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Post: #81
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
My biggest concerns are:
1) the team does not seem to be improving (though I can make excuses based on the injury bugs and ever-changing rotations)
2) no one appears to be stepping up to take control and lead the team (with of course no knowledge of what's happening at practice and behind closed doors).
Our identity needs to be created by Matt + Paul + Nate + Justin. The younger guys are talented, but we need them to slip in and complement the identity the older leaders have created. Until our experienced guys figure out their distinct roles, this team will continue to look lost on the floor.

Lots of basketball ahead - and what's ahead is all that matters in the end. So definitely still optimistic. Let's see if the guys can turn it around!
12-06-2018 12:29 PM
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Tribe32 Online
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Post: #82
Game 9: At Old Dominion
(12-06-2018 11:31 AM)SoCal Frank Wrote:  We got beat by a team with better players. That’s the long and short of it!


I’m not sure if you watched game, but ODU doesn’t have better players. Both teams played like crap. We were just worse.


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12-06-2018 01:05 PM
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LeadBolt Offline
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Post: #83
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
(12-06-2018 12:29 PM)ColonelEbirt Wrote:  My biggest concerns are:
1) the team does not seem to be improving (though I can make excuses based on the injury bugs and ever-changing rotations)
2) no one appears to be stepping up to take control and lead the team (with of course no knowledge of what's happening at practice and behind closed doors).
Our identity needs to be created by Matt + Paul + Nate + Justin. The younger guys are talented, but we need them to slip in and complement the identity the older leaders have created. Until our experienced guys figure out their distinct roles, this team will continue to look lost on the floor.

Lots of basketball ahead - and what's ahead is all that matters in the end. So definitely still optimistic. Let's see if the guys can turn it around!

I share your worries as well.

I actually thought they defended better last night than previously. The 2-3 zone was a good move against ODU's personnel and system.

The offense was awful. Too few assists, but then again it's hard to get assists when no one is making shots. Turnovers were not egregious as has been the case earlier games. Passing seems a little less lazy than at times earlier in the season. All 11 players that saw time seemed unable to hit the ocean with a beach ball.

I may be crazy, but I didn't see the ODU defense as the major reason for the offense sputtering, although ODU does play defense well. 46% FT shooting (40% when adjusted for frontend 1 and 1 misses) is hard to blame on the other teams defense.

The health of the 4 Jr's & Sr is critical in allowing them to play aggressively and effectively, as is the development of the Sophs and Frosh and them finding defining roles within the team structure where they contribute to fill in where the upper class men need supplementing.

I'm going to the game in C'ville and the home games vs. JMU and Towson, I hope to see increased progress toward an effective CAA season.
12-06-2018 01:07 PM
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Zorch Offline
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Post: #84
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
(12-06-2018 12:03 PM)TribePride91 Wrote:  Last night 11 guys played and none of them were particularly effective. We shot the ball very poorly and defended poorly. There is no one we can beat when both those things occur. But, the schedule has been difficult. I don't think "the chemistry is bad". We are missing an excellent point guard and a fantastic 3 point shooter from last season. Milon, Pierce, and Rowley are all struggling with various injuries which also impacts conditioning and likely their shooting. Nathan can be limited or taken away with zones and double teams or fouls. He is still a major impact player. So, the 4 returning leaders of the team are all no where near where I hope they will be during the conference season. All 4 are excellent players and have shown the repeated ability to make great team plays. The freshmen, Loewe, Jihar, and Clark are all still working to find their roles. Say what you want, but the limited number of guys who played last year were all very familiar with the system. They may all still make significant improvement over the next 2 months. The shooting, including that from the foul line is concerning. But, I hope that the guys remain positive, keep working hard, and accept that the Tribe needs all of them to get where they want to go. None of the losses mean anything for the CAA race except that we aren't playing well right now. While I went way off the deep end on my season prediction, I still think the Tribe is capable of a good CAA season if we can defend, work together within a well proven offensive system, and make critical free throws. It is not like any other CAA team looks unbeatable at this point, either. We have 3 weeks to try and get things going before we open at home with JMU and Towson.

(12-06-2018 06:18 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  The CAA appears right now to look weaker overall than last year. Suffered some abominable losses with few "highlight" victories.

No chance at an at-large NCAA bid.

TribePride91 said what I want to say, so I have simply highlighted his points that I most agree with.

From the Tribe website: "The road can be difficult. It often deals out tough lessons and leaves bumps. Playing its fifth contest in the opening nine on the road, the youthful William & Mary men's basketball team experienced another challenging setting on Wednesday nigth, falling at Old Dominion, 71-53.

The Tribe's five road opponents to this point in 2018 are a combined 23-3 inside their own gyms.

The game, as it usually does, changed on the simplest of plays. After a missed ODU free throw, the Tribe did not pull down the defensive rebound as it instead bounced out of bounds and went the way of the Monarchs. Marquis Godwin splashed a momentum-changing triple to stretch the lead back to seven, 41-34."

From ESPN Recap: "Old Dominion is ranked in the top seven in the nation for holding opponents to less than 55 points and 36 percent shooting. Those defensive stats were reflected Wednesday as William & Mary shot 35 percent (21 of 60) on the way to its 53 points."

The things that concern me the most are the abysmal free throw shooting (especially considering how good they were last year), the PG play (which will get better with experience for both of them), and Nathan's fouling. But let's face it, that last one involves an outside variable (namely, the officials). So if any officials (especially all these refs from other conferences who probably are not even familiar with Knight other than his reputation) want to foul out Nate, then they are going to foul out Nate regardless of what he himself is doing.

Remember, the UIC game went to OT and many of us thought that if Knight was on the floor instead of the bench then that game would have been a win; plus Rowley did not play. We lost to Notre Dame with Pierce and Rowley injured. We lost to a good Radford team with Pierce, Rowley, and Milon all out. Those could have been 3 wins and, if so, the psyche of this team would be in a far better place.

Since then, I think that we had no business losing to Mason; that we played poorly against Marshall; and that we had an absolutely terrible shooting night against ODU. But since conference play is all that matters in this one-bid league, and since everyone else but Charleston seems to be stinking it up, I think that we will do all right in CAA play.
12-06-2018 02:00 PM
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Tribe32 Online
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Post: #85
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
So let's get the 8 guys who will play the most minutes most of the playing time on Saturday and then clear the bench with William Peace. We need to get some continuity and cohesion.
12-06-2018 02:03 PM
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mturn017 Offline
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Post: #86
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
(12-06-2018 01:05 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  
(12-06-2018 11:31 AM)SoCal Frank Wrote:  We got beat by a team with better players. That’s the long and short of it!


I’m not sure if you watched game, but ODU doesn’t have better players. Both teams played like crap. We were just worse.


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I'm pretty happy with the way we played. Other than too many stupid turnovers and allowing too many second chances we played pretty well. Our defensive FG% is 35.8% (7th in the country) and the Tribe shot 35%.
12-06-2018 03:20 PM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #87
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
(12-06-2018 03:20 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(12-06-2018 01:05 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  
(12-06-2018 11:31 AM)SoCal Frank Wrote:  We got beat by a team with better players. That’s the long and short of it!


I’m not sure if you watched game, but ODU doesn’t have better players. Both teams played like crap. We were just worse.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm pretty happy with the way we played. Other than too many stupid turnovers and allowing too many second chances we played pretty well. Our defensive FG% is 35.8% (7th in the country) and the Tribe shot 35%.

As you should be. The Monarchs just finished defeating VCU, JMU, and the Tribe. Perhaps not the greatest versions of any of those teams, but a good streak to win all of those and something ODU would not have done in recent seasons. As I stated earlier, I hate that we lost to ODU, but last night the better team won. Hopefully, the Tribe will be a vastly different team in March from the one that visited Norfolk last night. I do like when teams in state are willing to play each other in Nov. and December. See you guys next year at the Kap hopefully.
12-06-2018 04:14 PM
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TribePride91 Offline
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Post: #88
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
For a small ray of hope for the season, here is a historical fact.

This Tribe team from the past struggled thru the nonconference schedule of that season and had a generally listless November and December which included a few blowout losses. The 2 road victories it did get were against Wofford and Howard(and both of those games were close). It lost 2 games by decent margins at home(similar to the 2 losses the Tribe has suffered this season). That team also later suffered one of the worst losses in the Shaver era, losing by 35 on the road in conference play.

We all remember that team well(especially the last 15 minutes of basketball that team played). Hopefully, this Tribe team can right the ship, come together and go on a special conference run. Hopefully, the next 3 Saturdays will be fun times to measure progress and define some roles. Plus, it is fun to imagine how much better Chase, Thornton and LJ might be in about 3 months.

Excited to see where things go from here. I am still confident Nathan, Justin, Paul, and Matt figure this out and the freshmen turn into young sophomores during the conference season.
12-06-2018 04:36 PM
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mturn017 Offline
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RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
(12-06-2018 04:14 PM)TribePride91 Wrote:  
(12-06-2018 03:20 PM)mturn017 Wrote:  
(12-06-2018 01:05 PM)Tribe32 Wrote:  
(12-06-2018 11:31 AM)SoCal Frank Wrote:  We got beat by a team with better players. That’s the long and short of it!


I’m not sure if you watched game, but ODU doesn’t have better players. Both teams played like crap. We were just worse.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm pretty happy with the way we played. Other than too many stupid turnovers and allowing too many second chances we played pretty well. Our defensive FG% is 35.8% (7th in the country) and the Tribe shot 35%.

As you should be. The Monarchs just finished defeating VCU, JMU, and the Tribe. Perhaps not the greatest versions of any of those teams, but a good streak to win all of those and something ODU would not have done in recent seasons. As I stated earlier, I hate that we lost to ODU, but last night the better team won. Hopefully, the Tribe will be a vastly different team in March from the one that visited Norfolk last night. I do like when teams in state are willing to play each other in Nov. and December. See you guys next year at the Kap hopefully.

I don't blame you but we were due. Your program has come a long way and I think you'll be fine going into the future with the young talent on the team. I'll be rooting for you in the CAA this year, something I wasn't able to do last year as the "Trot Shot" created a burning loathing deep within my soul towards the Tribe. That was (mostly) quenched last night but do hope we continue the rivalry.
12-06-2018 04:41 PM
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WMInTheBurg Offline
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Post: #90
RE: Game 9: At Old Dominion
(12-06-2018 06:39 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  *Pierce had his first bad game last night...up to then he has been very good. Last night he appeared to be trying to do too much. And, by the way, I don't believe he's injured--Tony would never play a guy who should not be playing. Never.

We lost games because Daniel Dixon and Quinn McDowell tried to play through injuries. The history of this coaching staff is that players return too soon, and the most favorable way of putting that is that the players want to play and the coaches believe the players when they say they're healthy. I wouldn't be upset if Pierce didn't play until 2019. The most important games he'll play are in March, not December. I'd rather get Quinn Blair extra court time than risk Pierce's injury lingering all season.

I think we've got something special, but it's going to take a different kind of coaching than our teams have required in the past to see any returns this year. I'm not saying Coach Shaver isn't up to it, just that this year is different.
12-06-2018 06:39 PM
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