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TheRevSWT Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

It's a simple deal: EKU could get the votes, while Liberty did not.

Make no mistake: EKU is not ready this year. Would be a monumental task for them to be ready next year. But that's the beauty. We are not required to add someone today. If we find someone we like more than Liberty (or someone that can get the votes, more to the point), then we have the luxury of waiting for them. We could easily add them to the conference for all except football, and let the football team grow for 2-3 years and let them join after that.
03-21-2014 09:45 PM
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Post: #22
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 09:45 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

It's a simple deal: EKU could get the votes, while Liberty did not.

Make no mistake: EKU is not ready this year. Would be a monumental task for them to be ready next year. But that's the beauty. We are not required to add someone today. If we find someone we like more than Liberty (or someone that can get the votes, more to the point), then we have the luxury of waiting for them. We could easily add them to the conference for all except football, and let the football team grow for 2-3 years and let them join after that.

I don't think EKU can get the votes this year and not sure anyone not tied to EKU is terribly convinced they can this year.
03-21-2014 10:09 PM
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Post: #23
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
Probably Missouri St., Liberty and JMU are in play here--- that would be my guess.
03-21-2014 10:11 PM
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Libertygrad01 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 09:45 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 04:54 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  It is hard to take comments like this seriously....It is hard for me to comprehend how EKU is even still in the discussion. As much as some of the SBC President's do not like Liberty, if they have even medicore logical reasoning skills they can see that EKU is nowhere near ready for FBS football.

REV...are you actually serious when you say that EKU would be a better option for the SBC than Liberty? How can that be justified? I want facts here.. I want numbers. I want logic and sound reasoning. Put all ill feelings aside and tell me exactly how EKU would be a better fit than Liberty for the SBC. Ready, go -

It's a simple deal: EKU could get the votes, while Liberty did not.

Make no mistake: EKU is not ready this year. Would be a monumental task for them to be ready next year. But that's the beauty. We are not required to add someone today. If we find someone we like more than Liberty (or someone that can get the votes, more to the point), then we have the luxury of waiting for them. We could easily add them to the conference for all except football, and let the football team grow for 2-3 years and let them join after that.

Rev you make comments like you know exactly how each Pres. is going to vote. To say EKU has the votes? you have no clue is that's true! Who knows if Liberty was voted on last year or not, but either way that's a year ago and things can change in a year.
03-21-2014 10:30 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
Since the member need is in the East I suspect the SBC will add in the East.

What about Chattanooga olympic sports and Liberty FB Only? That would serve to keep the footprint tight in olympic sports while also picking up that 12th school in football. Liberty FB Only might sit better with presidents than an all sport invite.

I know Missouri State probably brings the most to the table but they aren't going to help balance out the Eastern schools.
(This post was last modified: 03-21-2014 10:41 PM by Kittonhead.)
03-21-2014 10:40 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Since the member need is in the East I suspect the SBC will add in the East.

What about Chattanooga olympic sports and Liberty FB Only? That would serve to keep the footprint tight in olympic sports while also picking up that 12th school in football. Liberty FB Only might sit better with presidents than an all sport invite.

I know Missouri State probably brings the most to the table but they aren't going to help balance out the Eastern schools.

UTC is not interested in moving.

This balance out in the East is overblown. App wants a travel partner...but App probably isn't going to get what they want because the rest of us would prefer a strong program.
03-21-2014 10:43 PM
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TheRevSWT Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 10:30 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  Rev you make comments like you know exactly how each Pres. is going to vote. To say EKU has the votes? you have no clue is that's true! Who knows if Liberty was voted on last year or not, but either way that's a year ago and things can change in a year.

My statements are based on observation, and simple deductions.

Let's examine, shall we?

- Liberty has almost been BEGGING the Sun Belt for an invite for two years.
- Benson has been SALIVATING at having Liberty in for two years.
- We had a "need" for a 12th team last year.
You're right.... There probably wasn't a vote on Liberty last year.

Further, EKU has a better chance at getting the votes to get in (assuming their plan to move is viable) than Liberty, by virtue that they are NOT Liberty.

It's 100% clear that Liberty, without it's political or private institution implications is a great fit. Money to burn, great facilities, a desire to be here, even a location. Liberty even has the endorsement of the conference commissioner. So it's clearly not a concern about the athletic abilities (unless it's been the lack of performance in playoffs for football, but that's unlikely as they invited us), but something else.

That something else? It's something that EKU doesn't have to overcome.
03-21-2014 10:45 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 10:45 PM)TheRevSWT Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:30 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  Rev you make comments like you know exactly how each Pres. is going to vote. To say EKU has the votes? you have no clue is that's true! Who knows if Liberty was voted on last year or not, but either way that's a year ago and things can change in a year.

My statements are based on observation, and simple deductions.

Let's examine, shall we?

- Liberty has almost been BEGGING the Sun Belt for an invite for two years.
- Benson has been SALIVATING at having Liberty in for two years.
- We had a "need" for a 12th team last year.
You're right.... There probably wasn't a vote on Liberty last year.

Further, EKU has a better chance at getting the votes to get in (assuming their plan to move is viable) than Liberty, by virtue that they are NOT Liberty.

It's 100% clear that Liberty, without it's political or private institution implications is a great fit. Money to burn, great facilities, a desire to be here, even a location. Liberty even has the endorsement of the conference commissioner. So it's clearly not a concern about the athletic abilities (unless it's been the lack of performance in playoffs for football, but that's unlikely as they invited us), but something else.

That something else? It's something that EKU doesn't have to overcome.

If it comes down to EKU and Liberty...Liberty's odds get a lot better simply because of how far off EKU is.

What Liberty cannot have happen is Missouri State or JMU declare interest, My guess would be the same scenario falls under UTC as well.
03-21-2014 10:47 PM
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AppinVA Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 10:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Since the member need is in the East I suspect the SBC will add in the East.

What about Chattanooga olympic sports and Liberty FB Only? That would serve to keep the footprint tight in olympic sports while also picking up that 12th school in football. Liberty FB Only might sit better with presidents than an all sport invite.

I know Missouri State probably brings the most to the table but they aren't going to help balance out the Eastern schools.

UTC is not interested in moving.

This balance out in the East is overblown. App wants a travel partner...but App probably isn't going to get what they want because the rest of us would prefer a strong program.

We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.
03-21-2014 10:52 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 10:52 PM)AppinVA Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Since the member need is in the East I suspect the SBC will add in the East.

What about Chattanooga olympic sports and Liberty FB Only? That would serve to keep the footprint tight in olympic sports while also picking up that 12th school in football. Liberty FB Only might sit better with presidents than an all sport invite.

I know Missouri State probably brings the most to the table but they aren't going to help balance out the Eastern schools.

UTC is not interested in moving.

This balance out in the East is overblown. App wants a travel partner...but App probably isn't going to get what they want because the rest of us would prefer a strong program.

We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.

Its nothing against you guys. If a UTC or JMU was ready and willing, this wouldn't be a discussion. The problem is they are not, so our options are not exactly the greatest in the world. Meanwhile, you've got a West team with strong Olympic sports flirting with the SBC after snubbing our advances for years.

It changes things.
03-21-2014 10:59 PM
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Libertygrad01 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 10:59 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:52 PM)AppinVA Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Since the member need is in the East I suspect the SBC will add in the East.

What about Chattanooga olympic sports and Liberty FB Only? That would serve to keep the footprint tight in olympic sports while also picking up that 12th school in football. Liberty FB Only might sit better with presidents than an all sport invite.

I know Missouri State probably brings the most to the table but they aren't going to help balance out the Eastern schools.

UTC is not interested in moving.

This balance out in the East is overblown. App wants a travel partner...but App probably isn't going to get what they want because the rest of us would prefer a strong program.

We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.

Its nothing against you guys. If a UTC or JMU was ready and willing, this wouldn't be a discussion. The problem is they are not, so our options are not exactly the greatest in the world. Meanwhile, you've got a West team with strong Olympic sports flirting with the SBC after snubbing our advances for years.

It changes things.

Who is the West team that's has such strong Olympic sports? MSU hasn't been to the NCAA tourney in basketball in 15 years. They have a rich history, but 15 years is a long time. MSU baseball is 8-11 this year dropping 3 straight to Dallas Baptist. Liberty is 17-6 on the year. Football averages less than 9,000. Really?? All common sense would say JMU or Liberty.
03-21-2014 11:14 PM
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AppinVA Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 10:59 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:52 PM)AppinVA Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Since the member need is in the East I suspect the SBC will add in the East.

What about Chattanooga olympic sports and Liberty FB Only? That would serve to keep the footprint tight in olympic sports while also picking up that 12th school in football. Liberty FB Only might sit better with presidents than an all sport invite.

I know Missouri State probably brings the most to the table but they aren't going to help balance out the Eastern schools.

UTC is not interested in moving.

This balance out in the East is overblown. App wants a travel partner...but App probably isn't going to get what they want because the rest of us would prefer a strong program.

We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.

Its nothing against you guys. If a UTC or JMU was ready and willing, this wouldn't be a discussion. The problem is they are not, so our options are not exactly the greatest in the world. Meanwhile, you've got a West team with strong Olympic sports flirting with the SBC after snubbing our advances for years.

It changes things.

I wouldn't poo poo Missouri State, and I doubt our administration would, either...unless the league somehow wound up in the position where it could choose MoSt over JMU.
03-21-2014 11:21 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 11:14 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:59 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:52 PM)AppinVA Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Since the member need is in the East I suspect the SBC will add in the East.

What about Chattanooga olympic sports and Liberty FB Only? That would serve to keep the footprint tight in olympic sports while also picking up that 12th school in football. Liberty FB Only might sit better with presidents than an all sport invite.

I know Missouri State probably brings the most to the table but they aren't going to help balance out the Eastern schools.

UTC is not interested in moving.

This balance out in the East is overblown. App wants a travel partner...but App probably isn't going to get what they want because the rest of us would prefer a strong program.

We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.

Its nothing against you guys. If a UTC or JMU was ready and willing, this wouldn't be a discussion. The problem is they are not, so our options are not exactly the greatest in the world. Meanwhile, you've got a West team with strong Olympic sports flirting with the SBC after snubbing our advances for years.

It changes things.

Who is the West team that's has such strong Olympic sports? MSU hasn't been to the NCAA tourney in basketball in 15 years. They have a rich history, but 15 years is a long time. MSU baseball is 8-11 this year dropping 3 straight to Dallas Baptist. Liberty is 17-6 on the year. Football averages less than 9,000. Really?? All common sense would say JMU or Liberty.

Missouri State has the unfortunate problem of competing in a league with Wichita State. The reality is, if their Olympics even remotely match Liberty, they'll get the nod because they have such a strong relationship with many of the West teams in the league.

If Liberty wants in, they are going to have to convince ASU and ULL to change their minds.
03-21-2014 11:32 PM
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LexColonel Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
Amusing how much these Liberty people know about EKU based on internet searches and what a few bias old rivals say.

Actually pretty pathetic all the negativity regarding those they are afraid might get their pre ordained spot in the SBC, and the pleading being offered trying to convince everyone of the fact. 03-hissyfit Almost feel sorry for them, they have to be worn out and frazzled.
03-21-2014 11:33 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
A couple things to keep in mind here on SBC expansion.

1. Due to the attendance requirement, the minimum capacity for an FBS program is only 15,000. Charlotte has a 15,000 seat stadium and ODU has 20,000 seats. Both play in CUSA.

For this reason Missouri State and Lamar have just as much of a chance as Liberty or Eastern Kentucky on a facility vote. EKU might have the tougher sell because their facility hasn't undergone a recent renovation.

2. Do not underestimate the power of a FB only invite. Nobody with football is joining the SBC because they can't wait to join the basketball conference. They are considering it because of football.

Missouri State or JMU could accept a FB only invite to the SBC more easily. The MVC doesn't require schools with FB programs to play football in that conference. Drake is playing in the Pioneer League. Missouri State would be better off accepting a FB-Only to the SBC and moving to FBS than taking a chance on the status quo.
03-21-2014 11:35 PM
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Libertygrad01 Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 11:35 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  A couple things to keep in mind here on SBC expansion.

1. Due to the attendance requirement, the minimum capacity for an FBS program is only 15,000. Charlotte has a 15,000 seat stadium and ODU has 20,000 seats. Both play in CUSA.

For this reason Missouri State and Lamar have just as much of a chance as Liberty or Eastern Kentucky on a facility vote. EKU might have the tougher sell because their facility hasn't undergone a recent renovation.

2. Do not underestimate the power of a FB only invite. Nobody with football is joining the SBC because they can't wait to join the basketball conference. They are considering it because of football.

Missouri State or JMU could accept a FB only invite to the SBC more easily. The MVC doesn't require schools with FB programs to play football in that conference. Drake is playing in the Pioneer League. Missouri State would be better off accepting a FB-Only to the SBC and moving to FBS than taking a chance on the status quo.

What would MSU bring to the table with a football only invite? I could see that more with JMU. Most JMU fans want nothing to do with the SB and if you read their board much the SB isn't even talked much about as an option. Some actually think they can get into the AAC. That's how highly they think of themselves.
03-21-2014 11:49 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 11:32 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 11:14 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:59 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:52 PM)AppinVA Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:43 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  UTC is not interested in moving.

This balance out in the East is overblown. App wants a travel partner...but App probably isn't going to get what they want because the rest of us would prefer a strong program.

We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.

Its nothing against you guys. If a UTC or JMU was ready and willing, this wouldn't be a discussion. The problem is they are not, so our options are not exactly the greatest in the world. Meanwhile, you've got a West team with strong Olympic sports flirting with the SBC after snubbing our advances for years.

It changes things.

Who is the West team that's has such strong Olympic sports? MSU hasn't been to the NCAA tourney in basketball in 15 years. They have a rich history, but 15 years is a long time. MSU baseball is 8-11 this year dropping 3 straight to Dallas Baptist. Liberty is 17-6 on the year. Football averages less than 9,000. Really?? All common sense would say JMU or Liberty.

Missouri State has the unfortunate problem of competing in a league with Wichita State. The reality is, if their Olympics even remotely match Liberty, they'll get the nod because they have such a strong relationship with many of the West teams in the league.

If Liberty wants in, they are going to have to convince ASU and ULL to change their minds.

It seems to me the Missouri St FB only might be the best move here.

1. Gives you a 12th school without another mouth to feed in basketball (albeit a nice mouth). The MVC and AAC are also sitting at 11 schools in basketball so I don't see a problem there.

2. Takes Missouri St off the table for the MAC or CUSA because it allows them to be able to keep their olympic sports in the MVC.

3. Out of all the schools with potentially the most upside Missouri St is it. They would be only the second FBS school in Missouri, a state like Arkansas with only one SEC school. As Missouri is forced into recruiting more across SEC country that will open up second tier FBS players for Missouri State.

James Madison has a better football facility but would be the 4th FBS school in Virginia. I don't think CAA bylaws permit football only membership. Its all sports or nothing with these guys.
03-21-2014 11:50 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 11:49 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 11:35 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  A couple things to keep in mind here on SBC expansion.

1. Due to the attendance requirement, the minimum capacity for an FBS program is only 15,000. Charlotte has a 15,000 seat stadium and ODU has 20,000 seats. Both play in CUSA.

For this reason Missouri State and Lamar have just as much of a chance as Liberty or Eastern Kentucky on a facility vote. EKU might have the tougher sell because their facility hasn't undergone a recent renovation.

2. Do not underestimate the power of a FB only invite. Nobody with football is joining the SBC because they can't wait to join the basketball conference. They are considering it because of football.

Missouri State or JMU could accept a FB only invite to the SBC more easily. The MVC doesn't require schools with FB programs to play football in that conference. Drake is playing in the Pioneer League. Missouri State would be better off accepting a FB-Only to the SBC and moving to FBS than taking a chance on the status quo.

What would MSU bring to the table with a football only invite? I could see that more with JMU. Most JMU fans want nothing to do with the SB and if you read their board much the SB isn't even talked much about as an option. Some actually think they can get into the AAC. That's how highly they think of themselves.

I can tell you that the AAC looks at football tradition first and FCS programs last. Every single program aside from South Florida has made one of the 6 CFP bowls in its history. Even Temple and Tulsa have done it surprisingly.

Missouri St would be the #2 program in an SEC state, very similar to the Arkansas State situation and we all know that ASU has taken off. MSU could also dip into Kansas for the JUCO's and get players considering Kansas and K-State to stay home. Tap into Illinois some where there is only one G5 program in Illinois St.

This move also gives the SBC an "in" in case the Missouri St does want to leave the MVC like the MAC has with UMass.
(This post was last modified: 03-22-2014 12:10 AM by Kittonhead.)
03-22-2014 12:09 AM
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SumItUp Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 11:50 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  James Madison has a better football facility but would be the 4th FBS school in Virginia. I don't think CAA bylaws permit football only membership. Its all sports or nothing with these guys.

CAA Football is a separate entity and not related to OLY sports.
03-22-2014 12:24 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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RE: Sun Belt Conference votes to expand
(03-21-2014 11:50 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 11:32 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 11:14 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:59 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  
(03-21-2014 10:52 PM)AppinVA Wrote:  We spent 40 years in the SoCon. We're used to it.

Its nothing against you guys. If a UTC or JMU was ready and willing, this wouldn't be a discussion. The problem is they are not, so our options are not exactly the greatest in the world. Meanwhile, you've got a West team with strong Olympic sports flirting with the SBC after snubbing our advances for years.

It changes things.

Who is the West team that's has such strong Olympic sports? MSU hasn't been to the NCAA tourney in basketball in 15 years. They have a rich history, but 15 years is a long time. MSU baseball is 8-11 this year dropping 3 straight to Dallas Baptist. Liberty is 17-6 on the year. Football averages less than 9,000. Really?? All common sense would say JMU or Liberty.

Missouri State has the unfortunate problem of competing in a league with Wichita State. The reality is, if their Olympics even remotely match Liberty, they'll get the nod because they have such a strong relationship with many of the West teams in the league.

If Liberty wants in, they are going to have to convince ASU and ULL to change their minds.

It seems to me the Missouri St FB only might be the best move here.

1. Gives you a 12th school without another mouth to feed in basketball (albeit a nice mouth). The MVC and AAC are also sitting at 11 schools in basketball so I don't see a problem there.

2. Takes Missouri St off the table for the MAC or CUSA because it allows them to be able to keep their olympic sports in the MVC.

3. Out of all the schools with potentially the most upside Missouri St is it. They would be only the second FBS school in Missouri, a state like Arkansas with only one SEC school. As Missouri is forced into recruiting more across SEC country that will open up second tier FBS players for Missouri State.

James Madison has a better football facility but would be the 4th FBS school in Virginia. I don't think CAA bylaws permit football only membership. Its all sports or nothing with these guys.

Why on earth would the SBC invite Missouri State's weakest sport, when the reality is we need the basketball help a lot more than football?

There is zero chance the SBC offers anyone a football only invite. If Missouri State wants to play...they have to bring all their sports and kick the Valley to the curb.
03-22-2014 12:32 AM
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