(05-10-2013 03:00 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  A little long winded, but I'll dignify you with a response.

(05-10-2013 01:41 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  I quoted more than one, if you'll look closer, but regardless, most of the crazies seem to come from Georgia Southern or ULL. I have collectively never seen a more insecure bunch.

You need to look closer. Your essay on softball vs. volleyball attendance figures did nothing to answer my initial argument with you that stated that UL volleyball IS god-awful. Sure you quoted me, but it was on an unrelated topic. Your beef is with CrazyCajun. It's not that hard to differentiate between two posters is it?

(05-10-2013 01:41 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  As for the second paragraph, if your softball team goes .500 for a decade, would that be good or terrible? If your volleyball team goes .500 for a decade, is that good or terrible?

Relevance? Softball is a more popular in South Louisiana, so if the team wins less than 40 games it's considered a bad year. Still I wouldn't call softball teams like UNT, FIU, FAU, and even Troy god-awful. All of these teams have usually finished around .500 for the last few years. That's respectable.

(05-10-2013 01:41 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  Perspective is what matters. When our athletic program was muddling along in the '80's, volleyball was competing. It was our crown jewel. When our programs started to recover after footballs dismemberment and each sport became fully funded, volleyball dominated and kept the popularity.

SFA would have to win the conference championship five more times to equal our total number. 2nd place Central Arkansas would have to do it 9 more times to equal our #1 mark. We and Texas were the premier volleyball teams in the SW. 20 wins was expected for the bare minimum. This past year was pathetic, though I will temper what some fellow Mavs have said and point out that there were no seniors and we did beat the WAC champions, so there is potential. I suspect the same would be for your softball team. .500 just means different things to different programs.

Perspective does matter as my previous statement said that < 40 wins or not making a regional is a bad year for UL softball, but the previous softball teams I mentioned (UNT, FIU, FAU, Troy) have frequently finished around .500, but I would never call them god-awful. MTSU has been god-awful in softball the last few years, but my opinion can change if they stop having single digit win seasons and get closer to 20-25 wins. Why hasn't yours? UL volleyball hasn't had a single digit win season since 2009.

(05-10-2013 01:41 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  While god-awful may have overstated it a bit,

Glad I could get you to admit that you were being an ass for the sake of trying to win an argument.

(05-10-2013 01:41 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  your VB program isn't on the level of a SWAC school, I stand by my statement that your VB team is not good.

Is that volleyball smack? The SWAC sucks in most sports, so should I assume their volleyball sucks? This past season UL beat TSU 3-0, Southern 3-0, and Alabama A&M 3-0. Last year UL beat Alcorn State 3-0, TSU 3-0, MVSU 3-0, Southern 3-0, and PVAMU 3-0. 2010 UL beat PVAMU 3-0, JSU 3-0, and Southern 3-0.

Sounds like we've handled the SWAC pretty well in the last few years, so I wouldn't put the program at that level. Then again overstating things to try and win an argument is sort of your thing, so I shouldn't be surprised.

Proof is in the coverage of each sport, its not even close. She sounds like a teenager debating with their parents. What if ...or what if......
Anyway you crunch the numbers, one sports has a huge advantage over the other in national and ragional converage. The stats are straight from the NCAA web site. She is not as informed on the subject as she pretends.

Dang.

I clicked on this thread thinking it was a discussion about which girls were hotter, volleyball players or softball players.

So disappointed.

By the way, the answer is conditional.

In uniform, it is volleyball players.
Out of uniform, it's a toss up for the most part with the softball players having a higher talent ceiling.

see Jennie Finch.

(05-10-2013 03:43 PM)CAJUNNATION Wrote:  Dang.

I clicked on this thread thinking it was a discussion about which girls were hotter, volleyball players or softball players.

So disappointed.

By the way, the answer is conditional.

In uniform, it is volleyball players.
Out of uniform, it's a toss up for the most part with the softball players having a higher talent ceiling.

see Jennie Finch.

Nation,

I tried to steer this in the right direction.

I failed.

I like you. This is what conference message boards should be about. I'll give you a +1 for the evenhanded approach you are going with.

(05-10-2013 03:00 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  A little long winded, but I'll dignify you with a response.

I am known to over do it.

(05-10-2013 03:00 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  You need to look closer. Your essay on softball vs. volleyball attendance figures did nothing to answer my initial argument with you that stated that UL volleyball IS god-awful. Sure you quoted me, but it was on an unrelated topic. Your beef is with CrazyCajun. It's not that hard to differentiate between two posters is it?

Let me clarify. Look back in the previous thread. I quoted more than one who tried to down play the example.

(05-10-2013 03:00 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  Relevance? Softball is a more popular in South Louisiana, so if the team wins less than 40 games it's considered a bad year. Still I wouldn't call softball teams like UNT, FIU, FAU, and even Troy god-awful. All of these teams have usually finished around .500 for the last few years. That's respectable.

And that's really my point. Coming from the place we were in, both are programs would be considered terrible. Some teams don't consider .500 a good season. Many Cajun fans would look at a program that gets 25 wins a year as terrible. Considering your team hasn't reached .500 often, it isn't out of the realm of consideration to think those teams are terrible. Plus being .500 by beating SWAC teams doesn't bolster your case. La Tech went winless in an average WAC this year, but swept the WAC teams they played.

(05-10-2013 03:00 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 01:41 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  While god-awful may have overstated it a bit,

Glad I could get you to admit that you were being an ass for the sake of trying to win an argument.

Hmm.

(05-10-2013 03:00 PM)CajunFan3406 Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 01:41 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  your VB program isn't on the level of a SWAC school, I stand by my statement that your VB team is not good.

Is that volleyball smack? The SWAC sucks in most sports, so should I assume their volleyball sucks? This past season UL beat TSU 3-0, Southern 3-0, and Alabama A&M 3-0. Last year UL beat Alcorn State 3-0, TSU 3-0, MVSU 3-0, Southern 3-0, and PVAMU 3-0. 2010 UL beat PVAMU 3-0, JSU 3-0, and Southern 3-0.

Sounds like we've handled the SWAC pretty well in the last few years, so I wouldn't put the program at that level. Then again overstating things to try and win an argument is sort of your thing, so I shouldn't be surprised.

I bolded the relevant part for you.

Yes, their VB is usually the last of the conferences in RPI ranking. If you beat three SWAC teams and finish around .500, that isn't saying much. If you beat 3 SEC teams and finish around .500, your case is bolstered tremendously.

If it makes you feel any better, the Cajuns volleyball program is not god-awful. Yours are a below average one that is making strides toward averageness. For a team that is historically below .500, is that better?

(05-10-2013 02:43 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  For both, you do realize ESPNU is not a true network, but a webcast right?

ESPNU is a part of the ESPN network for TV. It is not a webcast. ESPN360 is a webcast.

(05-10-2013 03:03 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 02:55 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 02:38 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:   Wow, so no discussion of the difference in televison coverage? Well let me help you with that UTA fan. I said and continue to say that NCAA Women's College Softball provides more recognition for a sports program and is televised more across the nation than Volleyball. So here is the prove; both television schedules begin with the NCAA selection committee and the games convered during the tournament. Don't bother to count, because the numbers are not at close as you think!

Let me requote a post, and remove all other bits of information in that post, so you may actually read it.

(05-10-2013 10:49 AM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  And volleyball competes with football, men's basketball, women's basketball, women's soccer and even field hockey in certain parts of the country, so a TV appearances thing isn't a good comparison. Softball competes with baseball after March. Softball appears on network programing not because it is an attraction, but because they need to fill air-time. The same isn't true from September to December.

(05-10-2013 10:49 AM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  It's an apples-to-oranges comparison. If softball competed against football and Bowl season, Men's and women's basketball they wouldn't air so much. The fact is, volleyball's regional semi-finals were on ESPN 3 and the Final Four was on ESPN 2. The Softball College Series is split between ESPN and ESPN 2. (http://web1.ncaa.org/NCAATV/exec/query)

So yes, the final 8 of softball gets bit better coverage than the final 8 of volleyball, but in the end, it is closer to a wash.

The best way to compare, a true apples-to-apples comparison is attendance. As you can see above, it really isn't close.

You sirs, have just been pwned.

So yes there was a discussion, but when it comes down to it, a double-elimination softball tourney game or a single-elimination volleyball tourney match doesn't make a lick of difference in tv coverage if it is on NCAA.com. That .com thing at the end means it is on the internet, not broadcast on tv (some websites end in .org, .net, .edu, etc. and those are not on tv as well).

Those that were on a network were alluded to in my post. So there was a discussion. Does that help o do I need to use smaller words and type at a ULL-level for you to understand?

So if I go back and post the regular season schedule for each sport would you still be a smart azz? Of course you would, because I'v said all along it was the second most viewed NCAA Women's Sports in country and now you want to parse words. Again, you can eliminate all the broadcast on websites for both sports and still remains almost a 2 to 1 ratio. So much for your reading comprehension dipstick!

Not it isn't. And it still doesn't get past the fact that it, by the nature of when it plays, softball will compete with baseball on the college landscape. Every other team sport is done when those two have the stage. Those are the only sports at that time. Volleyball is competing against the three biggest NCAA sports. A monkey could see that.

You however can't. The only true apples-to-apples (you do know what that means I assume) comparison is butts-in-seats. Of which there is no comparison. Softball will have anywhere from 2-3 times as many games as a postseason volleyball tournament. You can lose one in the first round and lose once in the CWS and still be champs. There will be 63 matches in the NCAA volleyball tournament. At a minimum there will double that in softball. Does that mean it is more popular because ncaa.com is carrying it? No, it means there is more product to broadcast. By your reasoning, the NHL is more popular than the NFL. Wanna make that claim?

(05-10-2013 04:03 PM)OsageJ Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 02:43 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  For both, you do realize ESPNU is not a true network, but a webcast right?

ESPNU is a part of the ESPN network for TV. It is not a webcast. ESPN360 is a webcast.

I stand corrected.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESPNU

Utah State was on ESPNU when the Mavericks played there and the game was only available online here. I assumed and as they say...

Was going this thread was going to be about which sport is more fun to watch.

I am disappoint.

My vote is for volleyball, regardless. They got some thighs!

(05-10-2013 04:04 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 03:03 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 02:55 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 02:38 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:   Wow, so no discussion of the difference in televison coverage? Well let me help you with that UTA fan. I said and continue to say that NCAA Women's College Softball provides more recognition for a sports program and is televised more across the nation than Volleyball. So here is the prove; both television schedules begin with the NCAA selection committee and the games convered during the tournament. Don't bother to count, because the numbers are not at close as you think!

Let me requote a post, and remove all other bits of information in that post, so you may actually read it.

(05-10-2013 10:49 AM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  And volleyball competes with football, men's basketball, women's basketball, women's soccer and even field hockey in certain parts of the country, so a TV appearances thing isn't a good comparison. Softball competes with baseball after March. Softball appears on network programing not because it is an attraction, but because they need to fill air-time. The same isn't true from September to December.

(05-10-2013 10:49 AM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  It's an apples-to-oranges comparison. If softball competed against football and Bowl season, Men's and women's basketball they wouldn't air so much. The fact is, volleyball's regional semi-finals were on ESPN 3 and the Final Four was on ESPN 2. The Softball College Series is split between ESPN and ESPN 2. (http://web1.ncaa.org/NCAATV/exec/query)

So yes, the final 8 of softball gets bit better coverage than the final 8 of volleyball, but in the end, it is closer to a wash.

The best way to compare, a true apples-to-apples comparison is attendance. As you can see above, it really isn't close.

You sirs, have just been pwned.

So yes there was a discussion, but when it comes down to it, a double-elimination softball tourney game or a single-elimination volleyball tourney match doesn't make a lick of difference in tv coverage if it is on NCAA.com. That .com thing at the end means it is on the internet, not broadcast on tv (some websites end in .org, .net, .edu, etc. and those are not on tv as well).

Those that were on a network were alluded to in my post. So there was a discussion. Does that help o do I need to use smaller words and type at a ULL-level for you to understand?

So if I go back and post the regular season schedule for each sport would you still be a smart azz? Of course you would, because I'v said all along it was the second most viewed NCAA Women's Sports in country and now you want to parse words. Again, you can eliminate all the broadcast on websites for both sports and still remains almost a 2 to 1 ratio. So much for your reading comprehension dipstick!

Not it isn't. And it still doesn't get past the fact that it, by the nature of when it plays, softball will compete with baseball on the college landscape. Every other team sport is done when those two have the stage. Those are the only sports at that time. Volleyball is competing against the three biggest NCAA sports. A monkey could see that.

You however can't. The only true apples-to-apples (you do know what that means I assume) comparison is butts-in-seats. Of which there is no comparison. Softball will have anywhere from 2-3 times as many games as a postseason volleyball tournament. You can lose one in the first round and lose once in the CWS and still be champs. There will be 63 matches in the NCAA volleyball tournament. At a minimum there will double that in softball. Does that mean it is more popular because ncaa.com is carrying it? No, it means there is more product to broadcast. By your reasoning, the NHL is more popular than the NFL. Wanna make that claim?

We have been comparing the two sports head-to-head dipstick! And now you want to talk about the other sports each compete with during the season? Give it a rest, you can spin it any way you want and conflat the two sports by bringing in other intangibles that were never part of the discussion. You've been proven wrong period dipstick and hell, I didn't even catch your stupidity on ESPNU! You are a complete moron. Just give a rest now!

(05-10-2013 02:43 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  For both, you do realize ESPNU is not a true network, but a webcast right?

And also that softball plays more games because it is a double-elimination. If every game of both tournaments were televised, softball would have more but your point would be worthless.

I also don't count things like the LHN nor BYU's because they will broadcast either. In the end, the only national telecast on a major network were what I mentioned earlier.

BTW, I did read what I linked, however, unlike you, I parsed through the data to get to a relevant point. Sorry, but if you are trying to make the point that DIII softball is legitimate because it is broadcast on NCAA.com, you fail.

ESPNU "is" a sports channel. ESPN3 is a webcast.

(05-10-2013 04:52 PM)CrazyCajun Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 04:04 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  Not it isn't. And it still doesn't get past the fact that it, by the nature of when it plays, softball will compete with baseball on the college landscape. Every other team sport is done when those two have the stage. Those are the only sports at that time. Volleyball is competing against the three biggest NCAA sports. A monkey could see that.

You however can't. The only true apples-to-apples (you do know what that means I assume) comparison is butts-in-seats. Of which there is no comparison. Softball will have anywhere from 2-3 times as many games as a postseason volleyball tournament. You can lose one in the first round and lose once in the CWS and still be champs. There will be 63 matches in the NCAA volleyball tournament. At a minimum there will double that in softball. Does that mean it is more popular because ncaa.com is carrying it? No, it means there is more product to broadcast. By your reasoning, the NHL is more popular than the NFL. Wanna make that claim?

We have been comparing the two sports head-to-head dipstick! And now you want to talk about the other sports each compete with during the season? Give it a rest, you can spin it any way you want and conflat the two sports by bringing in other intangibles that were never part of the discussion. You've been proven wrong period dipstick and hell, I didn't even catch your stupidity on ESPNU! You are a complete moron. Just give a rest now!

So I guess you are saying that if volleyball was a spring sport and softball was a fall sport, the coverage would be the same? Geezus you either are stubborn and can't admit fault (look up a few posts to see how it is done) or your intelligence level is scraping by near the bottom of the barrel.

I guess you think MLB is the most popular professional sports league based on the number if regional and nationally telecasts, followed by the NHL, NBA, MLS, AAA baseball and then the NFL. You are wrong. There is nothing wrong with that.

I have said repeatedly that softball is a bigger deal at ULL than volleyball. Fact. I have said softball is a bigger deal in Louisiana. Fact. It is not, however much you want it to be, a bigger deal to the country as a whole. Period.

(05-10-2013 06:02 PM)geauxcajuns Wrote:  

(05-10-2013 02:43 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  For both, you do realize ESPNU is not a true network, but a webcast right?

And also that softball plays more games because it is a double-elimination. If every game of both tournaments were televised, softball would have more but your point would be worthless.

I also don't count things like the LHN nor BYU's because they will broadcast either. In the end, the only national telecast on a major network were what I mentioned earlier.

BTW, I did read what I linked, however, unlike you, I parsed through the data to get to a relevant point. Sorry, but if you are trying to make the point that DIII softball is legitimate because it is broadcast on NCAA.com, you fail.

ESPNU "is" a sports channel. ESPN3 is a webcast.

My mistake. I confused the two.

Volleyball. Comparison not even close. Look at the attendance stats. At places like Hawaii and Penn State volleyball is a huge deal. And volleyball is one of the few sports in which women compare very well to men as far as what it looks like to watch.