(04-11-2012 12:46 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:17 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:10 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:02 AM)War Torn Ruston Wrote:  I am at the point that I do not believe anything I read on this Alliance/merger thing.

That's probably very true right now.

I think the thing that kind of took them by surprise quite frankly and set them back was the loss of Memphis. It seems after that- things have really scuttled along.

I can tell you with 100% certainty that we knew Memphis was gone. TH told me that via email a long time ago. No surprise at all there.

As far as Alliance / Merger / Whatever, this is the kind of progression that should be expected when 16 representatives from academia, lawyers and television execs try working things out. At this point it wouldn't surprise me at all if the merger is just scrapped and they work out a scheduling Alliance. I'd actually prefer that I think.

Bottom line is CUSA and MWC have lost a combined 12 schools over the past 10 years to the Big East and we'll likely lose another one and then another if there are more defections. What you're seeing with this clusterf'ck just illustrates how powerless we are to do anything about it. It's really sad and frustrating to be a part of it.

You bring up tv. I wonder with Memphis, if indeed they were expecting to lose them- which I don't totally buy- if TV folks drastically reduced the tv value with Memphis gone- to a point where the numbers didn't make up for the loss in the exit fees and hoops money forfeited.

I think you overestimate the importance of that 1.2-1.3M Memphis metropolitan area. Memphis ain't Miami. It does cripple the value of the basketball side of the C-USA TV contract, but since C-USA got $14M from contracts signed a little over a year ago, I don't think that Memphis was the difference between the Alliance looking at a good TV contract vs a bad TV contract.

(04-11-2012 12:55 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 12:46 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:17 AM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:10 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:02 AM)War Torn Ruston Wrote:  I am at the point that I do not believe anything I read on this Alliance/merger thing.

That's probably very true right now.

I think the thing that kind of took them by surprise quite frankly and set them back was the loss of Memphis. It seems after that- things have really scuttled along.

I can tell you with 100% certainty that we knew Memphis was gone. TH told me that via email a long time ago. No surprise at all there.

As far as Alliance / Merger / Whatever, this is the kind of progression that should be expected when 16 representatives from academia, lawyers and television execs try working things out. At this point it wouldn't surprise me at all if the merger is just scrapped and they work out a scheduling Alliance. I'd actually prefer that I think.

Bottom line is CUSA and MWC have lost a combined 12 schools over the past 10 years to the Big East and we'll likely lose another one and then another if there are more defections. What you're seeing with this clusterf'ck just illustrates how powerless we are to do anything about it. It's really sad and frustrating to be a part of it.

You bring up tv. I wonder with Memphis, if indeed they were expecting to lose them- which I don't totally buy- if TV folks drastically reduced the tv value with Memphis gone- to a point where the numbers didn't make up for the loss in the exit fees and hoops money forfeited.

I think you overestimate the importance of that 1.2-1.3M Memphis metropolitan area. Memphis ain't Miami. It does cripple the value of the basketball side of the C-USA TV contract, but since C-USA got $14M from contracts signed a little over a year ago, I don't think that Memphis was the difference between the Alliance looking at a good TV contract vs a bad TV contract.

I think it took a lot of the starch out of the basketball side of things. I mean- they have a ridiculous proportion of the bball units the conference has(18/22 or something like that) the last 6 years. I think the last CUSA team to win a NCAA game besides them- was Louisville. If CUSA got 14M, probably at least 3M of that was because of Memphis bball. With Memphis gone, what is the best eastern bball game that could be shown on TV? Southern Miss vs Marshall? how many tourney wins do either school have? Not to mention if they had even 2 crossovers, you could have had Memphis vs UNLV or Memphis vs New Mexico- great matchups.

(04-11-2012 01:04 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 12:55 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  I think you overestimate the importance of that 1.2-1.3M Memphis metropolitan area. Memphis ain't Miami. It does cripple the value of the basketball side of the C-USA TV contract, but since C-USA got $14M from contracts signed a little over a year ago, I don't think that Memphis was the difference between the Alliance looking at a good TV contract vs a bad TV contract.

I think it took a lot of the starch out of the basketball side of things. I mean- they have a ridiculous proportion of the bball units the conference has(18/22 or something like that) the last 6 years. I think the last CUSA team to win a NCAA game besides them- was Louisville. If CUSA got 14M, probably at least 3M of that was because of Memphis bball.

Hmm. Most conferences estimate a 70/30 split. 30% of $14M is $4.2M, and I could see Mr. TV Executive explaining that without Memphis, and without the Houston, Dallas and Orlando TV markets, C-USA basketball is within a rounding error of being worthless.

There were 30 national TV games with under the C-USA TV contracts, and 9 of them were Memphis games, plus you'd assume Memphis would play in 3 C-USA tournament games.

Maybe Memphis leaving was the straw that broke the camel's back. But I think the Alliance ship was sinking before Memphis got their Big East ticket punched.

"So here is where we stand in terms of a new conference.
First, if this merger is successful, it could be stronger than the old CUSA and it will probably be more stable.
Second, members of the new conference recognize the importance of regional rivalries; they are committed to adding more teams with the goal of ensuring 4 divisions of geographical proximity. We look forward to playing long-time rivals such as Marshall and Southern Miss and to adding several eastern universities to our schedule. Hopefully, one will be Charlotte. This is a good trend and certainly one that allows us to concentrate on the academic success and graduation of our student athletes."
[/quote]

If you go to this link you will clearly hear Appalachian and Charlotte mentioned at the same time by the ECU chancellor. Start at the 6 minute mark to get everything in context.

http://smart.ecu.edu/mediasite/Silverlig...48523bc81d

So they're adding FIU?

(04-11-2012 11:14 AM)ConanX Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:10 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:02 AM)War Torn Ruston Wrote:  I am at the point that I do not believe anything I read on this Alliance/merger thing.

That's probably very true right now.

I think the thing that kind of took them by surprise quite frankly and set them back was the loss of Memphis. It seems after that- things have really scuttled along.

I think this is the first time in the history of sports that sentence has ever been written.

I have described Memphis moving the Big East as a punch to the gut of the alliance.

And Temple's spurning of an alliance football only offer for the Big East was a kick to the nuts.

It looks like outside of Florida International the alliance is going to have to settle for WAC schools.

East: FIU, La Tech
West: UTSA, Utah State

I don't even think North Texas is interested at this point because of the travel involved and the Sun Belt will probably add Texas State and UT-Arlington once the dust clears.

FIU is aside from FAU pretty far from any of the other schools in the Alliance OR the SBC so they may as well jump for the alliance.

(04-11-2012 01:15 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  Hmm. Most conferences estimate a 70/30 split. 30% of $14M is $4.2M, and I could see Mr. TV Executive explaining that without Memphis, and without the Houston, Dallas and Orlando TV markets, C-USA basketball is within a rounding error of being worthless.

Rice is going to the Big East too?

Last I checked, we were still present and accounted for in Houston. And our baseball team was on television last night.

I love seeing the big east ladies getting their panties in a bunch. Wouldn't it be something if another airport conference arose from all this

(04-11-2012 05:49 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:14 AM)ConanX Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:10 AM)stever20 Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 11:02 AM)War Torn Ruston Wrote:  I am at the point that I do not believe anything I read on this Alliance/merger thing.

That's probably very true right now.

I think the thing that kind of took them by surprise quite frankly and set them back was the loss of Memphis. It seems after that- things have really scuttled along.

I think this is the first time in the history of sports that sentence has ever been written.

I have described Memphis moving the Big East as a punch to the gut of the alliance.

And Temple's spurning of an alliance football only offer for the Big East was a kick to the nuts.

It looks like outside of Florida International the alliance is going to have to settle for WAC schools.

East: FIU, La Tech
West: UTSA, Utah State

I don't even think North Texas is interested at this point because of the travel involved and the Sun Belt will probably add Texas State and UT-Arlington once the dust clears.

FIU is aside from FAU pretty far from any of the other schools in the Alliance OR the SBC so they may as well jump for the alliance.

Really? It isn't looking like that at all. Not that I consider it any sort of home run but it's looking like we might be adding 3 Sun-Belt teams potentially in UNT, FIU, and MTSU. The 4th on the C-USA side is sadly looking like it will be Charlotte. It's probably between MTSU and La Tech for spot 4. UNT and FIU are locks, they always have been.

I don't know how reliable the source but take it for what its worth.

Quote:East Carolina chancellor Steve Ballard gave the school's State of the University address Tuesday, during which he commented on the coming joint venture between the Mountain West and Conference USA. Ballard described the new conference as having four divisions, with ECU hopefully picking up Charlotte as a local rival.

Charlotte has reportedly been invited. A four-division arrangement could mean anywhere from four to six teams in each group, which could all set up a semifinal round within the conference or whatever it is.

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/20...usa-merger

(04-11-2012 08:43 PM)HXC NINER Wrote:  I don't know how reliable the source but take it for what its worth.

Quote:East Carolina chancellor Steve Ballard gave the school's State of the University address Tuesday, during which he commented on the coming joint venture between the Mountain West and Conference USA. Ballard described the new conference as having four divisions, with ECU hopefully picking up Charlotte as a local rival.

Charlotte has reportedly been invited. A four-division arrangement could mean anywhere from four to six teams in each group, which could all set up a semifinal round within the conference or whatever it is.

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/20...usa-merger

If true, CONGRATS Niners... And welcome back home.

(04-11-2012 08:43 PM)HXC NINER Wrote:  I don't know how reliable the source but take it for what its worth.

Quote:East Carolina chancellor Steve Ballard gave the school's State of the University address Tuesday, during which he commented on the coming joint venture between the Mountain West and Conference USA. Ballard described the new conference as having four divisions, with ECU hopefully picking up Charlotte as a local rival.

Charlotte has reportedly been invited. A four-division arrangement could mean anywhere from four to six teams in each group, which could all set up a semifinal round within the conference or whatever it is.

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/20...usa-merger

Can you tell me how "...Hopefully, one will be Charlotte. ..." translates into your quote of "Charlotte has reportedly invited"?

I mean Charlotte is a eastern team to help the eastern division of the merger/CUSA. Charlotte was a former member of CUSA but didn't play football because, at that time, they didn't have it.

(04-11-2012 09:36 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(04-11-2012 08:43 PM)HXC NINER Wrote:  I don't know how reliable the source but take it for what its worth.

Quote:East Carolina chancellor Steve Ballard gave the school's State of the University address Tuesday, during which he commented on the coming joint venture between the Mountain West and Conference USA. Ballard described the new conference as having four divisions, with ECU hopefully picking up Charlotte as a local rival.

Charlotte has reportedly been invited. A four-division arrangement could mean anywhere from four to six teams in each group, which could all set up a semifinal round within the conference or whatever it is.

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/20...usa-merger

Can you tell me how "...Hopefully, one will be Charlotte. ..." translates into your quote of "Charlotte has reportedly invited"?

I mean Charlotte is a eastern team to help the eastern division of the merger/CUSA. Charlotte was a former member of CUSA but didn't play football because, at that time, they didn't have it.

Either Jason Kirk just read it that way, or he has a source telling him that.

listen at the 8.50 mark as to what was really said.
Charlotte and Appalachian State.

http://smart.ecu.edu/mediasite/Silverlig...48523bc81d

just a number from the past 5 years for the big east fans...

27,936.... the average attendance for a football game the past 5 years for the 7 new little east football schools. That includes SDSU free firework nights!!!

what's that about markets???

I'm not going to even do the numbers for bball, but I'm guessing below the 5,000 mark

What was that you guys were saying??? "punch in the gut"???

(04-12-2012 12:22 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  just a number from the past 5 years for the big east fans...

27,936.... What was that you guys were saying??? "punch in the gut"???

Buh bye, UAB, RICE, UTEP, Tulane... Talk about a tough sell...

(04-12-2012 12:22 AM)randaddyminer Wrote:  just a number from the past 5 years for the big east fans...

27,936.... the average attendance for a football game the past 5 years for the 7 new little east football schools. That includes SDSU free firework nights!!!

what's that about markets???

I'm not going to even do the numbers for bball, but I'm guessing below the 5,000 mark

What was that you guys were saying??? "punch in the gut"???

What does Memphis bball avg on its own? About 17k. For the Big East to average less than 5000, the other 4 schools would have to average about 1800 each. Nice try.

If the goal is for us to add markets just for the sake of markets then add markets the BE isn't ever going to be interested in. Those schools for me are UNT, the F_U's, and MTSU. The BE has 2 teams in Texas already who are not likely to have anyplace to go, and would never support the addition of UNT to the BE. The BE has 2 teams in Florida who are not likely to leave, and would never support the additions of the F_U's. Memphis isn't likely leaving and they would throw a hissy fit at the thought of being in the same league with MTSU. That gets you a lot of TV sets without adding anyone who's a real flight risk, and crushes the Sun-Belt back to where they are zero threat to pass us. Then they can call up all the FCS schools they want to like Charlotte, GSU, and UTSA. If the BE wants to add those schools straight from the Sun-Belt then that's fine, at least we stayed stable and are allowed to continue to grow.

(04-12-2012 08:17 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  If the goal is for us to add markets just for the sake of markets then add markets the BE isn't ever going to be interested in. Those schools for me are UNT, the F_U's, and MTSU. The BE has 2 teams in Texas already who are not likely to have anyplace to go, and would never support the addition of UNT to the BE. The BE has 2 teams in Florida who are not likely to leave, and would never support the additions of the F_U's. Memphis isn't likely leaving and they would throw a hissy fit at the thought of being in the same league with MTSU. That gets you a lot of TV sets without adding anyone who's a real flight risk, and crushes the Sun-Belt back to where they are zero threat to pass us. Then they can call up all the FCS schools they want to like Charlotte, GSU, and UTSA. If the BE wants to add those schools straight from the Sun-Belt then that's fine, at least we stayed stable and are allowed to continue to grow.

That is a very good point.

(04-12-2012 10:02 AM)roundsound Wrote:  

(04-12-2012 08:17 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  If the goal is for us to add markets just for the sake of markets then add markets the BE isn't ever going to be interested in. Those schools for me are UNT, the F_U's, and MTSU. The BE has 2 teams in Texas already who are not likely to have anyplace to go, and would never support the addition of UNT to the BE. The BE has 2 teams in Florida who are not likely to leave, and would never support the additions of the F_U's. Memphis isn't likely leaving and they would throw a hissy fit at the thought of being in the same league with MTSU. That gets you a lot of TV sets without adding anyone who's a real flight risk, and crushes the Sun-Belt back to where they are zero threat to pass us. Then they can call up all the FCS schools they want to like Charlotte, GSU, and UTSA. If the BE wants to add those schools straight from the Sun-Belt then that's fine, at least we stayed stable and are allowed to continue to grow.

That is a very good point.

Only that goes completely against Terry Holland's objective of tightening the geography around ECU.
I'm surprised to hear any ECU fan advocating for Louisiana Tech and FIU, much less another Texas school. Pirates have long been complaining about geographic proximity. The above post screams Status Quo.
By looking at Charlotte and ASU, Terry Holland is using the recent defections to finally address ECU's issues of being on an island in CUSA.

The fact that some within his own fanbase have done a complete 180, and are clamoring for more of the same (but with lesser names), is interesting indeed...

No matter what happens, I hope that means they're retiring that 'travel' drum they've been banging for the last decade.