The Tide playing a non-conference road game? Maybe...

Quote:Alabama is negotiating to schedule a home-and-home football series with Notre Dame, The Tuscaloosa News has learned. Alabama is also working on a home-and-home deal with Texas.

Quote:“I’ll say that we are exploring some home-and-homes,” Byrne said.

But, don't expect to see Nick Saban coaching the Tide in those games...

Quote:It the Notre Dame series comes to fruition, it would not likely take place until well into the next decade because Notre Dame has several other contracted high-profile games in future years.

https://www.tidesports.com/alabama-negot...otre-dame/

I suppose you can only play in Atlanta and Dallas so many times before everyone gets bored.

(03-24-2018 11:47 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  I suppose you can only play in Atlanta and Dallas so many times before everyone gets bored.

The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

(03-25-2018 01:57 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(03-24-2018 11:47 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  I suppose you can only play in Atlanta and Dallas so many times before everyone gets bored.

The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

I know. I'm not sure why anyone cares though.

I enjoy home and homes, but the important thing is to play a quality opponent. If you can make more money at a neutral site every year than you can on a home game every other year then why not?

I imagine though that fans are getting tired of traveling and promoters are getting tired of seeing the same team in the same venues. So it makes sense to shake it up.

(03-25-2018 10:23 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 01:57 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(03-24-2018 11:47 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  I suppose you can only play in Atlanta and Dallas so many times before everyone gets bored.

The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

I know. I'm not sure why anyone cares though.

I enjoy home and homes, but the important thing is to play a quality opponent. If you can make more money at a neutral site every year than you can on a home game every other year then why not?

I imagine though that fans are getting tired of traveling and promoters are getting tired of seeing the same team in the same venues. So it makes sense to shake it up.

Alabama has enough clout to do what they want. Why do fans of other teams care? Because playing non-con road games against good teams is challenging, and because "their" teams play road games. Michigan has home/home series with ND, Washington, UCLA, OU, and UT scheduled for upcoming seasons. OU has home/home series with UCLA, Nebraska, Michigan, Tennessee, and LSU scheduled, and they just finished one with Ohio State.

Say What ?

If this is true it's a good thing. Somebody in Tuscaloosa found Jesus! Or Saban said, "do what you want after 2022, I'll be retired by then"

This is part of ND's scheduling philosophy as an independent to have game "markers" (for playoff consideration) against teams from all P5 conferences.

Regarding SEC "markers", ND scheduled home/home series recently with Georgia, Arkansas and Texas A&M.

Setting up a home/home with Alabama fits with that philosophy, as were home/home series against Texas and Oklahoma (Big 12) and Michigan (Big Ten).

ND has the ACC "markers" covered with the five games per year and the Pac 12 with annual games with Southern Cal and Stanford.

(03-26-2018 06:56 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This is part of ND's scheduling philosophy as an independent to have game "markers" (for playoff consideration) against teams from all P5 conferences.

Regarding SEC "markers", ND scheduled home/home series recently with Georgia, Arkansas and Texas A&M.

Setting up a home/home with Alabama fits with that philosophy, as were home/home series against Texas and Oklahoma (Big 12) and Michigan (Big Ten).

ND has the ACC "markers" covered with the five games per year and the Pac 12 with annual games with Southern Cal and Stanford.

And that 5 game contracted schedule kinda makes that tag of "independent" passe'.

(03-26-2018 07:22 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 06:56 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This is part of ND's scheduling philosophy as an independent to have game "markers" (for playoff consideration) against teams from all P5 conferences.

Regarding SEC "markers", ND scheduled home/home series recently with Georgia, Arkansas and Texas A&M.

Setting up a home/home with Alabama fits with that philosophy, as were home/home series against Texas and Oklahoma (Big 12) and Michigan (Big Ten).

ND has the ACC "markers" covered with the five games per year and the Pac 12 with annual games with Southern Cal and Stanford.

And that 5 game contracted schedule kinda makes that tag of "independent" passe'.

Hell no, it does not.

What division of the ACC is ND in?

How much does ESPN pay ND football for being in the ACC?

I guess that NBC is in for a big surprise, knowing that its ND contract is null and void.

In the past, ND schedules included three games a year against Big Ten schools and two games a year (usually Pitt and BC) against Big East schools.

From ND's perspective, replacing those scheduled games with five against the ACC is merely shuffling game opponents, not something that is "passe'". Same arrangement, different opponents.

ND sees these as scheduling arrangements as an independent, nothing more.

(03-26-2018 09:46 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 07:22 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 06:56 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This is part of ND's scheduling philosophy as an independent to have game "markers" (for playoff consideration) against teams from all P5 conferences.

Regarding SEC "markers", ND scheduled home/home series recently with Georgia, Arkansas and Texas A&M.

Setting up a home/home with Alabama fits with that philosophy, as were home/home series against Texas and Oklahoma (Big 12) and Michigan (Big Ten).

ND has the ACC "markers" covered with the five games per year and the Pac 12 with annual games with Southern Cal and Stanford.

And that 5 game contracted schedule kinda makes that tag of "independent" passe'.

Hell no, it does not.

What division of the ACC is ND in?

How much does ESPN pay ND football for being in the ACC?

I guess that NBC is in for a big surprise, knowing that its ND contract is null and void.

In the past, ND schedules included three games a year against Big Ten schools and two games a year (usually Pitt and BC) against Big East schools.

From ND's perspective, replacing those scheduled games with five against the ACC is merely shuffling game opponents, not something that is "passe'". Same arrangement, different opponents.

ND sees these as scheduling arrangements as an independent, nothing more.

If you have shuffled the B1G and Big East out for the 5 ACC games how would you explain Michigan Sept 1 and Northwestern Nov. 03 in 2018, Michigan Oct 26 in 2019 and Wisconsin on Oct 3 in 2020?

(03-26-2018 12:38 AM)Wedge Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 10:23 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 01:57 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(03-24-2018 11:47 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  I suppose you can only play in Atlanta and Dallas so many times before everyone gets bored.

The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

I know. I'm not sure why anyone cares though.

I enjoy home and homes, but the important thing is to play a quality opponent. If you can make more money at a neutral site every year than you can on a home game every other year then why not?

I imagine though that fans are getting tired of traveling and promoters are getting tired of seeing the same team in the same venues. So it makes sense to shake it up.

Alabama has enough clout to do what they want. Why do fans of other teams care? Because playing non-con road games against good teams is challenging, and because "their" teams play road games. Michigan has home/home series with ND, Washington, UCLA, OU, and UT scheduled for upcoming seasons. OU has home/home series with UCLA, Nebraska, Michigan, Tennessee, and LSU scheduled, and they just finished one with Ohio State.

Bama can do what they want within certain parameters, yes. That's why they chose to play a neutral site game every year. These were essentially made for TV events and helped create buzz for the program back before Saban had established a pattern of success. They also drew large TV audiences. It made too much sense and they've been good for us.

As far as fans of other schools go, again, I don't see why they are particularly worried about what Bama does or doesn't do. If certain schools want to play home and home then that's great. If they want to arrange neutral site games then that's great too. I've never sat back and looked at another school's schedule and wondered why they weren't playing P5 road games every other season. I like to see good match-ups on TV and all that, but I don't care where the game is played.

If we're evaluating someone's resume for a CFP appearance then I want to see that they've played a good team out of conference. Other than that, doesn't matter to me.

People have lobbed this criticism at Florida for many years saying they never played a quality non-conference opponent outside the state of Florida...who cares? They played Florida State every year and the two programs happen to be geographically close to one another. In most years, FSU is a far tougher opponent than most schools will play out of conference so I don't know why anyone would be worried about that.

Personally, I would love it if we all played 12 quality games every season, but that won't happen anytime soon.

(03-26-2018 01:53 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 12:38 AM)Wedge Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 10:23 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 01:57 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(03-24-2018 11:47 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  I suppose you can only play in Atlanta and Dallas so many times before everyone gets bored.

The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

I know. I'm not sure why anyone cares though.

I enjoy home and homes, but the important thing is to play a quality opponent. If you can make more money at a neutral site every year than you can on a home game every other year then why not?

I imagine though that fans are getting tired of traveling and promoters are getting tired of seeing the same team in the same venues. So it makes sense to shake it up.

Alabama has enough clout to do what they want. Why do fans of other teams care? Because playing non-con road games against good teams is challenging, and because "their" teams play road games. Michigan has home/home series with ND, Washington, UCLA, OU, and UT scheduled for upcoming seasons. OU has home/home series with UCLA, Nebraska, Michigan, Tennessee, and LSU scheduled, and they just finished one with Ohio State.

Bama can do what they want within certain parameters, yes. That's why they chose to play a neutral site game every year. These were essentially made for TV events and helped create buzz for the program back before Saban had established a pattern of success. They also drew large TV audiences. It made too much sense and they've been good for us.

As far as fans of other schools go, again, I don't see why they are particularly worried about what Bama does or doesn't do. If certain schools want to play home and home then that's great. If they want to arrange neutral site games then that's great too. I've never sat back and looked at another school's schedule and wondered why they weren't playing P5 road games every other season. I like to see good match-ups on TV and all that, but I don't care where the game is played.

If we're evaluating someone's resume for a CFP appearance then I want to see that they've played a good team out of conference. Other than that, doesn't matter to me.

People have lobbed this criticism at Florida for many years saying they never played a quality non-conference opponent outside the state of Florida...who cares? They played Florida State every year and the two programs happen to be geographically close to one another. In most years, FSU is a far tougher opponent than most schools will play out of conference so I don't know why anyone would be worried about that.

Personally, I would love it if we all played 12 quality games every season, but that won't happen anytime soon.

Wedge already told you, but I'll tell you again: playing a neutral site game (particularly if it's within the SEC footprint - which they all have been) is MUCH easier than playing a true road game. It's just NOT the same thing.

I would agree with the 12 P5 games per year, though - but ONLY if 6 are on the road.

(03-26-2018 03:00 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 01:53 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 12:38 AM)Wedge Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 10:23 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 01:57 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

I know. I'm not sure why anyone cares though.

I enjoy home and homes, but the important thing is to play a quality opponent. If you can make more money at a neutral site every year than you can on a home game every other year then why not?

I imagine though that fans are getting tired of traveling and promoters are getting tired of seeing the same team in the same venues. So it makes sense to shake it up.

Alabama has enough clout to do what they want. Why do fans of other teams care? Because playing non-con road games against good teams is challenging, and because "their" teams play road games. Michigan has home/home series with ND, Washington, UCLA, OU, and UT scheduled for upcoming seasons. OU has home/home series with UCLA, Nebraska, Michigan, Tennessee, and LSU scheduled, and they just finished one with Ohio State.

Bama can do what they want within certain parameters, yes. That's why they chose to play a neutral site game every year. These were essentially made for TV events and helped create buzz for the program back before Saban had established a pattern of success. They also drew large TV audiences. It made too much sense and they've been good for us.

As far as fans of other schools go, again, I don't see why they are particularly worried about what Bama does or doesn't do. If certain schools want to play home and home then that's great. If they want to arrange neutral site games then that's great too. I've never sat back and looked at another school's schedule and wondered why they weren't playing P5 road games every other season. I like to see good match-ups on TV and all that, but I don't care where the game is played.

If we're evaluating someone's resume for a CFP appearance then I want to see that they've played a good team out of conference. Other than that, doesn't matter to me.

People have lobbed this criticism at Florida for many years saying they never played a quality non-conference opponent outside the state of Florida...who cares? They played Florida State every year and the two programs happen to be geographically close to one another. In most years, FSU is a far tougher opponent than most schools will play out of conference so I don't know why anyone would be worried about that.

Personally, I would love it if we all played 12 quality games every season, but that won't happen anytime soon.

Wedge already told you, but I'll tell you again: playing a neutral site game (particularly if it's within the SEC footprint - which they all have been) is MUCH easier than playing a true road game. It's just NOT the same thing.

It's actually far worse for both schools involved. There is no direct benefit to the supporting communities of the two schools. It is merely a corporately backed and contrived (complete with the concessions of the sponsoring city) business opportunity that exploits the two fan bases. It's merely a preseason bowl game, only scheduled during the regular season.

(03-26-2018 03:00 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 01:53 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 12:38 AM)Wedge Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 10:23 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 01:57 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

I know. I'm not sure why anyone cares though.

I enjoy home and homes, but the important thing is to play a quality opponent. If you can make more money at a neutral site every year than you can on a home game every other year then why not?

I imagine though that fans are getting tired of traveling and promoters are getting tired of seeing the same team in the same venues. So it makes sense to shake it up.

Alabama has enough clout to do what they want. Why do fans of other teams care? Because playing non-con road games against good teams is challenging, and because "their" teams play road games. Michigan has home/home series with ND, Washington, UCLA, OU, and UT scheduled for upcoming seasons. OU has home/home series with UCLA, Nebraska, Michigan, Tennessee, and LSU scheduled, and they just finished one with Ohio State.

Bama can do what they want within certain parameters, yes. That's why they chose to play a neutral site game every year. These were essentially made for TV events and helped create buzz for the program back before Saban had established a pattern of success. They also drew large TV audiences. It made too much sense and they've been good for us.

As far as fans of other schools go, again, I don't see why they are particularly worried about what Bama does or doesn't do. If certain schools want to play home and home then that's great. If they want to arrange neutral site games then that's great too. I've never sat back and looked at another school's schedule and wondered why they weren't playing P5 road games every other season. I like to see good match-ups on TV and all that, but I don't care where the game is played.

If we're evaluating someone's resume for a CFP appearance then I want to see that they've played a good team out of conference. Other than that, doesn't matter to me.

People have lobbed this criticism at Florida for many years saying they never played a quality non-conference opponent outside the state of Florida...who cares? They played Florida State every year and the two programs happen to be geographically close to one another. In most years, FSU is a far tougher opponent than most schools will play out of conference so I don't know why anyone would be worried about that.

Personally, I would love it if we all played 12 quality games every season, but that won't happen anytime soon.

Wedge already told you, but I'll tell you again: playing a neutral site game (particularly if it's within the SEC footprint - which they all have been) is MUCH easier than playing a true road game. It's just NOT the same thing.

I would agree with the 12 P5 games per year, though - but ONLY if 6 are on the road.

If you had 13 teams in your conference. You could play all conference games. 6 at home and 6 away.

This would be great for ND. I really love the way they schedule.

(03-26-2018 12:00 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 09:46 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 07:22 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 06:56 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This is part of ND's scheduling philosophy as an independent to have game "markers" (for playoff consideration) against teams from all P5 conferences.

Regarding SEC "markers", ND scheduled home/home series recently with Georgia, Arkansas and Texas A&M.

Setting up a home/home with Alabama fits with that philosophy, as were home/home series against Texas and Oklahoma (Big 12) and Michigan (Big Ten).

ND has the ACC "markers" covered with the five games per year and the Pac 12 with annual games with Southern Cal and Stanford.

And that 5 game contracted schedule kinda makes that tag of "independent" passe'.

Hell no, it does not.

What division of the ACC is ND in?

How much does ESPN pay ND football for being in the ACC?

I guess that NBC is in for a big surprise, knowing that its ND contract is null and void.

In the past, ND schedules included three games a year against Big Ten schools and two games a year (usually Pitt and BC) against Big East schools.

From ND's perspective, replacing those scheduled games with five against the ACC is merely shuffling game opponents, not something that is "passe'". Same arrangement, different opponents.

ND sees these as scheduling arrangements as an independent, nothing more.

If you have shuffled the B1G and Big East out for the 5 ACC games how would you explain Michigan Sept 1 and Northwestern Nov. 03 in 2018, Michigan Oct 26 in 2019 and Wisconsin on Oct 3 in 2020?

Look up past ND schedules from 1977 to 2017.

Traditionally, ND played Michigan, Michigan State and Purdue to start the year, every year.

ND played Pitt every year, BC some years.



The rotation of some Big Ten teams in home/home series is not the same as playing Michigan, Michigan State and Purdue EVERY YEAR.

Those three ANNUAL games are no more, replaced by the ACC games.

Pitt was an annual game and is now a sometime ACC opponent.

Its a scheduling agreement in football with the ACC, nothing more.

(03-26-2018 04:00 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  This would be great for ND. I really love the way they schedule.

If there ever is a much larger playoff, one good thing will (hopefully) be more courageous scheduling, because it will be possible to be chosen for a large tournament with 3 or even 4 losses. It would be fun to have each P5 team play two non-con games vs. other P5 teams and for top programs to play each other a lot more often. As a fan, you want to see more of these games. Oklahoma at Ohio State and Georgia at ND were two of the best games last season.

(03-26-2018 06:01 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 04:00 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  This would be great for ND. I really love the way they schedule.

If there ever is a much larger playoff, one good thing will (hopefully) be more courageous scheduling, because it will be possible to be chosen for a large tournament with 3 or even 4 losses. It would be fun to have each P5 team play two non-con games vs. other P5 teams and for top programs to play each other a lot more often. As a fan, you want to see more of these games. Oklahoma at Ohio State and Georgia at ND were two of the best games last season.

If courageous scheduling is what you want then what we need to do is to consolidate into a P4 and have a champs only access. Who you schedule OOC won't matter at all. Win your conference and you are in.

(03-26-2018 03:00 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 01:53 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-26-2018 12:38 AM)Wedge Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 10:23 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  

(03-25-2018 01:57 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  The Crimson Tide hasn't played a true P5 OOC road game since 2011 at Penn State.

I know. I'm not sure why anyone cares though.

I enjoy home and homes, but the important thing is to play a quality opponent. If you can make more money at a neutral site every year than you can on a home game every other year then why not?

I imagine though that fans are getting tired of traveling and promoters are getting tired of seeing the same team in the same venues. So it makes sense to shake it up.

Alabama has enough clout to do what they want. Why do fans of other teams care? Because playing non-con road games against good teams is challenging, and because "their" teams play road games. Michigan has home/home series with ND, Washington, UCLA, OU, and UT scheduled for upcoming seasons. OU has home/home series with UCLA, Nebraska, Michigan, Tennessee, and LSU scheduled, and they just finished one with Ohio State.

Bama can do what they want within certain parameters, yes. That's why they chose to play a neutral site game every year. These were essentially made for TV events and helped create buzz for the program back before Saban had established a pattern of success. They also drew large TV audiences. It made too much sense and they've been good for us.

As far as fans of other schools go, again, I don't see why they are particularly worried about what Bama does or doesn't do. If certain schools want to play home and home then that's great. If they want to arrange neutral site games then that's great too. I've never sat back and looked at another school's schedule and wondered why they weren't playing P5 road games every other season. I like to see good match-ups on TV and all that, but I don't care where the game is played.

If we're evaluating someone's resume for a CFP appearance then I want to see that they've played a good team out of conference. Other than that, doesn't matter to me.

People have lobbed this criticism at Florida for many years saying they never played a quality non-conference opponent outside the state of Florida...who cares? They played Florida State every year and the two programs happen to be geographically close to one another. In most years, FSU is a far tougher opponent than most schools will play out of conference so I don't know why anyone would be worried about that.

Personally, I would love it if we all played 12 quality games every season, but that won't happen anytime soon.

Wedge already told you, but I'll tell you again: playing a neutral site game (particularly if it's within the SEC footprint - which they all have been) is MUCH easier than playing a true road game. It's just NOT the same thing.

I would agree with the 12 P5 games per year, though - but ONLY if 6 are on the road.

Yes, I read what you both said and the notion that a road game is more difficult than any neutral site game is an opinion. The level of competition is what determines the difficulty. Playing Florida State in Atlanta was much more difficult last season than Vanderbilt on the road. For that matter, playing a neutral site game is more difficult than playing a home game so is it really an empirical demonstration of quality to schedule a home and home? Only one of the two games is "on the road."

The point I was making is that it's a bit silly to be worried about how another program schedules. Every school does what they think is best for their program at any given place and time. People hone in on such things because their desire is to diminish or undermine in some way the perception of success. If Wake Forest played a neutral site game every year and never won more than 7 games a season then no one would care. There's nothing about neutral site games that would suggest such match-ups are easy.

With that said, I enjoy home and homes. They're fun and visiting another campus is interesting.

(03-26-2018 09:58 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  ...I read what you both said and the notion that a road game is more difficult than any neutral site game is an opinion. The level of competition is what determines the difficulty. Playing Florida State in Atlanta was much more difficult last season than Vanderbilt on the road. For that matter, playing a neutral site game is more difficult than playing a home game so is it really an empirical demonstration of quality to schedule a home and home? Only one of the two games is "on the road."

Comparing FSU to Vanderbilt is a straw-man argument. Let's look at the last 10 years (wherein the road opponents are nearly all SEC, so therefore balanced home/away):

Year Loss(es)
2017 at Auburn (road)
2016 Clemson (at Tampa)
2015 Ole Miss (home)
2014 at Ole Miss (road)
---- Ohio State (at New Orleans)
2013 at Auburn (road)
---- Oklahoma (at New Orleans)
2012 Texas A&M (home)
2011 LSU (home)
2010 at S Carolina (road)
---- at LSU (road)
---- Auburn (home)
2009 (none)
2008 Florida (at Atlanta)
---- Utah (at New Orleans)

Last 10 years, Alabama has
4 losses at home (in 70 home games, or 5.7%)
5 losses on the road (in 41 away games, or 12.2%)
5 losses at neutral sites (in 27 games, or 18.5%)
8-0 in the regular season, under conditions that Alabama controls (i.e. 1st game of the season, choose the opponent, etc.)
14-5 in the post-season, out of Alabama's control, vs. good competition. This is a different animal, so let's put these aside. Obviously Bama is good or they wouldn't put up such gaudy numbers... but don't discount the advantage of having the opposition come to you!

Based on regular season games, the Tide are more than TWICE as likely to lose on the road versus at home. That's not an opinion, it's a fact - and it holds for nearly every P5 team, not just Bama. Road games ARE tougher, given the same level of competition both home and away (which is what we are talking about - home and home SERIES).