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Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-24-2013 12:05 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  
(09-23-2013 10:36 PM)chiefsfan Wrote:  I don't know if the Sun Belt in its present form will survive. But I know that your core Sun Belt members would make sure their universities complied with any new standards. (ULL, Troy, ASU, ULM, Texas State, USA, probably App State and Georgia Southern) Even if it means radical changes to the athletic budget and structure. Most of our schools could not afford being forced to drop down because it would kill fan support.

Since no legislation would work in the current climate to force a school out of FBS, you'll simply see standards set to hopefully reduce the number of FBS teams, only to provide a drawback that most teams do what they need to do to stay up.

If D4 put requirements in place like increasing the minimum number of sports, full cost of attendance scholarships, stipends, and prohibiting schools from only partially funding sports, do you think those same schools would be able to afford it? How much money do you think the majority of G5 schools can just pull out of their butts?

If you have to increase how much a scholarship is worth, increase how many you award, pay stipends, have to higher more coaches and build new facilities (for new sports), can schools in the Sun Belt keep up?

The typical P5 tv contract is $18M/year or more greater than the G5? The amount of bowl and playoff money the P5 will be getting will also be substantially larger than the G5, right? What if the P5 set the standards to a level that is anticipated at a $10-15M/year increase in athletic spending for all universities (P5 and G5)?

Because that's what I'd do if I was the P5. I'd say, "We are more than willing to open our doors to anyone who wants to join just so long as they know that by joining they will be required to do x, y and z."

I also don't think fan support would suffer much. I believe the P5 will continue to schedule G5 even if that is the dividing line for D4. So the schedule will remain mostly unchanged. But now your school will have a much better shot at actually winning a national title without directly having to compete with the P5 schools.

Thats not what the networks want. By pushing the G5 to some other so called "national championship" that nobody will recognize or care about, thier games are reduced in importance and become valueless. Those viewers do not necessarily suddenly become P5 fans. They may either become less involved fans of G5 football or become disgusted with the college football NFL "light" attitude and concentrate thier football interest on the real NFL. The networks don't want half thier inventory devalued and they don't want the total college audience to be damaged. Make no mistake---that's exactly what a P5/G5 split does.

The reality is, other than a couple of big mouthed AD's and coaches, nobody has been pushing for a split WITHIN FBS. The pressure has been for a split of ALL FBS from the rest of D1.
(This post was last modified: 09-24-2013 10:32 AM by Attackcoog.)
09-24-2013 09:15 AM
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TerryD Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
This seems all very underwhelming to me.

What happened to the big, bad "power conference breakaway" that some posters were predicting?
09-24-2013 10:06 AM
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IceJus10 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-23-2013 09:05 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  The BIG EAST deserves to be on the right side of any split, if the split extends to basketball. Otherwise, I think that it should be P5.

I think they're major programs (at least for Basketball)... however, the only thing about how they will fall in the realignment is, when a decision about the new Big East's power had to be made this Spring, the conferences voted to give the new Big East only mid-major voting power, not major conference status. So if they were fine relegating them then, I'm not sure they wouldn't do the same going forward, far or not.
(This post was last modified: 09-24-2013 06:41 PM by IceJus10.)
09-24-2013 06:39 PM
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Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-24-2013 06:39 PM)IceJus10 Wrote:  
(09-23-2013 09:05 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  The BIG EAST deserves to be on the right side of any split, if the split extends to basketball. Otherwise, I think that it should be P5.

I think they're major programs (at least for Basketball)... however, the only thing about how they will fall in the realignment is, when a decision about the new Big East's power had to be made this Spring, the conferences voted to give the new Big East only mid-major voting power, not major conference status. So if they were fine relegating them then, I'm not sure they wouldn't do the same going forward, far or not.

If they are included they need less voting weight than any FBS conference and they need not gripe one bit. Otherwise, why should they be in the "FBS" conference?? Its freaking expensive running a FBS conference, the MAC ( and other G5) spend a ton on fielding football teams and out basketball has suffered in some degrees directly relating to the FBS expenses. Let Providence and Marquette and La Salle and Xavier throw $10 million a year at football and see how major they are.

This new division should be for FBS only! They can have stipends too if they want but leave them out of the governance, they have different priorities and is exactly what tore up the big East to begin with. Conflict of interest!!!

They don't deserve to have any say.
09-24-2013 06:50 PM
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Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
Let a conference that cant relate to the expenses of FBS have their own governance with their "peers". Sure they can have stipends, but they will have no say in FBS Division and battle their own basketball-only brethren whether they can have stipends or not. I dont feel bad for bball-only conferences one bit or feel they are owed anything.
09-24-2013 07:05 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-24-2013 10:06 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This seems all very underwhelming to me.

What happened to the big, bad "power conference breakaway" that some posters were predicting?

03-lmfao
09-24-2013 07:07 PM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-24-2013 10:06 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This seems all very underwhelming to me.

What happened to the big, bad "power conference breakaway" that some posters were predicting?

Emmert speaks of both possibilities. I guess you used selective reading to only read the part you wished to read. There are plenty of sources citing Emmert on this subject. Did you read only one?

Is that the kind of research approach that they teach at Notre Dame? 07-coffee3
09-24-2013 07:34 PM
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Bull_In_Exile Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-23-2013 04:35 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-23-2013 04:08 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  per NCAA president Mark Emmert.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/...oming-ncaa

Sound more like a lean to the split of the FBS conferences and some other conferences (Big East..) that are in line with the issues of the Big Schools from the last paragraph of the article.

"suggests that FBS institutions and conferences that are more closely aligned in issues and athletics resources form a new division."

I read that as more that the P5 form a new division. Basketball conferences, CUSA, MAC, Sun Belt not invited. AAC and MWC possibly not invited as well.

Then you read it wrong.... The FBS schools, all of them, are pretty much aligned on all the issues and 30 million being spent at the top of the MAC is not too far off the bottom of the B1G compared to how far the MEAC is from the MAC
09-24-2013 07:34 PM
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Bull_In_Exile Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-23-2013 08:21 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-23-2013 07:23 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  
(09-23-2013 04:35 PM)bullet Wrote:  
(09-23-2013 04:08 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  per NCAA president Mark Emmert.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/...oming-ncaa

Sound more like a lean to the split of the FBS conferences and some other conferences (Big East..) that are in line with the issues of the Big Schools from the last paragraph of the article.

"suggests that FBS institutions and conferences that are more closely aligned in issues and athletics resources form a new division."

I read that as more that the P5 form a new division. Basketball conferences, CUSA, MAC, Sun Belt not invited. AAC and MWC possibly not invited as well.

My interpretation is FBS institutions (all FBS) and particular conferences (BE) going into a new division.

07-coffee3

I guess it depends on how you read the "and." I read it as referring to FBS conferences that were also aligned in resources. It could also be read as "all FBS conferences" "and" others.

See herein lies the problem..

The "resources thing" is tied to the scholarship numbers and the full cost of attendance. In 2005-2006 the bigger conferences tried to raise the number of scholarships on a lot of sports (many non revenue womens sports). the FBS conferences were all in agreement, all of them...

It was held back by the non FBS conferences. That reason was *specifically* mentioned in the grievances listed by the FBS conferences who drafted the memo. That memo was signed off for by a rep from each FBS conference.

And the $28,856,248 spent by Fresno in 2008 is *not* all that distinguishing from the $25,153,394 spent by *gasp* Eastern Michigan. The idea that a 10 million dollar difference between 25M and 35M looks big to the P5 teams dropping 70 million you've lost your mind
(This post was last modified: 09-24-2013 08:00 PM by Bull_In_Exile.)
09-24-2013 07:46 PM
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Post: #50
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-23-2013 05:54 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  Let's see how the Cards do without Bridgewater. Replacing an NFL caliber QB ain't as easy as it seems...

You haven't seen how good our backup's looking, have you?

In all seriousness though, I still maintain that the P5 will become the P4. Doing so would streamline things more than anything else you could do in college football. It would automatically expand the playoff system to 8 and do so in such a manner that the conferences get to keep the lion's share of the $$$ while excluding "upstarts" like Boise who would most likely be in the new lower division.
09-25-2013 06:21 AM
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TerryD Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-24-2013 07:34 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  
(09-24-2013 10:06 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This seems all very underwhelming to me.

What happened to the big, bad "power conference breakaway" that some posters were predicting?

Emmert speaks of both possibilities. I guess you used selective reading to only read the part you wished to read. There are plenty of sources citing Emmert on this subject. Did you read only one?

Is that the kind of research approach that they teach at Notre Dame? 07-coffee3


So you are boldly predicting that the Pac 12, the Big 12, the ACC, the Big Ten and the SEC are definitely going to soon break away totally from the NCAA?

I don't care what Mark Emmert has said anywhere, I don't see that ever happening.
(This post was last modified: 09-25-2013 06:56 AM by TerryD.)
09-25-2013 06:55 AM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-25-2013 06:55 AM)TerryD Wrote:  
(09-24-2013 07:34 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  
(09-24-2013 10:06 AM)TerryD Wrote:  This seems all very underwhelming to me.

What happened to the big, bad "power conference breakaway" that some posters were predicting?

Emmert speaks of both possibilities. I guess you used selective reading to only read the part you wished to read. There are plenty of sources citing Emmert on this subject. Did you read only one?

Is that the kind of research approach that they teach at Notre Dame? 07-coffee3


So you are boldly predicting that the Pac 12, the Big 12, the ACC, the Big Ten and the SEC are definitely going to soon break away totally from the NCAA?

I don't care what Mark Emmert has said anywhere, I don't see that ever happening.

Here you go again, putting words in people's mouth.

No dummy, I said it was a possibility and yes Emmert has also done the same as well as have other media folks who have talked on the subject. It is possible that happens and it is possible that FBS simply breaks off from the rest yet staying within the NCAA. Both are possible and I have said that many times so cut it out with the bull**** attempts to mischaracterize other people's arguments that they have made on many multiple occasions and I KNOW you read this **** regularly.
09-25-2013 07:46 PM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
IF the P5 conferences decide to totally break away from the NCAA, Emmert will be the last one to know...
09-25-2013 08:38 PM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-25-2013 08:38 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  IF the P5 conferences decide to totally break away from the NCAA, Emmert will be the last one to know...

Wrong, it is just a threat so of course he is the first one to be told such since it is just a threat. This isn't some secretive movement in the night akin to the departure of the Baltimore Colts.
09-25-2013 09:08 PM
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Attackcoog Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-25-2013 08:38 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  IF the P5 conferences decide to totally break away from the NCAA, Emmert will be the last one to know...

lol....So true.
09-25-2013 10:36 PM
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Wilkie01 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-25-2013 10:36 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(09-25-2013 08:38 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  IF the P5 conferences decide to totally break away from the NCAA, Emmert will be the last one to know...

lol....So true.

So spot on and he will never see it coming! 05-stirthepot
09-25-2013 10:47 PM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-25-2013 09:08 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  
(09-25-2013 08:38 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  IF the P5 conferences decide to totally break away from the NCAA, Emmert will be the last one to know...
Wrong, it is just a threat so of course he is the first one to be told such since it is just a threat. This isn't some secretive movement in the night akin to the departure of the Baltimore Colts.
Don't be so sure of that, HO. As incompetent as Emmert and Co. have proved themselves to be, the notice would get lost. So even if he had advanced notice, he'd still be clueless...
09-26-2013 11:52 AM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #58
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-26-2013 11:52 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  
(09-25-2013 09:08 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  
(09-25-2013 08:38 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  IF the P5 conferences decide to totally break away from the NCAA, Emmert will be the last one to know...
Wrong, it is just a threat so of course he is the first one to be told such since it is just a threat. This isn't some secretive movement in the night akin to the departure of the Baltimore Colts.
Don't be so sure of that, HO. As incompetent as Emmert and Co. have proved themselves to be, the notice would get lost. So even if he had advanced notice, he'd still be clueless...

I think I could agree that he could be told exactly what is about to happen and still be clueless about what is about to happen. On that note, I could agree. I just don't think they are going to be so secretive about it.
09-26-2013 10:05 PM
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bitcruncher Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-26-2013 10:05 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  
(09-26-2013 11:52 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  
(09-25-2013 09:08 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  
(09-25-2013 08:38 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  IF the P5 conferences decide to totally break away from the NCAA, Emmert will be the last one to know...
Wrong, it is just a threat so of course he is the first one to be told such since it is just a threat. This isn't some secretive movement in the night akin to the departure of the Baltimore Colts.
Don't be so sure of that, HO. As incompetent as Emmert and Co. have proved themselves to be, the notice would get lost. So even if he had advanced notice, he'd still be clueless...
I think I could agree that he could be told exactly what is about to happen and still be clueless about what is about to happen. On that note, I could agree. I just don't think they are going to be so secretive about it.
I don't think they'll be secretive about it. But if Emmert is going to be left out of the picture, I'm not sure anyone will tell him until it happens...

It's like layoffs. Do it on Friday, and they'll be less likely to raise a big stink...
09-27-2013 10:13 AM
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Post: #60
RE: Big Changes Coming for the NCAA
(09-23-2013 08:18 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  So the Big East will be included in with the P5? I guess I was right all along and those who said we were mid majors were wrong!

Does there come a time when the 14th,15th and 16th seeds in the BB tournament are not given out to lower tier conferences automatically but all spots given to teams in the new div.07-coffee3
09-27-2013 10:57 AM
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