Just came across this fan gear site. Will probably be shut down at some point.

http://www.prepsportswear.com/vintagetea...ic_160x208

That's great but why do they think we were founded in 1917?

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

(09-30-2016 09:24 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  That's great but why do they think we were founded in 1917?

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Coincidentally, even 1917 is off...WM was first referenced as The Indians in 1916.

http://www.wm.edu/about/mascot/history/

Nobody said this place is reputable or knows what its talking about...but harder to get something like this than you think...

(09-30-2016 09:31 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

Frankly I still don't understand why we can't have feathers. I think the block WM with feathers is one of most solid logos. Tons of schools use feather logos, even ones that used to have Native mascots, but we can't seem to exploit whatever loopholes they do.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

(09-30-2016 10:06 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 09:31 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

Frankly I still don't understand why we can't have feathers. I think the block WM with feathers is one of most solid logos. Tons of schools use feather logos, even ones that used to have Native mascots, but we can't seem to exploit whatever loopholes they do.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

I think the short answer is Gene Nichol.

(09-30-2016 10:09 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:06 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 09:31 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

Frankly I still don't understand why we can't have feathers. I think the block WM with feathers is one of most solid logos. Tons of schools use feather logos, even ones that used to have Native mascots, but we can't seem to exploit whatever loopholes they do.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

I think the short answer is Gene Nichol.

Hahaha I didn't want to start anything but you are correct.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Our current mascot has feathers. This is a no brainer, and could be easily done, and easily justified, if the school wanted to do it.

There could be two logos.

The first logo would be the W&M with feathers (representing the upper half of the mascot).

The second logo would be the script Tribe, with the William and Mary in the "swoosh", except the "swoosh" is replaced by a lion's tale (representing the bottom half of the mascot).

Lots of variations could be done, but the school has to want to do it.

(09-30-2016 10:13 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:09 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:06 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 09:31 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

Frankly I still don't understand why we can't have feathers. I think the block WM with feathers is one of most solid logos. Tons of schools use feather logos, even ones that used to have Native mascots, but we can't seem to exploit whatever loopholes they do.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

I think the short answer is Gene Nichol.

Hahaha I didn't want to start anything but you are correct.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

Actually, the correct answer is the NCAA. A number of years ago the NCAA declared that inclusion of the feathers in the logo was offensive to Native Americans. So to remain in good standing with the NCAA the feathers were removed.

From the W&M website when the change to the logo was made:

"I've read a lot on the Mascot Blog and Facebook group about the NCAA ruling. What's the short explanation?

In 2004, the National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) requested that several member institutions, including William & Mary, submit a self-evaluation to determine if the Native American imagery or nicknames used at the schools were hostile or abusive. Schools found in violation would not be permitted to wear the offending logos during postseason competition or be allowed to host postseason NCAA athletic events on their own campuses.

In May 2006, the NCAA agreed with the W&M's assessment that the nickname "Tribe" was not offensive but ruled that the university should stop using two feathers on its athletic logo. In July 2006, the university appealed the ruling regarding the use of the feathers to the NCAA’s executive committee. On August 3, 2006, the NCAA upheld its initial ruling that the feathers attached to William & Mary's athletic logo are unacceptable under their regulations."

Here is a helmet that Miami University wore in 2013. It's COVERED in feathers. But for whatever reason the Redhawks (nee Redskins) are allowed to get away with it while our two feathers are offensive.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

(09-30-2016 10:09 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:06 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 09:31 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

Frankly I still don't understand why we can't have feathers. I think the block WM with feathers is one of most solid logos. Tons of schools use feather logos, even ones that used to have Native mascots, but we can't seem to exploit whatever loopholes they do.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

I think the short answer is Gene Nichol.

The school filed an appeal with the NCAA on the ruling and the NCAA upheld it. Not sure what else he could of done. The guy did some boneheaded things, but blaming him for the loss of the feather logo is not accurate or fair.

Even more vintage would be "The Fighting Virginians". the name Tribe teams were called long before Indians. They have a W&M Fighting Virginians belt buckle in the library.

(09-30-2016 08:13 AM)nogretheogre Wrote:  Just came across this fan gear site. Will probably be shut down at some point.

http://www.prepsportswear.com/vintagetea...ic_160x208

Great find but I think this site is one "cease and desist" away from being shut down (agreeing with your sentiment). I just found apparel for my kids middle school and elementary school here in Northern Virginia. Correct mascot but logo was completely wrong.

(09-30-2016 11:50 AM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:09 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:06 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 09:31 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

Frankly I still don't understand why we can't have feathers. I think the block WM with feathers is one of most solid logos. Tons of schools use feather logos, even ones that used to have Native mascots, but we can't seem to exploit whatever loopholes they do.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

I think the short answer is Gene Nichol.

The school filed an appeal with the NCAA on the ruling and the NCAA upheld it. Not sure what else he could of done. The guy did some boneheaded things, but blaming him for the loss of the feather logo is not accurate or fair.

Pip, pip cherio, he filed an appeal but did not effectively do so, that's all that is needed old chap!

(09-30-2016 01:43 PM)LeadBolt Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 11:50 AM)Paulbintheburg Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:09 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 10:06 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(09-30-2016 09:31 AM)LeadBolt Wrote:  I'd rather see feathers and Tribe than Indians, even though that was the team name when I attended.

Frankly I still don't understand why we can't have feathers. I think the block WM with feathers is one of most solid logos. Tons of schools use feather logos, even ones that used to have Native mascots, but we can't seem to exploit whatever loopholes they do.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

I think the short answer is Gene Nichol.

The school filed an appeal with the NCAA on the ruling and the NCAA upheld it. Not sure what else he could of done. The guy did some boneheaded things, but blaming him for the loss of the feather logo is not accurate or fair.

Pip, pip cherio, he filed an appeal but did not effectively do so, that's all that is needed old chap!

Well Ole Chap if it was such a big deal at the time, then you and the rest of the lads should of created a defense fund and fought the NCAA like some of the other schools did.

Gene was a complete toolbag for a lot of reasons but the feather deal was/is a pompous NCAA grandstanding and trying to save the world.

I'm convinced the NCAA and Stretch are the devil's handywork.

One Tribe. One Family.