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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:28 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 02:52 PM)Brokeback Flamer Wrote:  I'm not sure how obvious. There were several people on this board saying the SBC doesn't need to expand and have a Championship game. There's a whole thread about it.

You confuse posters on a message board with presidents and decision makers.

Going to 11 wasn't just for funsies. It was because Benson promised JMU last year. He couldn't deliver them, but JMU never gave a no. That caused the conference to look in other directions (Missouri State: who it seems has always been on the radar, but discussions expanded, and EKU).

It's a known quantity that Liberty is there any time we want. No one else is going to expand to pick them up, so it comes down to who says yes first (Missouri State, JMU, or EKU)... Or for the Liberty folks, when the others say no (and that's assuming no other candidates step up their commitment and become viable).



It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

EKU is a public school open to the talents of all as students, employees, athletes and fans

EKU is well within our footprint and would allow for a better division split from the perspective of Troy and USA.

EKU has better basketball and better football
03-22-2014 11:37 AM
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FloridaJag Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 11:37 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:28 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 02:52 PM)Brokeback Flamer Wrote:  I'm not sure how obvious. There were several people on this board saying the SBC doesn't need to expand and have a Championship game. There's a whole thread about it.

You confuse posters on a message board with presidents and decision makers.

Going to 11 wasn't just for funsies. It was because Benson promised JMU last year. He couldn't deliver them, but JMU never gave a no. That caused the conference to look in other directions (Missouri State: who it seems has always been on the radar, but discussions expanded, and EKU).

It's a known quantity that Liberty is there any time we want. No one else is going to expand to pick them up, so it comes down to who says yes first (Missouri State, JMU, or EKU)... Or for the Liberty folks, when the others say no (and that's assuming no other candidates step up their commitment and become viable).



It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

EKU is a public school open to the talents of all as students, employees, athletes and fans

EKU is well within our footprint and would allow for a better division split from the perspective of Troy and USA.

EKU has better basketball and better football

True
03-22-2014 11:39 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 11:37 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:28 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 02:52 PM)Brokeback Flamer Wrote:  I'm not sure how obvious. There were several people on this board saying the SBC doesn't need to expand and have a Championship game. There's a whole thread about it.

You confuse posters on a message board with presidents and decision makers.

Going to 11 wasn't just for funsies. It was because Benson promised JMU last year. He couldn't deliver them, but JMU never gave a no. That caused the conference to look in other directions (Missouri State: who it seems has always been on the radar, but discussions expanded, and EKU).

It's a known quantity that Liberty is there any time we want. No one else is going to expand to pick them up, so it comes down to who says yes first (Missouri State, JMU, or EKU)... Or for the Liberty folks, when the others say no (and that's assuming no other candidates step up their commitment and become viable).



It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

EKU is a public school open to the talents of all as students, employees, athletes and fans

EKU is well within our footprint and would allow for a better division split from the perspective of Troy and USA.

EKU has better basketball and better football

While this is true...EKU is not near ready, and that is going to play a major factor.
03-22-2014 11:41 AM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 11:41 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 11:37 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:28 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 02:52 PM)Brokeback Flamer Wrote:  I'm not sure how obvious. There were several people on this board saying the SBC doesn't need to expand and have a Championship game. There's a whole thread about it.

You confuse posters on a message board with presidents and decision makers.

Going to 11 wasn't just for funsies. It was because Benson promised JMU last year. He couldn't deliver them, but JMU never gave a no. That caused the conference to look in other directions (Missouri State: who it seems has always been on the radar, but discussions expanded, and EKU).

It's a known quantity that Liberty is there any time we want. No one else is going to expand to pick them up, so it comes down to who says yes first (Missouri State, JMU, or EKU)... Or for the Liberty folks, when the others say no (and that's assuming no other candidates step up their commitment and become viable).



It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

EKU is a public school open to the talents of all as students, employees, athletes and fans

EKU is well within our footprint and would allow for a better division split from the perspective of Troy and USA.

EKU has better basketball and better football

While this is true...EKU is not near ready, and that is going to play a major factor.

Also true, but no need to take a bad fit just to take one this year. If JMU wants to join, they're welcome to do so. If Missouri State wants to join, they're welcome as well. I see no other candidate at this point.
03-22-2014 11:50 AM
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LexColonel Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 11:41 AM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 11:37 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:28 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 02:52 PM)Brokeback Flamer Wrote:  I'm not sure how obvious. There were several people on this board saying the SBC doesn't need to expand and have a Championship game. There's a whole thread about it.

You confuse posters on a message board with presidents and decision makers.

Going to 11 wasn't just for funsies. It was because Benson promised JMU last year. He couldn't deliver them, but JMU never gave a no. That caused the conference to look in other directions (Missouri State: who it seems has always been on the radar, but discussions expanded, and EKU).

It's a known quantity that Liberty is there any time we want. No one else is going to expand to pick them up, so it comes down to who says yes first (Missouri State, JMU, or EKU)... Or for the Liberty folks, when the others say no (and that's assuming no other candidates step up their commitment and become viable).



It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

EKU is a public school open to the talents of all as students, employees, athletes and fans

EKU is well within our footprint and would allow for a better division split from the perspective of Troy and USA.

EKU has better basketball and better football

While this is true...EKU is not near ready, and that is going to play a major factor.

Finally a 'few' sane points regarding EKU.
We do have work to do, no one from EKU has said otherwise. This move has been batted around for a number of years, but until we finally got a Chair of the Board of Regents and then a new president who understands the importance of athletics, fund raising, and not doing what you always have done, we were sitting on our hands complaining about the OVC. And make no mistake, being in the OVC , with the present inclusion of some schools has affected attendance in a negative way. There's just no way around that. Now, we have been criticized for trying to move too quickly, but I see no reason to NOT announce our intentions. That does not mean these two very capable men don't understand what has to be done. All this melodrama thrown out by Liberty people, who have no clue about what's going on at EKU is a smoke screen to sway people on a message board they are the best candidate. Maybe they are at this time, however it's tiresome reading all the crap and speculation thrown out by Liberty folks.
BTW, although it helps, sometimes money can't buy you everything you want nor change certain issues or your athletic history, it's just the way it is. Belittling another school sure does not enhance your argument in any way, after awhile it only makes you look desperate.
(This post was last modified: 03-22-2014 12:19 PM by LexColonel.)
03-22-2014 12:05 PM
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HappyAppy Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 09:24 AM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 07:00 AM)panama Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 11:14 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:59 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:52 PM)AppinVA Wrote:  We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.

Its nothing against you guys. If a UTC or JMU was ready and willing, this wouldn't be a discussion. The problem is they are not, so our options are not exactly the greatest in the world. Meanwhile, you've got a West team with strong Olympic sports flirting with the SBC after snubbing our advances for years.

It changes things.

Who is the West team that's has such strong Olympic sports? MSU hasn't been to the NCAA tourney in basketball in 15 years. They have a rich history, but 15 years is a long time. MSU baseball is 8-11 this year dropping 3 straight to Dallas Baptist. Liberty is 17-6 on the year. Football averages less than 9,000. Really?? All common sense would say JMU or Liberty.
Their RPI is at what, mid 80s. Yours is what, mid 330s? Thanks for playing though.

The fact is they've still not been to the NCAA tourney is 15 years. It's impossible to defend Liberty basketball, but people on this board act like MSU is the second coming of UK. The facts are Liberty has been to the NCAA tourney twice since the last time MSU has. Thank you for playing all knowing Panama.

The fact is, they play in a real basketball conference. Nobody cares that your 17-14 and 15-20 teams got hot for a weekend and won the Big South tournament. Put the Missouri State teams of the last 15 years in the Big South and they would have double digit tournament appearances over that span.
(This post was last modified: 03-22-2014 12:06 PM by HappyAppy.)
03-22-2014 12:05 PM
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SHWISH Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
Who Who Who...lol
There is no logic in the forum. There are only 4 schools in the position to say yes by June 1st.
MSU EKU, Belmont, coastal, SFA, SHSU, UTC,NDS, Del. is not one of those 4 schools

JMU
Liberty
Jax st
Lamar

SBC will choose 1 of these school.
take your pick.
03-22-2014 12:32 PM
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arkstfan Online
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Post: #68
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
AState's last (only) NCAA appearance was the same year as Mo State's. The difference being Mo State has finished with a top 100 RPI a number of times.

If I had my druthers, we would take NMSU and Mo State all-sports in exchange for whatever school the east can drag up and dropping Idaho in two years. 14 for hoops and 12 football with zero football only works quite fine to me.
03-22-2014 12:39 PM
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EKUSteve Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
Wouldn't all of the schools in the list above need to do a two year transition to FBS? I know EKU would as well, but just asking for a clarification. I believe that any FCS candidate going into the Sun Belt wouldn't be eligible until 2016. I'm I correct with that statement?
03-22-2014 12:41 PM
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panama Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 12:32 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  Who Who Who...lol
There is no logic in the forum. There are only 4 schools in the position to say yes by June 1st.
MSU EKU, Belmont, coastal, SFA, SHSU, UTC,NDS, Del. is not one of those 4 schools

JMU
Liberty
Jax st
Lamar

SBC will choose 1 of these school.
take your pick.
Crap that doesnt want us.
Fried Crap on Stick
School not trying to be crap.
Texas deep fried crap with salsa


Pass
03-22-2014 12:44 PM
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Check Yosef Offline
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Post: #71
Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
I'm just glad we are getting closer and closer to the deadline, I entered the 12th man talks happy and enthusiastic and interested and now I'll be leaving this era a tired old man praying we don't have to pick up a new team for a good while


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03-22-2014 01:06 PM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 12:44 PM)panama Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 12:32 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  Who Who Who...lol
There is no logic in the forum. There are only 4 schools in the position to say yes by June 1st.
MSU EKU, Belmont, coastal, SFA, SHSU, UTC,NDS, Del. is not one of those 4 schools

JMU
Liberty
Jax st
Lamar

SBC will choose 1 of these school.
take your pick.
Crap that doesnt want us.
Fried Crap on Stick
School not trying to be crap.
Texas deep fried crap with salsa


Pass

If JMU says yes, this year, I'm okay with extending them a bid. I think they have a much higher sense of how desirable they are and how much trouble they'll have transitioning. If the MAC really isn't interested in them, they'll be with us for a long time.

LU - Not interested
Jacksonville State - I feel for them, I really do, but they're stuck in an awful location (they don't even have a media market)
Lamar - If ULL and State are blocking SHSU, they're certainly going to block 'a rap by little ole me Lamar'

No need to rush into anything. Quite frankly, given the landscape right now, I'm good with hiring Carr and Associates to do a two year 'study' of potential applicants and wait until that it finished.
03-22-2014 01:08 PM
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SoCalBobcat78 Offline
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Post: #73
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 01:04 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  There is a false presumption out there on the sports boards that any FCS school with strong basketball would by its very nature be less likely to be accepted to a conference FB-only because of it.

New Mexico State is FB-only in the SBC and they have a very good basketball program with very weak football. I would think Missouri State has a lot more potential in football than New Mexico State in football. That is pretty obvious.

I don't think the primary goal of adding a 12th football school is to upgrade the basketball conference. The primary goal is to upgrade the football conference.

1. Missouri St, 2nd FBS team in Missouri
2. James Madison, 4th FBS team in Virginia
3. Eastern Kentucky, 4th FBS team in Kentucky
4. Lamar, 13th FBS team in Texas

As you can see, the problem with adding another Texas school to the SBC is that while its a great recruiting state Lamar is too far down the list in the state hierarchy to make a difference. Then you have North Dakota State is the only school in the the Dakota's but doesn't have any recruiting upside.

The reason why Missouri State isn't very good in football right now is because its in the MVC football conference. Facility wise prior to the renovation they've been average for an FCS school. You put that same program in an FBS and the talent base is there to take off.

The SBC has the potential to go head-to-head with any G5 league in football and that is where the main focus of expansion should be. Finish ahead of the MAC and CUSA in the G5 standings and challenge the AAC for the access bowl.

This whole conversation starts and ends with JMU. They have the right geography. They have the attendance numbers (21,000 per game). They have a $30 million athletic budget. They have the football facility (25,000 capacity). They have won in football.

They also have the academics. The recent ranking in Forbes 650 best colleges had JMU at #168. The SBC rankings are Idaho at #352, NMSU at #376, Georgia State at #427, APP State at #452 and Texas State at #487. That is the top 500 and all of the SBC schools in the top 500 are recent adds. The SBC is trying to improve their academic image and JMU would be a huge addition from an academic standpoint.

These other three schools (Missouri State, EKU and Lamar) are not FBS ready if they really want to move up. Only Liberty and Jacksonville State are FBS prepared after JMU and neither is as appealing as JMU.

I think the only FBS choice available to JMU is the SBC. None of the other options are expanding. There is an athletic ceiling in the CAA and I think being in an FBS conference gives them a higher athletic ceiling. I still think they will decide to join the SBC, despite the academic image issues this move will present for them.
(This post was last modified: 03-22-2014 01:28 PM by SoCalBobcat78.)
03-22-2014 01:27 PM
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slycat Offline
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Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 12:41 PM)EKUSteve Wrote:  Wouldn't all of the schools in the list above need to do a two year transition to FBS? I know EKU would as well, but just asking for a clarification. I believe that any FCS candidate going into the Sun Belt wouldn't be eligible until 2016. I'm I correct with that statement?

If you declare by June 1, you will start SBC play in 2015 and be eligible for the conference title (like App and GSU this year). You wouldn't be bowl eligible until 2017. Although maybe 2016 if all 6 win teams find a bowl and there is still a spot open. Never happen unless multiple schools have postseason bans.


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03-22-2014 01:28 PM
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EKUSteve Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 12:32 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  Who Who Who...lol
There is no logic in the forum. There are only 4 schools in the position to say yes by June 1st.
MSU EKU, Belmont, coastal, SFA, SHSU, UTC,NDS, Del. is not one of those 4 schools

JMU
Liberty
Jax st
Lamar

SBC will choose 1 of these school.
take your pick.

(03-22-2014 01:28 PM)slycat Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 12:41 PM)EKUSteve Wrote:  Wouldn't all of the schools in the list above need to do a two year transition to FBS? I know EKU would as well, but just asking for a clarification. I believe that any FCS candidate going into the Sun Belt wouldn't be eligible until 2016. I'm I correct with that statement?

If you declare by June 1, you will start SBC play in 2015 and be eligible for the conference title (like App and GSU this year). You wouldn't be bowl eligible until 2017. Although maybe 2016 if all 6 win teams find a bowl and there is still a spot open. Never happen unless multiple schools have postseason bans.


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Thanks Slycat
03-22-2014 01:37 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #76
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
Transition is two years and you must declare by June 1st.

If a team accepted this year and filed before June 1st the Transition would be

2014 FCS Playoff Ineligible
2015 FBS Play Full SBC Schedule, but Bowl ineligible
2016 FBS Bowl Eligible

If a team chose to wait until after June 1st to file

2014 FCS Playoff Eligible
2015 FCS Playoff Ineligible
2016 FBS Play full SBC schedule, Bowl ineligible
2017 FBS Bowl eligible
03-22-2014 01:41 PM
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SHWISH Offline
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Post: #77
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 12:44 PM)panama Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 12:32 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  Who Who Who...lol
There is no logic in the forum. There are only 4 schools in the position to say yes by June 1st.
MSU EKU, Belmont, coastal, SFA, SHSU, UTC,NDS, Del. is not one of those 4 schools

JMU
Liberty
Jax st
Lamar

SBC will choose 1 of these school.
take your pick.
Crap that doesnt want us.
Fried Crap on Stick
School not trying to be crap.
Texas deep fried crap with salsa


Pass
Those are the 4 choices.
03-22-2014 02:23 PM
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SHWISH Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 02:23 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 12:44 PM)panama Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 12:32 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  Who Who Who...lol
There is no logic in the forum. There are only 4 schools in the position to say yes by June 1st.
MSU EKU, Belmont, coastal, SFA, SHSU, UTC,NDS, Del. is not one of those 4 schools

JMU
Liberty
Jax st
Lamar

SBC will choose 1 of these school.
take your pick.
Crap that doesnt want us.
Fried Crap on Stick
School not trying to be crap.
Texas deep fried crap with salsa


Pass
Those are the 4 choices.
unless sbc wait another year, but i doubt it.
03-22-2014 02:29 PM
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OsageJ Online
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Post: #79
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
I don't understand how Lamar is ready and Missouri St is not. I don't disagree that MSU is not ready but I can't see Lamar being ready either.
03-22-2014 02:44 PM
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arkstfan Online
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-22-2014 02:23 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 12:44 PM)panama Wrote:  
(03-22-2014 12:32 PM)SHWISH Wrote:  Who Who Who...lol
There is no logic in the forum. There are only 4 schools in the position to say yes by June 1st.
MSU EKU, Belmont, coastal, SFA, SHSU, UTC,NDS, Del. is not one of those 4 schools

JMU
Liberty
Jax st
Lamar

SBC will choose 1 of these school.
take your pick.
Crap that doesnt want us.
Fried Crap on Stick
School not trying to be crap.
Texas deep fried crap with salsa


Pass
Those are the 4 choices.

I know some people involved with the decision who don't believe those are the choices, with the possible exception of Liberty.
03-22-2014 02:45 PM
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