Maybe we are throwing out another life line this time to UMASS adding them and Liberty in 2015 and then MO St in 2016 to go to 14.

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(04-08-2014 07:03 PM)Check Yosef Wrote:  Anyways... Done with my save the world rant, sorry to go off topic like that.


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Fwiw it was an excellent post.

(04-08-2014 06:50 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:12 PM)Florida Red Wolf Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 05:16 PM)LUalumfromnc Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 05:11 PM)Check Yosef Wrote:  Sun belt forum got eerily quiet all of a sudden


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ayet. It is not over until there is confirmation who the 12th member is. I hope Liberty is that member and I do not know why all this hate is happening towards my alma mater. If Liberty is the new member this is going to be a great new rivalry between Appy State and LU!!!!

Hate is usually centered on ignorance, the unknown and bias. Liberty would probably be a better choice than most but I'm not boosting any given that I'm no 12th team man.

The concerns of those of us opposed to Liberty's inclusion in the Sun Belt are based upon facts. Feel free to produce an openly Gay LU employee (not some contractor hired for a week), a practicing Jewish employee of the school, and the full Liberty Way student handbook that so that everyone can see the policies proscribing discipline for Gay students in federally recognized marriages. I think even the LU folks wont dare defend Mat Staver (then why does JFJ?) We feel that LU's 'strategy' of rejecting the talents of millions of Americans, simply because of those Americans' religion or sexual orientation is stupid and will produce less success in athletics.

None of LU's controversial policies are justified by any rational interpretation of Christianity (really - where in the Bible does it justify not employing persons outside your faith?). Nor will LU changing a few policies and reining in a Law School Dean that embarrasses the University just about every week on a network radio program make LU less of a Christian institution. Rather, it would make it MORE of one IMHO.

Liberty would be "a better than most" choice if they were willing to change a few policies (and would make them real peers of institutions they apparently aspire to be peers of, such as SMU and Notre Dame)

And guys, Liberty's behavior is going to look even worse next year. And even worse the year after that. If you want to argue that a school that rejects the talents of just about everyone is likely to be successful, then go right ahead. But its not what most people think. And that type of overt discrimination will be less and less acceptable as time progresses. And with LU's reluctance to cooperate with anyone, this might present an even greater issue moving forward.

But I guess we do have a way to force LU out of the Belt if they somehow get a bid. Just have the membership vote in some non-discrimination rules binding on all member institutions.

Without taking the time to look up smu, Tom you do realize that at notre dame you have to agree with, abide by, and advance the Catholic mission. So to say you'd take them and not Liberty wrecks your reasoning (since athletics is not considered)

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(04-08-2014 07:05 PM)WKUApollo Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 07:03 PM)Check Yosef Wrote:  Anyways... Done with my save the world rant, sorry to go off topic like that.


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Fwiw it was an excellent post.

Ty, just social science is near to my heart, but as I said after typing it I remembered this isn't the proper medium for that.


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(04-08-2014 07:00 PM)Check Yosef Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:50 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:12 PM)Florida Red Wolf Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 05:16 PM)LUalumfromnc Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 05:11 PM)Check Yosef Wrote:  Sun belt forum got eerily quiet all of a sudden


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ayet. It is not over until there is confirmation who the 12th member is. I hope Liberty is that member and I do not know why all this hate is happening towards my alma mater. If Liberty is the new member this is going to be a great new rivalry between Appy State and LU!!!!

Hate is usually centered on ignorance, the unknown and bias. Liberty would probably be a better choice than most but I'm not boosting any given that I'm no 12th team man.

The concerns of those of us opposed to Liberty's inclusion in the Sun Belt are based upon facts. Feel free to produce an openly Gay LU employee (not some contractor hired for a week), a practicing Jewish employee of the school, and the full Liberty Way student handbook that so that everyone can see the policies proscribing discipline for Gay students in federally recognized marriages. I think even the LU folks wont dare defend Mat Staver (then why does JFJ?)

None of LU's controversial policies are justified by any rational interpretation of Christianity (really - where in the Bible does it justify not employing persons outside your faith?). Nor will LU changing a few policies and reining in a Law School Dean that embarrasses the University just about every week on a network radio program make LU less of a Christian institution. Rather, it would make it MORE of one IMHO.

Liberty would be "a better than most" choice if they were willing to change a few policies (and would make them real peers of institutions they apparently aspire to be peers of, such as SMU and Notre Dame)

And guys, Liberty's behavior is going to look even worse next year. And even worse the year after that. If you want to argue that a school that rejects the talents of just about everyone is likely to be successful, then go right ahead. But its not what most people think. And that type of overt discrimination will be less and less acceptable as time progresses. And with LU's reluctance to cooperate with anyone, this might present an even greater issue moving forward.

But I guess we do have a way to force LU out of the Belt if they somehow get a bid. Just have the membership vote in some non-discrimination rules binding on all member institutions.

Lol as I've stated many times I'm indifferent to the liberty debate, even though I am an agnost and a huge supporter of equality no matter the race, religion, sexual orientation, or really any other prejudice created by any group to discriminate on any other group, if liberty gets in then good for them, if not that's fine too, do I agree with all their beliefs? No. Do I believe deeply in their right to have that belief? Yes. Social problems are creations of mankind, the more people accept the fact there will be differences between them and others around them the more peace we will see


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While I don't retract my comments, I deleted the post. I noted I wasn't on the "Liberty" thread.

(04-08-2014 07:07 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 07:00 PM)Check Yosef Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:50 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:12 PM)Florida Red Wolf Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 05:16 PM)LUalumfromnc Wrote:  ayet. It is not over until there is confirmation who the 12th member is. I hope Liberty is that member and I do not know why all this hate is happening towards my alma mater. If Liberty is the new member this is going to be a great new rivalry between Appy State and LU!!!!

Hate is usually centered on ignorance, the unknown and bias. Liberty would probably be a better choice than most but I'm not boosting any given that I'm no 12th team man.

The concerns of those of us opposed to Liberty's inclusion in the Sun Belt are based upon facts. Feel free to produce an openly Gay LU employee (not some contractor hired for a week), a practicing Jewish employee of the school, and the full Liberty Way student handbook that so that everyone can see the policies proscribing discipline for Gay students in federally recognized marriages. I think even the LU folks wont dare defend Mat Staver (then why does JFJ?)

None of LU's controversial policies are justified by any rational interpretation of Christianity (really - where in the Bible does it justify not employing persons outside your faith?). Nor will LU changing a few policies and reining in a Law School Dean that embarrasses the University just about every week on a network radio program make LU less of a Christian institution. Rather, it would make it MORE of one IMHO.

Liberty would be "a better than most" choice if they were willing to change a few policies (and would make them real peers of institutions they apparently aspire to be peers of, such as SMU and Notre Dame)

And guys, Liberty's behavior is going to look even worse next year. And even worse the year after that. If you want to argue that a school that rejects the talents of just about everyone is likely to be successful, then go right ahead. But its not what most people think. And that type of overt discrimination will be less and less acceptable as time progresses. And with LU's reluctance to cooperate with anyone, this might present an even greater issue moving forward.

But I guess we do have a way to force LU out of the Belt if they somehow get a bid. Just have the membership vote in some non-discrimination rules binding on all member institutions.

Lol as I've stated many times I'm indifferent to the liberty debate, even though I am an agnost and a huge supporter of equality no matter the race, religion, sexual orientation, or really any other prejudice created by any group to discriminate on any other group, if liberty gets in then good for them, if not that's fine too, do I agree with all their beliefs? No. Do I believe deeply in their right to have that belief? Yes. Social problems are creations of mankind, the more people accept the fact there will be differences between them and others around them the more peace we will see


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While I don't retract my comments, I deleted the post. I noted I wasn't on the "Liberty" thread.

Yea my bad as well we both went on a bit of a tangent there


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(04-08-2014 07:05 PM)Georgia_Power_Company Wrote:  Maybe we are throwing out another life line this time to UMASS adding them and Liberty in 2015 and then MO St in 2016 to go to 14.

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That would be idiotic. Why would we do that? So then we'd have an Eastern division with SIX teams that weren't even full FBS members in 2012?

I guess it's time to let the cat out of the bag. The Sun Belt is adding Akron, who has been looking for a way to differentiate itself from the rest of the MAC schools in Ohio.

(04-08-2014 07:19 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  I guess it's time to let the cat out of the bag. The Sun Belt is adding Akron, who has been looking for a way to differentiate itself from the rest of the MAC schools in Ohio.

Woohoo! We're adding soap box derby as a league sport!

(04-08-2014 07:19 PM)uakronkid Wrote:  I guess it's time to let the cat out of the bag. The Sun Belt is adding Akron, who has been looking for a way to differentiate itself from the rest of the MAC schools in Ohio.

They can add Akron and Liberty. One school in a city known for rubber, one school that doesn't believe in rubbers

For the last few weeks someone on this forum has been saying SBC will add more than 1 team. But you guys wouldn't listen. We need to start listening and learning from our wiser member.

(04-08-2014 07:17 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 07:05 PM)Georgia_Power_Company Wrote:  Maybe we are throwing out another life line this time to UMASS adding them and Liberty in 2015 and then MO St in 2016 to go to 14.

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That would be idiotic. Why would we do that? So then we'd have an Eastern division with SIX teams that weren't even full FBS members in 2012?

Well that may be but no matter who we add this most likely would still be true. Look at it this way if we added the teams above in 2015 six out the seven eastern teams would be full FBS and in 2016 all but MO St would be bowl eligible.

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Count me in with the group that is not a big fan of going beyond 12. If we add this year we need to add ONE team, not 2-3. If or when Idaho leaves conference or someone else leaves then you add more to get to a football playing number of 12.

(04-08-2014 08:05 PM)GaSoEagle Wrote:  Count me in with the group that is not a big fan of going beyond 12. If we add this year we need to add ONE team, not 2-3. If or when Idaho leaves conference or someone else leaves then you add more to get to a football playing number of 12.

I agree I'm just playing along with the add two this year theme of the op.

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(04-08-2014 06:24 PM)Eagleditka Wrote:  Not seeing much chatter on the Mo State or JMU boards.

There's chatter but it's via private message...

No one wants to be the one to put it out in public...

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(04-08-2014 08:10 PM)MSUBear42 Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:24 PM)Eagleditka Wrote:  Not seeing much chatter on the Mo State or JMU boards.

There's chatter but it's via private message...

No one wants to be the one to put it out in public...

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If true welcome to the Belt. Glad to have you. If not true I still hope your in the Belt's future plans.

No to going past 12


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(04-08-2014 07:07 PM)Liberty22 Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:50 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 06:12 PM)Florida Red Wolf Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 05:16 PM)LUalumfromnc Wrote:  

(04-08-2014 05:11 PM)Check Yosef Wrote:  Sun belt forum got eerily quiet all of a sudden


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ayet. It is not over until there is confirmation who the 12th member is. I hope Liberty is that member and I do not know why all this hate is happening towards my alma mater. If Liberty is the new member this is going to be a great new rivalry between Appy State and LU!!!!

Hate is usually centered on ignorance, the unknown and bias. Liberty would probably be a better choice than most but I'm not boosting any given that I'm no 12th team man.

The concerns of those of us opposed to Liberty's inclusion in the Sun Belt are based upon facts. Feel free to produce an openly Gay LU employee (not some contractor hired for a week), a practicing Jewish employee of the school, and the full Liberty Way student handbook that so that everyone can see the policies proscribing discipline for Gay students in federally recognized marriages. I think even the LU folks wont dare defend Mat Staver (then why does JFJ?) We feel that LU's 'strategy' of rejecting the talents of millions of Americans, simply because of those Americans' religion or sexual orientation is stupid and will produce less success in athletics.

None of LU's controversial policies are justified by any rational interpretation of Christianity (really - where in the Bible does it justify not employing persons outside your faith?). Nor will LU changing a few policies and reining in a Law School Dean that embarrasses the University just about every week on a network radio program make LU less of a Christian institution. Rather, it would make it MORE of one IMHO.

Liberty would be "a better than most" choice if they were willing to change a few policies (and would make them real peers of institutions they apparently aspire to be peers of, such as SMU and Notre Dame)

And guys, Liberty's behavior is going to look even worse next year. And even worse the year after that. If you want to argue that a school that rejects the talents of just about everyone is likely to be successful, then go right ahead. But its not what most people think. And that type of overt discrimination will be less and less acceptable as time progresses. And with LU's reluctance to cooperate with anyone, this might present an even greater issue moving forward.

But I guess we do have a way to force LU out of the Belt if they somehow get a bid. Just have the membership vote in some non-discrimination rules binding on all member institutions.

Without taking the time to look up smu, Tom you do realize that at notre dame you have to agree with, abide by, and advance the Catholic mission. So to say you'd take them and not Liberty wrecks your reasoning (since athletics is not considered)

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Liberty22, I'm very ignorant with regards to Liberty so please know that my statements and questions are sincere. I have never known anyone to be turned down from acceptance into Liberty due to grades or SAT/ACT scores. I probably live in a small world, but do you know my findings to be way off, and can you give examples.

With all of the online courses Liberty offers, many people draw a closer comparison to DeVry, University of Phoenix, and ITT rather than the University of Notre Dame as you have tried to compare LU. It has been stated by many that Liberty walks dangerously close to the line between being a "for profit" school versus a "non-profit" and the tax advantages that go with it.

I am a follower of Christ and an active member of a Southern Baptist church, so please don't conclude that I have any ill will towards the mission of Liberty. However, there are times when we need to be of the world in order to have the message received. I believe Liberty works the system in a way that is frowned upon by universities in which it wants to align itself and this is the bigger reason LU has difficulties in FBS conference affiliation rather than the menu of rules and regulations placed upon its students.

Liberty is not the only school walking a financial tax implication tightrope, but because of the strict student policies, it easily stands out from the crowd while others, such as JMU, Appy, etc., fight their financial battles using similar weapons.

(04-08-2014 07:05 PM)Georgia_Power_Company Wrote:  Maybe we are throwing out another life line this time to UMASS adding them and Liberty in 2015 and then MO St in 2016 to go to 14.

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My money's on this.

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A little bit of self control. That's all it takes to keep every thread from turning into an existential debate about Liberty's existence. We all have an opinion about them. None of those opinions happen to be relevant to the topic at hand. Which is expansion. All I care about at this point is who the 12th school is going to be. If you want to debate Liberty as an academic institution there are plenty of threads for that. Can we please reserve this one for sources/tweets/news rather than another Liberty thread?


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